Nuclear fusion: Closer than we think?

[Guest]

Have I been living in a barn for the last few years? A working fusion reactor within a decade? That's stunning.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/10/15/us-lockheed-fusion-idUSKCN0I41EM20141015

http://www.forbes.com/sites/williampentland/2014/10/15/lockheed-martin-claims-fusion-breakthrough-that-could-change-world-forever/

[bush_cheney2004]

Oh no...that evil defense contractor Lockheed Martin has been up to no good...working on fusion reactors.

[Guest]

It would be ironic if they saved the world, wouldn't it?

[Keepitsimple]

Wow - out of the blue - last I knew a prototype was envisioned around 2040. Sounds almost too good to be true - but that's what happens when there's a scientific breakthrough - and then leaps and bounds happen with the various applications.

Absolutely fantastic news!

[Derek 2.0]

If it comes to fruition, an obvious game changer.....in not only electric power generation and naval power plants, but also space flight and cheaper production of hydrogen for fuel cells......

[bush_cheney2004]

Never underestimate the power of tree hugging EnviroMentalists to slow this down. That's why they were not allowed on the Manhattan Project !

[Wilber]

Exciting stuff. Fingers crossed.

[Derek 2.0]

Never underestimate the power of tree hugging EnviroMentalists to slow this down. That's why they were not allowed on the Manhattan Project !

For sure........not only would it put a big dent in Big Oil & Coal, but also Big Solar & Wind.......

[Guest]

I don't see that myself. This is the Holy Grail for environmentalists.

[eyeball]

Good news for sure but given who's developing the technology I would caution people who have fusion reactor fuel under them to approach this very carefully. Fighting over fuel is just too lucrative a sideline in the business of producing energy to imagine Lockheed Martin won't try to exploit it.

[Wilber]

I don't see that myself. This is the Holy Grail for environmentalists.

You would think so. Never new the Manhattan Project was top secret because of tree huggers. Learn something new every day.

[Guest]

Some skeptical voices...

http://www.businessinsider.com/scientists-bash-lockheed-on-nuclear-fusion-2014-10

[overthere]

You would think so. Never new the Manhattan Project was top secret because of tree huggers. Learn something new every day.

Unfortunately that knowledge is a state secret.

Do not answer the door no matter how hard they hammer.

[bush_cheney2004]

You would think so. Never new the Manhattan Project was top secret because of tree huggers. Learn something new every day.

It was...the first thing they would have demanded was an "Environmental Impact Statement". Japan can answer that.

[Wilber]

It was...the first thing they would have demanded was an "Environmental Impact Statement". Japan can answer that.

When did the US government start issuing "Environmental Impact Statements" for top secret weapon systems?

[bush_cheney2004]

When did the US government start issuing "Environmental Impact Statements" for top secret weapon systems?

Sorry...still classified...NOFORN.

[Moonlight Graham]

It would be ironic if they saved the world, wouldn't it?

Bahaha yes.

[Bob Macadoo]

Funny though the reactor will fuse tritium. Guess what produces the most amount of tritium? CANDU fission reactors. Tritium fuel will be too expensive to be viable. Might as well have said we'll burn platinum.

[Shady]

This isn't good news for alarmists at all. If this succeeds, there won't be a reason to impose their oppressive enironmental and economic regulations on us anymore. Any guess as to the next crisis that will need their "remedy"?

[Mighty AC]

Abundant, cheap, clean, star powered electricity would be nice. Imagine closing the coal plants, leaving the tar sand in the ground and the world losing interest in the middle east.

[Shady]

Petroleum would still be needed, as it's a part of thousands of things that we use.

http://www.ranken-energy.com/Products%20from%20Petroleum.htm

And the middle east will cause the world problems for quite some time. Regardless of oil.

Edited October 17, 2014 by Shady

[On Guard for Thee]

This isn't good news for alarmists at all. If this succeeds, there won't be a reason to impose their oppressive enironmental and economic regulations on us anymore. Any guess as to the next crisis that will need their "remedy"?

Don't worry Shady, the environment will still be important to those who have an understanding of how it works. We've got you back.

[On Guard for Thee]

Abundant, cheap, clean, star powered electricity would be nice. Imagine closing the coal plants, leaving the tar sand in the ground and the world losing interest in the middle east.

That would be nice. And I'm quite happy if they hire all the people who currently produce all those tary things and keep them well employed. Just shut off those smoke stacks.

[Bonam]

I work in the fusion energy field.

Lockheed Martin's concept (what little they have revealed of it) suggests a hybrid between two well-explored methods: the tandem mirror and the Polywell. The two mirror concepts suffer from excessive end losses, preventing the core plasma from reaching the needed temperature and density. Meanwhile, in Polywell experiments, nothing close to fusion conditions has ever been observed. Although the concept could use benefits from both, the correct working of the physics and minimization of instabilities is far from assured.

More information on the Lockheed Martin concept can be found here:

http://aviationweek.com/technology/skunk-works-reveals-compact-fusion-reactor-details

Note the comment below by Tom Jarboe, a leading professor in fusion energy research, who notes that the configuration presented by Lockheed includes the use of two coils inside the fusion plasma, where they present major difficulties. He elaborates on what the difficulty of this topology implies for the size of the device, making it unfeasible.

Enthousiasts might also be interested to know that there are many other private companies pursuing fusion energy. These include:

Tri Alpha Energy : Colliding FRC fusion

General Fusion: Liquid metal magnetized target fusion

EMC2: Polywell confinement fusion

Helion Energy: Colliding FRC fusion

Like Lockheed Martin's, all of these concepts face varying challenges in being developed to a real commercializable system.

There are of course also the large scale experiments:

ITER - Tokamak magnetic confinement fusion (the most traditional approach and most highly funded)

NIF - Inertial confinement fusion

Wendelstein 7X - Stellarator

Note that almost all avenues involve using Deuterium - Tritium (DT) fuel, with the exception of Tri Alpha, which is considering the much more desirable (but more difficult) aneutronic proton-Boron reaction. The reason DT fuel is most often considered is it has the highest fusion cross-section, meaning it needs the lowest combination of temperature and density to create a self-sustaining fusion reaction. However, once the physics and engineering of fusion are worked out in first generation reactors, making the step to other reactions (like the holy grail of proton-Boron) will be much easier. In regards to the point about the availability of tritium fuel made by another member above, almost all fusion reactor designs that use DT, other than inertial confinement designs, make their own tritium through neutron irradiation of lithium in a blanket around the reactor. Deuterium is abundantly available in ocean water.

Edited October 17, 2014 by Bonam

[Bob Macadoo]

I work in the fusion energy field.

...

In regards to the point about the availability of tritium fuel made by another member above, almost all fusion reactor designs that use DT, other than inertial confinement designs, make their own tritium through neutron irradiation of lithium in a blanket around the reactor. Deuterium is abundantly available in ocean water.

Thank-you for that informative and practical post.

That method of tritium production is currently only available in small research scale......production scale may well be unmanageable. As well D2 is naturally occuring in ocean water but is currently expensive to sift out. I think 99% isotopic costs $500/L, don't know what refinement you need.