Boges Posted February 16, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 The point that you're obviously missing is that this is not a tyranny. The governing party is supposed to open the floor to debate and listen to possible amendments, etc. The Conservatives have shut down debate more often than any other party. Harper has even prorogued parliament not to answer questions. As mentioned before this internet crime bill is an example of where consultation has proved that the governments initial idea of what the bill is thought to be over-reaching and changes will be made. But that's not what this thread about. Trudeau Jr. didn't cite the fact that the CPC have been shutting down debate on issues. He just nebulously stated a hypothetical universe in which he may consider separation to be a good idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PIK Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 Funny thing how quebec culture is protected in this country but the english culture was ripped out of this country by trudeau. The amopunt of money wasted on biligualism for a very small part of the population, and as the little one said----When Quebec is not involved in governing the country," he explained, "it moves too much to the right." So the apple does not fall from the tree does it. And again he went after the FLQ hard,(which people thought was to protect the country)but it really was to not make the separtist movement look bad ,real bad. I don't think PET had any love for english canada. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 No, there is a vote every 4 years or less...So the constituencies that elect opposition members only get a say every 4 years? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 Funny thing how quebec culture is protected in this country but the english culture was ripped out of this country by trudeau. What the hell are you even talking about? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted February 16, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 (edited) So the constituencies that elect opposition members only get a say every 4 years? What say did the Reform/Alliance MPs have in all of the years of the Chretien/Liberal rule? Opposition has Question Period to highlight and try to hold the government to account but simple democracy shows that the government has the power to pass any legislation they want assuming the vote is whipped. Edited February 16, 2012 by Boges Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 english culture was ripped out of this country by trudeau No offense, but this is one of the silliest things I've ever read on this forum in a long time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted February 16, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 That's twice in this thread someone has called PIK's thoughts on PET's separatist leaning one of the most ridiculous things said on this board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted February 16, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 (edited) I normally find Chantel Hebert one of the least objectionable of the Toronto Star columnists but this column today just doesn't make sense. http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/politics/article/1131856--hebert-harper-s-alienation-of-quebec-just-what-the-liberals-need?bn=1 As the issues on which Quebec and Ottawa don’t even seem to be able to agree to disagree continued to multiply earlier this month, Premier Charest waded in: “In a democracy, you can’t just say, ‘I won, you lost, I’m going to do what I want,’ ” he said.If this were a fairy tale, Harper would be the character who keeps poking a sleeping dragon with a tin sword. Unlike in a fairy tale, there is no guaranteed happy ending to this story — not for Canada but also not for the Conservatives themselves. The deteriorating Ottawa-Quebec climate could be the gift of life to both the Parti Québécois and the federal Liberals. Quebecers are never more likely to install sovereignists in power than when they feel collectively threatened and, on that score, most don’t take their cues from self-interested sovereignists but rather from the body language of federalists. That body language has not exhibited as much discomfort with the direction Canada is taking since the 1990 Meech Lake constitutional crisis. The virtual disappearance of the Bloc Québécois and the less-than-stellar performance of the NDP is increasing Quebec’s sense of vulnerability. So because Quebecers hate Harper and the rest of the country pretty much hates Quebec; the Nationalist movement might see an uptick? But how does that benefit Federalist Liberals? Edited February 16, 2012 by Boges Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 So because Quebecers hate Harper and the rest of the country pretty much hates Quebec; the Nationalist movement might see an uptick? No everyone in Quebec hates Harper, and certainly the rest of the country doesn't hate Quebec. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted February 16, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 No everyone in Quebec hates Harper, and certainly the rest of the country doesn't hate Quebec. Hyperbole FTW. Clearly not everyone, Harper still has a handful of seats in Quebec. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 Hyperbole FTW. I wasn't the one being hyperbolic, that was you. There are actually a not insignificant number of Conservatives in Quebec. That isn't very well reflected in their seat count because of what the NDP did last election. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWTT Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 What say did the Reform/Alliance MPs have in all of the years of the Chretien/Liberal rule? Opposition has Question Period to highlight and try to hold the government to account but simple democracy shows that the government has the power to pass any legislation they want assuming the vote is whipped. Thats why you should vote NDP! WWWTT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted February 16, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 I wasn't the one being hyperbolic, that was you. There are actually a not insignificant number of Conservatives in Quebec. That isn't very well reflected in their seat count because of what the NDP did last election. I know I was being hyperbolic. What was the CPC's popular vote total in La Belle Province last May. I still sore that the 2008 election went the way it did because Quebec were worried about Arts funding so they didn't vote for Harper and that cost him the Majority. That's why I was more than happy the see the CPC win a majority with little support from Quebec last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 What was the CPC's popular vote total in La Belle Province last May. Again, that isn't a good measure. The NDP stole much of the thunder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evening Star Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 What say did the Reform/Alliance MPs have in all of the years of the Chretien/Liberal rule? Reform practically wrote the 1995 budget! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 Hyperbole FTW. Clearly not everyone, Harper still has a handful of seats in Quebec. There is a widening of the already existing cultural rift between English Canada and Quebec. The political voting pattern is an indication of that. While the federal government was led by a Quebecer, and bent over backwards to please Quebec, this was not quite so obvious. But now that we have a party which is oriented more to Western Canada and owes almost nothing to Quebec it's become much more clear. But hey, that's okay. I hope Quebec does separate. At least Greece would have someone to look down on as being even less fiscally responsible than they are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 I hope Quebec does separate. Maybe you should separate? Quebec, by the way, is not in the same fiscal position as the Hellenic Republic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 Rex Murphy nailed it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tilter Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 Again, that isn't a good measure. The NDP stole much of the thunder. reword that to The St Jack stole much of the thunder He's gone & so is any NDP influence in PQ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiddleClassCentrist Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 Conservative circle jerk over a single comment. And yet there are hundreds of crazy harper quotes flying around. "You have to remember that west of Winnipeg the ridings the Liberals hold are dominated by people who are either recent Asian immigrants or recent migrants from eastern Canada; people who live in ghettos and are not integrated into Western Canadian society." "Canada is a Northern European welfare state in the worst sense of the term, and very proud of it" To prepare for possible attacks against what their leader said in the past, the Conservatives compiled a 500-page book of controversial Stephen Harper quotes. What the Conservatives didn't expect on was that the book would fall into the hands of the Liberals during the election campaign. The book of Harper quotes is available at the following address: http://www.scribd.com/doc/53953055/Harpers-Big-Book-of-Fancy-Quotations 500 Pages for all of the crazy comments Stephen Harper has made. Trudeau's comment, taken in its context, says only that if the Conservatives took Canada back to the dark ages (AKA Conservatopia) then he'd want to leave that environment. Maybe not the best wording but the media really did have to do some twisting to make it seem worse than it was. And the media loves the Harp Dog. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 Maybe you should separate? Childish. Quebec, by the way, is not in the same fiscal position as the Hellenic Republic. Only because it gets billions from TROC to keep it out of bankruptcy. Withdraw that money and Quebec would be bankrupt tomorrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 Childish. Yes, you're remarks about wishing one of the founding parts of this country leave were very adult. Only because it gets billions from TROC to keep it out of bankruptcy. Withdraw that money and Quebec would be bankrupt tomorrow. Again, no. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted February 18, 2012 Report Share Posted February 18, 2012 Only because it gets billions from TROC to keep it out of bankruptcy. Withdraw that money and Quebec would be bankrupt tomorrow. They don't pay any kind of federal taxes in Quebec? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbg Posted February 18, 2012 Report Share Posted February 18, 2012 From the sounds of the remarks, Trudeau is a traitor. His dad wasn't so honorable either; he hung out with an anti-Jewish crowd. He was only pro-Canada to the extent that he knew that Quebec, as a swing voting province, can punch above its weight. The Trudeau family is a cancer on Canada. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted February 18, 2012 Report Share Posted February 18, 2012 http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/2012/02/17/andrew-coyne-the-problem-with-justin-trudeaus-petty-separatism-threat-is-that-its-so-commonplace/ Wonderful piece by Andrew Coyne. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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