Moderating Mapleafweb's Moderation

[Big Guy]

..

As I and others consider YOU to be a baiter and agitator, despite your continual bleats of innocent nobility, I see your 'suggestion' as self-serving drivel.

...

I would not expect a more honest response from a German-Canadian-Millionaire-Working Class-Honest poster. But unlike yourself, I do not speak for others but only for myself. I let others speak for themselves.

BTW - Congratulations, your vocabulary seems to be expanding and your use of grammar may soon catch up. Once it reaches the level of the stronger posters here, I look forward to responding in kind.

[Argus]

I would not expect a more honest response from a German-Canadian-Millionaire-Working Class-Honest poster. But unlike yourself, I do not speak for others but only for myself. I let others speak for themselves.

Indeed, but, if I may quote Rex Murphy, you talk down to them without listening, which, along with your credulity in accepting information from dubious sources, is your greatest fault.

BTW - Congratulations, your vocabulary seems to be expanding and your use of grammar may soon catch up. Once it reaches the level of the stronger posters here, I look forward to responding in kind.

You mean with good grammar? Like your political and social positions, your insults are poorly thought-out.

[Big Guy]

Indeed, but, if I may quote Rex Murphy, you talk down to them without listening, which, along with your credulity in accepting information from dubious sources, is your greatest fault.

You mean with good grammar? Like your political and social positions, your insults are poorly thought-out.

You obviously did not understand my message. I will repeat it for you: "Congratulations, your vocabulary seems to be expanding and your use of grammar may soon catch up. Once it reaches the level of the stronger posters here, I look forward to responding in kind."

Until it reaches that level do not expect a response.

[Argus]

You obviously did not understand my message.

Well, it wasn't worth putting much time into understanding.

Until it reaches that level do not expect a response.

Uh huh. You've been "ignoring" me for a long time now, ever since you pompously declared you would. That doesn't seem to stop you from reading and replying to so many of my posts.

[Big Guy]

...

--- because I want to understand how you think. I think your suggestion is gravely wrong but I trust your intentions are right.

I want you to answer my questions so that I may express myself in terms that may convince you.

We are talking past eachother and I need to know your language. I am willing to put this extra effort into the conversation.

I believe that we both would like to diffuse any acrimony that begins to develop though discussion on this board when the focus changes to personal insults. It serves nothing to enhance dialogue and only derails thoughtful threads. I do understand the difficulty in trying to keep track of every thread that is beginning to evolve into personal grounds.

Your suggestion that baiting be ignored is great advice but after a while, it becomes irritating to a point where one wants to retaliate. A mosquito ignored may go away but to guarantee an end to the buzzing - one swats it.

I also assume that some posters on this board sign on to check out the "action". Many people attend car races to enjoy the accidents.

My point is that there are only one or two baiters and agitators on this board. You know who they are and I know who they are. I suggested a method to verify who they are through stats on who is consistently involved in personal insults. You have those stats.

On a personal level, you know I do not report others. I am prepared to accept any verbal challenge and retaliate what I feel appropriate and you may not.

Where I disagree is that when a mosquito has singled me out and is buzzing around my head you allow only "shooing away" rather than a good swat. One good swat and the mosquito is no longer an irritant.

Thank you for taking the extra time to address my concerns. Your job is not an easy one and I hope we are not talking past each other.

But as John Lydgate said: “You can please some of the people all of the time, you can please all of the people some of the time, but you can't please all of the people all of the time”.

Thank you for trying to please Big Guy.

Edited July 24, 2016 by Big Guy

[Big Guy]

Well, it wasn't worth putting much time into understanding.

Uh huh. You've been "ignoring" me for a long time now, ever since you pompously declared you would. That doesn't seem to stop you from reading and replying to so many of my posts.

You are missing the point. I continue to ignore that uninformed babble that you continue to contribute to any and every thread. It is obvious that you have an equal knowledge in all fields. I seldom comment on the content of your posts because there is nothing of consequence to comment upon. I do comment on your attitude and undermining of serious discussion here. You will notice that this thread deals with process and not product (you may have to get someone to explain that concept to you).

You are correct in that I do sometimes react to your unique and courageous interruptions when I am having an adult conversation with someone here. I have treated you like one treats a mosquito by first just "shooing" it away. I am reluctant to "swat" since the moderators here look on that process with disfavor. By request, I have just suggested to the mods a method to objectively identify the baiters and agitators and to deal with them accordingly. I have wasted far too much time on your personally and am moving on. Shoo, go away. Go find someone else to buzz.

[Argus]

You are missing the point. I continue to ignore that uninformed babble that you continue to contribute to any and every thread.

Oh, sorry if I don't spend all my time on Al Jazeera and Worldnews daily like you do. I give little credence to your constant bragging about how knowledgeable and well-informed you are since your posts amply demonstrate the opposite.

I seldom comment on the content of your posts because there is nothing of consequence to comment upon. I do comment on your attitude and undermining of serious discussion here.

And therein lies the almost laughable ignorance behind your complaints. You demand the moderators deal with people here who 'insult and bait' while in the same breath openly admit that rather than addressing the actual content of my posts you instead make 'me' the subject of your replies. You are confessing to the exact behavior the moderators have been striving to eliminate and remain in blissful ignorance of that fact!

You are correct in that I do sometimes react to your unique and courageous interruptions when I am having an adult conversation with someone here.

And once again, you show how confused you are about the purpose behind a discussion site. It's not here for you to have a 'conversation' with someone. All topics are open to 'interruption' from any and all viewers who wish to insert their own judgement of your opinions and positions. I know this deeply offends you, not the least because your opinions, generally lacking any coherent logic or reasonable evidence to support them can be difficult to defend. You have demonstrated that what you really want to do is get up on a pedestal, lecture people, and have your opinions be unquestioningly received and applauded. Sorry, not going to happen.

I have treated you like one treats a mosquito by first just "shooing" it away. I am reluctant to "swat" since the moderators here look on that process with disfavor.

As you have repeatedly demonstrated that you are singularly ill-equipped to 'swat' anyone except with banal and unimaginative personal insults I would suggest you

consider either addressing the substance of their arguments or simply go back to rabble, where the moderation does not permit 'progressive' opinions to be challenged. I'm quite sure you'll be happier there.

[Big Guy]

.... I'm quite sure you'll be happier there.

I will take the advice of the mods: Shoo, shoo. Go away. I do not feed trolls.

Edited July 24, 2016 by Big Guy

[Charles Anthony]

Folks,

Do not post requests for moderator intervention in the open forums.

If you want mod staff to intervene, you are expected to Report it to us by clicking the Report function and telling us what you want.

I believe that we both would like to diffuse any acrimony that begins to develop though discussion on this board when the focus changes to personal insults. It serves nothing to enhance dialogue and only derails thoughtful threads. I do understand the difficulty in trying to keep track of every thread that is beginning to evolve into personal grounds.

Agreed.

There is a pot-pourri of dynamic opinion here at MLW forums. It is mathematically impossible for there to be a vast array of opinion without a vast array of vehement disagreement over statements of fact and faith.

Disputes over fact invariably lead to disputes over character.

My point is that there are only one or two baiters and agitators on this board.

My point is that I disagree. Most of you engage in baiting and agitation but few of you are willing to admit/see it.

I suggested a method to verify who they are through stats on who is consistently involved in personal insults. You have those stats.

Incorrect.

We actually have to read a post before we judge whether it warrants an intervention. There is no artificial intelligence here. There is no automatic switch that goes off whenever somebody engages in what-you-perceive-to-be baiting and or agitation.

We read a post.

Then we read a few more posts around it to get the context.

If we judge the post warrants an intervention, we intervene.

Then we move on.

We do not log a tick-mark on member profiles to label them as baiters and agitators. Ergo, there are no "stats" for what you seek.

Last question:

Thank you for trying to please Big Guy.

Have you learned something new here?

Have you changed an opinion of yours after tolerating what you perceive to be baiting and agitation?

Over the past decade, I have learned many things by reading MLW forum posts and forcing myself to follow discussions where I would otherwise not care.

[Argus]

I will take the advice of the mods: Shoo, shoo. Go away. I do not feed trolls.

Did you know calling someone a troll is considered an insult and can bring warning points?

[Big Guy]

...

Last question:

Have you learned something new here?

Have you changed an opinion of yours after tolerating what you perceive to be baiting and agitation?

Over the past decade, I have learned many things by reading MLW forum posts and forcing myself to follow discussions where I would otherwise not care.

I have learned that you care enough to take the time to respond. I thank you for that. There are inherent problems created by any medium which allows individuals to express themselves without having to take responsibility for their statements. Moderation is the only method of control and no decision is met with unanimous agreement.

I do get frustrated when I am following or getting involved in a thread and one of the anonymous resident agitators jumps in and is allowed to derail it. But that is the nature of these boards. They seldom draw individuals who prefer, and are more comfortable with physical social contact.

Perhaps that is the price to pay to dialogue with those few, thoughtful, well researched and passionate individuals who are obviously very well versed in certain issues and are prepared to share that information here.

I believe that you know who the problem posters are but are reluctant to act because they are some of the most active members here, commenting on everything and anything, in an attempt get noticed. Unfortunately, I do not have any solutions short of pruning away the problems. You must be doing something right because of the number of articulate presentations that can often be found here.

Again, thank you for taking the time to respond to my concerns.

[Charles Anthony]

I have learned that you care enough to take the time to respond. I thank you for that.

Forgive me but perhaps my question was not clear. I was not asking about your dialogue with me. I want to ask about your dialogue with all of the other MLW forum members. Please afford me 1 last chance and permit me to re-phrase my question:

Have you learned something new from a troll** here? ever?

** troll = whoever Big Guy says should be banned

I believe that you know who the problem

No.

The only members who should be banned have already been banned.

[GostHacked]

No.

The only members who should be banned have already been banned.

Nah I'd throw a couple more on that list.

[Big Guy]

Forgive me but perhaps my question was not clear. I was not asking about your dialogue with me. I want to ask about your dialogue with all of the other MLW forum members. Please afford me 1 last chance and permit me to re-phrase my question:

Have you learned something new from a troll** here? ever?

** troll = whoever Big Guy says should be banned

No.

The only members who should be banned have already been banned.

That is like asking if a mosquito buzzing around my head as I am lining up my next shot on a golf course is going to improve my game. I have learned to try to ignore them. On a golf course I am able to swat them. Here, it is only you who are able to swat them. As to my definition of "troll" - I have seen you struggling with a definition that will satisfy all posters. Why should my personal definition matter?

As to the last part, it is obvious that you disagree with me that there are still on this board participants whose only role appears to be to disrupt intelligent dialogue or insult anyone who does not fit into their political agenda. It is after all your board and you make those decisions. I disagree with your statement but I am only one participant and here by choice. If/when the agitators become more of a negative than the positive of reading well researched views, then I will vote with my feet - as will anyone else who participates on these boards.

Thank you for asking.

[GostHacked]

Did you know calling someone a troll is considered an insult and can bring warning points?

Trolls are trolls, call them out as you see them. But think of that next time you throw out 'those on the left' ......

[Charles Anthony]

When problems of fighting occur in schools, sometimes the easiest solution is to remove the cause.

That is not the only easy solution.

If the goal of the intervention is only to put an end to the activity, the easiest solution is to cheat and or to choose the winning side.

All I really need to know I learned in kindergarten.

I have learned to try to ignore them.

I suggest you make things easier on yourself by using the Ignore feature of the forum.

[Big Guy]

...

All I really need to know I learned in kindergarten.

I suggest you make things easier on yourself by using the Ignore feature of the forum.

I will seriously consider your advice. I am also sharing the advice you received in kindergarten:

1. Share everything.

2. Play fair.

3. Don't hit people.

4. Put thngs back where you found them.

5. CLEAN UP YOUR OWN MESS.

6. Don't take things that aren't yours.

7. Say you're SORRY when you HURT somebody.

8. Wash your hands before you eat.

9. Flush.

10. Warm cookies and cold milk are good for you.

11. Live a balanced life - learn some and drink some and draw some and paint some and sing and dance and play and work everyday some.

12. Take a nap every afternoon.

13. When you go out into the world, watch out for traffic, hold hands, and stick together.

14. Be aware of wonder. Remember the little seed in the Stryrofoam cup: The roots go down and the plant goes up and nobody really knows how or why, but we are all like that.

15. Goldfish and hamster and white mice and even the little seed in the Styrofoam cup - they all die. So do we.

16. And then remember the Dick-and-Jane books and the first workd you learned - the biggest word of all - LOOK.”

BYW. I noticed an ongoing civil debate in my backyard:

Debate

[Charles Anthony]

0. Big people lie.

[?Impact]

Interesting dynamic

[Argus]

Folks,

Please avoid trolling and responding to trolling.

A bunch of posts were taken down because they were all sister branches off of a trolling post.

I'm curious. You've made two separate forays today into deleting all these argumentative, off topic posts and yet you've left up the original trolling post.

It's a post which is blatant flame bait, and basically insulted every person on the topic who disagreed with the poster about segregating swimming classes by gender, and it's still there.

Edited August 11, 2016 by Argus

[Big Guy]

I'm curious. You've made two separate forays today into deleting all these argumentative, off topic posts and yet you've left up the original trolling post.

It's a post which is blatant flame bait, and basically insulted every person on the topic who disagreed with the poster about segregating swimming classes by gender, and it's still there.

So we have the most prolific reporter and complainer crying again because he might not be getting his way.

Curious? I would suggest confused is a more accurate term. But ducks do have difficulty with the English language. If you disagree with how this site is managed then move on. Please.

Edited August 12, 2016 by Big Guy

[Spiderfish]

I'm curious. You've made two separate forays today into deleting all these argumentative, off topic posts and yet you've left up the original trolling post.

It's a post which is blatant flame bait, and basically insulted every person on the topic who disagreed with the poster about segregating swimming classes by gender, and it's still there.

Yeah, that had me a bit curious as well.

Curious? I would suggest confused is a more accurate term. But ducks do have difficulty with the English language. If you disagree with how this site is managed then move on. Please.

How many warning points did you say you have managed to rack up in your self-absorbed duck hunting foray? 14?...15? As I mentioned previously, the moderators seem to have found the source of much of the quacking.

[Big Guy]

Yeah, that had me a bit curious as well.

How many warning points did you say you have managed to rack up in your self-absorbed duck hunting foray? 14?...15? As I mentioned previously, the moderators seem to have found the source of much of the quacking.

As to points, I have lost track of the number. Mods generally allow anything until someone complains. I have never made a complaint but I have a pretty good idea who the complainer would be in my case.

I have been called many things in my time. Most were faulty and based on misinformation. I just let those comments go because there was no substance to them. Now I have noticed that the duck analogy has hit a nerve with you. Why is that? If there is not some truth to the analogy in your case, then why such an indignant reaction?

There are those on this board who consider themselves as superior to the recent immigrants who will soon be Canadians. They and/or their ancestors were also immigrants but they want the door closed now because these folks do not look like them, do not talk like them, do not worship the same god as them and probably smell bad. The truth is that many of the immigrants are smarter than them and will probably succeed far better than the racists. They fear this competition. Being Canadian is their RIGHT! - even if their families are not native to this country. They feel ENTITLED!!!

This is where the mods get caught in the middle. They have decided that racists cannot be called racists on this site - for various reasons. Because of this restriction, the racists now feel vindicated and continue to try to intellectualize or rationalize by cloaking their prejudices in self-righteous gaffly-gob.

I do not know what is the big deal. Big Guy has been called every name in the book by the different posters who resent his truthful messages, are unable to counter them with facts and instead go after the messenger. They have lost the moral ground and want to strike back. He understands that - and that is why it does not bother him. Those insults and names just re-enforce the fact that he has hit the nerve of conscience. That is why he has not and will not report any negative comments. He has no need for protection from angry losers.

I suggest that you spend a little more time contemplating why some Big Guy statements are hitting a nerve with you folks and less time looking to the mods for help.

Yes, I have received a number of warning points to remind me what the parameters are of this board. I have not contested or complained about those decisions. I thank them for that direction.

Perhaps it is time for you folks to look in a mirror and read some of your anti-immigrant rhetoric. It may be something of which you are not proud.

Edited August 12, 2016 by Big Guy

[cybercoma]

Warning points are a joke. More than half of mine come from interactions with a single poster on here who constantly instigated. That poster no longer posts here and surprise surprise, I all but stopped getting points.

[Argus]

This is where the mods get caught in the middle. They have decided that racists cannot be called racists on this site - for various reasons.

One of your many problems is you consider anyone who objects to or disapproves of any aspect of any foreign culture to be a 'racist'. Yet it's human nature to judge, and certainly, you have no hesitation in judging others as you have demonstrated many times.

You also have a paternalistic sense of duty to 'protect' anyone you perceive as a visible minority from criticism - something I assure you no visible minority will thank you for nor needs.

This causes you extreme frustration since you want to scream "Racist!" all the time here and are not allowed. I sympathize, to some extent. There are many pejorative terms I feel would be honestly and suitably applied to some of the posters here, such as "moron", "idiot", "imbecile", "pompous ass", as well as a variety which are more crude, but which I honestly feel apply.

I leave it to you to imagine which of these I would honestly apply to you as a reflection of my opinion of you. But of course, I'm not allowed to do that, any more than you're allowed to call people racist.

My heart bleeds.

If you object to an opinion someone here expresses, towards immigrants or anything else, I have a novel suggestion. Why don't you make the attempt - you never have thus far - to actually discuss your objection to that opinion in a rational and intelligent fashion instead of getting up on your podium like some dark ages priest and screaming "Heretic!" at people?