Contraception not welcome in PMO G8 Maternal Health policy

[nicky10013]

More right wing fringe gargbage. Despite the fact that most G8 nations have gone on record supporting the need for contraception and abortion to be supported for any maternal health package, Harper puts forward his marquee plan for this year's G8 without those specific planks. Yet another embarassing blow to the Canadian image abroad.

http://www2.macleans.ca/2010/03/17/harpers-g8-maternal-health-plan/

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/blogs/bureau-blog/conservatives-accused-of-willfully-ignoring-contraception-research/article1503743/

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/birth-control-wont-be-in-g8-plan-to-protect-mothers-tories-say/article1502796/

[waldo]

that Macleans article clearly shows the Harper Conservative position is/will be at odds with other G8 members. What's the point of purposely going in with an obviously antagonistic position, one that counters actual evidence of improving maternal health? Rally the fundy/evangelical part of the base - ya think?

obviously the Harper Conservatives have conflated abortion with family planning... because... really, unless die-hard religious fundamentalism is driving the Conservative policy, how could the real facts be purposely ignored. Oh wait... never mind! Hidden agenda... is no longer... hidden!

from the United States Agency for International Development:

Global Importance of Family Planning

• Saves lives of mothers and children: Births that are too close together, too early, or too late in a woman’s life decrease both the mother’s and the infant’s chances for survival. By helping women space births at least three years apart, bear children during their healthiest years, and avoid unplanned pregnancies, family planning could prevent 25 percent of maternal and child deaths in the developing world.

• Reduces abortion rates: Unintended pregnancy can result in abortion.An estimated 35 million abortions take place each year in the developing world.Wider availability of family planning programs could prevent many of these abortions.

• Important in fight against HIV/AIDS, particularly mother-to-child HIV transmission: Family planning allows HIV-positive women to space births for optimal health and contributes to programs providing voluntary counseling and testing and pre­ vention of mother-to-child transmission (PMTCT) services. Family planning services also help reduce stigma, improve referral networks for HIV-related services, and prevent unintended pregnancy, HIV infection, and other sexually transmitted infec­tions.

[Shakeyhands]

You'll notice the lack of responses to this indefensible action by the usual CPC Booster Club. What a joke we are becoming on the International front. Truly embarrassing.

[eyeball]

Contraception not welcome...

What'll it take, a War on Sex?

[Moonbox]

While I laugh at the 'hidden agenda' comments by some of the wing nuts here, I will say that there's a reason Harper does so poorly with the female vote. His party is out to lunch on a lot of social issues and he suffers in the polls accordingly due to this. Religion has no place in politics EVER and the sooner politicians realize this the better.

[waldo]

While I laugh at the 'hidden agenda' comments by some of the wing nuts here, I will say that there's a reason Harper does so poorly with the female vote. His party is out to lunch on a lot of social issues and he suffers in the polls accordingly due to this. Religion has no place in politics EVER and the sooner politicians realize this the better.

well... can we attribute your described 'poor Harper Conservative female vote' to Conservative social policy driven by an overt religious underpinning/agenda (that you acknowledge)... since you certainly won't/can't acknowledge it's hidden agenda policy! Which is it - an overt or hidden agenda?

[M.Dancer]

I suppose paying for contraception and abortions is more important than prenatal healthcare, post natal healthcare, nutrition and education.

So I agree fully.

[waldo]

I suppose paying for contraception and abortions is more important than prenatal healthcare, post natal healthcare, nutrition and education.

So I agree fully.

another Conservative conflation of family planning and abortion? Should we really be surprised?

[M.Dancer]

another Conservative conflation of family planning and abortion? Should we really be surprised?

You didn't know that abortion was part of the equation?

[waldo]

You didn't know that abortion was part of the equation?

we're talking about the upcoming Harper Conservative G8 position that purposely refuses to include provisions for contraception. The raised concerns over this Conservative omission, the concerns I'm privy to, focus on contraception. The purposeful attempt to tie contraception to abortion is a Harper Conservative conflation. Perhaps I've missed raised concerns about the Conservative G8 position not including provision for abortion funding/policy... I would be encouraged for you to bring forward examples of such raised concerns in relation to the released Harper Conservative G8 position statement. Even if their were such concerns, are Harper Conservatives not capable of separating one from the other... of separating abortion from contraception?

[M.Dancer]

I would be encouraged for you to bring forward examples of such raised concerns in relation to the released Harper Conservative G8 position statement. Even if their were such concerns, are Harper Conservatives not capable of separating one from the other... of separating abortion from contraception?

Ask Ignatieff...

But it was Liberal Leader Michael Ignatieff who first made abortion part of the issue, asking whether Mr. Harper's government would include access to abortions as part of the strategy

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/birth-control-wont-be-in-g8-plan-to-protect-mothers-tories-say/article1502796/

Aside from the obvious aspects of cultural imperialism where we promote our western values on those who do not necessarily accept or want them, birth control and abortion are not generally seen as "healthcare".

[Shady]

How exactly does birth control and abortion save lives? It definitely prevents and destroys them, but I'm trying to figure out how that's in any way related to the main mission statement of this particular initiative: Saving Lives.

[Shady]

Aside from the obvious aspects of cultural imperialism where we promote our western values on those who do not necessarily accept or want them, birth control and abortion are not generally seen as "healthcare".

What many leftwingers don't quite understand, is that in many parts of the world, their beloved sacrament of abortion is considered abhorrent.

[Smallc]

How exactly does birth control and abortion save lives?

From the Globe and Mail:

She argues that no maternal-health policy can be effective without providing ways for women to space out pregnancies, because many childbirth deaths are caused by complications from having too many pregnancies too quickly or from unsafe abortions.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/birth-control-wont-be-in-g8-plan-to-protect-mothers-tories-say/article1502796/

[Moonbox]

well... can we attribute your described 'poor Harper Conservative female vote' to Conservative social policy driven by an overt religious underpinning/agenda (that you acknowledge)... since you certainly won't/can't acknowledge it's hidden agenda policy! Which is it - an overt or hidden agenda?

There's no agenda. I'll acknowledge that there are Bible-thumping morons who've made it quite clear what they think of things like gay rights and women's rights and there's nothing hidden about it. The 'hidden agenda' you speak of implies that the Harper cons are out to take away these rights. That's not the case and hasn't been since Harper became PM. NOT promoting all of these rights abroad doesn't equate to a hidden agenda. It just means they're not promoting them. It's a lot more simple then you're making it out to be.

Edited March 18, 2010 by Moonbox

[waldo]

Ask Ignatieff...

Aside from the obvious aspects of cultural imperialism where we promote our western values on those who do not necessarily accept or want them, birth control and abortion are not generally seen as "healthcare".

again... aren't Harper Conservatives capable of separating abortion from contraception?

you can attempt to derail the topic towards tangential imperialism; however, you were provided with the responses and positions of other key G8 participants - none of which align with the Harper Conservative position. You were also provided with the platform put forward by the USAID, one that clearly and precisely lays out the "healthcare" benefits associated with contraception.

[eyeball]

What many leftwingers don't quite understand, is that in many parts of the world, their beloved sacrament of abortion is considered abhorrent.

Just like right wingers who don't understand that other parts if the world often feel much the same way about unbridled capitalism and globalization. Go figure.

[M.Dancer]

There was a Germaine Greer book abot 20 years ago...can't remember the title....anyway, there was a 3rd world project where the women had high (according to western standards) birth rates. All the women were glad to receive the contraception.

They went back a few years later and found that the birth rate remained unchanged.

Interviewing the women they found they were quite happy with western contracpetion, it was much easier, simpler and more enjoyable that what they had been using .

What the aid workers didn't take into account or ask perhaps was the women (and men) had children when they wanted children and used alternative methods to prevent children. Some were not up to western clinical safety (like BC pills that cause strokes) and some methods were simply alternatives to vaginal intecourse.

Money allocated to birth control and abortions would be better spent on healthcare and nutrition. Give the developing world better agriculture and you will see the number of babies born drop.

[waldo]

Money allocated to birth control and abortions would be better spent on healthcare and nutrition. Give the developing world better agriculture and you will see the number of babies born drop.

your attempts to derail this thread to include abortion are noted. You can continue to ignore the health-saving, life-saving elements attributed to contraception.

[M.Dancer]

your attempts to derail this thread to include abortion are noted. You can continue to ignore the health-saving, life-saving elements attributed to contraception.

I'm so happy you note it. Could you please pass your note on to the liberals?

The Liberals say they will pressure the government when Parliament returns this week to reverse its decision not to fund abortions, contraceptives, or reproductive health education in developing countries.

http://www.hilltimes.com/page/view/abortion-03-01-2010

Edited March 18, 2010 by M.Dancer

[Shady]

She argues

She can argue all she wants. It doesn't mean she's right. In fact, advocating abortion as birth control is the exact opposite of women's health.

[waldo]

your attempts to derail this thread to include abortion are noted. You can continue to ignore the health-saving, life-saving elements attributed to contraception.

I'm so happy you note it. Could you please pass your note on to the liberals?

again, are Harper Conservatives incapable of separating abortion from contraception? We can see your efforts have spawned expected trollish input... also purposely intent on derailing discussion towards abortion - well done!

[M.Dancer]

again, are Harper Conservatives incapable of separating abortion from contraception? We can see your efforts have spawned expected trollish input... also purposely intent on derailing discussion towards abortion - well done!

Well that certainly (calling someone a troll) one way to not deal with an argument not going your way.

So you have nothing to say about the Liberals demanding abortion be included...or is it a subject you just rather not tackle?

[waldo]

So you have nothing to say about the Liberals demanding abortion be included...or is it a subject you just rather not tackle?

read the title of this thread? It obviously does not include any mention of abortion. The argument you won't address, no matter how insistent you are about steering any discussion toward the Liberals, is that the Harper Conservatives are the ruling government and it is their position that will be placed before the upcoming G8 meeting. Again, are the Harper Conservatives incapable of separating abortion from contraception?

[M.Dancer]

read the title of this thread? It obviously does not include any mention of abortion.

The title of the threazd is not the gold standard pertaining to the issue. The Liberals are insistent that Abortion be included.

Deal with it