Which Tax?

[RNG]

I'm a FairTax fan. And you?

[Evening Star]

If these are the only three options, I prefer the current system.

--

I wouldn't necessarily be opposed to some moderately higher consumption taxes though. I thought it was a mistake to reduce the GST.

Edited July 7, 2011 by Evening Star

[Michael Hardner]

I don't know what the "fair tax" system is, but from the name I'm guessing it's not fair.

[M.Dancer]

I don't know what the "fair tax" system is, but from the name I'm guessing it's not fair.

I prefer a fair tax. That is where admissions to the CNE, PNE...etc are fully taxable

[Michael Hardner]

I prefer a fair tax. That is where admissions to the CNE, PNE...etc are fully taxable

There was no fair quite like the Quinte Exhibition in the 1970s. Demolition Derby, and the Uniroyal Stunt Drivers. I'll bet they were in a high bracket.

[M.Dancer]

There was no fair quite like the Quinte Exhibition in the 1970s. Demolition Derby, and the Uniroyal Stunt Drivers. I'll bet they were in a high bracket.

Of course, every burning person thingy would get an extra few points added...

consumption tax don't you know....

[RNG]

I don't know what the "fair tax" system is, but from the name I'm guessing it's not fair.

Typical. Try google or Wiki.

[August1991]

I favour the Unfair Tax system where everyone else pays more tax than I do.

[Moonlight Graham]

the choices for this poll are not exhaustive. i cant respond.

[Bonam]

FairTax is a proposal to remove all income and corporate taxes completely and replace all that revenue with a consumption tax similar to HST. Those below a certain income level would receive rebates. In Canada, a rough look at government tax revenues suggests an HST rate of about 40% would be required if we didn't have income tax:

http://www40.statcan.ca/l01/cst01/govt48a-eng.htm

12%*(248+107)/107 = 40%

That's also still paying CPP and EI contributions off your paycheque so the income is not totally tax free. Shifting the CPP burden from income to sales tax also, you'd get an HST of 49%.

I am not a fan. I don't want to buy a house in Vancouver for $3 million and pay $1.5 million in sales tax on it, thanks.

Edited July 7, 2011 by Bonam

[dre]

Absolutely no question... if those are the choices then "current system" is the only one worth considering.

[RNG]

FairTax is a proposal to remove all income and corporate taxes completely and replace all that revenue with a consumption tax similar to HST. Those below a certain income level would receive rebates. In Canada, a rough look at government tax revenues suggests an HST rate of about 40% would be required if we didn't have income tax:

http://www40.statcan.ca/l01/cst01/govt48a-eng.htm

12%*(248+107)/107 = 40%

That's also still paying CPP and EI contributions off your paycheque so the income is not totally tax free. Shifting the CPP burden from income to sales tax also, you'd get an HST of 49%.

I am not a fan. I don't want to buy a house in Vancouver for $3 million and pay $1.5 million in sales tax on it, thanks.

Can you define "own source revenue"?

[Bonam]

Can you define "own source revenue"?

Yes. Why?

[RNG]

Yes. Why?

I already got one nastygram from a mod. But still, can I suggest you indulge in sex and travel?

[Bonam]

I already got one nastygram from a mod. But still, can I suggest you indulge in sex and travel?

Sex and travel? Sounds like a good suggestion for my next vacation, though a bit generic.

[RNG]

Sex and travel? Sounds like a good suggestion for my next vacation, though a bit generic.

A truly despicable acquaintance of mine used to go to Thailand each year on vacation just to buy under-aged consorts. It sickened me. At least they were opposite sex. Still don't make me feel good.

[Shakeyhands]

I already got one nastygram from a mod. But still, can I suggest you indulge in sex and travel?

nice.

[cybercoma]

At least they were opposite sex.

How abhorrent, saying that as though them being opposite sex makes the under-age sex trade even marginally better. You should be ashamed of yourself.

[Saipan]

A truly despicable acquaintance of mine used to go to Thailand each year on vacation just to buy under-aged consorts. It sickened me.

Why Thailand? It's much cheaper in Canada and Cuba.

[Michael Hardner]

Typical. Try google or Wiki.

Old fish tend to recognize what a lure looks like after awhile.

Anyway, I don't need wiki for this one - I have MLW, and Bonham to explain it...

[Remiel]

Perhaps I am not the best one to comment, given my potty mouth of late, but how did we go from Bonam's intelligent post about taxes to RNG telling him to fuck off? Is there a joke beyond the insults that I am missing?

[Evening Star]

Perhaps I am not the best one to comment, given my potty mouth of late, but how did we go from Bonam's intelligent post about taxes to RNG telling him to fuck off? Is there a joke beyond the insults that I am missing?

I was wondering the same thing.

[William Ashley]

I don't support either system I have my own

For the federal government it works as follows:

1. -2nd Bank Account/ SIN

2. Cycles for essential services and poverty eradication program

3. -Subscription to government services that are nonessential runing as public/private crown corps

4. Payfor for everything else people want the government to do

1.Instead of everyone having a SIN to file taxes, everyone has a bank account and a bank card (that also acts as governmentID. Those are tied to biometrics data to make the bank card more secure. This same bank links all other banks. Everyone citizens or not in Canada needs to have an account, and thus has a SIN and an account to do business with the government.

2. Its called "cycles". Essentially programs like the "Right to Work" program (aimed at removing unemployment and wage above the poverty line, Old Age Security for the poor elderly, and basic healthcare for those in poverty, and for debt reduction. Cycles go either to the general population based upon income level, for instance someone at $30,000 income may get hit with 1 cent while someone at $40,000 2 cents per cycles, with 1 cent more for every $10,000. With healthcare for those in poverty it first comes from the medical sector (both in and those selling or providing services in Canada). The debt is devided per capita, and people are responsible to pay their debt interest (at 4% of between currently 30 to 35k (or about $1400/year as a base), they can pay down their "personal public debt to reduce the annual interest charges) meanwhile businesses both in canada and doing business in Canada are taxed a "mirror" payment of the debt interest that goes to paydown the debt. So in this way base corporate taxes are tied into a share of "net revenue" that in turn is divided up and applied to a maximum of the interest mirror. This insure the public debt is paid off in 15 years or less, while consistently reducing basic corporate taxes annually. Right to work meanwhile ends up being the major program expense with debt reduction at about $50 billion but unlike action lan the funds are put to ROI projects, and reducing the cost of government services, suplimentary military and civil employees (putting a government directed labour force at up to 3 million people.) Defence costs are set to be taken from the complex itself (up to about 5%) (With revenues of over 20 billion 5% sits at 1 billion of the 4 to 7 billion directed towards military funding. The rest ends up being about $250 to $300, and for some the "Military Allowance program adds a second military tax of $300 that decreases annually" The military allowance program funds into building the resources the military has from non tax streams.

4. Most of the other stuff is provincial however the government could run crown corps funded by donations or revenues.

And that is basically it. Although there is a little more behind the scenes. Things like healtcare would be funded through a government run insurance company - that taxes people based on the cost of running the program in subscription taxes, directing a percentage of funds to health research buying companies and patents to make health care costs lower.

I think that this is the most effective way to insure the debt is eliminated by 2030 if not sooner, and individuals taxes are based on the "needs", rather than government bloat.

There are a lot more initiatives in my budget plan for 2015, however that is the bones.

I don't like the current tax system I think there is too much social engineering and targetting involved, rather than an honest tax system. I really don't support taxesand my system is a bit of a compramise to insure people who are willing to work have the oppourtunity of work, and that basic needs are not deprived. Since the provinces can't be trusted to do those things, and run mismanaged attempts at poverty reduction, unemployments reduction, and provision of things such as food shelter and clothing I think it is a national crisisthat 1 in 10 Canadians is going idle.

Edited July 9, 2011 by William Ashley

[August1991]

WA, thanks for getting this thread back on track.

Cycles go either to the general population based upon income level, for instance someone at $30,000 income may get hit with 1 cent while someone at $40,000 2 cents per cycles, with 1 cent more for every $10,000. With healthcare for those in poverty it first comes from the medical sector (both in and those selling or providing services in Canada).

How would the government determine "income level"?

[Scotty]

FairTax is a proposal to remove all income and corporate taxes completely and replace all that revenue with a consumption tax similar to HST. Those below a certain income level would receive rebates. In Canada, a rough look at government tax revenues suggests an HST rate of about 40% would be required if we didn't have income tax:

Sounds like a recipe for an exploding black market in goods and services.