Boges Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 (edited) http://www.canada.com/Trudeau+clarifies+stance+Quebec+sovereignty/6155365/story.html Liberal MP Justin Trudeau delivered an emotional defence of his commitment to Canada, Tuesday, after provoking a political firestorm through his own public musings about Quebec independence.Trudeau, who, like his father, has always been known as a staunch defender of Canada, kick-started the controversy in a Frenchlanguage radio interview as he expressed his outrage over the policies and the direction of the Conservative government. But the pro-Quebec outburst forced him to clear the air with a three-minute address in front of a mob of reporters and cameras, waiting for him on Parliament Hill. "The question is not why does Justin Trudeau suddenly not love this country because the question is ridiculous," Trudeau said, immediately after walking up to a microphone outside the House of Commons. "I live this country in my bones every breath I take, and I'm not going to stand here and somehow defend that I actually do love Canada because we know I love Canada." Two days earlier, Trudeau explained that his opposition to social conservative policies under Prime Minister Stephen Harper's government were pushing him to the edge. "I always say that if, some time, I believed that Canada was really the Canada of Stephen Harper, and it was going against abortion, and it was going against same-sex marriage, and that it was moving backwards in 10,000 different ways, maybe I would think about making Quebec a country," said the Montreal-area MP in the weekend interview with Radio-Canada. Look if you're not a Harper fan, I get it. But to imply that Harper is doing so many things wrong that people in Quebec would be right to think separation is good is beyond ridiculous. All the bad things people say about Harper are things everyone knew going into the 2011 election and he won a majority. To say he's ruining the country less than a year into his mandate is sour grapes. I'd like him to run down some of the "10,000" way Harper is ruining the country. 2 of those things certainly aren't re-opening abortion or same-sex marriage. And what's with his speaking in the 3rd person defense of himself? This guy is an absolute clown! Edited February 15, 2012 by Boges Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shakeyhands Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 Talk about fabricated outrage... Reading comprehension REALLY is a challenge sometimes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted February 15, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 Talk about fabricated outrage... Reading comprehension REALLY is a challenge sometimes. So you're saying I fabricated this story? Or the any number of media outlets that are reporting it and the reporters that caused him to make his 3rd person diatribe in the commons yesterday? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CPCFTW Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 Trudeau is officially anti-Canadian. Way to go libs... Firm up that center vote for Harper!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 Look if you're not a Harper fan, I get it. But to imply that Harper is doing so many things wrong that people in Quebec would be right to think separation is good is beyond ridiculous. you're making shyte up to suit your own purposeful agenda - you incorrectly attach a definite separatist intent/want to Justin Trudeau's words. He did nothing more than offer a despondent reaction to the direction he perceives the country is heading... that if at some, "given time, he believed that Canada was really the Canada of Stephen Harper"..... You can keep pumping that majority tag for all you're worth - 60% of Canadians did not vote for the Canada of Stephen Harper. In recent weeks you are beginning to see the expressed negative reaction/criticism of Canadians, not just the 60%, to stated intentions of this Harper Conservative government. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 (edited) Trudeau is officially anti-Canadian. Way to go libs... Firm up that center vote for Harper!! why not troll on over to this thread... show us just how that center vote is being firmed up, hey? Edited February 15, 2012 by waldo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 Could Trudeau have chosen his words more carefully ? I think so. Personally, I have never seen potential for leadership in him and I hope that this incident somehow puts him further from the leadership. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukin Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 Justin trudeau is a weak politician. He is a perfect fit for the Liberals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaycola Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 I agree that Trudeau could have chosen his words more carefully but the point he was attempting to make is worth discussing. First off, Harper is a Majority Prime Minister with 40% support of Canadians. While that is a fact of our parliamentary electoral system, it does not give Harper the tacit justification to make major changes in social policy without bringing the issues to the public. If Western led, conservative majority government makes drastic changes in Canada's social policy such as Gay marriage and abortion, it is not the kind of Canada I would want to be part of either. If the justice system is reformed into "one size fits all" sentencing, it is not a justice system I would support or have faith in. Trudeau's comments simply highlight the divisions in our country that exist along both geographical and linguistic lines. The federal conservatives had focused their election platform on economic issues and gained support as a result. Had they made social change the focus of their campaign, as did the Ontario PC party, I think their support would have waned and they would not now be in a majority position Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mentalfloss Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 (edited) you're making shyte up to suit your own purposeful agenda - you incorrectly attach a definite separatist intent/want to Justin Trudeau's words. A conservative twisting the message to suit his political agenda? No way... Trudeau says he'll help Quebec separate - The Toronto Sun Edited February 15, 2012 by mentalfloss Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topaz Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 Trudeau is officially anti-Canadian. Way to go libs... Firm up that center vote for Harper!! Show how Trudeau is anti-Canadian? Because he disagrees with the Harper? You'd find MORE Canadians disagreeing with Harper than agreeing and you know it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Peeves Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 Could Trudeau have chosen his words more carefully ? I think so. Personally, I have never seen potential for leadership in him and I hope that this incident somehow puts him further from the leadership. Pretty deep thought for someone apparently with his mother's brain pool that opens his mouth and inserts foot at near any opportunity. The guys a popinjay, an inconsequential fop with an unfortunate inclination to impulsive pettifoggery. I might add he lacks my respect in any capacity although that opinion might be redundant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Peeves Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 (edited) Show how Trudeau is anti-Canadian? Because he disagrees with the Harper? You'd find MORE Canadians disagreeing with Harper than agreeing and you know it. So you suggest his remarks are of a sovereignist ? Edited February 15, 2012 by Peeves Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shakeyhands Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 So you're saying I fabricated this story? Or the any number of media outlets that are reporting it and the reporters that caused him to make his 3rd person diatribe in the commons yesterday? See? Reading comprehension IS hard for some. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Squid Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 A stupid thing to say.... If the Cons do something that you don't like, you don't separate from the country.... you work to fix it! What happens when a Quebec national gov't does something he doesn't like? His little piece of Quebec separates to become Trudeau-astan? A little Utopia ruled by his highness? This guy is the saviour of the Liberals? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Peeves Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 I agree that Trudeau could have chosen his words more carefully but the point he was attempting to make is worth discussing. First off, Harper is a Majority Prime Minister with 40% support of Canadians. While that is a fact of our parliamentary electoral system, it does not give Harper the tacit justification to make major changes in social policy without bringing the issues to the public. If Western led, conservative majority government makes drastic changes in Canada's social policy such as Gay marriage and abortion, it is not the kind of Canada I would want to be part of either. If the justice system is reformed into "one size fits all" sentencing, it is not a justice system I would support or have faith in. Trudeau's comments simply highlight the divisions in our country that exist along both geographical and linguistic lines. The federal conservatives had focused their election platform on economic issues and gained support as a result. Had they made social change the focus of their campaign, as did the Ontario PC party, I think their support would have waned and they would not now be in a majority position Just a question. I keep seeing the 40% number used in a pejorative manner yet Harper received another victory, a majority, and obviously the other parties got less of the vote than 40%. To me that suggests , (A the voters spoke. (B. the losers lost. (C. Anyone using the 40% figure is ignoring the reality of elections since many winners are in the (only) 40% range. So my question is, why do those that disagree with our government resort to paper tigers and straw man arguments? Tell us with what policies you disagree and how you would do otherwise. Like Trudeau, you seem not to have a clue which way to turn beyond throwing spitballs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mentalfloss Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 (edited) It appears as if he was just making an offhand comment about the life of a separatist and how it could be valid if the worst ideals of conservatism came to fruition. Makes sense, but based on his statement, he's also aware that it will never really come to that. Edited February 15, 2012 by mentalfloss Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mentalfloss Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 (edited) Just a question. I keep seeing the 40% number used in a pejorative manner yet Harper received another victory, a majority, and obviously the other parties got less of the vote than 40%. To me that suggests , (A the voters spoke. (B. the losers lost. (C. Anyone using the 40% figure is ignoring the reality of elections since many winners are in the (only) 40% range. There are values that synonymous with both Liberals and NDP voters that make up the 60%. I think that's what people usually refer to when they quote the 40% Conservative base, or make statements that the country is clearly not centre-right as they would have you believe. Edited February 15, 2012 by mentalfloss Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 If the Cons do something that you don't like, you don't separate from the country.... you work to fix it! What? By debating in the House? Oh... right. The CPC has shutdown, shortened, and otherwise subverted the democratic process in the House more than any government in our history. They seem to think majority and tyranny are synonyms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olpfan1 Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 Thank goodness we have Supreme Court of Canada and The Charter without those we'd be doomed but I have a feeling they won't let Harper get away with going overboard.. even the Conservative judges so far have shown no political bias Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted February 15, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 There are values that synonymous with both Liberals and NDP voters that make up the 60%. I think that's what people usually refer to when they quote the 40% Conservative base, or make statements that the country is clearly not centre-right as they would have you believe. Yes but there are many in the Liberal party that have far more in common with the Harper Conservatives than thy do the NDP. And there are many in the NDP that have far more in common with a Communist party than they do the Liberals. I don't think Canada's left can be pigeon-holed into a single big-tent party like the CPC did with Canada's Right. As for the 40% figure. Did the Liberals consult with the other members of the Commons when they failed to receive a 50% mandate in their 3 majorities? Stephen Harper is doing what he ran an election on, and in every election he's ran his support has grown. And to still be fear-mongering about some social conservative agenda is just that: fear mongering. Other than a vote on re-opening the issue of Same-sex marriage (which was a promise to his base that I bet he prayed he lost) he doesn't have a whole lot to say about social issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keepitsimple Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 Thank goodness we have Supreme Court of Canada and The Charter without those we'd be doomed but I have a feeling they won't let Harper get away with going overboard.. even the Conservative judges so far have shown no political bias That's because they're Conservatives! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 Could Trudeau have chosen his words more carefully ? I think so. Personally, I have never seen potential for leadership in him and I hope that this incident somehow puts him further from the leadership. it's only his name that raises the scrutiny bar. It's also his name that should remove him from any serious leadership considerations... simply because of the polarization his name brings forward for some; not unlike the polarization that the name Harper invokes, for some. In any case, that is Justin Trudeau's 'cross to bear', rightly or wrongly. This is also red-meat territory for uberConservativePartisans... anything to distract away from the current stumbling, bumbling pattern of the Harper Conservatives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Squid Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 What? By debating in the House? Oh... right. The CPC has shutdown, shortened, and otherwise subverted the democratic process in the House more than any government in our history. They seem to think majority and tyranny are synonyms. No, by winning an election! If Trudeau thinks that the CPC's are going to become a dictatorship and elections will be banned forever, then I can see separation as a solution. But we have elections every 4 years. The CPC's won't win if they start cramming their crazy ideology down Canadian's throats! They are already shooting themselves in the foot with their ideologically driven "crime agenda"... Prepare to be voted back in to government and fix the problems the CPCs have caused! Don't take your ball and go home! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 It's a good thing that we have uberLiberalPartisans like Waldo here to defend Trudeau's flawed remarks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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