DogOnPorch Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 5 hours ago, dialamah said: You and extremists ignore those Quranic verses forbidding murder which includes terrorism. Most Muslims - 99% - condemn terrorism and murder. But people like you refuse to acknowledge that fact, preferring instead to pretend that the less than 1% who practice terrorism are the norm. The unsubstantiated hyperbole people like you engage in makes it impossible to discuss this topic reasonably. There is no such verse forbidding murder. There is, however, verse 5:32 of the Quran which states.... Because of that, We decreed upon the Children of Israel that whoever kills a soul unless for a soul or for corruption [done] in the land - it is as if he had slain mankind entirely. And whoever saves one - it is as if he had saved mankind entirely. And our messengers had certainly come to them with clear proofs. Then indeed many of them, [even] after that, throughout the land, were transgressors. https://quran.com/5/32 As we can see, there is a condition(s) where killing is permitted. Revenge....a soul for a soul. Or for causing fitnah upon the land (mischief, corruption)...which under Sharia is going against Islam in any form. Ask the dead poets... Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
DogOnPorch Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 8 minutes ago, jacee said: Interesting. So called 'Islamic' extremists seldom/never go to mosque. This is called "The No True Scotsman" fallacy. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Argus Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 (edited) 13 minutes ago, jacee said: Interesting. So called 'Islamic' extremists seldom/never go to mosque. From what I've heard they all go to mosques. But of course, it depends on your definition of extremist. If you mean the terrorists, many go to mosques. In fact, the batch who attacked people in Spain were led by the Imam of their mosque. My definition of extremist is not someone who is extreme according to the Muslim religion but someone whose views are extreme by the standards of mainstream, secular Canada. That would include anyone who says "In order to keep men from becoming aroused, women must cover themselves," for example. Someone who thinks homosexuality should be illegal would also be an extremist in my opinion, as would anyone of any religion who says that if you leave that religion or blaspheme against it you should be killed. Edited September 3, 2017 by Argus 1 Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
jacee Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 22 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: This is called "The No True Scotsman" fallacy. We can always blame the Scotsman. But no religion claims any terrorists. 2 Quote
DogOnPorch Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 1 minute ago, jacee said: We can always blame the Scotsman. But no religion claims any terrorists. Islam does... Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) said, "I have been sent with the shortest expressions bearing the widest meanings, and I have been made victorious with terror (cast in the hearts of the enemy), and while I was sleeping, the keys of the treasures of the world were brought to me and put in my hand." Abu Huraira added: Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) has left the world and now you, people, are bringing out those treasures (i.e. the Prophet did not benefit by them). https://sunnah.com/bukhari/56/186 Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Michael Hardner Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 40 minutes ago, Argus said: If you are not religious, you're not a Muslim. Ask any Muslim and they'll tell you that is a plain and simple fact. Isn't that the true Scotsman fallacy? Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
DogOnPorch Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 2 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: Isn't that the true Scotsman fallacy? Islam is a religion not a race or skin colour. Anybody can join. Leaving....well...not so much. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
eyeball Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 (edited) 5 hours ago, jacee said: I wish all you war nuts would stay in the International forum. Some people might actually want to seek solutions to Canadian problems. I'd rather seek out the problems - keep an eye on them and expose them for what they are. You'll likely find me in the International Forum but it needs to be said that if we fought them here at home we wouldn't need to clean up their messes on the global stage. Edited September 3, 2017 by eyeball Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
Michael Hardner Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 12 hours ago, DogOnPorch said: Islam is a religion not a race or skin colour. Anybody can join. Leaving....well...not so much. So that Muslim lady who was flirting with me at the bar that time - it's ok for her to stay in Canada? Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
Guest Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 12 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: So that Muslim lady who was flirting with me at the bar that time - it's ok for her to stay in Canada? Poor judgement and/or eyesight doesn't enter into the immigration question... Quote
Michael Hardner Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 2 minutes ago, bcsapper said: Poor judgement and/or eyesight doesn't enter into the immigration question... I am so handsome. Take that back. Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
Argus Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 13 hours ago, Michael Hardner said: Isn't that the true Scotsman fallacy? No it's not. Are you a Socialist if you don't really believe in Socialism? How can you be a Muslim if you're not religious? Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
GostHacked Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Argus said: No it's not. Are you a Socialist if you don't really believe in Socialism? How can you be a Muslim if you're not religious? How can one be a Christian without following the bible to the letter? Same notion. I know many who claim to be of a certain religion but that goes as far as saying they believe in a God and that's about it. Non practicing Christians I think would be the term. You have varying degrees of a certain levels of religiousness in all religions. Edited September 3, 2017 by GostHacked 1 Quote
Guest Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 (edited) 47 minutes ago, Argus said: No it's not. Are you a Socialist if you don't really believe in Socialism? How can you be a Muslim if you're not religious? I've drank beer with Muslims and consoled divorced Catholics. I suppose the Pope and the closest Imam would say neither were what they claim, but if they claim it, I'm with them. Edited September 3, 2017 by bcsapper Quote
DogOnPorch Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said: So that Muslim lady who was flirting with me at the bar that time - it's ok for her to stay in Canada? In your hypothetical scenario, the supposed Muslim woman would have to have become an apostate in order to flirt with a male not a family member in a bar. Islam forbids it. Haram. Muslims practice Islam. If you don't practice Islam...you're not a Muslim. Islam is from the Quran and Hadiths. No other source is needed. Judaism, Christianity and Islam are all from the same desert in the Middle East. Skin colour has no actual bearing to joining the cult of Islam. You confuse it with a race due to many countries being near 100% Muslim in faith. This due to Islam's absolute intolerance to other faiths...or towards atheism for that matter. All others are suppressed or driven out. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
DogOnPorch Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 4 minutes ago, bcsapper said: I've drank beer with Muslims and consoled divorced Catholics. I suppose the Pope and the closest Imam would say neither were what they claim, but if they claim it, I'm with them. The Quran specifically forbids it. Quote 90: O you who have believed, indeed, intoxicants, gambling, [sacrificing on] stone alters [to other than Allah ], and divining arrows are but defilement from the work of Satan, so avoid it that you may be successful. 91: Satan only wants to cause between you animosity and hatred through intoxicants and gambling and to avert you from the remembrance of Allah and from prayer. So will you not desist? https://quran.com/5/90-91 You're a Muslim in Hell at that point... Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Michael Hardner Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 7 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: In your hypothetical scenario, the supposed Muslim woman would have to have become an apostate in order to flirt with a male not a family member in a bar. Islam forbids it. Haram. Muslims practice Islam. If you don't practice Islam...you're not a Muslim. Islam is from the Quran and Hadiths. No other source is needed. Judaism, Christianity and Islam are all from the same desert in the Middle East. Skin colour has no actual bearing to joining the cult of Islam. You confuse it with a race due to many countries being near 100% Muslim in faith. This due to Islam's absolute intolerance to other faiths...or towards atheism for that matter. All others are suppressed or driven out. So it seems like Muslims do leave the faith then. Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
DogOnPorch Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, GostHacked said: How can one be a Christian without following the bible to the letter? Same notion. I know many who claim to be of a certain religion but that goes as far as saying they believe in a God and that's about it. Non practicing Christians I think would be the term. You have varying degrees of a certain levels of religiousness in all religions. One has to accept Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior to be a Christian. Jesus said I have not come to change the laws but to fulfill them. This means that one doesn't follow the old laws if they conflict with Jesus's laws... Edited September 3, 2017 by DogOnPorch Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
DogOnPorch Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 Just now, Michael Hardner said: So it seems like Muslims do leave the faith then. Not under Sharia. And in the West, apostates are reviled...like Ayaan Hirsi Ali. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Guest Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 4 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: The Quran specifically forbids it. You're a Muslim in Hell at that point... And you'd be with that divorced Catholic who got the abortion. But while she's on this plane of existence, she can call herself whatever she wants. If one doesn't hold to that, all the numbers are wrong... Quote
DogOnPorch Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 Just now, bcsapper said: And you'd be with that divorced Catholic who got the abortion. But while she's on this plane of existence, she can call herself whatever she wants. If one doesn't hold to that, all the numbers are wrong... They are on the road to atheism...which should be encouraged. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Guest Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 Just now, DogOnPorch said: They are on the road to atheism...which should be encouraged. No argument there... Quote
DogOnPorch Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 Just now, bcsapper said: No argument there... Because you and I know what a pub is. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Michael Hardner Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 7 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: Not under Sharia. And in the West, apostates are reviled...like Ayaan Hirsi Ali. Right, but in the real world it appears to happen. Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
DogOnPorch Posted September 3, 2017 Report Posted September 3, 2017 10 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: Right, but in the real world it appears to happen. A rare occurrence since Muslims are not to take non-Muslims as friends or allies according to the Quran. The real world is which law happens to be calling the shots. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
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