US tea party

[punked]

I hate to find myself agreeing with "punked" but he is right,give Obama time to prove himself.To date,I don't think he's done anything noteworthy and he appears to be leading the US sharply to the left but he did win the election.I doubt that the 180 on foreign policy and his massive spending will benefit Americans and the rest of the world in any way.As for the tea parties they are just folks concerned with excessive spending and taxation.I just heard an extremely ignorant comment from one Janeane Garofalo,a no talent,liberal "celebrity" concerning the tea parties.She claims they are all racist bigots that don't like a black man in the White House.

.She can't intelligently make her point or even try to use reason so she resorts to the usual method of the left,attack,attack,attack.

To be fair the tea parties were hyped on white supremacists websites, and some of the signs at the events were racist although I don't think that represents the majority of people who were there it is no different then the right wing claiming that those at anti-war rallies were terrorist loving anarchists or whatever they said back then.

[KrustyKidd]

The Obama presidency is an utter disaster.

I disagree. He has certainly made moves to the left but no disaster yet. Who knows, possibly this all may turn out for the better.

A side note though, if it does become a disaster such as a tanking economy or a nuclear attack in a city then there will be a right wing backlash and all he has, and is trying to accomplish will be washed away in a moment.

[sharkman]

Yeah, uh, I'd say whatever he would be trying to accomplish would be 'washed' away in a moment if a NUCLEAR BLAST occurred on U.S. soil, but it wouldn't be rightwingers doing the washing. It would be the nuclear blast. Good grief, I can't believe the hysteria about the vast right wing conspiracy that has now been elevated to the equivalent of a nuke.

As for the tanking economy, we're already there. If Obama can't turn it around he should be fired at the next election.

[WIP]

The largest employer in the US is by far small business. You're probably taking the example of, say, an article about Nike in indonesia you read in some left wing rag and extrapolating if over vast swaths of the economy you know nothing about.

The question wasn't about small business -- it was regarding your claim that the richest 2% are the ones who invest capital and create manufacturing jobs. If they are creating manufacturing jobs in China, this not only does not provide manufacturing jobs in the U.S., it has secondary effects on those small businesses that provide parts and services for the large manufacturer. Add to that the problem of depressing wages in a sector of the economy that's already in decline, and the lesson we can draw from supply side economic theory is that the claims that cutting taxes on the wealthiest citizens will trickle down to the middle class in capital investment - is for the most part a fraud! The rich have gotten richer, and made their capital investments overseas, and even moved larger and larger shares of their wealth to tax havens in the Caymen Islands and elsewhere:

Over two decades, the income gap has steadily increased between the richest Americans, who own homes and stocks and got big tax breaks, and those at the middle and bottom of the pay scale, whose paychecks buy less.

The growing disparity is even more pronounced in this recovering economy. Wages are stagnant and the middle class is shouldering a larger tax burden. Prices for health care, housing, tuition, gas and food have soared.

The wealthiest 20 percent of households in 1973 accounted for 44 percent of total U.S. income, according to the Census Bureau. Their share jumped to 50 percent in 2002, while everyone else's fell. For the bottom fifth, the share dropped from 4.2 percent to 3.5 percent.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/08/13/...ain635936.shtml

Interesting to note the coincidence that the growing income gap started just after Ronald Reagan started cutting taxes on the richest Americans.

It doesn't have to "kill" small business. But if you bump up the taxes on an already suffering small plastics manufacturer in suburban Detriot, the owner's gotta cut a few jobs to stay afloat (so that the rest of the people who work there will still have somewhere to go in the morning).

And that's because you have put the "small plastics manufacturer" in the position of having to compete head to head with countries that have no environmental regulations and no workplace safety regulations - who are working for less than a dollar an hour, and possibly even less, considering that countries like China have prison camp-labour making consumer products destined for Western store shelves.

Of course if you have more left wing simplified view of the world, then the "richest two percent" aren't the reality of economic drivers and job creators I have just described, but rather just a bunch of scrooge mcducks ploughing their gold coins back and forth with a tractor behind the walls of their estate.

If they are doing so much public good, how is it that they are driving off with all the gold?:

Income inequality grew significantly in 2005, with the top 1 percent of Americans — those with incomes that year of more than $348,000 — receiving their largest share of national income since 1928, analysis of newly released tax data shows.

The top 10 percent, roughly those earning more than $100,000, also reached a level of income share not seen since before the Depression.

While total reported income in the United States increased almost 9 percent in 2005, the most recent year for which such data is available, average incomes for those in the bottom 90 percent dipped slightly compared with the year before, dropping $172, or 0.6 percent.

The gains went largely to the top 1 percent, whose incomes rose to an average of more than $1.1 million each, an increase of more than $139,000, or about 14 percent.

The new data also shows that the top 300,000 Americans collectively enjoyed almost as much income as the bottom 150 million Americans. Per person, the top group received 440 times as much as the average person in the bottom half earned, nearly doubling the gap from 1980.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/03/29/business/29tax.html

You see! All of that economic prosperity from lower taxes and cutting government spending has only benefited the people at the top of the pyramid. What good is economic prosperity if most of the people are working longer hours and taking home less money for their efforts?

Now, back to the Tea Party - since the movement is a coordinated effort of FoxNews and rightwing radio personalities that have been financed and organized by big business advocacy groups: FreedomWatch and Americans United for Change, what other conclusion is there to draw from this tempest in a TeaPot other than it being another scam from those richest 1% who are afraid of even paying a little more for the benefit of their nation? The tragedy is that they are able to sucker so many "Joe the Plumbers" into fighting on their behalf for benefits that only a few will enjoy!

[KrustyKidd]

Now, back to the Tea Party - since the movement is a coordinated effort of FoxNews and rightwing radio personalities that have been financed and organized by big business advocacy groups: FreedomWatch and Americans United for Change, what other conclusion is there to draw from this tempest in a TeaPot other than it being another scam from those richest 1% who are afraid of even paying a little more for the benefit of their nation? The tragedy is that they are able to sucker so many "Joe the Plumbers" into fighting on their behalf for benefits that only a few will enjoy!

In order to not be labeled somebody who doesn't quite get what the movement is about, please provide the proof that Fox News and Rightwing radio Personalities began this. Then, once you have done that, please provide proof that all those who are against this movement approve of the trillion dollars that Bush left as a deficit immediately prior to leaving office. Then, you can show how all those who are against this movement approve of the bogus pork thrown into the stimulus package that congress recently passed.

The movement as I see it is people who are sick and tired of government approving crap to increase their hold on power. That this seems to be right or left to you is interesting to say the least as it, to me is a common challenge to all people.

[WIP]

In order to not be labeled somebody who doesn't quite get what the movement is about, please provide the proof that Fox News and Rightwing radio Personalities began this. Then, once you have done that, please provide proof that all those who are against this movement approve of the trillion dollars that Bush left as a deficit immediately prior to leaving office. Then, you can show how all those who are against this movement approve of the bogus pork thrown into the stimulus package that congress recently passed.

The movement as I see it is people who are sick and tired of government approving crap to increase their hold on power. That this seems to be right or left to you is interesting to say the least as it, to me is a common challenge to all people.

You really need proof that Foxnews has been promoting and beating the bushes for this movement? And all of the noise machines that owe their livelihood to the small handful of media companies that own most of the radio stations. This was all Beck, O'Reilley, Hannity and Limbaugh had to talk about in the weeks leading up to the big day. Where would this movement be without Foxnews and rightwing radio's free promotion of it? This page on Thinkprogress has a lot of links showing Freedomworks fingerprints on this "grassroots" movement. And:

The Tea Party Movement: Who's In Charge?

Here is the organizational landscape of the April 15 tea party movement, in a nutshell: three national-level conservative groups, all with slightly different agendas, are guiding it. All are quick to tell you that the movement is a bottom-up affair and that its grassroots cred is real.................

http://politics.theatlantic.com/2009/04/th...s_in_charge.php

Yeah, that looks like a real grassroots movement of ordinary American millionaires.

[KrustyKidd]

You really need proof that Foxnews has been promoting and beating the bushes for this movement? And all of the noise machines that owe their livelihood to the small handful of media companies that own most of the radio stations. This was all Beck, O'Reilley, Hannity and Limbaugh had to talk about in the weeks leading up to the big day. Where would this movement be without Foxnews and rightwing radio's free promotion of it? This page on Thinkprogress has a lot of links showing Freedomworks fingerprints on this "grassroots" movement.

I know they talked about it however, you said;

What he said......

the movement is a coordinated effort of FoxNews and rightwing radio personalities that have been financed and organized by big business advocacy groups: FreedomWatch and Americans United for Change

And I asked you to prove that this is an invention or product of Fox News etc rather than the people who actually started it.

[JerrySeinfeld]

It doesnt' surprise me that people who are the richest earn more and more all the time and the others stay stagnant.

A market economy rewards merit, innovation, investment and risk taking.

For the ignorant masses in both Canada and the US content to "put in their time" at a job, live in mediocrity their whole lives and wait for the government to make things better for them, there are no rewards.

Tough shit.

[BubberMiley]

Tough shit.

Uh…it’s fortunate we have a market economy then. Unfortunately, you don’t really understand how a market economy works. It is based on a system that requires government to create a stable environment for the market to thrive. Therefore, you need roads and railroads and bridges to move goods; you need a healthy, educated workforce to produce goods; you need a stable political environment to grow in, and you need a proper regulatory system so that the economy doesn’t break down because of the greed of a few individuals. Unfortunately, people with simplistic ideologies like your own gained too much credence in recent years and hastened the destruction of our economy. Fortunately, with the right degree of stimulus and a renewed understanding of the importance of sustainable regulation, the market will correct itself and we will be back on the road to prosperity.

Amazing that there still exist a few who haven’t learned anything from the catastrophe of Reaganomics, even well after they’ve been proven terribly, terribly wrong.

[WIP]

I know they talked about it however, you said;

What he said......

And I asked you to prove that this is an invention or product of Fox News etc rather than the people who actually started it.

Who first proposed holding tea party events? When did major conservative organizations get involved? And how much support have they gained along the way?

The answer to the first question is "FreedomWorks." The answer to the second question is "right from the start." And the answer to the last question is "less than you'd expect, given the months of hype."

The first tea-partyish events occurred in February in Seattle, WA, Denver, CO, and Mesa, AZ around the time President Obama signed the stimulus bill into law, but they didn't have an explicitly tea-based theme. If they had a theme of any kind it was "pork" and government waste. Conservative blogger Michelle Malkin wrote a post about the Seattle protest called "From the Boston Tea Party to your neighborhood pork protest." And in Denver, protesters shouted, "No more pork!" By and large, though, the events lacked a unifying issue.

That all changed on February 19, when CNBC commentator Rick Santelli erupted in anger on the floor of the Chicago Board of Trade, and proposed a "Chicago Tea Party" for traders to protest the government's plan to provide mortgage assistance to distressed homeowners.

The idea took hold and on February 27, a handful of cities across the country hosted gatherings that involved genuine tea (or at least the use of the word "tea"). One of those tea parties occurred from 12:00 to 2:00 p.m. on Friday February 27, in Tampa, FL, organized according to the website Tampa Bay Online, by "John Hendricks, a Tampa-based consultant."

John Hendricks turns out to be John Hendrix, who by phone earlier today described the events as completely spontaneous. "These are independent groups, not coordinated," he says, "and most of the people, including myself, have never done anything like this." He even said that two distinct groups in Tampa emerged simultaneously--both called the "Tampa Tea Party," each unbeknown to the other.

I asked him where the idea came from. "Tom Gaithens," Hendrix said. "He's with FreedomWorks."

"Oh really?"

"He sent an email out with his network of contacts to see who could help."

The event, Hendrix said, drew somewhere in the ballpark of 200 protesters, and there were, by his count, 88 people on hand at peak. That's not very many people. Henke may be right, in a sense, about the distinction between astroturf events and genuine protests--but this appears to be, at best, somewhere in between the two. There was certainly not enough burning furor about the stimulus bill or the bank bailouts in Tampa to drive residents into the streets without the help of Dick Armey's 501 group.

An email to Gaithens, and a call to Brendan Steinhauser, also of FreedomWorks, were not immediately returned.

Over time, the Tea Party Protest Movement (or whatever you want to call it) has grown. There were larger tea parties in March, and if you've been watching Fox News, you know that tomorrow (tax day!) Tea Parties are scheduled to occur in cities across the country. That growth has been facilitated in part by such favored grassroots techniques as robocalls, which readers have been tipping us off to for nearly a week, and early estimates suggest that the largest of tomorrow's parties will draw about 5,000 people

That's more than 200--and certainly enough to look impressive on a television screen--but significantly smaller than the March 2003 Iraq war protests, which occurred in cities around the world, and resulted in thousands of arrests in the United States.

All of which raises a question nobody seems to be asking: What will the media say if FreedomWorks hosts a bunch of Tea Bag Parties and nobody comes?

Late update: Additional tax-day teabag coverage here and here.

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/04...-teabagging.php

[KrustyKidd]

Who first proposed holding tea party events? When did major conservative organizations get involved? And how much support have they gained along the way?

No. The question was asking you to prove that this was an invention by Fox News You said;

What he said.......

the movement is a coordinated effort of FoxNews and rightwing radio personalities that have been financed and organized by big business advocacy groups: FreedomWatch and Americans United for Change

From what I understand, the roots are here;

New American Tea Party

We’re a coalition of citizens and organizations concerned about the recent trend of fiscal recklessness in government. This website is dedicated to the Washington, D.C. effort of February 27th, 2009 specifically sponsored by the American Spectator, the Heartland Institute, Americans for Tax Reform, the National Taxpayers Union, Americans for Prosperity, FreedomWorks, the Institute for Liberty, the Coalition for a Conservative Majority and the Young Conservatives Coalition.

[lasrek]

We get blindsided sometimes by all the garbage that the mainstream media puts out, I admit I do! Then reality revisits and puts things back in perspective.

The problems we are seeing with the auto industry most of us who know how the money system works knew it was coming we knew it would affect everything and everyone around the world, we just got blindsided by the media hype.

G. Edward Griffin explained in his book "The Creature From Jeckyl Island" and his audio found here http://www.fortruth.org/edward-griffin-jekyll.CDQuality.MP3 Please remember this audio was made in 1994 that's fifteen years ago. He tells us in his book and audio that any monetary system that is debt based is doomed to fail. We don't have any "Real" money. In order for our fiat money ("legal tender") to come into existence (I know that's a bit of an oxymoron) we have to "borrow it into existence". These notes and the electronic currency are just debt and no matter how much we trade them around the bottom line is you cannot pay a debt with a debt. I cannot pay my I.O.U. by writing another I.O.U. for the same amount, you cannot use your visa to pay off your Mastercard. If all debts were set off tomorrow there would be no so called money in circulation.

Everything we are seeing now in the economies of the world was destined to happen people like G. Edward Griffin, Thomas Jefferson etc. have been warning us for two centuries J.F. Kennedy died because he knew and was attempting to do partial remedy. Too bad the internet didn't exist back them. Also that isn't to say that the situation isn't being manipulated, it is and the Federal Reserve and it's directors shareholders are the ones doing the manipulating. London and New York is where the power behind the government lies.

This is the second video http://therealnews.com/t/index.php?option=...mp;jumival=3636 in regards to the auto industry but if you listen closely to what Richard Wolff says it just highlights the fact that our money system must change. We have to get rid of fractional reserve banking, we have to have some tangible asset backing the currency, we have to limit the power of the corporations, we have to stop corporate lobbying, we have to get control of our politicians, and above all we need to teach our children, our schools schools need to be teaching this stuff.

The following is a forward that I sent to my email group 26th. June 2004 this is a MUST read in order to fully understand what changes we are facing and why things are the way they are.

An excellent article that everyone should read and understand in order to return our so called democratic systems to a "true" democratic system. If you understand the problem then you can implement the necessary changes.

Published on Thursday, December 19, 2002 by CommonDreams.org

Americans Revolt in Pennsylvania - New Battle Lines Are Drawn

by Thom Hartmann

The good citizens of Pennsylvania have done it again. Back in 1776, they hosted at Liberty Hall in Philadelphia a gathering of people radicalized by the predations of the East India Company. The world's first multinational corporation then held a virtual stranglehold on commerce and politics in North America, and brazenly used British troops as its enforcers.

On the first week of December, 1600, when she created the East India Company, Queen Elizabeth I became the first CEO monarch, and by 1776 King George II was following in her footsteps with his sizeable holdings in and open advocacy of corporate rule. The American colonists were offended by the idea they should be vassals of a corporation and a kingdom that supported and profited from it.

Thomas Jefferson wrote the Declaration of Independence, which explicitly stated that humans were born into this world endowed by their Creator with certain rights, that governments were created by humans to insure only humans held those rights, and "That whenever any form of government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or abolish it…" Stating flatly that "it is their right, it is their duty," to alter their government and thus claim their unique human rights, 56 men defied the East India Company and the government whose army supported it by placing their signatures on the Declaration of Independence, saying, "with a firm reliance on the protection of divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred Honor." Thus began America's first experiment with democracy.

The first week of December of that same year, Thomas Paine wrote in a pamphlet he published a few weeks later that, "Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered… What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly: it is dearness only that gives every thing its value. Heaven knows how to put a proper price upon its goods; and it would be strange indeed if so celestial an article as FREEDOM should not be highly rated." Exactly 226 years later, another small group in Pennsylvania also met in early December to sign a document that claimed the same right - their duty - to alter their government in a way that would restore the democracy the original Founders were willing to fight and die for.

The democratically elected municipal officials of Porter Township put their signatures to an ordinance passed unanimously on December 9, 2002. It reads, in part: "A corporation is a legal fiction created by the express permission of the people…; "Interpretation of the U.S. Constitution by the Supreme Court justices to include corporations in the term 'persons' has long wrought havoc with our democratic processes by endowing corporations with constitutional privileges intended solely to protect the citizens of the United States or natural persons within its borders; "This judicial bestowal of civil and political rights upon corporations interferers with the administration of laws within Porter Township and usurps basic human and constitutional rights exercised by the people of Porter Township; … "Buttressed by these constitutional rights, corporate wealth allows corporations to enjoy constitutional privileges to an extent beyond the reach of most ci tizens; "Democracy means government by the people. Only citizens of Porter Township should be able to participate in the democratic process in Porter Township and enjoy a republican form of government therein;…" And then, with an audacity and willingness to take on overwhelming multinational corporate power similar to that displayed by the Founders, the elders of Porter Township said that "Corporations shall not be considered to be 'persons' protected by the Constitution of the United States or the Constitution of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania within the Second Class Township of Porter, Clarion County, Pennsylvania." It became the law of that land five days later.

In 1773, the East India Company had claimed the "right" to participate in the political processes of England and, with wealth and power greater than the average citizen, got passed for themselves a huge tax reduction on tea and an overall tax rebate so large they could undersell and wipe out their small Colonial competitors. The response of the entrepreneurial colonists to the Tea Act of 1773 was the Boston Tea Party revolt against that transnational corporation, setting the stage for the Declaration of Independence and the beginnings of what Lincoln called "government of the people, by the people, for the people." Similarly, in 2000, one of the largest sludge hauling corporations in the United States sued Porter Township, claiming that as a "person" the corporation had rights equal to the citizens of the township, and therefore they couldn't "discriminate" against the corporation under the due process and equal protection clauses of t he 14th Amendment, which was passed after the Civil War to free the slaves.

Porter Township, supported by a coalition including the Pennsylvania Farmers Union, the Pennsylvania Association for Sustainable Agriculture, The Sierra Club, the AFL-CIO, the United Mine Workers of America, Common Cause, the Program on Corporations, Law, and Democracy (POCLAD), the Community Environmental Legal Defense Fund (CELDF), and other pro-democracy groups, fought back. They bluntly asserted that - as it was from the founding of this nation until the bizarre Santa Clara County v. Southern Pacific Railroad Supreme Court case in 1886 - only humans are entitled to human rights in their community. In the law they passed on December 9, 2002, they explicitly said, "The judicial designation of corporations as 'persons' grants corporations the power to sue municipal governments for adopting laws that violate the purported constitutional rights of corporations.

For example, in September 2000, Synagro Inc. filed a federal lawsuit against Rush Township (Centre County) Supervisors, forcing the Township to spend tens of thousands of taxpayer dollars to defend its health-related sewage sludge testing ordinance against claims that the ordinance violated the corporation's constitutional rights." The implications of this are staggering. For example: Before 1886, it was a felony in most states for corporations to give money to politicians or otherwise try (through lobbying or advertising) to influence elections. Such activity was called "bribery and influencing," and the reason it was banned was simple: corporations can't vote, so what are they doing in politics? Their concern is making money, and they don't need clean air to breathe or fresh water to drink; leave them to making money and leave the administration of the commons to We, The People.

Before 1886, it was a crime in most states for corporations to own others of their own kind. The need to keep corporations from becoming so large that they could usurp democracy was so clear to the Founders that Jefferson and Madison proposed an 11th Amendment to the Constitution that would have banned "monopolies in commerce," restricting each company to performing a single purpose, making it responsible to its local community, and barring it from owning other corporations. The amendment didn't pass because everybody at the time knew that the states already had such laws in place.

Before 1886, only humans had full First Amendment rights of free speech, including the right to influence legislation and the right to lie when not under oath. Now corporations have claimed that they have the free speech right to influence public opinion and legislation through deceit, and a case based on a multinational corporation asserting this right is poised to go before the Supreme Court as you read these words.

That corporation reserves the right to fire and even prosecute human employees who lie to it, however. Before 1886, only humans had Fourth Amendment rights of privacy. Since then, however, corporations have claimed that EPA and OSHA surprise inspections are violations of their human right of privacy, while at the same time asserting their right to perform surprise inspections of their own employees' bodily fluids, phone conversations, and keystrokes.

Before 1886, only humans had Fifth Amendment rights against double jeopardy and the right to refuse to speak if they'd committed a crime. Since 1886, corporations have asserted these human rights for themselves: the results range from today's corporate scandals to 60 years of silence about the deadliness of tobacco and asbestos.

Before 1886, and following the Civil War, only humans had Fourteenth Amendment rights to protection from discrimination. Since then, corporations have claimed this human right and used it to stop local communities from passing laws to protect their small, local businesses and keep out predatory retailers or large corporations convicted of crimes elsewhere.

Porter Township has fired the first shot in the New American Revolution with this first binding law denying corporate personhood. It's a revolution that will be fought not with guns but in the courts, in the voting booths, and on the battlefield of public opinion. (Far from harming corporations, returning human rights solely to humans will lead to an entrepreneurial boom in America - only a small handful of very large corporations abuse these rights to deceive people, hide crimes, or make politicians violate the will of their own voters. The millions of ethical corporations will thus be freed from the tyranny of the few while democratic government will be returned to its citizens.) As Thomas Paine - another Pennsylvania resident - wrote on that 1776 December night and published 2 days before Christmas, "Let it be told to the future world, that in the depth of winter, when nothing but hope and virtue could survive, that the city and the country, alarmed at one common danger, came forth to meet and repulse it." Thom Hartmann is the author of "Unequal Protection: The Rise of Corporation Dominance and the Theft of Human Rights," a book containing a version of the above ordinance customized for each of the 50 states. www.unequalprotection.com. He holds the copyright to this article, but grants permission for reprint in print, web, and email media as long as this credit is attached

My Comments:

The Dutch East India Company, The British East India Company, The Hudson Bay Company and many other corporations illegally occupied, raped, enslaved, and pillaged countless countries with the help of the military of their respective countries. We still witness the repercussions of these actions.

Nothing much has changed since those days we still see corporations (aided by their bought and paid for government's) using deceit, and manipulation to gain (illegal) access to valuable resources in other countries. For example Vietnam, Haiti, India, Pakistan, Africa Iraq etc etc.

The M.O. doesn't change just the names:

Haliburton Oil ( proposed pipeline from Caspian sea [largest oil deposits on the planet] through Iraq, Iran, and Afghanistan). U.S. Military to Take Over Halliburton Oil Role by Sue Pleming, Reuters http://www.occupationwatch.org/article.php?id=2379

The Carlyle Group (Sometimes referred to as the Ex-presidents club) "And as the Carlyle investors watched the World Trade towers go down, the group's prospects went up." http://www.hereinreality.com/carlyle.html

Standard Oil now Exxon C.I.A.'s secret history about the Iranian coup of 1953. http://www.counterpunch.org/faruqui05282003.html

United fruit company now Chiquita The United Fruit Company, the CIA & the Dullas Brothers. http://www.mayaparadise.com/ufc1e.htm

Bechtel “BOLIVIA’S WAR OVER WATER” http://www.democracyctr.org/bechtel/

The World Bank http://www.democracyctr.org/bechtel/world_bank.html

IBM Provided Hollerith punch card technology to assist Nazis in processing huge volumes of prisoners http://www.ibmandtheholocaust.com/

Just a few of the many.

The motive doesn't change:

-Gold

-Oil The pipeline of greed http://www.rememberjohn.com/dawn.html

-Drugs (CIA & Drugs Rep. McKinney of Georgia Blasts "Drug War" Lawsuit in Open Letter to Rob't Strauss. http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ciadrugs/index.html

-Cheap (slave labour) The US in Haiti: Why? http://dominionpaper.ca/weblog/2004/02/the..._haiti_why.html

-and all other natural and valuable resources including water.

-Regional control (The Ongoing Geopolitical Game in the Caucasus and the Caspian Basin:

Bush administration. Most have connections to OIL companies most still get some form of income from oil companies

- George W Bush and Salem Bin Laden (yes Osama Bin Laden's brother) were co-founders of) Arbusto Energy oil company Texas

- Donald Evans Donald was the CEO of Tom Brown Inc. -- a natural gas company with fields in Texas, Colorado and Wyoming -- for more than a decade.

- Dick Cheney was, until last year, the CEO of Halliburton, the world’s largest oil field services company. Halliburton, through its European subsidiaries, sold spare parts to Iraq’s oil industry, despite U.N. sanctions.

- Condoleeza Rice Was on the board of directors of Chevron she has a130,000-ton oil tanker named after her.

To see how many more of the current Bush administration have oil, banking and corporate ties go to http://www.opensecrets.org/bush/cabinet.asp

As much as we Canadians like to think we are immune from various issues on the basis that "yes but that's in the U.S." Let's face it we are not immune.

[bush_cheney2004]

To see how many more of the current Bush administration have oil, banking and corporate ties go to http://www.opensecrets.org/bush/cabinet.asp

Nothing wrong with that....the US runs on petroleum distillates. See "Carter Doctrine".

As much as we Canadians like to think we are immune from various issues on the basis that "yes but that's in the U.S." Let's face it we are not immune.

That would explain the Canadian obsession with the United States. Party on....

[Oleg Bach]

Nothing wrong with that....the US runs on petroleum distillates. See "Carter Doctrine".

That would explain the Canadian obsession with the United States. Party on....

Canadians are idol and hero worshippers..that explains why they are so taken by American culture. It's like the guy that thinks a hot guitar player is a god..or it's because we are so colonialist in mind still that we look up to the brother that escaped the bonds of mental and social subserviance..America fought maw and pa Britian to be free of them and get his own basement apartment..now the escaped son has a mansion and we still live with the folks...waiting for someone to die so we can buy a hot car..

[bush_cheney2004]

....It's like the guy that thinks a hot guitar player is a god..or it's because we are so colonialist in mind still that we look up to the brother that escaped the bonds of mental and social subserviance..America fought maw and pa Britian to be free of them and get his own basement apartment...

Well, I'm sure boredom has its virtues.

We get the "Creature from Jekyl Island" reference from time to time....I think the last one was posted by Polynewbie.

Edited May 2, 2009 by bush_cheney2004

[Oleg Bach]

Well, I'm sure boredom has its virtues.

We get the "Creature from Jekyl Island" reference from time to time....I think the last one was posted by Polynewbie.

NOT if you are an adventurer...not if you are of the American blood that boils on command...imagine - if you are American - you get a bit bored and so off you go to invent an A - bomb and use it out of sheer curiousity...or you get a bit bored and blow the hell out of Baghdad by remote control like a grand video game...(shock and awh) - Yes you do know how to get rid of boredom...like going to the moon - that tops it all! We on the other hand....create situations where the family dog can have marital status ...and we watch the experiment..not the best entertainment - we must be more cerebral..

[bush_cheney2004]

....We on the other hand....create situations where the family dog can have marital status ...and we watch the experiment..not the best entertainment - we must be more cerebral..

Must be...cause that's pretty funny.

I guess it really doesn't matter in the end...somebody has to put on the show.

But you are right....a post-modern America is easily bored these days.....maybe it's time to break out the snuff flicks.

[Oleg Bach]

Must be...cause that's pretty funny.

I guess it really doesn't matter in the end...somebody has to put on the show.

But you are right....a post-modern America is easily bored these days.....maybe it's time to break out the snuff flicks.

That's not funny. Look at the idots that adore the percieved self importance of life and death..this war in Afghanistan...our people are so bored and feel ineffective that they get a kick out of sending back one body at a time ...and stand and salute the singular corpse as it passes under the highway over pass. That shows a real bored population..NOW if this was WW one or 2...or some ancient battle......and a thousand a day were slaughtered - all entertainment value would go out the window and reality would set in...OR have a war on Canadian or American soil..that would shut the ass holes up.

[bush_cheney2004]

.... all entertainment value would go out the window and reality would set in...OR have a war on Canadian or American soil..that would shut the ass holes up.

Maybe..but the Americans have already been there and done that (Civil War).

I think it's gonna take space aliens looking for dog food.

[Oleg Bach]

Maybe..but the Americans have already been there and done that (Civil War).

I think it's gonna take space aliens looking for dog food.

Forgot the your civil war..it is still a sobering bit of history. DOG food...the aliens are our new modern woman who can't stand to have "relationships" with male humans and spend a billion bucks a year on dog chow and baby clothes...for the mutts..try to get one of these aliens to buy you a drink and sleep with you...dysfunctional is not to strong a word for these out of spacers...but - I do admit that I sad loaded at the bar with two local whores ..making out with both at the same time...the bar tender thought I was a nasty old man..all that kissing and gropping ----- but she might just be an alien also --- actually all she said to me - and she is strikingly beautiful and bright...."no one wants to ride an old pony" - still gets me excieted to be called a pony...off track but...I am probably the most American guy on the block - I had fun and did not feel guilty.

[ironstone]

Tonight on FOX at 9pm,there is a special about the media coverage of the tea parties.I encourage you guys to check it out and post your comments.So far,everything I have seen and read indicates there is a great deal of media bias on this subject.Merely reporting the facts as they are is apparently not what the mainstream media is about these days.I suspect some tea party myths will be "punked"on this special.

[JerrySeinfeld]

Uh…it’s fortunate we have a market economy then. Unfortunately, you don’t really understand how a market economy works. It is based on a system that requires government to create a stable environment for the market to thrive. Therefore, you need roads and railroads and bridges to move goods; you need a healthy, educated workforce to produce goods; you need a stable political environment to grow in, and you need a proper regulatory system so that the economy doesn’t break down because of the greed of a few individuals. Unfortunately, people with simplistic ideologies like your own gained too much credence in recent years and hastened the destruction of our economy. Fortunately, with the right degree of stimulus and a renewed understanding of the importance of sustainable regulation, the market will correct itself and we will be back on the road to prosperity.

Amazing that there still exist a few who haven’t learned anything from the catastrophe of Reaganomics, even well after they’ve been proven terribly, terribly wrong.

"destruction" of our economy? hahahahaha. the US economy has contracted about 5%.

Meanwhile the growth from Reagan's massive tax cuts and deregulation was one of the longest and most prosperous growth periods in history.

Of course, anyone who espouses that "government is the answer" everytime your paycheck doesn't arrive as quickly as the milk from yo mama's teet wouldn't understand that in fact the odd correction is a natural part of free enterprise growth cycles.

you should read "chicken little" you might learn something.

people are such little childeren these days, everytime the unemployment rate goes up the go crying to the government like it's their mama.

if you don' have enough money to pay your rent between jobs, that's more of a reflection of college-kid financial planning and and irresposibility than it is of the fact that mama government didn't spend enough on bridges.

why don't you just take care of your own adult responsibilities like a real man instead of whining that you need someone else's help?

I love these people at the tea parties because they are like minded economic thinkers: ie. enough confiscating my mony with the promise that you'll "take care of things". I can take car of myself thank you very much. THAT is the message.

It's fundamentally a tug of war between people who see themselves as freeborn adult citizens versus those who see themselves as overgrown adolescents who haven't yet figured out how to go it alone. Unfortunately for us free born adults, more and more adolescents are joining the dole and confiscating more and more of our hard earned money. Sad.

Edited May 2, 2009 by JerrySeinfeld

[BubberMiley]

"destruction" of our economy? hahahahaha. the US economy has contracted about 5%.

Really? You only lost 5% of your overall wealth in the past year? You must've had nothing to start with.

Meanwhile the growth from Reagan's massive tax cuts and deregulation was one of the longest and most prosperous growth periods in history.

Sad that the deregulation "growth" turned out to be just a bubble based on greed though.

Of course, anyone who espouses that "government is the answer" everytime your paycheck doesn't arrive as quickly as the milk from yo mama's teet wouldn't understand that in fact the odd correction is a natural part of free enterprise growth cycles.

You wouldn't understand that you rely on government as much as the next guy. Even "free enterprise" wouldn't function without government.

you should read "chicken little" you might learn something.

You should read "Intro to Economics." You would learn a lot.

if you don' have enough money to pay your rent between jobs, that's more of a reflection of college-kid financial planning and and irresposibility than it is of the fact that mama government didn't spend enough on bridges.

Meanwhile, you bike to school wondering how you got over that river without getting wet.

Edited May 5, 2009 by BubberMiley

[JerrySeinfeld]

Really? You only lost 5% of your overall wealth in the past year? You must've had nothing to start with.

Firts of all, the above statement shows a lack of basic math skills. Regardless of starting value, 5% is still 5%. But I digress.

Fluctuations in stock/real estate markets (which almost always overshoot in both directions) are a separate issue from the actualy measured size of the economy. You said that reaganomics "destroyed the economy" (and I quote). That's a chicken little statement. The US GDP has contracted exactly 3% from it's peak. That's hardly "destruction". That means the economy produced 97% of what it did at it's all time peak about a year ago.

Sad that the deregulation "growth" turned out to be just a bubble based on greed though.

No it didn't.

US Real GDP at the end of Reagan's term: $6.6 trillion.

US Real GDP in January 2008: $11.6 trillion

US Real GDP in January 2009: $11.3 trillion

So in January 2009, the depths of the "burst bubble", we saw a "whopping" 2.6% decline in overall GDP. If that's "destruction" of the economy, I think it's prety clear who it is that needs the economics lesson.

But I will concede that there was somewhat of a housing bubble created by legislation enacted largely due to pressure from Barack Obama's ACORN, which pressured financial institutions to make more risky loans so that minorities and other bad credit risks could "own" a home.

Of course, investment banks were culpable too in that they used poor credit mortages to leverage up and create CDOs and other levered mortage-backed paper which ultimately led to the serious asset write downs and subsequent banking problems we see today. Based upon early reports leaked from thursday's upcoming "stress test" results on the biggest US banks, 10 of the 19 will need to partially re-capitalize. While that's not good news, it's encouraging to hear that news instead of what people feared a while back, which was many many bank failures.

Of course the creation of these levered financial vehicles came as a result of the fact that

1. The crappy loans wo poor credit risk minorities were even made in the first place - thanks in large part to Barack and his ACORN buddies.

and

2. Repealed Glass Steagall act, passed by a republican congress and signed into law by Bill Clinton.

Both of which hardly can be placed upon Ronald Reagan. And now that the markets have recovered 30% from march lows largely in anticipation of a late year economic recovery, we can see that this is a result of the free market pricing out the losers, forcing the unsustainable into chapter 11 then allowing the survivors to recover with big gains - and not a result of Barack spening $2 trillion on STD testing and "save the tree" initiatives.

Whatever miniscule economic value the stimulous will actually provide won't hit the economy until late this year or early next and even afterward, which means it'll be the absolute worst timing possible as it will compound the already massive ocean of dollars that have been printed by the federal reserve during it's brief but effect "quantitative easing" - meaning that Obama and his ilk's "stimulous" will arrive just in time to cause a rocket up in inflation and renewed economic concerns just as we're starting to see normailized growth. Great.

Just one more of the gazillion examples of why government should stay the hell out of the economy.

But hey, no problem, because we don't have to pay for all that debt anyway, right? Our grand childeren have already been pre-approved...by us. Lovely job Barack.

Or...we could just let markets sort out the winners and losers efficiently as they always have.

Meanwhile, you bike to school wondering how you got over that river without getting wet.

Why would I do that. In a free enterprise world it would be a toll bridge built and operated by a private company where only the people who USE it would PAY for it, keeping taxes at close to zero for everyone. Then we'd all have more money in our jeans and we wouldn't have to ride bikes around.

Edited May 5, 2009 by JerrySeinfeld

[Shady]

Amazing that there still exist a few who haven’t learned anything from the catastrophe of Reaganomics, even well after they’ve been proven terribly, terribly wrong.

When were Reaganomics proven to be terribly wrong? Are tax rates at 70% again, like they were before he became President? I mean, I know they're headed there soon, because Obama is racking up so much debt in so little time, that taxpayers will have to pay much more to prevent the country from going bankrupt.