Carney announces creation of Canada's first sovereign wealth fund - Will "co fund" projects the gov't likes for partners they approve of

[CdnFox]

22 minutes ago, ExFlyer said:

Yuk Yuk Yawn Yawn

 

LOL congratulations, you've reached the intellectual level of a parrot   Well done!

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More BS banter from coinfux LOL

Awww kiddo, did i break your brain already?!!? It's not even second breakfasts yet!!!    

 

But it's not my fault that you look like a twat. You can't get mad at me for that. You ought to know by now it's starting off anything with trying to pretend you know more than other people always ends badly for you. You need to take some time and do a little more research

A sovereignty well fun takes the profits from wealth generated by govt owned Interests such as national oil companies or royalties or the like and invests them like any other investment fund to use the interest in the future to benefit the taxpayers.

What's happening here is carney is borrowing a bunch of money And we'll use it to fund projects he approves of or that meet ideological goals or benefit people he likes. This is just another liberal slush fund same as the green energy fund was, same as all the other liberal/fonts. He calls it a sovereignty fund because that sounds better than slush fund

[Goddess]

Well, this is interesting.

Carney pitched this idea to Trudeau in 2024:

Multi-billion fund involving Brookfield, Ottawa and major pensions being discussed, sources say

"The creation of a multi-billion-dollar investment fund seeded with federal government money and designed to attract additional investments from Canada’s large pension plans... ...global investment firm Brookfield Corp. pitched the proposal and could be an investor and possibly manage the fund, with hopes that pooled investment dollars would reach $50 billion."

 

I noticed yesterday when a reporter asked Carney who would be managing the fund, he dodged the question. 

Note that the original pitch had Brookfield managing it, and seeded from pension funds. 

Canadian retirees and those about to retire better start paying attention to what's going on in Canada.

Literally everything that is being done is related to Brookfield, Carney's green stocks or his EU globalist banker buddies, whom he has already installed in top government positions.

I'll take "Things That Are In No Way Surprising" for $25 billion, Alex.

[CdnFox]

19 minutes ago, Goddess said:

Well, this is interesting.

Carney pitched this idea to Trudeau in 2024:

Multi-billion fund involving Brookfield, Ottawa and major pensions being discussed, sources say

"The creation of a multi-billion-dollar investment fund seeded with federal government money and designed to attract additional investments from Canada’s large pension plans... ...global investment firm Brookfield Corp. pitched the proposal and could be an investor and possibly manage the fund, with hopes that pooled investment dollars would reach $50 billion."

 

I noticed yesterday when a reporter asked Carney who would be managing the fund, he dodged the question. 

Note that the original pitch had Brookfield managing it, and seeded from pension funds. 

Canadian retirees and those about to retire better start paying attention to what's going on in Canada.

Literally everything that is being done is related to Brookfield, Carney's green stocks or his EU globalist banker buddies, whom he has already installed in top government positions.

I'll take "Things That Are In No Way Surprising" for $25 billion, Alex.

Listening to our finance minister talk about it I noticed there was an awful lot of comments like "We'll be working that out later" Or "We need to consult with experts while we're setting that up"

All those consultations by the way will cost us millions of dollars and I think we can all guess who they'll be Consulting with.

The idea was to announce it and then sneak in the poison pill details later when people aren't watching.

And because it's a crown Corporation the debt will not be part of carney's budget debt down the road

[Goddess]

9 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

And because it's a crown Corporation the debt will not be part of carney's budget debt down the road

Now with the fancy accounting tricks, the $25 billion isn't even counted as debt.

It's now "investment".

[herbie]

Amazing how people know better than a former head of both the Bank of Canada and the Bank of England.
}He must be corrupt because he's wealthier and more ducated in economics than you. Worse, he has a positive outlook on life that's counter to the Tory doom and gloom message.

[CdnFox]

13 minutes ago, Goddess said:

Now with the fancy accounting tricks, the $25 billion isn't even counted as debt.

It's now "investment".

Exactly, and as a crown corp it's not exposed to the same level of scrutiny or accountability.

There are many games they can play. That 25 billion isn't just going to be sitting there, it'll earn interest while it's waiting for invesment, and they can syphon that money easily.  Just the 'seed' money will earn 500 - 700 million a year in interest. 

That will allow carney to appoint some more of his 'banker' friends on million dollar a year plus expenses wages, and still be able to leave lots of room for "consultants" and "programming companies" and the like, as well as budgets to pay for "executive meetings and lunches" where they treat business men and women to luxury meals and entertainment supposedly to attract investment but in reality to build their own personal relationships with the person. 

They will also then announce to a cheering public that the fund manages to raise $700 million last year! Missing the fact that most of the money got spent.

If they do lend a company money you can bet it will be with the provisions that the company also hire person X as a consultant and company y to do their accounting etc etc

This is all before you even factor in brookfields involvement

 

[CdnFox]

3 minutes ago, herbie said:

Amazing how people know better than a former head of both the Bank of Canada and the Bank of England.

Oh I don't think we know any better, I'm sure he's absolutely aware of all of this stuff. The banking part isn't hard, the magic is in how you dilute the public people like you for example.

 

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}He must be corrupt because he's wealthier and more ducated in economics than you.

He's corrupt because the things he is doing show corruption. For example he spoke to Brookfield executives after he was told not to by the ethics commission. Many of the other things he is doing are classic ways that people siphon money out of governments. You can catch somebody in your home putting your belongings into a sack and wearing a mask you don't need a degree in criminology to be able to say they're up to no good

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Worse, he has a positive outlook on life that's counter to the Tory doom and gloom message.

Of course he does, he's managing to make tens if not hundreds of millions of dollars personally and eating $2,000 a plate meals while he's flying around to parties with the world leaders. Is that look as extremely positive  

 

There's nothing negative about the tori outlook, they're just pointing out that a thief is putting all of this stuff you own into a sack and heading towards the door. That's neither negative or positive it's simply a fact and one that we should all be somewhat concerned about correcting.

But you're so emotionally invested in the left that you'll tolerate any level of corruption as long as the conservatives look bad in your mind.

[Goddess]

3 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

This is all before you even factor in brookfields involvement

 

6 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

They will also then announce to a cheering public that the fund manages to raise $700 million last year! Missing the fact that most of the money got spent.

Brookfield doesn't publicly disclose their percentage of take for asset management, but it's a generally accepted industry standard at 2%.

That means on $25 billion, they get $500,000,000/year.

This is a slush fund.  Nothing more.

[Legato]

8 minutes ago, herbie said:

Amazing how people know better than a former head of both the Bank of Canada and the Bank of England.
}He must be corrupt because he's wealthier and more ducated in economics than you. Worse, he has a positive outlook on life that's counter to the Tory doom and gloom message.

Yeah, ask the Brits how that turned out.

He has a positive outlook on making himself rich(er).

[suds]

Japan also has a SWF which has surpassed Norway's as world's largest. The difference is that Japan's is funded with borrowed money (mostly from the Bank of Japan and other domestic sources) with ridiculously low interest rates. The government then uses these borrowed funds to buy foreign equities and bonds. Like the trader who buys on margin to gain leverage, it's risky business, because leverage can act as a two way street. It can result in immense gains or immense losses.  And in Japan's case, the risk is ultimately borne by its taxpayers, bondholders, and bank depositors.

https://pubs.aeaweb.org/doi/pdfplus/10.1257/jep.20251452

Edited April 28 by suds

[herbie]

So nobody's able tp criticize the idea of a sovereign fund, just who it's started by?

Would that be because the next Tory will just p1ss it away 'reducing the deficit' like Alberta did? Or because thee loser PP didn't suggest it first?

Your lame aspersions of corruption are laughable when you all are the same defenders of the open, in your face atcual corruption down South.
 

[CdnFox]

1 minute ago, herbie said:

So nobody's able tp criticize the idea of a sovereign fund, just who it's started by?

 

actually many people Just criticized it. You just like to lie and ignore the truth in order to support your beloved liberals

The problem here is that people slap the label of sovereignty wealth fund on things which aren't really sovereignty wealth funds. 

He's sovereignty well fund is normally funded by profits that are derived from state-owned assets and then used to invest normally. This is largely the opposite where we are borrowing the money and investing in politically.

I mean they could call it rrsp if they wanted, but it's not an rrsp.

This is going to be a liberal slush fund. Historically, it is not normal for governments to borrow money to invest in equity markets. They're SUPPOSED to be what you do with surplus cash you've got from something like oil royalties or the like that you've got to do something with. 

[Goddess]

5 hours ago, herbie said:

Amazing how people know better than a former head of both the Bank of Canada and the Bank of England.

There's some things that are just obvious.

If a doctor to told you to shove cucumbers up your butt to fix your receding hairline, would you do it?  I mean, he's a doctor, after all.

"Experts" have gotten us into this mess.

Sheesh.  Use your f*cking brain.

[herbie]

Good analogy from someone the doctor told to take the vax and avoid 3 weeks in bed with a ventilator shoved down your face and didn't.

HTG you can't just toss vague accusations about shit you know nothing about and expect more than the dumbestrightwing conspiracy flakes on the forum to believe it.

Implying the fund might be used to co-fund a pipeline with Enbridge because he 'likes' them instead of investing in the Burn Wind Farms Fund because you like that is not corruption. Even if his 2nd cousin's mother in law's RRIF holds 12 shares of Enbridge.

[suds]

2 hours ago, CdnFox said:

The problem here is that people slap the label of sovereignty wealth fund on things which aren't really sovereignty wealth funds. 

It's confusing because you read stuff and find out that people have different opinions on what a SWF actually is.  If Carney's plan is to do something along the same lines as Japan, then he shouldn't have compared his idea of a SWF to Norway.  I'll agree with that. There are even some who believe that the money held and invested in our CPP is a SWF. It's not because it's not administered by government but by people who are supposed to be at arms length from government. Personally, this topic on SWF's has forced me to change my mind on a number of different issues. My past criticism's on how those who administer the CPP favour investing in the U.S. is one of them.

[Legato]

Asking for your after-tax dollars. After using, your tax dollars, to force all Canadians to invest in a debt fund. The interest is paid by you.

And liabilities are also insured by you.

So they can use their infinite political “investment wisdom,” to choose who gets YOUR money.

This is Carney’s “new government” The Liberal Cartel of Canada.

Rice planting season is upon us.

Edited April 29 by Legato

[eyeball]

2 hours ago, suds said:

It's confusing because you read stuff and find out that people have different opinions on what a SWF actually is.

I think it's safe to say the word sovereign is loaded up with enough emotion to be all it takes to throw things into a tizzy.

The difference between Norway and Canada is the we have 12-13 essentially sovereign provinces all pulling in as many directions. Some harder than others when it comes to 'their' natural resources.

 

[CdnFox]

1 hour ago, eyeball said:

I think it's safe to say the word sovereign is loaded up with enough emotion to be all it takes to throw things into a tizzy.

The difference between Norway and Canada is the we have 12-13 essentially sovereign provinces all pulling in as many directions. Some harder than others when it comes to 'their' natural resources.

 

But the federal government still taxes that. For example the industrial gas taxes and such could be put into a sovereign wealth fund I understand that in their totality they bring in about $20 billion a year as well so there you go.

But the borrowing money for a reason. This is not going to work out well for Canada

[eyeball]

50 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

But the federal government still taxes that. For example the industrial gas taxes and such could be put into a sovereign wealth fund I understand that in their totality they bring in about $20 billion a year as well so there you go.

We could have done this 50 years ago and have a trillion dollars working for us now as well.

But we're stupid so we don't.

 

[ExFlyer]

11 hours ago, eyeball said:

I think it's safe to say the word sovereign is loaded up with enough emotion to be all it takes to throw things into a tizzy.

The difference between Norway and Canada is the we have 12-13 essentially sovereign provinces all pulling in as many directions. Some harder than others when it comes to 'their' natural resources.

 

Comparing Canada with Norway in SWF's makes no sense.

"While Norway's oil industry is not fully nationalized, but it is heavily state-controlled and managed through a "hybrid" model. The government ensures maximum public benefit by owning 67% of Equinor (formerly Statoil), controlling 70% of state-owned direct financial interests (SDFI) in production licenses, and taxing profits at a high 78% rate"

In contrast, Canada does not own any oil production. Harper sold ours to China "In December 2012, the Harper government approved the $15.1-billion acquisition of Calgary-based Nexen Inc. by the Chinese state-owned company CNOOC."

We, Canada, make no profit off oil to invest in anything.  "The Alberta government acts as the resource owner, owning 81% of the mineral rights in the province. It sets the conditions and collects the royalties to support provincial services." 

Comparing with Japan is equally as useless. Japan has immeasurably more manufacturing capability as Canada and exports far far more manufactured product than Canad a as well. 

Edited April 29 by ExFlyer

[John Johnston]

 We will wish we still had Petro Can. 

[ExFlyer]

6 minutes ago, John Johnston said:

 We will wish we still had Petro Can. 

Petro-Canada Was Once Government- Owned Petro-Canada was founded in 1975 under Prime Minister Pierre Elliott Trudeau by the federal government as a Crown corporation to keep Canada's energy resources under Canadian control.

, Prime Minister Brian Mulroney's Progressive Conservative government began the privatization of Petro-Canada, selling the first shares of the government-owned corporation to the public in July 1991.

[John Johnston]

11 minutes ago, ExFlyer said:

Petro-Canada Was Once Government- Owned Petro-Canada was founded in 1975 under Prime Minister Pierre Elliott Trudeau by the federal government as a Crown corporation to keep Canada's energy resources under Canadian control.

, Prime Minister Brian Mulroney's Progressive Conservative government began the privatization of Petro-Canada, selling the first shares of the government-owned corporation to the public in July 1991.

Yup. 

[Legato]

18 minutes ago, ExFlyer said:

Petro-Canada Was Once Government- Owned Petro-Canada was founded in 1975 under Prime Minister Pierre Elliott Trudeau by the federal government as a Crown corporation to keep Canada's energy resources under Canadian control.

, Prime Minister Brian Mulroney's Progressive Conservative government began the privatization of Petro-Canada, selling the first shares of the government-owned corporation to the public in July 1991.

Petro-Canada was subsidized for decades by taxpayers, with estimates suggesting it lost between $8 and $16 billion of taxpayer money before being privatized.

The sale was finalised by Paul Martin in 2004.

[ExFlyer]

4 hours ago, Legato said:

Petro-Canada was subsidized for decades by taxpayers, with estimates suggesting it lost between $8 and $16 billion of taxpayer money before being privatized.

The sale was finalised by Paul Martin in 2004.

Point was and is, We, Canada owned it and some of you conservatives have been comparing Norways SWF and how it got the funds and how big the SWF is.

Norways funds come from it's ownership and royalties of it's oil.

We do not own the oil....Harper sold it and Alberta gets the royalty.

Yes, Martin put the remaining 19% share up for public sale in 2004. Harper sold 81% in 1991

EDIT: Correction  Prime Minister Brian Mulroney's Progressive Conservative government began the privatization of Petro-Canada, selling the first shares of the government-owned corporation to the public in July 1991."

Edited April 29 by ExFlyer