scouterjim Posted June 20, 2011 Report Posted June 20, 2011 I believe everybody has a right to believe as they wish, but I think they should not push those beliefs on others. Worship as you wish, but stop bothering people about it! Quote I have captured the rare duct taped platypus.
Michael Hardner Posted June 20, 2011 Report Posted June 20, 2011 It's communication, as in expressing yourself - so yes. If companies can cold call me on my iPhone, which I pay airtime for, then somebody should be able to talk to me about spiritual matters. Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
Bonam Posted June 20, 2011 Report Posted June 20, 2011 As long as their pushing takes the form of simply expressing themselves, their right to do so is guaranteed. Not that we have to like them doing it of course. You have the right to tell them what you think of them, too. If they really "push" though, as in behaving in a threatening manner, trying to coerce people, or worst of all, spreading religion in the good old fashion way (by the sword), then of course they do not have that right. Quote
DrGreenthumb Posted June 20, 2011 Report Posted June 20, 2011 As long as their pushing takes the form of simply expressing themselves, their right to do so is guaranteed. Not that we have to like them doing it of course. You have the right to tell them what you think of them, too. If they really "push" though, as in behaving in a threatening manner, trying to coerce people, or worst of all, spreading religion in the good old fashion way (by the sword), then of course they do not have that right. What about the Conservative way of pushing their faith on others through legislation? Quote
lukin Posted June 20, 2011 Report Posted June 20, 2011 What about the Conservative way of pushing their faith on others through legislation? You are truly out there, aren't you? Quote
Shakeyhands Posted June 20, 2011 Report Posted June 20, 2011 I believe everybody has a right to believe as they wish, but I think they should not push those beliefs on others. Worship as you wish, but stop bothering people about it! Was this meant to be a PM to Betsy?? Quote "They muddy the water, to make it seem deep." - Friedrich Nietzsche
eyeball Posted June 20, 2011 Report Posted June 20, 2011 What about the Conservative way of pushing their faith on others through legislation? Lets face it our own Charter of Rights and Freedoms recognizes the supremacy of God and the rule of law. Our system of government is based on the idea that the authority to rule or govern us comes from God however much we like to tell ourselves it comes from us. There was probably once a time when people had the right to do whatever they wanted unless it was otherwise stated in law that they couldn't now however the assumption seems to be that everything is illegal unless it's otherwise stated. Given that's the paradigm I'd certainly be wary of a group's right to do something morphing into an obligation of the state to see that it gets done. Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
Harper Rules Posted June 20, 2011 Report Posted June 20, 2011 What about the Conservative way of pushing their faith on others through legislation? Freedom of expression is a great thing. I'm sure we have all "pushed" our opinions or beliefs on others in some way. But in the end we are in control of how we process information and hopefully we do what is best for us. At least the majority (lol) of us. Quote
ToadBrother Posted June 20, 2011 Report Posted June 20, 2011 I believe everybody has a right to believe as they wish, but I think they should not push those beliefs on others. Worship as you wish, but stop bothering people about it! They certainly have a right to advocate their religious position. That is the most fundamental aspect of freedom of expression. You are free to debate them or ignore them. Quote
ToadBrother Posted June 20, 2011 Report Posted June 20, 2011 What about the Conservative way of pushing their faith on others through legislation? Could you provide some examples? Quote
Shady Posted June 20, 2011 Report Posted June 20, 2011 Was this meant to be a PM to Betsy?? Nice! Quote
cybercoma Posted June 21, 2011 Report Posted June 21, 2011 I believe everybody has a right to believe as they wish, but I think they should not push those beliefs on others. Worship as you wish, but stop bothering people about it! I believe they do have the right to market their beliefs however they choose. I am, hwoever, opposed to them pushing their beliefs on children, telling them for most of their lives that these mythologies are uncontestable facts. Quote
Michael Hardner Posted June 21, 2011 Report Posted June 21, 2011 I believe they do have the right to market their beliefs however they choose. I am, hwoever, opposed to them pushing their beliefs on children, telling them for most of their lives that these mythologies are uncontestable facts. On their own children ? That's pretty draconian. I can see the Drudgereport story now: "Indiana mom jailed for telling child about tooth fairy, Jesus" Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
GostHacked Posted June 21, 2011 Report Posted June 21, 2011 On their own children ? That's pretty draconian. I can see the Drudgereport story now: "Indiana mom jailed for telling child about tooth fairy, Jesus" A parent can get jailed for spanking (aka disciplining) their child. It's termed physical abuse. Mental abuse does not show the scars like physical abuse, but can be just as bad if not worse than physical abuse. Quote
Michael Hardner Posted June 21, 2011 Report Posted June 21, 2011 Mental abuse does not show the scars like physical abuse, but can be just as bad if not worse than physical abuse. Telling a child there's an easter bunny who will bring him chocolate = abuse. We're through the looking glass, I think. Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
M.Dancer Posted June 21, 2011 Report Posted June 21, 2011 A parent can get jailed for spanking (aka disciplining) their child. No, not in Canada...thankfully Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
GostHacked Posted June 21, 2011 Report Posted June 21, 2011 Telling a child there's an easter bunny who will bring him chocolate = abuse. We're through the looking glass, I think. If you believe in the Easter bunny, it's easy to convince you that Jesus exists. What does the easter bunny have to do with the zombie jesus coming back to life anyways? One fake story to uphold another fake story? What happens to that person when they realize that they have been fed lies all their life? Religion is part of that lie. So, I could say that religion is a form of mental and emotional abuse. Quote
GostHacked Posted June 21, 2011 Report Posted June 21, 2011 No, not in Canada...thankfully http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Crime/2010/12/10/16499341.html Although I do support spanking .. using a belt crosses the line .. so they got charged with abuse, and I really don't have a problem if it is found out that it is abuse. I betcha a good deal of us got a spanking or the belt when we were kids and most of us are well adjusted adults. It all depends on how the punishment is delivered I guess. EDMONTON - A bizarre case involving an Edmonton couple convicted of assault for using a belt to spank their sexually active 14-year-old daughter ended Thursday with fines. In the USA. http://www.nj.com/mercer/index.ssf/2009/01/doctor_wrongful_arrested_for_s.html LAWRENCE -- A man who was cleared of a child abuse charge stemming from an incident in which he spanked his 2-year-old son at Quaker Bridge Mall has won $30,000 from the township in compensation. Quote
Guest American Woman Posted June 21, 2011 Report Posted June 21, 2011 (edited) I believe everybody has a right to believe as they wish, but I think they should not push those beliefs on others. Worship as you wish, but stop bothering people about it! Does the opposite hold true? Do you also believe that people who aren't religious should not push those beliefs at others? I ask because it seems as if those who don't believe in God feel as if they can say anything they want - stating their views as fact; even going so far as to declare that people who do believe in God shouldn't be able to teach their children about religion - that it's a form of abuse to do so. So I'm curious if it's just wrong when the religious "push [their] beliefs on others" - or if it applies to everyone. Edited June 21, 2011 by American Woman Quote
cybercoma Posted June 22, 2011 Report Posted June 22, 2011 Telling a child there's an easter bunny who will bring him chocolate = abuse. We're through the looking glass, I think. I don't expect it to be popular. In fact, I don't expect many people to agree with me. It's just my opinion that religious ideological indoctrination can be psychologically abusive. A child believing that a jolly fat man brings them gifts on Christmas or that there's a fluffy bunny bringing eggs is one thing. Even inspirational things like the sermon on the mount, for example, are fine. The problem is when it goes deeper than that. When intolerance for others arises because they believe in some other religious authority or source of moral absolutes. When these things are so indoctrinated that no amount of reason can shake someone from irrational ideologies that push some to do horribly destructive things fully believing they are doing good... that, to me, is horrifyingly abusive. We don't accept cults indoctrinating adults, let alone children. When they do have children in their grip, it is even more shocking to our sensibilities. What they do is considered brainwashing and religious indoctrination with its often disastrous consequences is no different to me personally. Quote
Michael Hardner Posted June 22, 2011 Report Posted June 22, 2011 When intolerance for others arises because they believe in some other religious authority or source of moral absolutes. It sounds like you're really put off by self-righteous behavior, really. Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
Sir Bandelot Posted June 22, 2011 Report Posted June 22, 2011 Indoctrination, especially that of children, takes place in many forms. Quote
betsy Posted June 22, 2011 Report Posted June 22, 2011 Indoctrination, especially that of children, takes place in many forms. Amen. These days, "truth" is stretched into many forms. Quote
DogOnPorch Posted June 22, 2011 Report Posted June 22, 2011 Amen. These days, "truth" is stretched into many forms. Case in point...betsy. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
M.Dancer Posted June 22, 2011 Report Posted June 22, 2011 http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Crime/2010/12/10/16499341.html Although I do support spanking .. using a belt crosses the line .. I would say, 9 times out of 10, a belt is abuse. My father spanked me with a belt, but it was all drama....slowly the belt came off his pants (he wore suspenders too...no worries) and he tested it once or twice be folding it and thwacking it against itself....all the while telling me what I did, why he was angry (he used the word, cross) with me..etc etc...after a few minutes of lecture I would take my medicine, being told to take it like a man, a then I got 3 or 4 love taps on the hand. Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
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