blueblood Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 Your explanation doesn't sound biased at all. Ignore the adjectives then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olp1fan Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 We'll see if this was the right idea in 5-10 years...but if its a failure this will not bode well for the cons during the 2014 or 2015? election, might actually sink them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueblood Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 We'll see if this was the right idea in 5-10 years...but if its a failure this will not bode well for the cons during the 2014 or 2015? election, might actually sink them How would it be a failure? wheat acreage has gone up in Ontario where this sort of thing was tried and in Australia. Don't hear very much complaints. All grain prices right now are at very favorable levels. The board disappearing isn't going to change that, and with current price levels there won't be any desire for change of gov't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olp1fan Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 How would it be a failure? wheat acreage has gone up in Ontario where this sort of thing was tried and in Australia. Don't hear very much complaints. All grain prices right now are at very favorable levels. The board disappearing isn't going to change that, and with current price levels there won't be any desire for change of gov't. like i said, in 4 years we'll see and it will be an election issue that could haunt the tories OR could boost them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueblood Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 like i said, in 4 years we'll see and it will be an election issue that could haunt the tories OR could boost them Considering that any producer with a brain in their head rotates their crops and those crops typically being non-board grains and the fact that those producers are not only surviving but thriving with at least half of their production in non-board grains should bode well for the tories. Do you think we do things like the old south before the civil war and plant wall to wall wheat every year and the board handles all of producer's production? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olp1fan Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 Considering that any producer with a brain in their head rotates their crops and those crops typically being non-board grains and the fact that those producers are not only surviving but thriving with at least half of their production in non-board grains should bode well for the tories. Do you think we do things like the old south before the civil war and plant wall to wall wheat every year and the board handles all of producer's production? Canada had a civil war? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueblood Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 Canada had a civil war? Really? In the old south growers down there would grow cotton every year, and it turned out to cause production problems later on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olp1fan Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 (edited) Really? In the old south growers down there would grow cotton every year, and it turned out to cause production problems later on. where the hell is the old south in canada? do you mean Lower Canada Edited October 22, 2011 by olp1fan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 Im for opening markets, and regulating them. This is the right move for that, and it will probably present opportunities for processing within this country that previously didn't exist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olp1fan Posted October 23, 2011 Report Share Posted October 23, 2011 (edited) Im for opening markets, and regulating them. This is the right move for that, and it will probably present opportunities for processing within this country that previously didn't exist. hog farmers had a board and since it was disbanded manitoba went from 5000hog farmers to 300 in a matter of years same will happen here http://greenparty.ca/media-release/2011-10-19/loss-wheat-board-will-kill-family-grain-farms Edited October 23, 2011 by olp1fan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueblood Posted October 23, 2011 Report Share Posted October 23, 2011 Im for opening markets, and regulating them. This is the right move for that, and it will probably present opportunities for processing within this country that previously didn't exist. Correct Alliance Grain is dropping 50 million bucks in Regina to build a pulse and pasta plant citing that the loss of the cwb monopoly was a major factor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted October 23, 2011 Report Share Posted October 23, 2011 Correct Alliance Grain is dropping 50 million bucks in Regina to build a pulse and pasta plant citing that the loss of the cwb monopoly was a major factor. And people consider this to be a bad thing? That one investment alone, is huge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topaz Posted October 23, 2011 Report Share Posted October 23, 2011 I thought at first having choice would be the best way, make everyone happy but, on thinking about more I could see a problem rising. If the 40,000 farmer's that wanted the WB and went through it to sell their grain and the other farmer's didn't and had a friend in Ottawa, I could see those 40,000 not being able to find buyers for their grain if the other farmers against had direct buyer's with a little help from their friend in Ottawa, which would make the WB fold and die. If Harper has to get rid of the WB, he'll do it one way or another. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueblood Posted October 23, 2011 Report Share Posted October 23, 2011 And people consider this to be a bad thing? That one investment alone, is huge. We have massive investment in the prairies the last 5 years iin value added production in non-board grains. Guess how much private investment in value added production for board grains... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueblood Posted October 23, 2011 Report Share Posted October 23, 2011 I thought at first having choice would be the best way, make everyone happy but, on thinking about more I could see a problem rising. If the 40,000 farmer's that wanted the WB and went through it to sell their grain and the other farmer's didn't and had a friend in Ottawa, I could see those 40,000 not being able to find buyers for their grain if the other farmers against had direct buyer's with a little help from their friend in Ottawa, which would make the WB fold and die. If Harper has to get rid of the WB, he'll do it one way or another. Read my posts throughout the thread. What about those non-board grains everybody grows... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olp1fan Posted October 23, 2011 Report Share Posted October 23, 2011 hog farmers had a board and since it was disbanded manitoba went from 5000hog farmers to 300 in a matter of years same will happen here http://greenparty.ca/media-release/2011-10-19/loss-wheat-board-will-kill-family-grain-farms ^^^ that will happen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueblood Posted October 23, 2011 Report Share Posted October 23, 2011 ^^^ that will happen And at that point in time demand for hogs was tapped out and those who shouldn't be producing hogs were purged from the market. You forgot to mention how the provincial NDP has taken a bat to the provincial hog industry. A market board isn't going to save producers when the market price of anything comes down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William Ashley Posted October 25, 2011 Report Share Posted October 25, 2011 (edited) And at that point in time demand for hogs was tapped out and those who shouldn't be producing hogs were purged from the market. You forgot to mention how the provincial NDP has taken a bat to the provincial hog industry. A market board isn't going to save producers when the market price of anything comes down. Federal NDP are trying to defend it though.. http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/canada/asks+seven+Tory+abstain+from+Wheat+Board+vote/5599698/story.html I actually agree the tories are out to lunch 0.0002% of the Canadian population is not a broad segment of the canadian population. Now 'all farmers" might do it but 'wheat farmers is pretty damn specific. The vote needs to be ammended or the 7 mps locked away for corruption, note my own opinion is that the wheat boars should be an optional service for farmers for collective sale distrobution (an outlet of sale but not a forced monopoly) that is paid for by the farmers who participate in the board,,. mega agri stomp small farmers as a result of this, Edited October 25, 2011 by William Ashley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dithers Posted October 25, 2011 Report Share Posted October 25, 2011 There is no way that 16% of farms are incorporated. It's probably a lot closer to 99%. But hey, I "hate farmers", right? EDIT - Predictably, guyser avoids the the thrust of the thread and goes into irrelevant tangents, which doesn't bode any better for him. Cute. Look at you decrying a general lack of education yet pulling numbers out of your arse to justify an ideological rant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scribblet Posted November 8, 2011 Report Share Posted November 8, 2011 As I understand it, the Wheat Board was developed as an option around 1935 but was made compulsory for WW2 purposes, yet draconian wartime measures remain in place. The Wheat Board only operates in AB, SK, and MN where it has a monopoly. It has no jurisdiction in the other provinces, which makes me wonder why the board is spending money running ads in Ontario opposing it, and pushing the lie about a Harper quote for propaganda purposes and disinformation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted November 8, 2011 Report Share Posted November 8, 2011 The CWB seems to be to be a combine that favours producers. As such, I don't see why they would want to give that up. We don't even allow other industries to collude in this way. It seems to be borne out by the mention of a vote by the farmers themselves, wherein they wanted to keep the board. If this is true, then why are we discussing whether it's good for farmers or not - they gave their opinion didn't they ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scribblet Posted November 8, 2011 Report Share Posted November 8, 2011 (edited) I understand that the vote by the farmers was conducted by the CWB not the gov't. I would say the farmers voted with their ballots the last election, electing a CPC gov't which promised to get rid of the board. If the board really is worth while then the farmers will stay with it, they won't opt out, thus it will survive on merits. Ontario doesn't have a board, they rejected the concept. We don't need forced collectives and oligarchies or draconian wartime measures remaining in place now. Edited November 8, 2011 by scribblet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueblood Posted November 8, 2011 Report Share Posted November 8, 2011 The CWB seems to be to be a combine that favours producers. As such, I don't see why they would want to give that up. We don't even allow other industries to collude in this way. It seems to be borne out by the mention of a vote by the farmers themselves, wherein they wanted to keep the board. If this is true, then why are we discussing whether it's good for farmers or not - they gave their opinion didn't they ? Did you not read my prev. posts on this topic... That "vote" was a sham. Many producers didn't get a ballot mailed to them and there were people who were retired/landlords who got ballots. Remember, that when the gov't tried to put restrictions on who could vote, the cwb and their supporters threw a hissy fit. You know what that restriction is - a minimum of 40 tones of wheat produced. To put that in perspective that's 1 semi load or about 12,000 dollars worth of grain. That's below welfare, nobody lives on that let alone deal with expenses to get that gross of 12000. The farmers also gave their opinion in a gov't plebiscite a couple years back and most wanted marketing choice. The cwb and their supporters threw another hissy fit calling the vote rigged, and then there was the election when western canada was solidly tory blue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BubberMiley Posted November 8, 2011 Report Share Posted November 8, 2011 If the board really is worth while then the farmers will stay with it, they won't opt out, thus it will survive on merits. I agree. The farmers voted for Harper en masse, and now they cry because he's doing what he always said he would. I agree with the CPC on this issue. F--- them all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted November 8, 2011 Report Share Posted November 8, 2011 If the board really is worth while then the farmers will stay with it, they won't opt out, thus it will survive on merits. That doesn't make sense - a combine only works if everybody is "in", otherwise it falls apart. Saying "the election decided this issue" is also a cop out. Why doesn't the government ask them ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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