New voting rules blamed for historically low turnout

[jdobbin]

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/stor...008&no_ads=

New voting rules are being blamed in part for the low number of Canadians who went to the polls in Tuesday's election. Only 59.1 per cent of those eligible voted -- possibly the lowest turnout in the country's history.

The new rules, which require voters to produce valid identification with an address, made it difficult for some students, aboriginals and rural Canadians to cast their ballots.

The federal Election Act, amended two years ago, requires everyone voting to produce government-issued identification that includes a street name and house number.

But about one million Canadians living in rural areas don't have an address with a street name and number, and for some Aboriginals their only address is the name of their reserve.

There certainly were some issues related to the ID that went beyond people just not remembering to bring it.

[M.Dancer]

An even more likely reason given here....

OTTAWA -Stephen Harper's Conservatives won 19 seats more on Tuesday than in the 2006 election, when Canadians cast 168,737 fewer ballots for his party. The real reason for his bigger victory is that Liberal supporters stayed home in droves.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/sto...y/politics/home

I think many said, I am a Liberal but I won't vote for this ....and they didn't.

[nbguyca]

There was no reason for anyone not to know what to bring for id at the polls. That's a cop-out.

[drewski]

I think most of the excuses were just to cover voter laziness. if they really wanted to voted, they could get documents relatively easily

http://www.elections.ca/content.asp?sectio...tonly=false#two

if they lived in residence, they could get a letter from there saying thats where they lived.

Attestation of Residence issued by the responsible authorities (shelters, soup kitchens, student/senior residences, long-term care facilities)

if they lived off-campus, they could have used their lease as ID

Residential Lease, Residential Mortgage Statement or Agreement

as for aboriginals

Attestation of Residence issued by the responsible authority of an Indian band or reserve

[Mad_Michael]

Yes, the elites always need to create reasons to explain why the people don't play along with their rules and their games.

I'd venture to guess that turnout was historically low because the choices on offer were historically poor ones. Kinda like Bush vs Gore in 2000 (ugly choice).

Increasingly, the people (ie. voters) are learning that voting just doesn't matter all that much.

[capricorn]

Increasingly, the people (ie. voters) are learning that voting just doesn't matter all that much.

Luckily, a majority of Canadians voted. Those that don't are the ones that complain the loudest when they don't agree with politicians.

Edited October 16, 2008 by capricorn

[Mr.Canada]

Everyone had 2 years to get together the proper documents in order to vote.

I see no problem.

[msj]

Well, my wife and I almost didn't get to vote.

Being self-employed should make it easy but not when you have meetings spread throughout the day with clients. Not when you are driving hundreds of kilometers between offices.

Sure, you can show up at the polling station at 7AM and try to get registered since we had the nerve to move a month before the election.

You can bring your passport, birth certificate and drivers license but, what's that?, you still haven't received the change of address sticker to attach to your drivers' license from the government yet? [Which arrived on Wednesday, of course]

Well, how is Elections Canada supposed to know that we moved?

Fortunately I had changed our address for banking purposes and a visa statement had just arrived (albeit, by email).

I printed that out at work and took it back in the afternoon.

EC did accept this and we got to vote.

The lesson here is don't move before an election and, better yet, don't take a vacation just after moving (but before the election). You may not be lucky enough to have a bill with your new address on it.

As for homeless people and aboriginals - with the inexperience that I had to suffer through (we were almost registered in the morning before they checked the rules again and again and denied us), I can't imagine trying to register to vote under their conditions so I won't judge these people for not voting.

[Moonlight Graham]

I think having the election the day after Thanksgiving also had a big impact.

[Mr.Canada]

@MSJ

I applaud your motivations to get out and vote.

You found solutions and didn't just sit here and whine about it.

Also you provided some helpful solutions.

Well done.

[myata]

Of course, the new rules won't explain the trend with lower voter participation seen in several earlier elections. I think there may be a deeper problem(s) here.

[msj]

@MSJ

I applaud your motivations to get out and vote.

You found solutions and didn't just sit here and whine about it.

Also you provided some helpful solutions.

Well done.

It was a struggle.

But had we not received that visa statement with our new address on it then my wife and I would not have been able to vote at all.

Sure, circumstances here are extreme, but who knows what other peoples circumstances were like.

[guyser]

I think having the election the day after Thanksgiving also had a big impact.

What...trytophan intoxication?

Hush, dont want to give the "it rained" people another excuse .

[Alta4ever]

Well, my wife and I almost didn't get to vote.

Being self-employed should make it easy but not when you have meetings spread throughout the day with clients. Not when you are driving hundreds of kilometers between offices.

Sure, you can show up at the polling station at 7AM and try to get registered since we had the nerve to move a month before the election.

You can bring your passport, birth certificate and drivers license but, what's that?, you still haven't received the change of address sticker to attach to your drivers' license from the government yet? [Which arrived on Wednesday, of course]

Well, how is Elections Canada supposed to know that we moved?

Fortunately I had changed our address for banking purposes and a visa statement had just arrived (albeit, by email).

I printed that out at work and took it back in the afternoon.

EC did accept this and we got to vote.

The lesson here is don't move before an election and, better yet, don't take a vacation just after moving (but before the election). You may not be lucky enough to have a bill with your new address on it.

As for homeless people and aboriginals - with the inexperience that I had to suffer through (we were almost registered in the morning before they checked the rules again and again and denied us), I can't imagine trying to register to vote under their conditions so I won't judge these people for not voting.

Do you not change the address before you move? Why leave it until after? Even better yet if you are unsure if you can make it election night go to an advanced poll, thats why they exist. I have had to do this acouple of times.

[Alta4ever]

Of course, the new rules won't explain the trend with lower voter participation seen in several earlier elections. I think there may be a deeper problem(s) here.

I agree with you on this, I think its the first time I have!

[mikedavid00]

Increasingly, the people (ie. voters) are learning that voting just doesn't matter all that much.

My wife and I didn't bother voting again this time around.

We live in a Liberal ethnic riding and there simply isn't a *realistic* point in voting.

At work, 3 people we spoke to didn't vote becuase the don't listen to the news and don't care that much. However, after speaking to them, the didn't want higher gas prices and really didn't care about the environment becuase they are tax payers (not tax receivers like the CBC and civil servants).

So there was 5 Conservative votes gone.

It's very simple: Do you want higher gas prices and an increase in the GST? No? Then don't vote Liberal or NDP.

Pretty simple for the tax payer struggling to get by.

[OddSox]

My wife and I didn't bother voting again this time around.

We live in a Liberal ethnic riding and there simply isn't a *realistic* point in voting.

At work, 3 people we spoke to didn't vote becuase the don't listen to the news and don't care that much. However, after speaking to them, the didn't want higher gas prices and really didn't care about the environment becuase they are tax payers (not tax receivers like the CBC and civil servants).

So there was 5 Conservative votes gone.

It's very simple: Do you want higher gas prices and an increase in the GST? No? Then don't vote Liberal or NDP.

Pretty simple for the tax payer struggling to get by.

Perhaps, if enough of you who felt the same had got out and voted - then it would no longer be a 'Liberal' riding. I suspect there are very few ridings in the country where the winning MP garnered over 50% of eligible voters.

[Smallc]

My wife and I didn't bother voting again this time around.

We live in a Liberal ethnic riding and there simply isn't a *realistic* point in voting.

There is always a point to voting. As a citizen it is your civic duty and as a conservative it should be your principled duty.

[msj]

Do you not change the address before you move? Why leave it until after? Even better yet if you are unsure if you can make it election night go to an advanced poll, thats why they exist. I have had to do this acouple of times.

In some cases the address change occurred before we left on vacation and in other cases it was done when we got back.

Didn't expect it to be a problem so there was no need to go an advanced poll (we were back from vacation by the end of September).

Terasen Gas, for example, was changed around September 9th (a few days before vacation, 1 day after the move).

I just received the bill yesterday (in the mail).

This timing lag is terrible but to a large extent beyond most people's control.

A person should not have to rely on the timing of bills from the bank or utility companies in order to vote.

Look at the visa statement that I used - Elections Canada has no idea how easy it would have been for me to have changed my address on various bank accounts and, since I get it all to my email address rather than through snail mail, go into various different polling stations to claim that I had moved to whatever address I put on the bank statements.

Yet this system is supposed to protect from voter fraud?

We'll put in a system which may disenfranchise X% of people in order to give false comfort that we'll prevent a smaller percent from cheating?

It's absurd.

Edited October 16, 2008 by msj

[guyser]

My wife and I didn't bother voting again this time around.

It rained in your neighbourhood didnt it?

We live in a Liberal ethnic riding and there simply isn't a *realistic* point in voting.

Jacques Parizeau, is that you?

It's very simple: Do you want higher gas prices and an increase in the GST? No? Then don't vote Liberal or NDP.

Pretty simple for the tax payer struggling to get by.

Gas prices are dropping. Down below $80. Would have been the same no matter who won.

[mikedavid00]

There is always a point to voting. As a citizen it is your civic duty and as a conservative it should be your principled duty.

That's idealistic. Ultimatly you are right.

But in a realistic context, our 2 votes didn't help the Libearl landslide victory which we all knew was going to happen. I feel there are a lot of tax payers like us who know the same and don't even bother.

I feel that you do not have democracy unless 100% of the people vote. Think about it. If half of that vote, it's not democracy, but rather people with special political intrests voting.

For the mainstreme non voter who probably dosn't even know who stephan Dion is (yes that exists.. i whitnessed it at work yesterday. They watch CSI, Dancing with the Stars, etc. and do not listen to talk radio so honestly they have no clue who Dion is and sometimes even Harper), those mainstreme voters know these things:

1 - They do not want a raise in gas prices.

2 - They do not want a raise in the GST.

3 - They don't care about the environment (because they don't watch the news)

4 - They don't want to lose their jobs.

5 - They get no help for the gov't and do not use their programs.

6 - They dislike the social effects of immigrants and question why there are so many here.

7 - They struggle to make ends meet and get buy.

Now. This is not going to be the average person on this forum. There probably isn't one person posting on this forum that first the above. Think of when you were 10 years old and had no clue about anything. That's how they are right now.

Does dancing with the stars or Americas Got Talent interest you? No? So what makes you think watching CPAC or CBC intrests them?

See, when you FORCE voting on people, there becomes yes and no campaigns that spell things out in plain English. Here's the grade 7 reading level 90 IQ questions and asnwers:

Do you want higher gas prices? No.

Do you want an increase in the GST? No.

If we lost 500,000 jobs, do you think 300,000 should be coming in each year? No.

Do you want Canada to set goals to reduce C02 emissions despite the fact we are responsible for 1.9% of world emissions? This will come at raised gas prices, and people losing jobs? .. ummmm.. NOPE!

So it's not rocket science. When people are forced to vote, the mainstreme tax payer will understand things pretty easily. WE ON THE FORUM can over complicate the above for 100 posts, but it's really not needed.

Here is the sort of mainstreme ads would we see during election. We can over complicate it, but

See? Very easy and simple. Grade 7 comprehension level. Apply the same to GST, Immigration, etc. and the choice is obvious.

(although the above youtube video was a bad example because that is actually debatable.. raising the GST isn't!)

[TCCK]

So did anyone here in this forum get turned awaaay from voting I aaaask???

I own my own businesses (pural), yes I have tons of staff but I was very busy that daaaay and yet at 4PM I left work eaaaarly (even though my main secretary was livid I had not signed a bunch of papers and you do not want to make Joyce mad she can kill a horse with her stare when she is maaaad.) becuse I was coming bck into the office in the evening so I went to my poll (1 hour away from office) then home for a quick dinner and back to the office.

It is a priviledge to be able to vote in this country and too mny people do not tke tht priviledge seriously. Maybe if there was monitary reprocussions for not voting then maybe people would get it.

Sorry aaaaaaaaaaaabout the aaa problem I need to get the IT department to chnge my keyboaaaaard aaaas it is driving me mad trying to keep fixing the double, or more or no aaa's at aaall. I will caaall them right now. Sorry.

[myata]

My wife and I didn't bother voting again this time around.

We live in a Liberal ethnic riding and there simply isn't a *realistic* point in voting.

That's of course, one obvious symptom of an outdated majoritary electoral system. All votes cast against dominant incumbent are lost; pure and simple; don't change anything, a bit, heck, milligram. Most people are smart enough to realize that.

What was good 100 years back (some choice); isn't good anymore (we need real choice). Should it take us another 100 years to realize that, and start fixing it?

[cybercoma]

If I still lived in Windsor, ON, I would have voted regardless of the fact that NDP was taking both ridings, but I can see why many would just stay home.

[mikedavid00]

That's of course, one obvious symptom of an outdated majoritary electoral system. All votes cast against dominant incumbent are lost; pure and simple; don't change anything, a bit, heck, milligram. Most people are smart enough to realize that.

What was good 100 years back (some choice); isn't good anymore (we need real choice). Should it take us another 100 years to realize that, and start fixing it?

I feel the way to fix that problem is to simply allow tax payers to vote. You would also have to have paid taxes for 65% of the last 5 years.

Evaid taxes, collect social benefits, are a civil servant and make a living off our tax dollars, then you get no right to vote becuase why the hell should you have a say on how our money is spent?

Problem solved.

Loud university snots and lame professors who never worked a day in the private sector do nothing for Canada except push agenda's down our throat and try to decide for us how our money should be spent when they have contributed NOTHING to do the bucket.

We all chip in money for lotto tickets at work (we dont but it's an example). If a ticket wins, only the people who chipped in decide if we will keep the money or buy more lotto tickets. Sure, we can listen to ideas from those who did not chip in, but they get no official say. We decide how the money is spent.

Look at it that way. Immigrants do not contribute, thus, they're vote is lost.

All proportional reperesentation does is ensure an Islamic party of Canada and decorate our house of commons with 20 parties based down racial and religious lines.

Is that what you want?