Boges Posted March 8, 2016 Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 (edited) http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/ohrc-urges-end-skimpy-dress-codes-1.3480998 The Ontario Human Rights Commission is calling for an end to sexualized dress codes that discriminate against female and transgender workers. Chief commissioner Renu Mandhane says employers must make sure their dress codes don't reinforce sexist stereotypes. ​Mandhane says policies requiring women to wear low-cut tops, short skirts or high heels could violate the human rights code, and they send a message than an employees' worth is tied to how they look. In a policy position paper released Tuesday on gender-specific dress codes, the commission said women should not be expected to dress in a sexualized way to attract clients. Kathy Laird of the Human Rights Legal Support Centre says "excellent customer service doesn't have a cup size." Laird encourages women to call her office for legal advice "if cleavage is deemed an essential skill in their workplace. Only in Canada this would be an issue for people. Bars that sexualize their staff is very commonplace. People who apply for these jobs know that they're being used for their sex appeal to make money for the business. Often it makes them a lot of money. Usually these restaurants are marketing to a specific clientele where the appearance of the waitress or bartender is a selling point. Legislating this kind of stuff is a huge slippery slope for any profession where appearance is an important aspect employment. Edited March 8, 2016 by Boges Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Squid Posted March 8, 2016 Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 Is there a Hooters in Ontario? This could pose a problem for that particular business model. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted March 8, 2016 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 Is there a Hooters in Ontario? This could pose a problem for that particular business model. Or even Strip Clubs. Plenty of restaurants do this. I was at a Shoeless Joe's with a friend a few weeks ago and were were struck by how gorgeous the wait staff was. Not sure how that's a problem. They were tipped accordingly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCoastRunner Posted March 8, 2016 Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 It's crazy to compare working at a strip club to a restaurant. Why do female servers need to show cleavage or a lot of leg. They can be just as hot when they are dressed classy and not made to look like a stripper/slut. Would a man tip less if they see less cleavage or more if they see a hot classy server? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted March 8, 2016 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 (edited) Would a man tip less if they see less cleavage or more if they see a hot classy server? Perhaps. But a waitress can choose to work at a place like the Keg or Milestones if they feel they want to dress in business casual attire. Sports Bars who cater to mostly men may want to present a different image. Edited March 8, 2016 by Boges Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC_chick Posted March 8, 2016 Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 I think they're the discussion is about restaurants where sex appeal is not supposed to be the niche. The article named places like Joey's, Earls amongst others. As the article stated many young people start their first job in the industry and that's where women are disadvantaged. I wore a skimpy outfit when I was a young server and I didn't mind it but I remember other servers complaining and tbh they had a right. Most of those places are couple restaurants, there is no need for it. Especially when the male servers don't have to do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted March 8, 2016 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 Most of those places are couple restaurants, there is no need for it. Especially when the male servers don't have to do it. And if you find it a repellant behaviour you don't have to go to restaurants that do that. Men also may not get tipped as generously as an attractive woman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCoastRunner Posted March 8, 2016 Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 And if you find it a repellant behaviour you don't have to go to restaurants that do that. Men also may not get tipped as generously as an attractive woman. It's a 'sexualized' behaviour which doesn't help society to treat women with respect but instead encourages the same old sexist issues for women. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC_chick Posted March 8, 2016 Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 (edited) What are you talking about? I'd be boycotting most restaurant chains. I am capable of finding the whole practice unnecessary and sexist and applause a little outside interference without a boycott. It's not fair to all the young women who are not comfortable with it. Eta - and who said repellent?? Edited March 8, 2016 by BC_chick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted March 8, 2016 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 It's a 'sexualized' behaviour which doesn't help society to treat women with respect but instead encourages the same old sexist issues for women. Yet we live in a country where prostitution is soon to be legal, if not already legal. I guess sexualization is only improper when the women are employees and not independent contractors. It's fine and good to find these practices distasteful. There's a Toronto area restaurant called the Tilted Kilt. I took a woman there because it's presented as an Pub. The women were essentially in bras and short kilts with the entire mid-rift showing. I apologized to the date as I had no idea that the wait staff dressed in such a manor. But it's my choice not to go to that place again. I would strongly oppose any model where the government is mandating dress codes for restaurants. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimG Posted March 8, 2016 Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 (edited) Yet we live in a country where prostitution is soon to be legal, if not already legal. I guess sexualization is only improper when the women are employees and not independent contractors.Ouch. If this HRC gets its way I guess it will open new business opportunities for brothels running restaurants... Edited March 8, 2016 by TimG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hal 9000 Posted March 8, 2016 Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 People make their own choices. If someone doesn't want to work at an establishment like that, then don't....but don't ruin it for those who do want to work there and the tips that go along with it. Another liberal trying to push another law! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted March 8, 2016 Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 I love how the same people who would argue that people should take any job they can get will also turn around and say they should just up and leave a job without hesitation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted March 8, 2016 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 (edited) I love how the same people who would argue that people should take any job they can get will also turn around and say they should just up and leave a job without hesitation. You would have to apply to a restaurant like this in the first place though. There are many jobs that have specialized requirements based on looks or health. Perhaps if you got a job at a Family Restaurant and out of the blue the owner said you have to wear sexy clothing, you'd have a point. Edited March 8, 2016 by Boges Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted March 8, 2016 Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 Why d,you have to work at one of these places to complain about the ridiculous requirement that women be objectified as servers, while men servers are not? More importantly why are women dependent on tips, while men get positions in these establishments that aren't? There's all kinds of double standards at play here that's worth discussing with a little more nuance than, "just go get another job." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted March 8, 2016 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 (edited) Why d,you have to work at one of these places to complain about the ridiculous requirement that women be objectified as servers, while men servers are not? More importantly why are women dependent on tips, while men get positions in these establishments that aren't? There's all kinds of double standards at play here that's worth discussing with a little more nuance than, "just go get another job." Male Bartenders and Servers can be dependent on tips as well. A group of women may be more willing to tip a good looking male as opposed to a woman regarding pay. There are always double standards regarding gender roles. Interestingly enough, this type of double standard can be advantageous to women. And this is not about supporting or not supporting such restaurants. People will do that on their own. But what kind of legislation can be tabled to prevent this in the same country where strip clubs and prostitution is legal. Are HRCs just going to start fining restaurants that have dress codes that have uniforms that meet some arbitrary definition of TOO sexy? Government officials going to restaurants measuring the length of the wait staff's skirts like at a Catholic school. Edited March 8, 2016 by Boges Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC_chick Posted March 8, 2016 Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 Strip clubs have different licenses than restaurants and I'm sure brothels will too. Nice red herring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Squid Posted March 8, 2016 Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 My sisters like the handsome male servers... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted March 8, 2016 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 Strip clubs have different licenses than restaurants and I'm sure brothels will too. Nice red herring. For the naked women and Lap Dances. But they serve food and have clothed staff that sell drinks. Would you be OK with a restaurant having to get a license to declare that they specialize in appealing to a male clientele? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted March 8, 2016 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 My sisters like the handsome male servers... They're clearly abhorrently sexist. You should chastise them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hal 9000 Posted March 8, 2016 Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 Why d,you have to work at one of these places to complain about the ridiculous requirement that women be objectified as servers, while men servers are not? More importantly why are women dependent on tips, while men get positions in these establishments that aren't? There's all kinds of double standards at play here that's worth discussing with a little more nuance than, "just go get another job." Men are objectified at certain jobs. They're also hired or not hired based on their looks. You don't see too many ugly or unkempt male servers either. A person - every one of us takes a job (or doesn't) that suits our looks, intelligence, personality etc. And yes, when you apply at a job for twin Peaks or Hooters, you sorta know what is expected of your appearance. If you can't deal with that, apply at Appleby's or McDonalds (where they complain that the uniforms make them look frumpy). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC_chick Posted March 8, 2016 Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 Would you be OK with a restaurant having to get a license to declare that they specialize in appealing to a male clientele? I would think places like your kilt restaurant, Hooters, strip clubs all have their place in society and should not adhere to any dress codes. I'm talking about places listed in the article where it's completely unnecessary and merely sexist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC_chick Posted March 8, 2016 Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 My sisters like the handsome male servers... Me too but I have yet to see a place where male servers are expected to dress nearly naked. They're always dressed in shirts and pants... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted March 8, 2016 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 I would think places like your kilt restaurant, Hooters, strip clubs all have their place in society and should not adhere to any dress codes. I'm talking about places listed in the article where it's completely unnecessary and merely sexist. But those restaurants are also not making their staff where ridiculously revealing cloth. Perhaps a Miniskirt or Exposed Cleavage. But the more important aspect is the attractiveness of the applicant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted March 8, 2016 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2016 Me too but I have yet to see a place where male servers are expected to dress nearly naked. They're always dressed in shirts and pants... Gender Roles, simple as that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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