betsy Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: Yeah, you did. Well, "must" isn't the same as "should." Given his lifestyle and his issues, especially how he dealt with women.....he should keep his mouth shut about Trump, if he doesn't want to look like an idiot! Twitting in public....he's only inviting tons of ridicule! His was a public statement, whereas Trump's was made privately. There's the huge difference. Edited December 31, 2016 by betsy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimmy Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 I think that if a deranged guy wants to go on Twitter and say crap and let the whole world know that he's a few cards short of a full deck, that's up to him. Who knows, people might like what he has to say. It could even lead to public office. Who knows. -k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dialamah Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 (edited) 13 minutes ago, betsy said: This man knowingly victimized women! And here you are, making a hero out of him! Oh....irony. Oh, liberals. Actually, I don't make a hero out of him; I feel about the same about him as I do Trump. Just because you find it easy to excuse rich/successful people doesn't mean everybody does. And as long as you continue to say it's all right for *some* people to say nasty things (because it's private) but not others (because it's not private), you are the engaging in hypocrisy. Edited December 31, 2016 by dialamah Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 (edited) 3 minutes ago, dialamah said: Actually, I don't make a hero out of him; I feel about the same about him as I do Trump. So, you equate Sheen's knowingly passing HIV to women, on the same footing as someone who's talking candidly (in private) about women that celebrities deal with in Hollywood? Uh.......liberals. What more can I say? :shrug: Quote Just because you find it easy to excuse rich/successful people doesn't mean everybody does. You downplay Sheen's actual grievous assault on women by putting it on equal footing with Trump's comment. Quote And as long as you continue to say it's all right for *some* people to say nasty things (because it's private) but not others (because it's not private), you are the one being a hypocrite. Given how you treat Sheen's assault against women, you do realize you're more talking about yourself than me? Edited December 31, 2016 by betsy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dialamah Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 Just now, betsy said: So, you equate Sheen's knowingly passing HIV to women, on the same footing as someone who's talking candidly (in private) about women that celebrities deal with in Hollywood? Uh.......what more can I say? :shrug: Equating behavior doesn't come into it - they are both pigs and I support neither of them. You, however, choose to support one of those pigs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCoastRunner Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 5 minutes ago, betsy said: So, you equate Sheen's knowingly passing HIV to women, on the same footing as someone who's talking candidly (in private) about women that celebrities deal with in Hollywood? Whoa! That's quite a leap!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 (edited) 20 minutes ago, dialamah said: Equating behavior doesn't come into it - they are both pigs and I support neither of them. You, however, choose to support one of those pigs. So they're both pigs. He still has the right to express himself though - whether you like what he says or not. What Trump said wasn't meant for your ears anyway - that's what we get for having eavesdropped! I support his right to express himself freely - especially in private. Because I hope someone would protect mine if ever it's threatened by self-appointed censors who want to dictate how we should live and think. We are living in a free society, with our constitutional rights to enjoy - it's something that must be protected. I hope the exchange we're having would make Canadians take pause, and see where our liberal society is taking us. It doesn't take much for some folks here to throw our rights under the bus. Edited December 31, 2016 by betsy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCoastRunner Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 11 minutes ago, betsy said: We are living in a free society, with our constitutional rights to enjoy - it's something that must be protected. I hope the exchange we're having would make Canadians take pause, and see where our liberal society is taking us. It doesn't take much for some folks here to throw our rights under the bus. Totally agree. I believe a woman's right to health care, should be protected from the Christian right and not thrown under the bus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omni Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 2 hours ago, bcsapper said: Not to split hairs, but he said, according to the quote on this page, "They let you do it". That's consent. So no rape, or sexual assault. Don't go to court using your definition of consent, you'll lose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omni Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 1 hour ago, betsy said: His statement was taken out of context. That's the issue. That's mot the issue, that's simply your feeble attempt to deflect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCoastRunner Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 8 hours ago, betsy said: That statement of Trump was deliberately taken out of context - the same way his statement that women who have abortion will go to jail, was taken out of context by the lying media! Trump, is not the moron. It wasn't taken out of context and he quickly walked back on it the very next day after the outrage from both sides. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 24 minutes ago, Omni said: Don't go to court using your definition of consent, you'll lose. Really, how come? Don't forget, I'm pro choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omni Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 1 minute ago, bcsapper said: Really, how come? Don't forget, I'm pro choice. Perhaps you heard of the judge who asked the rape victim why she didn't just keep her knees together? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 1 minute ago, Omni said: Perhaps you heard of the judge who asked the rape victim why she didn't just keep her knees together? Sure. Perhaps you've heard of the word "relevant"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
?Impact Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 18 hours ago, betsy said: Actually, if it wasn't for the election....Trump should never have apologised for what he said! They were having a private conversation. Like Clinton's emails? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omni Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 18 hours ago, betsy said: Actually, if it wasn't for the election....Trump should never have apologised for what he said! They were having a private conversation. It's the people who leaked that video who should apologise! Obviously you have completely missed the actual issue. It's not what he said, it's what he admitted to having done he needs to apologize for. Although the black mark on his character will be harder to erase. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimmy Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 22 minutes ago, bcsapper said: Really, how come? Don't forget, I'm pro choice. What Trump said is this, when they noticed Ariana Zucker: Quote I’ve gotta use some tic tacs, just in case I start kissing her. I'm automatically attracted to beautiful--- I just start kissing them. It's like a magnet. I just kiss, I don't even wait. And when you're a star, they let you do it. You can do anything — grab them by the pussy. You can do anything. If you walk up to a woman and kiss her or grab her genitals, that's a sexual assault. Whether she slaps your face afterward, or whether she kisses you back afterward, you started things off by acting like a predator. Maybe Trump feels that women let him do anything because none of them slap his face or call the police afterward, but that doesn't make it any less appalling. Personally, if someone walks up to me and grabs my genitals, they're getting a concussion. His attitude is clearly "I am a big deal so I am entitled to have access to women's bodies." Much like when he was bragging to Howard Stern that since he runs the beauty pageants he is entitled to walk into the changing room to look at the nude girls. -k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimmy Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 19 hours ago, betsy said: Actually, if it wasn't for the election....Trump should never have apologised for what he said! They were having a private conversation. It's the people who leaked that video who should apologise! Trump apologized because his comments revealed him to be an utter ass. The people who leaked to video gave us a look at what a contemptible individual he is. They have nothing to apologize for. -k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 4 minutes ago, kimmy said: What Trump said is this, when they noticed Ariana Zucker: If you walk up to a woman and kiss her or grab her genitals, that's a sexual assault. Whether she slaps your face afterward, or whether she kisses you back afterward, you started things off by acting like a predator. Maybe Trump feels that women let him do anything because none of them slap his face or call the police afterward, but that doesn't make it any less appalling. Personally, if someone walks up to me and grabs my genitals, they're getting a concussion. His attitude is clearly "I am a big deal so I am entitled to have access to women's bodies." Much like when he was bragging to Howard Stern that since he runs the beauty pageants he is entitled to walk into the changing room to look at the nude girls. -k Well, exactly. Concussion = not letting them do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimmy Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 2 minutes ago, bcsapper said: Well, exactly. Concussion = not letting them do it. Whether she yells at him, knocks him out, complains to the HR manager later, suffers in silence, or whatever doesn't make what he did any more or less of a crime. -k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dialamah Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 (edited) 6 minutes ago, bcsapper said: Well, exactly. Concussion = not letting them do it. If I walk up to someone and slap their face, I can assume its both legal and ok with them, unless they call the cops or slap me back? Edited December 31, 2016 by dialamah Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 Just now, kimmy said: Whether she yells at him, knocks him out, complains to the HR manager later, suffers in silence, or whatever doesn't make what he did any more or less of a crime. -k Only if she lets him do it. That makes it her choice. She really does get to choose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 1 minute ago, dialamah said: If I walk up to someone and slap their face, I can assume its both legal and ok with them, unless they call the cops or slap me back? If they say they are okay with it, they are okay with it. What about this is so hard to understand? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 4 minutes ago, kimmy said: Whether she yells at him, knocks him out, complains to the HR manager later, suffers in silence, or whatever doesn't make what he did any more or less of a crime. -k 3 minutes ago, dialamah said: If I walk up to someone and slap their face, I can assume its both legal and ok with them, unless they call the cops or slap me back? The problem here is, you're both irritated by the fact that a woman might allow a man to do something because she might get something out of it. It debases her, and that offends you. You can't take her choice away just because it offends you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimmy Posted December 31, 2016 Report Share Posted December 31, 2016 2 minutes ago, bcsapper said: Only if she lets him do it. That makes it her choice. She really does get to choose. And what about Trump's comment makes it sound like asks whether she agrees before he does the grabbing? -k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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