The Memo Scandal (Three Paragraphs)

Hal 9000 · February 9, 2018

1 hour ago, Argus said:

So you believe Russia rather than western intelligence agencies or Republicans like George Bush, Mitt Romney and the united states congress, which voted almost unanimously to impose economic sanctions on Russia for its interference?

At this point, I don't believe anybody. As I said, there has been no proof and very little credible evidence on who did what. Consensus doesn't equal proof and I see no reason why Bush or Romney would know anything more than anybody else. If I had to lean on the side of believing anybody, it would probably be Assange.

Hal 9000 · February 9, 2018

1 hour ago, Argus said:

A sales guy always tries to figure out what people want and then offer it to them, even if they have to lie to do it. So Trump figured out what people wanted, grandly offered it to them, then walked off snickering and laughing at the 'uneducated' people he loved so much as he counted his winnings.

That's quite possibly the scenario. Predictably, It worked better than showing disdain for the people.

Hal 9000 · February 9, 2018

1 hour ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

False...there is substantial evidence that many Canadian nationals contributed to election campaigns and crossed the border to volunteer, especially for Clinton and Sanders. They even came to the U.S. to participate in post election protests...some were turned away at the border. Canadians favoured Democrats by a wide margin, a political party in another nation, fully participating in and generating biased social media content, just like any "Russian". A Canadian illegal was busted for voting in New York.

Nope....Canadians and Russians are doing the same thing....trying to influence U.S. elections and policies to favour their own causes and interests. Your prime minister is back in my country for the 15th time, trying to influence American policies and decisions. Nothing special about Canada in that regard.

Here is an example of high profile Canadian nationals, voter wanabes trying to influence the U.S. election...because they wanted Clinton to win and hated Donald Trump. (These two foreign bozos were convinced Hillary would win, of course....WRONG !! )

This looks like a clear case of Canadian collusion.

On a side note, I could watch pre-election newscasts all day.

Omni · February 9, 2018

40 minutes ago, Hal 9000 said:

At this point, I don't believe anybody. As I said, there has been no proof and very little credible evidence on who did what. Consensus doesn't equal proof and I see no reason why Bush or Romney would know anything more than anybody else. If I had to lean on the side of believing anybody, it would probably be Assange.

Actually there is a heap of credible evidence which is why there is an investigation. Why would the US piss away millions assessing threats to their voting system if there wasn't?

Argus · February 9, 2018

3 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

False...there is substantial evidence that many Canadian nationals contributed to election campaigns and crossed the border to volunteer,

Yes, in vast numbers, like those three million illegal voters no one can find.

3 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

Nope....Canadians and Russians are doing the same thing....trying to influence U.S. elections

How did Canada try to influence the US election? Did we hack into your electoral system? Did we hack into your voter registration records? Did we have legions of professional shit disturbers flooding social media with made-up stories about how evil Clinton was?

It seems to me that a lot of the alt-right types so admire the Russian dictator that they really don't mind if he helps put 'his' guy in charge over you, and would only wish he'd be in charge directly. Do you have that same hope?

Argus · February 9, 2018

2 hours ago, Hal 9000 said:

At this point, I don't believe anybody. As I said, there has been no proof and very little credible evidence on who did what. Consensus doesn't equal proof and I see no reason why Bush or Romney would know anything more than anybody else. If I had to lean on the side of believing anybody, it would probably be Assange.

So when virtually the entire congress, both Republican and Democrat, vote to impose sanctions on Russia against the will of Trump they're just... uhm, help me out here? Going on no evidence?

bush_cheney2004 · February 9, 2018

16 minutes ago, Argus said:

How did Canada try to influence the US election? Did we hack into your electoral system? Did we hack into your voter registration records? Did we have legions of professional shit disturbers flooding social media with made-up stories about how evil Clinton was?

Yes...see above YouTube video as just one example. Why would prominent Liberal political hacks cross an international border to "help" a candidate in a foreign election if not for "shit disturbing", partisan reasons ?

I have never awakened one morning and decided that it was imperative for me to drive into Canada and volunteer in a foreign election campaign or protest the outcome. Some Canadians were more rabidly engaged in the U.S. election than American citizens, because they believe it "matters so much" to Canada.

Quote

It seems to me that a lot of the alt-right types so admire the Russian dictator that they really don't mind if he helps put 'his' guy in charge over you, and would only wish he'd be in charge directly. Do you have that same hope?

No to either Russian or Canadian nationals attempting to do such things...why do you think I should/would be more forgiving or tolerant of Canadian interference and influence on an American election ? Do you think Canada is special in that regard ?

The alt-left admires the Canadian "dictator" as well....he is in California right now trying to influence American policy.

Edited February 9, 2018 by bush_cheney2004

Omni · February 9, 2018

14 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

No to either Russian or Canadian nationals attempting to do such things...why do you think I should/would be more forgiving or tolerant of Canadian interference and influence on an American election ?

Maybe because any "proof" you have attempted about millions of illegal Canadian voters is purely laughable. The Russians however is another story it would seem. Every one of your security agencies is convinced and hence the Mueller investigation into Trump's (you know Putin's puppet) involvement.

?Impact · February 9, 2018

28 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

Some Canadians were more rabidly engaged in the U.S. election than American citizens, because they believe it "matters so much" to Canada.

There is a lot of American (and other) influence in Canadian elections. Perhaps not as grass roots as the other way around, it is far more organized and well funded.

bush_cheney2004 · February 9, 2018

2 minutes ago, ?Impact said:

There is a lot of American (and other) influence in Canadian elections. Perhaps not as grass roots as the other way around, it is far more organized and well funded.

Agreed...thousands of "grass roots" American citizens are not going to cross the border to volunteer/donate in Canadian elections, but the opposite is just too irresistible for some partisan Canadians (plus they can do some cross border shopping).

American funding in Canada is tied to pre-existing cultural, economic, and military dependence that continues by choice.

There would be no "memo scandal" about dossiers that confirm decades long, government solicited foreign direct investment in Canada by American groups.

Omni · February 9, 2018

1 minute ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

Agreed...thousands of "grass roots" American citizens are not going to cross the border to volunteer/donate in Canadian elections, but the opposite is just too irresistible for some partisan Canadians (plus they can do some cross border shopping).

American funding in Canada is tied to pre-existing cultural, economic, and military dependence that continues by choice.

There would be no "memo scandal" about dossiers that confirm decades long, government solicited foreign direct investment in Canada by American groups.

And do you have any actual proof of the opposite? or just some silly youtube nonsense.

August1991 · February 10, 2018

8 hours ago, Hal 9000 said:

At this point, I don't believe anybody. As I said, there has been no proof and very little credible evidence on who did what...

To be sustainable, China and Russia have a language.

America has a written constitution.

?Impact · February 10, 2018

25 minutes ago, August1991 said:

To be sustainable, China and Russia have a language.

America has a written constitution.

We, the multinational people of the Russian Federation, united by a common fate on our land, establishing human rights and freedoms, civic peace and accord, preserving the historically established state unity, proceeding from the universally recognized principles of equality and self-determination of peoples, revering the memory of ancestors who have conveyed to us the love for the Fatherland, belief in the good and justice, reviving the sovereign statehood of Russia and asserting the firmness of its democratic basic, striving to ensure the well-being and prosperity of Russia, proceeding from the responsibility for our Fatherland before the present and future generations, recognizing ourselves as part of the world community, adopt the CONSTITUTION OF THE RUSSIAN FEDERATION. - 1993

China is a country with one of the longest histories in the world. The people of all of China's nationalities have jointly created a culture of grandeur and have a glorious revolutionary tradition.

... (very long winded)

This Constitution, in legal form, affirms the achievements of the struggles of the Chinese people of all nationalities and defines the basic system and basic tasks of the state; it is the fundamental law of the state and has supreme legal authority. The people of all nationalities, all state organs, the armed forces, all political parties and public organizations and all enterprises and institutions in the country must take the Constitution as the basic standard of conduct, and they have the duty to uphold the dignity of the Constitution and ensure its implementation. - 1982 (1988, 1993 amendments)

Boges · February 10, 2018

So apparently the Democrat Memo won't be released.

It's now in the public's interest to keep that classified.

This completely ruins any traction the Nunes memo gets. If the rebuttal is being kept secret, it proves the Nunes Memo is Crap.

Edited February 10, 2018 by Boges

August1991 · February 10, 2018

24 minutes ago, ?Impact said:

We, the multinational people of the Russian Federation....

China is a country with one of the longest histories in the world....

Edited February 10, 2018 by August1991

August1991 · February 10, 2018

There are many Chinese-speaking people in the world.

Russian language and culture seem to have survived the collapse of the Soviet system.

Yet, many Chinese and Russian people want to learn English and go to America.

Edited February 10, 2018 by August1991

OftenWrong · February 10, 2018

29 minutes ago, Boges said:

So apparently the Democrat Memo won't be released.

It's now in the public's interest to keep that classified.

This completely ruins any traction the Nunes memo gets. If the rebuttal is being kept secret, it proves the Nunes Memo is Crap.

You sound just like Omni.

It will be released once classified content is removed.
Same as what had to be done for the Nunes memo.

Quote

"Although the president is inclined to declassify the February 5th Memorandum, because the Memorandum contains numerous properly classified and especially sensitive passages, he is unable to do so at this time," McGahn wrote.

"However, given the public interest in transparency in these unprecedented circumstances, the President has directed that Justice Department personnel be available to give technical assistance to the Committee, should the Committee wish to revise the February 5th Memorandum to mitigate the risks identified by the Department," McGahn continued. "The President encourages the Committee to undertake these efforts. The Executive Branch stands ready to review any subsequent draft of the February 5th Memorandum for declassification at the earliest opportunity."

Edited February 10, 2018 by OftenWrong
Added quote from White House

?Impact · February 10, 2018

29 minutes ago, Boges said:

So apparently the Democrat Memo won't be released.

Too funny, unfortunately the Trump supporters are incapable of understanding what that really means. They will follow him to the end of the Earth.

OftenWrong · February 10, 2018

1 minute ago, ?Impact said:

Too funny, unfortunately the Trump supporters are incapable of understanding what that really means. They will follow him to the end of the Earth.

Why not actually read up on things, instead of reacting emotionally to Omni's gossip.

Omni · February 10, 2018

1 minute ago, OftenWrong said:

Why not actually read up on things, instead of reacting emotionally to Omni's gossip.

Where do you read up on things, Breitbart?. If you go elsewhere you'll find Omni's gossip comes from the MSM, but I know you prefer the former.

OftenWrong · February 10, 2018

Just now, Omni said:

Where do you read up on things, Breitbart?. If you go elsewhere you'll find Omni's gossip comes from the MSM, but I know you prefer the former.

What I quoted above is from White House Counsel.

?Impact · February 10, 2018

Just now, OftenWrong said:

Why not actually read up on things, instead of reacting emotionally to Omni's gossip.

I did, and and Trump had zero problem declassifying the Nunes memo. You realize they both were classified when sent to the President.

Omni · February 10, 2018

2 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

What I quoted above is from White House Counsel.

Great. I'm sure there is no bias there!

Cum Laude · February 10, 2018

46 minutes ago, ?Impact said:

We, the multinational people of the Russian Federation, united by a common fate on our land, establishing human rights and freedoms, civic peace and accord, preserving the historically established state unity, proceeding from the universally recognized principles of equality and self-determination of peoples, revering the memory of ancestors who have conveyed to us the love for the Fatherland, belief in the good and justice, reviving the sovereign statehood of Russia and asserting the firmness of its democratic basic, striving to ensure the well-being and prosperity of Russia, proceeding from the responsibility for our Fatherland before the present and future generations, recognizing ourselves as part of the world community, adopt the CONSTITUTION OF THE RUSSIAN FEDERATION. - 1993

China is a country with one of the longest histories in the world. The people of all of China's nationalities have jointly created a culture of grandeur and have a glorious revolutionary tradition.

... (very long winded)

This Constitution, in legal form, affirms the achievements of the struggles of the Chinese people of all nationalities and defines the basic system and basic tasks of the state; it is the fundamental law of the state and has supreme legal authority. The people of all nationalities, all state organs, the armed forces, all political parties and public organizations and all enterprises and institutions in the country must take the Constitution as the basic standard of conduct, and they have the duty to uphold the dignity of the Constitution and ensure its implementation. - 1982 (1988, 1993 amendments)

You do realize this is a classic debt trap. The bankers and the producers are locked in the cycle of lending and borrowing to keep servicing prior bad debt. Each round costs more (normally) and produces less leading to the next round, and so on. The only alternative at every point along the way is immediate default, although at some point, default becomes simply inevitable no matter what. Add in current managers’ short term incentive to kick the can down the road just far enough to escape themselves, and you’ve got one helluva little self-destructive system. Extend and pretend indeed!

OftenWrong · February 10, 2018

4 minutes ago, ?Impact said:

I did, and and Trump had zero problem declassifying the Nunes memo. You realize they both were classified when sent to the President.

More information was to be released along with the Nunes memo to substantiate its claims, but the House Intel Committee voted against it. For the same reasons, national security.