Happy “Liberation Day” aka Economic Disaster Day

[Nationalist]

25 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

That is true, mostly.  It's definitely not a disaster yet.  And they may avoid that.  The challenge is the consequences (or benefits) don't fully show up for 6 months to a year, so it's hard to say at this point. There's definitely been some damage, but i think 'tragic' would be a serious stretch at this point. 

So far 'success' would be as much of a stretch as 'tragedy'.  No matter how you slice it he handled that badly.  He's cost the us a lot of investment and money and even if this turns out to be a net positive that will still be true. 

of course none of us are perfect and no matter what you can always look back and say 'If you'd done that a little different then.... " but he really did let his arrogance get the better of him. He's cost the us BILLIONS with his 51'st state  nonsense. And that will last for quite a while.  He's cost the us a tonne of reputation points and countries will stop relying on the us for things like military arms and the like. The us benefitted from those relationships, losing them is not to it's advantage. 

But we'll see, maybe despite the errors so far the net result will be substantially positive and the pros will significantly out weigh the cons and early stumbles won't take away from the final victory. It'll be a while before we can know that though. 

I see your point...but I see the Saudis investing hundreds of billions...the AI folks investing...companies putting manufacturing plants in...new and better trading environments...

Sure some potential investments in some markets may have suffered...some. But it looks like the overall picture will be a win/win for America. Which brings us back to the OP.

This is not the economic disaster the Tweenkie-class has been espousing. Far from it. If this keeps up, those silly twits will be contemplating doing anything to derail the economy...

Again...

[CdnFox]

2 hours ago, Nationalist said:

I see your point...but I see the Saudis investing hundreds of billions...the AI folks investing...companies putting manufacturing plants in...new and better trading environments...

Sure some potential investments in some markets may have suffered...some. But it looks like the overall picture will be a win/win for America. Which brings us back to the OP.

This is not the economic disaster the Tweenkie-class has been espousing. Far from it. If this keeps up, those silly twits will be contemplating doing anything to derail the economy...

Again...

They're not investing. They're announcing their intent to invest. And most of that has been in the works for  years.  But whether they break ground or drag it out a bit remains to be seen. 

Where it all shows up is in the GDP numbers.  Gdp, gdp per capita, gdp to debt ratio, that tells a lot of the stories.  And the unemployment numbers and a few other indicators.  If investment happens and money is being spent and real work is being done the GDP will go up correspondingly. 

Gdp can mask some things if you don't know how to look at it -  Biden liked to bump the gdp by spending money on gov't services and the like which shows up as gdp, but if you look at the gdp to debt ratio changes it becomes obvious he was losing ground not gaining. 

But over all that's where we'll be able to see if the rubber hit the road.  If trump's plan is successful, next quarter should have modest but not spectacular gdp stat growth, and the quarter after that should be very strong, stronger than average.  So we'll see how it pans out. 

[WestCanMan]

On 4/2/2025 at 5:45 PM, BeaverFever said:

LOL it’s been clear simce the day you showed uo youre NOT an educated person. As usual you don’t know what you’re talking about.

1) A basic fact that even a high schooler would understand is Tariffs are paid by the IMPORTING country  Thats the point of tariffs, to make foreign goods more expensive  Therefore Trumps tariffs will be paid by Americans who purchase those goods 

^That's the most economically illiterate BS I've ever read, unless myata posted something which I blocked from memory.

1. A basic fact that any non-cultist would understand is that tariffs (lower-case 't', imbecile) are paid by the importing country, to make foreign goods more expensive. However; the prices of American goods aren't raised at all by tariffs, so consumers still pay the same price for them. The end result is that consumers will choose American goods more frequently, saving jobs in the USA, growing American companies, and growing America's economy. 

 

[Nationalist]

Hey @Libbies how's that economic disaster you predicted coming along?

Get out the salt id1ots.

 

[Nationalist]

On 4/3/2025 at 7:01 AM, Nationalist said:

I want this thread to stay alive.

I have a sneaking suspicion most, if not all of the listed countries will cave, and manufacturing will come rushing back to the USA...as it already is.

BTW...I see the USMCA is still intact...

Come on Libbies.

@BeaverFever, @Hodad, @Aristides and the rest...tell us how the tariffs were going to be a disaster.

I mean...it's been a month and a half now. Things must be tragic by now eh?

Do any of you have the testosterone to support your bullshit now?

[CdnFox]

1 minute ago, Nationalist said:

Come on Libbies.

@BeaverFever, @Hodad, @Aristides and the rest...tell us how the tariffs were going to be a disaster.

I mean...it's been a month and a half now. Things must be tragic by now eh?

Do any of you have the testosterone to support your bullshit now?

The story won't be told until about the third quarter. At that point we'll know if it was a good idea or a bad idea. Frankly I think it hurt America but I don't think it hurt it that bad. Trump's tax breaks are coming up and that will probably have a significant positive effect as well

[Nationalist]

44 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

The story won't be told until about the third quarter. At that point we'll know if it was a good idea or a bad idea. Frankly I think it hurt America but I don't think it hurt it that bad. Trump's tax breaks are coming up and that will probably have a significant positive effect as well

And what was the original and current messaging? That there would be some temporary pain, but the end results will be great.

Man...everything is already much better. The great tariff scare seems to have already proven beneficial in several ways. 

So...I agree the final tally can't be done till a year later, but the current results and trajectory is fan-fcking-tastic. Hell the bloody Arabs actually like the guy!

The effect of the tariffs span a scope much wider than just financial. It's very unorthodox but...it works to have all the world leaders a tad apprehensive about how the POTUS might react to any given decision.

It doesn't hurt that Trump used the consumer weight of the US...as a club either.

You could call that...The Trump Card...

 

Edited 19 hours ago by Nationalist

[eyeball]

12 minutes ago, Nationalist said:

So...I agree the final tally can't be done till a year later, but the current results and trajectory is fan-fcking-tastic. Hell the bloody Arabs actually like the guy!

Trump obviously likes them too, especially the blood soaked ones.

What a lovely wonderful world.

[Hodad]

27 minutes ago, Nationalist said:

Come on Libbies.

@BeaverFever, @Hodad, @Aristides and the rest...tell us how the tariffs were going to be a disaster.

I mean...it's been a month and a half now. Things must be tragic by now eh?

Do any of you have the testosterone to support your bullshit now?

Your premise is dumb. It has been a disaster. I don't think anyone has ever turned robust growth into contraction in so little time. Trump is a 2x champ in that department. The first time he could blame COVID, but this time it's just his stupid policy choices.

But even at 30% tariffs rather than a more disastrous 145% or whatever, ceteris paribus, it still results in a price hike on the goods everyday Americans buy. It's inescapable voluntary inflation, with the unfounded and unreasonable hope that at some point in the future that would justify a buildup of offsetting US manufacturing to replace more expensive goods.

You whined and moaned about inflation for 4 years, and then when the big orange dummy started actively courting inflation, you're 100% on board. It's genuinely hilarious what a massive sub you are. Unbelievable lack of dignity.

 

^^What we have here isn't a difference of opinion. It's a difference of capability. I'm not telling you my political opinions. I'm telling you basic, bog-standard facts of market forces. If you tax something, it raises the price floor at a minimum, and that raises prices. The end. 

That's why the big buffoon is out there telling people to be ready for pain, and telling Americans that little girls don't need 30 dolls, they can be happy with 5. The gall of that is unbelievable, by the way. And it's hard to imagine how insane you people would be if a Democrat had told Americans that the solution to bad policies is to buy fewer toys for their children. 

 

If you really want to know what has muted the impact of the tariffs so far, it's multifold. 

The big baby can't make up his mind, so he on-again off-again "policies" and delays in implementation have extended ordering runways and created ordering windows for retailers to "stock up" with massive orders. They are just hoping to collect enough pre-tariff stock to defer pain and create a price advantage against competitors. When that stock runs out and the new orders are shipped across the ocean we'll see prices increase and the economy slow down. Nobody is sustainably selling at a loss. 

I don't know if there are businesspeople at your daily dive bar drink-a-thons, but stagger out onto the street and find some. Ask them how it's going. -- Go ask a contractor what would happen if they bid a job at X dollars and then the cost of supplies doubled. Go ask a retailer what happens when holiday shopping volume shrinks by 30%. Ask a Wal-mart shopper what happens when the stuff in their cart costs 50% more. 

I was talking with the Director of Operations of an 18 month startup earlier this week. They set up manufacturing in Shenzen and bult their entire business model around "normal" market realities, competing on quality and price against more established companies. Suddenly their "before the tariffs" big rush order hits an manufacturing delay and now it suddenly costs 50% more per unit. Can they compete on price and grow the business with every radical shift of presidential whimsy? Of course not. What do you think will happen to that business and those employees? Their odds of success are a lot worse, that's for sure. Pretty grim. 

Whether the big orange dummy's appetite for insane policy is moderated by good advice and public failure is an open question. When people say they don't know what's going to happen, they really mean they don't know how erratic he's going to be. Everyone knows the effect of blanket tariffs. There's no mystery there. The only mystery is the clown pulling the levers. 

There's also no mystery that you taint-licking biothces will celebrate the orange overlord regardless of actions and outcomes. That's just the way you're built. 

 

 

 

 

[Nationalist]

1 hour ago, eyeball said:

Trump obviously likes them too, especially the blood soaked ones.

What a lovely wonderful world.

Wha's-a-matter eyeball. Don't have the balls for big-boy games?

That's a rhetorical question...I know you don't.

[Nationalist]

1 hour ago, Hodad said:

Your premise is dumb. It has been a disaster. I don't think anyone has ever turned robust growth into contraction in so little time. Trump is a 2x champ in that department. The first time he could blame COVID, but this time it's just his stupid policy choices.

But even at 30% tariffs rather than a more disastrous 145% or whatever, ceteris paribus, it still results in a price hike on the goods everyday Americans buy. It's inescapable voluntary inflation, with the unfounded and unreasonable hope that at some point in the future that would justify a buildup of offsetting US manufacturing to replace more expensive goods.

You whined and moaned about inflation for 4 years, and then when the big orange dummy started actively courting inflation, you're 100% on board. It's genuinely hilarious what a massive sub you are. Unbelievable lack of dignity.

 

^^What we have here isn't a difference of opinion. It's a difference of capability. I'm not telling you my political opinions. I'm telling you basic, bog-standard facts of market forces. If you tax something, it raises the price floor at a minimum, and that raises prices. The end. 

That's why the big buffoon is out there telling people to be ready for pain, and telling Americans that little girls don't need 30 dolls, they can be happy with 5. The gall of that is unbelievable, by the way. And it's hard to imagine how insane you people would be if a Democrat had told Americans that the solution to bad policies is to buy fewer toys for their children. 

 

If you really want to know what has muted the impact of the tariffs so far, it's multifold. 

The big baby can't make up his mind, so he on-again off-again "policies" and delays in implementation have extended ordering runways and created ordering windows for retailers to "stock up" with massive orders. They are just hoping to collect enough pre-tariff stock to defer pain and create a price advantage against competitors. When that stock runs out and the new orders are shipped across the ocean we'll see prices increase and the economy slow down. Nobody is sustainably selling at a loss. 

I don't know if there are businesspeople at your daily dive bar drink-a-thons, but stagger out onto the street and find some. Ask them how it's going. -- Go ask a contractor what would happen if they bid a job at X dollars and then the cost of supplies doubled. Go ask a retailer what happens when holiday shopping volume shrinks by 30%. Ask a Wal-mart shopper what happens when the stuff in their cart costs 50% more. 

I was talking with the Director of Operations of an 18 month startup earlier this week. They set up manufacturing in Shenzen and bult their entire business model around "normal" market realities, competing on quality and price against more established companies. Suddenly their "before the tariffs" big rush order hits an manufacturing delay and now it suddenly costs 50% more per unit. Can they compete on price and grow the business with every radical shift of presidential whimsy? Of course not. What do you think will happen to that business and those employees? Their odds of success are a lot worse, that's for sure. Pretty grim. 

Whether the big orange dummy's appetite for insane policy is moderated by good advice and public failure is an open question. When people say they don't know what's going to happen, they really mean they don't know how erratic he's going to be. Everyone knows the effect of blanket tariffs. There's no mystery there. The only mystery is the clown pulling the levers. 

There's also no mystery that you taint-licking biothces will celebrate the orange overlord regardless of actions and outcomes. That's just the way you're built. 

 

 

 

 

LOL...Brandonflation is slowing.

Gas prices are down and dropping.

Groceries are stable and/or dropping. (your precious eggs included).

Your problem is , you hate Trump so intensely, that you actually cheer for harder times under his leadership. You think that will hurt Trump...but it hurts YOU and every single citizen. THAT is very unpatriotic.

Your insults are useless and only serve to point out how really destructive you are.

'Vote for a Democrat! He or she hates you openly.'

see ya stupid.

 

Edited 16 hours ago by Nationalist

[eyeball]

9 minutes ago, Nationalist said:

Wha's-a-matter eyeball. Don't have the balls for big-boy games?

That's a rhetorical question...I know you don't.

What's rhetorical about it?  What did Kashoggi do to make you as indifferent to his assassination as Trump?

Maybe you guys figure Kashoggi had it coming to him and he was actually an impediment to a better world.

[Hodad]

2 hours ago, Hodad said:

There's also no mystery that you taint-licking biothces will celebrate the orange overlord regardless of actions and outcomes. That's just the way you're built. 

 

50 minutes ago, Nationalist said:

Gas prices are down and dropping.

Groceries are stable and/or dropping. (your precious eggs included).

I rest my case.

Sure, Trump waved his magic orange wand and manipulated a global commodity and eradicated avian flu, all before hitting an early tee time. Thank goodness he's here to save us!

 

[Nationalist]

52 minutes ago, eyeball said:

What's rhetorical about it?  What did Kashoggi do to make you as indifferent to his assassination as Trump?

Maybe you guys figure Kashoggi had it coming to him and he was actually an impediment to a better world.

What the Hell does Kashoggi have to do with this?

10 minutes ago, Hodad said:

 

I rest my case.

Sure, Trump waved his magic orange wand and manipulated a global commodity and eradicated avian flu, all before hitting an early tee time. Thank goodness he's here to save us!

 

LOL...and that's why you fail...and lose. You're an arrogant little twerp...and it shows.

[Hodad]

 

2 minutes ago, Nationalist said:

What the Hell does Kashoggi have to do with this?

LOL...and that's why you fail...and lose. You're an arrogant little twerp...and it shows.

It's neither my fault (nor yours) that you aren't bright. But it's wholly your fault that you haven't bothered to educate yourself and gather information. Basic concepts like a oil as a global commodity market are not beyond any functional person's grasp. You're just not interested in learning or understanding the world. And that's on you. 

[eyeball]

16 minutes ago, Nationalist said:

What the Hell does Kashoggi have to do with this?

The question should be what the hell is Trump doing schmoozing with the butchers who murdered him and why you're cheering it on?

WTF is wrong with you?

 

[Nationalist]

29 minutes ago, Hodad said:

 

It's neither my fault (nor yours) that you aren't bright. But it's wholly your fault that you haven't bothered to educate yourself and gather information. Basic concepts like a oil as a global commodity market are not beyond any functional person's grasp. You're just not interested in learning or understanding the world. And that's on you. 

As you said...

46 minutes ago, Hodad said:

I rest my case.

Enjoy being a loser...

[Nationalist]

20 minutes ago, eyeball said:

The question should be what the hell is Trump doing schmoozing with the butchers who murdered him and why you're cheering it on?

WTF is wrong with you?

 

What's wrong with me? Lol...ask my wife...

What he's doing is 2 fold:

1. Establishing a real path to peace.

2. Opening new avenues for US economic growth. 

And he even won the bonus round and got a new jumbo jet for Airforce One.

Real positive results. What a concept eh?

 

[Hodad]

10 minutes ago, Nationalist said:

As you said...

Enjoy being a loser...

It's absolutely fascinating that you think you're "winning" this conversation. 

I assure you, nobody's winning. You look like an imbecile and I look like a guy who's fine wasting time showing data to an imbecile even when I know it's a waste. Neither is very flattering. 

But, FYI, the data is really there for the people playing along at home. I know you don't know what to do with it.

[Nationalist]

5 minutes ago, Hodad said:

It's absolutely fascinating that you think you're "winning" this conversation. 

I assure you, nobody's winning. You look like an imbecile and I look like a guy who's fine wasting time showing data to an imbecile even when I know it's a waste. Neither is very flattering. 

But, FYI, the data is really there for the people playing along at home. I know you don't know what to do with it.

The people playing along at home...know your full o'sh1t too. They lived through Brandon and they see the difference. They even know why there's such a stark difference. 

We all know what to do with your "data". And you.