Leafless

Well when gas does rise significantly, you come back and tell us how much you saved, because currently you are not saving anything.

Why do you continually refer to a bloody ground source heat pump as 'geothermal' rather than to properly identify what you are actually talking about.

What your saying is ridiculous. If government acted responsibly relating to infrastructure rather that creating money pits like 'official bilingualism', the country would be doing fabulously well with no deficit. Besides, what you are saying as always been the rule of thumb to something that has been ignored, ' PAY ME NOW OR PAY ME LATER, SUCKA'

Then what other single province surpasses the population of ONTARIO? I wouldn't want you as my math teacher. BTW, where do get your inflated 36 million people in Canada numbers. http://www.statcan.ca/english/edu/clock/population.htm You even beat out predicted population estimates.

That is why people like Mc.Guinty pass ILLUSIONARY laws that give the false impression children won't be a burden on society with cancer related disease and be rather productive healthy little workers. But do you think Mc.Guinty really cares whether it be children or adults live or die? If he did cigarettes would be banned. Vote for Mc.Guinty is what this is all about.

How wrong you are. If there is anything Christian it is the Lord's Prayer also known as the Our Father or Pater noster. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lord's_Prayer Have you never heard of Sister Janet Mead singing the Lord's Prayer, a popular hit in the 70's. http://www.hardrushmusic.com/sister_janet_mead.html

IOW, Melanie is telling you, 'it is NOT OKAY to have a DIVERSE view. Post as you wish UDhaditComing, that is within forum rules.

How is that since natural gas was also a lot cheaper than it is to-day and I doubt if ground source heat pump systems were any cheaper than than they are to-day. Most manufacturers and installation companies take advantage of any newer trick out in the market 10 years ago and would not provide cheaper ground source heat pump systems than what they are going for to-day. Canada a cold country depends on large quantities of energy for its survival. Gasoline shortages are already beginning to show at local service stations with no gas to sell at certain times. But like I said, if energy cost continue to skyrocket and without some type of government intervention in the way of energy cost, it will more than likely result in the collapse of Canada, as we know it to-day. The same can be said about the U.S., as the U.S. automotive industry and related industries provides the backbone of the country in the way of jobs and providing all important transportation.

Oh that must be Quebec /Maritime provinces Liberal supporters, federal employees, pensioners, and anyone else dependant on especially the federal Liberal gravy train. That sounds like more than 25%.

In this country it appears race trumps law of the land.

An average size house in the city on a small lot means boring holes for the piping up to a depth of 300 ft. and boring through rock dramatically increases the cost plus upgrading windows and insulation plus the cost of the equipment and installation. Oh, stop it jdobbin, I found the link you copied that from: http://www.gogeothermal.ca/faq.html That depends where you live and how cold it is, but I would average that at 20 years. And you should expect the more colder the climate you live in the more wear and tear on the compressor, which means in a cold climate like Winnipeg be prepared to replace your compressor every 5-10 years, and that cost $3,500 up. The true cost is everything you have invested in the system that must be averaged over the life time of the system being about 20 years. So in your case you say the total cost is $20k, so that means over 20 years, it cost you $1,000 yearly, plus hydro and maintenance, if any, which is on the low side. The information I found indicates your yearly saving compared to gas saves you about $1,000 dollars the exact amount your system cost you averaged over 20 years. So in effect, currently, you are NOT saving anything. BTW- I do think eventually energy cost for heating, will be government controlled or society will crumble.

You are wrong and have some nerve initiating a thread under a nick name used in his school years. I think you are trying to make him sound White. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barack_Obama

Negro lynching....LOL. This is highly against Canadian law. But bride burning committed by foreign cultures as part of their tradition would probably be treated like the turban issue with the RCMP. You know, religious rights and all that crap would probably trump murder or be so well covered by that race, (just like the Air India bombing) no one would suspect a bride was actually burnt to death.

I have worked in air-conditioning and refrigeration as part of my job involving scientific equipment. I just was wondering how someone like you can praise geothermal when you are not fully aware of all the technical aspects related to geothermal and all the extra cost involved and all you quote are hydro cost. You and others do not paint the full picture. But this is typical with Liberals anyways as all they feed you is horse manure relating to just about anything.

I agree. Smoking is legal and the province has no right dictating a law relating to smoking in your own car regardless of who is in it. This will probably only frustrate smokers and they will do it all the more. I think eating a hamburger while driving is more dangerous to someone elses health relating to an inattentive driver eating that hamburg causing a head on collision and killing someone. Why does Mc.Guinty just ban living and get it over with.

Sounds like you are going to have miles of pipe. BTW, what is Winnipeg sitting on anyways, a volcano?

Especially when everything you buy does not work or is defective, one way or the other. Earth has already been exploited and there is no stopping mankind from being affected, to the point of obliteration, from abuses by the greedy rich. But here in North America immigration will probably cure this, and they can start all over again, playing their little 'materialism' game. The rich have proven their little trick (consumerism) works, that is when most are employed and not unemployed. I agree, they can shove their little trinkets where the sun don't shine.

This is where you are totally disconnected from reality, in typical liberal fashion making false allegations and insults, Prove that I intentionally wanted to insult Bubber, commie lady? If you can't, at least have the common courtesy to apologize for your error in judgement. I sincerely assumed, he would rather enjoy the company of women in a female chat group. Simple isn't it!

There is a difference between a conventional house and a R2000 house which of course cost you lots of money. Now, what you didn't mention is the size of the house where as you seen a heating bill of $300. This must be an R2000 house or must be very very well insulated and I will tell you why. A 3-h.p. compressor is equivalent to approx. 2,235 watts and you did not inform us of the compressor size he uses. That is 735 watts more than a 1500 watt baseboard heater. So if his hydro bill is $300, this means the compressor is working no where near full time and means the glycol that is thermally heated must be quiet warm or do you know what temperature the glycol is by the time it hits the heat exchanger? What temperature does he keep the interior of the house at, another important factor?

If you think merging a thread that contains new information relating to a initial old controversial thread, that would add favourable information for a particular political party could be seen as censorship if that moderator is a supporter of another party and decides to move it for that reason. You might not think so, but that possibility exist. Anyway the reasons used to determine if a new thread should be merged is debatable. This is why I think when a old issue as been substantially updated with new information not related to the title of the old thread, should not be merged and be allowed to remain as a new thread. I will tell you something. After a thread as been debated with many replies, IMO, I have read all I want to read relating to that thread, I will not return to that thread under its old topic heading, even unknown to myself, something relevant could have been added to that thread. There is just to much hassle reading all the follow up post. With new threads on a old issue, it is much easier to follow new updated developments, than to scan through fifty old replies relating to the original issue.

Who is Barry Obama?

The $20k you quoted is super low and does not reflect the true cost of someone living within the city on a small lot, where installation cost of a complete system could be as high as $90,000, depending on the drilling cost. How long do you suppose your geo system is going to last...forever? The type of geo system you are describing requires a trench, minimum five feet deep, (the less depth the less heat to extract) 145 ft. long by 45 ft. wide, running about 3,500 ft. of pvc piping. That would require a large lot. Compressors only last 5-10 years and cost $3,500 for a small compressor equivalent to three horsepower, plus hydro. Larger compressors run a lot higher. What size compressor would you be using in cold Winnipeg? The trouble with what you are describing is that you are married to you house for a minimum in your case, 20-yrs. until it pays for itself. Or if you sell you would have to had the cost of your installation to the price of the house. So, how much do you figure you would save yearly compared to gas? Of course you would have to factor in your hydro cost and the income you would earn if you had invested your equipment and installation cost initially and maintenance. Another thing you are not describing is the cost to upgrade insulating your house as with a geo system the recovery rate to bring up the temperature of your house when outdoor temperatures drops rapidly is very slow. The cost to upgrade your homes insulation, windows etc. must also be added to the initial cost or you will be living in a cold house.

How can for instance a 3,000 watt upper tank element and a lower 3,000 watt tank element heat your house? Water tanks incorporate a flip-flop thermostat that allows only a single element to be energized at any single time. This single 3,000 watt element produces a measly 18,000 BTU's. So unless you are sitting on top of a volcano in that small northern Ontario town, what you are saying is impossible.

How do you know, were you speaking to her?

So, how much do you assume you would save annually taking into account your super low initial 20k investment and hydro cost? State your two cost gas vs. geothermal.