Insanity is what it looks. Reality is real. Truth matters

[myata]

For a while now, America boasted several characteristics and features in its social life and politics that kept others in the sane world puzzled, baffled and scratching their heads: no but that can't be right. Miracles don't happen. Something will have to give. No, no America pressed on, look we can throw at it whatever we like and however much we fancy and it's bound to stand right here and not as much as shake.

Big bucks and democratic politics: don't mix. The table is just too skewed.

Outrageously priced basic medications and generally health care. Makes zero sense in the modern democratic world. Why does it continue? Simple: big money in politics and concentration of political and media influence.

Big money and media ownership: slogans aren't enough to ensure objectivity of information.

Mass gun ownership: the rest of the democratic world combined doesn't come close to one country by the count of mass shootings. Gun checks in public schools, really?

The cost of public education, including post secondary: just insane.

And the final one, most recently: the assault on the objective truth, the reality itself under the duplicitous and deceitful slogans of "freedom" it has nothing to do with.

Economy and military power, the great facade contributed to influencing people to question these doubts. Wishful thinking, progressive humanity's long time companion played not a small role. But no: miracles don't happen. The foundations of democracy were strong built by generations of thinking and caring citizens to support a better future for their posterity. They withstood crises and wars. But nothing will stand to apathy, absence of thought and care and indifference. As a drying stream, the last drops of democracy are dripping and drying away. And if it could happened to a land this rich and generous this is a stern lesson to everybody: don't follow in that path. Truth matters. Objective reality exists. Big money and democratic politics don't mix. If if doesn't look right or outright insane that's what it is there are no propaganda-driven, dumb-down "explanations": someone just wants us dumb to control and make more dough this is what it always comes down to. This responsibility is bestowed upon us with the role and privilege of being free citizens. And the moment we forget and abandon it, the democracy will go.

America is falling behind on staples, trivial things in the developed democratic world: great public transit; affordable quality healthcare; high-speed trains; clean and healthy natural environment. Purses burst with billions and trillions, propaganda is pumped on the ears of dumbing by the hour pueblo yes it's great that you don't have it and can't have it, it's all for you you should be happy to pay more and outrageously for your basic medications. But look, the reality is real. A grandma in Spain takes a high speed train - right now, that will take her 300 km in just over an hour, at a reasonable price too. You don't have it and you can't even dream of having it. This is the reality of the 21st century America the land of what a trillion bucks in someone's pocket. No words can dismiss or falsify it: the facts.

Edited January 23 by myata

[Deluge]

2 hours ago, myata said:

For a while now, America boasted several characteristics and features in its social life and politics that kept others in the sane world puzzled, baffled and scratching their heads: no but that can't be right. Miracles don't happen. Something will have to give. No, no America pressed on, look we can throw at it whatever we like and however much we fancy and it's bound to stand right here and not as much as shake.

Big bucks and democratic politics: don't mix. The table is just too skewed.

Outrageously priced basic medications and generally health care. Makes zero sense in the modern democratic world. Why does it continue? Simple: big money in politics and concentration of political and media influence.

Big money and media ownership: slogans aren't enough to ensure objectivity of information.

Mass gun ownership: the rest of the democratic world combined doesn't come close to one country by the count of mass shootings. Gun checks in public schools, really?

The cost of public education, including post secondary: just insane.

And the final one, most recently: the assault on the objective truth, the reality itself under the duplicitous and deceitful slogans of "freedom" it has nothing to do with.

Economy and military power, the great facade contributed to influencing people to question these doubts. Wishful thinking, progressive humanity's long time companion played not a small role. But no: miracles don't happen. The foundations of democracy were strong built by generations of thinking and caring citizens to support a better future for their posterity. They withstood crises and wars. But nothing will stand to apathy, absence of thought and care and indifference. As a drying stream, the last drops of democracy are dripping and drying away. And if it could happened to a land this rich and generous this is a stern lesson to everybody: don't follow in that path. Truth matters. Objective reality exists. Big money and democratic politics don't mix. If if doesn't look right or outright insane that's what it is there are no propaganda-driven, dumb-down "explanations": someone just wants us dumb to control and make more dough this is what it always comes down to. This responsibility is bestowed upon us with the role and privilege of being free citizens. And the moment we forget and abandon it, the democracy will go.

America is falling behind on staples, trivial things in the developed democratic world: great public transit; affordable quality healthcare; high-speed trains; clean and healthy natural environment. Purses burst with billions and trillions, propaganda is pumped on the ears of dumbing by the hour pueblo yes it's great that you don't have it and can't have it, it's all for you you should be happy to pay more and outrageously for your basic medications. But look, the reality is real. A grandma in Spain takes a high speed train - right now, that will take her 300 km in just over an hour, at a reasonable price too. You don't have it and you can't even dream of having it. This is the reality of the 21st century America the land of what a trillion bucks in someone's pocket. No words can dismiss or falsify it: the facts.

Trump's only 3 days into his presidency comrade. 

Why don't you give your cyber mouth a rest? 

This country WILL get better. A lot better. 

 

[myata]

Bullsh*t. We have his first term. We have "stolen election" bullsh*t and the Jan 6. We have two impeachments, history's first. We have 34 felony convictions. We have the indictment for conspiracy to subvert the election. And we have the mass release of Jan 6 violent rioters.

As a result anywhere between a severe damage to final degradation of the rule of law at least at the federal level. Justice that is executed selectively is the opposite of itself and its purpose in a democratic society.

These are the facts and they aren't going anywhere. So not one chance of "just erase your memory and let it be a clean slate".

[User]

You don't care about truth. 

That is why you refuse to give specifics, answer questions, or to actually engage on almost anything you post on here. 

[Deluge]

9 hours ago, myata said:

Bullsh*t. We have his first term. We have "stolen election" bullsh*t and the Jan 6. We have two impeachments, history's first. We have 34 felony convictions. We have the indictment for conspiracy to subvert the election. And we have the mass release of Jan 6 violent rioters.

As a result anywhere between a severe damage to final degradation of the rule of law at least at the federal level. Justice that is executed selectively is the opposite of itself and its purpose in a democratic society.

These are the facts and they aren't going anywhere. So not one chance of "just erase your memory and let it be a clean slate".

Wrong. 

You have a knee capped first term thanks to democrat interference. You have a woke mandate that left lots of room for election rigging. You have J6 hysterics which only a woketard could embrace, and you have bullshit impeachments, left-wing kangaroo courts, and two failed assassination attempts.

In essence, you perverts have nothing - it's why you lost in November. 

Edited January 24 by Deluge

[Nationalist]

Oh for Gawd's sake... @myata wouldn't recognize truth if it was biting his balls off.

This is yet just another whinescapade brought to you by the terminally effeminate.

[myata]

Democracy doesn't matter. There's an excuse for anything. Hitler and Vlad would 100% agree.

There's been a fraction, a layer in the American populace that never understood what democracy and the rule of law is and didn't really need it. Now it feels emboldened and is coming to the fore. Nothing is guaranteed any longer. All futures are possible. Democracy is not a given nor is it a free gift.

[User]

6 minutes ago, myata said:

Democracy doesn't matter. There's an excuse for anything. Hitler and Vlad would 100% agree.

There's been a fraction, a layer in the American populace that never understood what democracy and the rule of law is and didn't really need it. Now it feels emboldened and is coming to the fore. Nothing is guaranteed any longer. All futures are possible. Democracy is not a given nor is it a free gift.

Just a bunch of generic, meaningless nonsense. 

[myata]

These people don't understand what rule of law is, why it is there. They think that they should be able to dismiss any decision that they don't like based on some words, a whim. I like it, it's the law. I don't like it, get it done with. This fraction was always here. And now through incessant propaganda, dumbing down and erasure of the boundary between the reality and desire by big money it feels emboldened and uplifted. This is how bad it is. There are some great words in the dusting book but even if they could make the syllables they just couldn't get it, the meaning.

[User]

11 minutes ago, myata said:

These people don't understand what rule of law is, why it is there. They think that they should be able to dismiss any decision that they don't like based on some words, a whim. I like it, it's the law. I don't like it, get it done with. This fraction was always here. And now through incessant propaganda, dumbing down and erasure of the boundary between the reality and desire by big money it feels emboldened and uplifted. This is how bad it is. There are some great words in the dusting book but even if they could make the syllables they just couldn't get it, the meaning.

Who are these people? Who is this they?

 

[myata]

People who do not understand in principle and profoundly what the rule of law is intend to decide the future of America. The rule of law is de facto abandoned. So it cannot be the same America of the founding fathers. The first American Constitution, 1789 - 2025. Nothing is guaranteed. The future is wide open.

[Venandi]

1 hour ago, myata said:

These people don't understand what rule of law is, why it is there. They think that they should be able to dismiss any decision that they don't like based on some words, a whim. I like it, it's the law. I don't like it, get it done with. This fraction was always here. And now through incessant propaganda, dumbing down and erasure of the boundary between the reality and desire by big money it feels emboldened and uplifted. This is how bad it is. 

Read that again...

You could easily be mistaken for a Republican describing Biden and the DNC horde over the last 4 years.

Politics is like a boomerang, your thoughts, deeds and words return to you sooner or later with astounding accuracy.

TAG... your it. 

 

[Nationalist]

18 minutes ago, myata said:

People who do not understand in principle and profoundly what the rule of law is intend to decide the future of America. The rule of law is de facto abandoned. So it cannot be the same America of the founding fathers. The first American Constitution, 1789 - 2025. Nothing is guaranteed. The future is wide open.

OK Twinkle-Toes...lets talk "rule of law".

Trump's home was assaulted by a swat team for documents he had. He was indicted and dragged through the mud until the case was finally dropped. Brandon got a pass because...he's just an addled old fart.

Rule of law?

The Democrats attacked Trump based on a proven lie by Steele. No prosecutions.

Rule of law?

Hundreds...Hell maybe thousands of criminal Illegal Immigrants have committed crimes and been released to commit more crimes.

Rule of law?

I could go on and on but...I think its rather obvious that you Libbies have no business even commenting on "the rule of law".

 

[eyeball]

27 minutes ago, Venandi said:

Read that again...

You could easily be mistaken for a Republican describing Biden and the DNC horde over the last 4 years.

Politics is like a boomerang, your thoughts, deeds and words return to you sooner or later with astounding accuracy.

TAG... your it. 

I know you are but what am I?

🙄

[Legato]

2 minutes ago, eyeball said:

I know you are but what am I?

🙄

I don't think the answer would be to your liking.

[eyeball]

23 minutes ago, Legato said:

I don't think the answer would be to your liking.

It rarely is with you people.

[Venandi]

1 hour ago, eyeball said:

It rarely is with you people.

Have you noticed that "you people" is now being used in a pejorative sense by the very folks who cheered when Don got fired? Ironically, your response brilliantly illustrates the very point I was making. 

There's a wise saying (might be an African proverb I don't remember) that says:

"Wrong done and injustice inflicted is paid back in the same coin"

I predict you'll collect a full purse... I think the same level of courtesy, respect and thoughtful consideration "you people" extended to your political rivals will be reflected right back at you.

What you now see on this forum is but a mirror image of the past four years.... POOF your left hand has suddenly become your right in a mirror "you people" designed and created. And, as if that doesn't bode badly enough for you as it is, Doggie-boy, Herb and Robodah are busy mass producing more mirrors for your cause.   

 

[eyeball]

7 hours ago, Venandi said:

Have you noticed that "you people" is now being used in a pejorative sense by the very folks who cheered when Don got fired?

Do I look like I give a shit?

Have you noticed how tightly you people clutch your pearls?

[myata]

11 hours ago, Venandi said:

You could easily be mistaken for a Republican describing Biden and the DNC horde over the last 4 years.

Politics is like a boomerang, your thoughts, deeds and words return to you sooner or later with astounding accuracy.

Bullsh*t generalities with little or no meaning. But the objective reality exists. Squeezing fogs and fantasies out of sick/lying brains does not make objective facts. Lying words don't make objective facts even with endless repetition. The felon was convicted on 34 counts by a jury of citizens. Fact. Twice impeached in Congress. Fact. Indicted by a grand jury on the charges of conspiracy. All facts. Called to take control of Greenland and Panama canal not ruling out use of force? Fact.

See, it's only because you decided to let go of your sanity, to forsake the difference between the objective reality and the imaginations, fogs, fantasies, and plainly, lies that problem now exists for you. You created it for yourself as so many before. But nothing is relative between the reality and lies. And nothing new you will dig out here.

A liar can rename a gulf or mountain, signed and done. Can he with his twisty words build a high speed train that a grandma could take to see her daughter 300 miles away? Can he make it so she would walk into a pharmacy and buy her medications when she left her prescription home because they are so cheap it wouldn't break her old age pension? That's where the difference is, the real life, the reality. See it, the difference? Try again? You can still save it, your brain you know. Unless you decide to let it go, done.

[Venandi]

4 hours ago, myata said:

Can he with his twisty words build a high speed train that a grandma could take to see her daughter 300 miles away? Can he make it so she would walk into a pharmacy and buy her medications when she left her prescription home because they are so cheap it wouldn't break her old age pension?

This whole Trump thing seems to have had an effect.

You’re now framing shared objectives in a manner in which reasonable people can engage with them... that's new IMO. On the “all things gender” front the conversation has swung to kindness, compassion, tolerance and concern for the rights of neighbours who’s values you don’t even share.

I would call this an old school liberal philosophy and it is nothing akin to progressive thinking at all. Not even close.

Progressives were building an unholy alliance between government, security services (including intelligence), and media. You could see the effect of that on a number of fronts but my favs were when people clapped as their neighbours were fired under vaccine mandates and the absolute horror show of the emergencies act here at home. Even if you dispute that aspect of the equation there’s no disputing the polarization, meanness, and lack of politeness on this very forum. What do you think spawned that?

There’s more to the Trump thing than this of course, but it’s not superficial either.

Putting economic issues aside for the moment, you lost me with the arrogance of drag queen story time for tots, branding concerned parents who objected to it as domestic terrorists, engaging a weaponized FBI to investigate them, and vilifying them with state aligned media. In your train example it was the decades long environmental and gender equity impact studies that delayed it… the number of criminal illegals stabbing random passengers and the safety implications of DEI hiring for staff once the damn thing was built.

I see this shift in progressives (personally at least) as being pretty profound, it’s completely at odds with what was on the table a scant few months ago, and for that reason I don’t believe there’s been a change of heart at all. Suing communities who won’t fly your flag, cutting advanced math classes because they’re racist, running a secretive school referral process in the name of gender care etc, etc just isn’t going to fly anymore... I think that era is over and I applaud its absence.

As you begin to approach all of this in a rational and thoughtful manner you have a new problem though, based on previous experience, no one believes you. No one trusts your motives and to paraphrase what Eyeball wisely asked (above)... does it look like the people now in control give a sh*t?

Edited January 25 by Venandi

[myata]

8 minutes ago, Venandi said:

You’re now framing shared objectives in a manner in which reasonable people can agree with them.

Except they aren't shared. With who, zillionaires who run a few media outlets each to convince you that astronomical cost medications is exactly what you need because it's some twisted form of "liberty" that they then fail to prove or explain? No, it's one or the other. Mutually exclusive interests. No, they don't coexist. Have to choose one.

11 minutes ago, Venandi said:

Progressives were building an unholy alliance between government, security services (including intelligence), and media. You could see the effect of that on a number of fronts but my favs were when people clapped as their neighbours were fired under vaccine mandates and the absolute horror show of the emergencies act here at home. Even if you dispute that aspect of the equation there’s no disputing the polarization, meanness, and lack of politeness on this very forum. What do you think spawned that?

But many, myself included disputed it. So your argument's failing, factually: it's possible to stay on the side of the objective reality see things for what they are wherever they are coming from, call them and stop them if necessary. Rather than branding them with a general label and then "explaining" one wrong with another, Putin style.

15 minutes ago, Venandi said:

Putting economic issues aside for the moment, you lost me with the arrogance of drag queen story time for tot

You're piling a lot in one bucket for one response. We discussed many of those overreaches when they were proven real and factual. And yes some of them are real, the drive of some progressives in the high chair to impose their (self-appointed) goodness on the society is misconceived and need to be resisted. Absolutely we recognized and resisted it. But at the cost of throwing out the baby, the democracy, rule of law, reliable and trusted international partners right at this time in the free world's history? Just not a sane proposition in any universe. Not a chance. One has to let go of sanity or be dumb from the outset to argue something like that. Why wouldn't you agree?

[Venandi]

53 minutes ago, myata said:

You're piling a lot in one bucket for one response. We discussed many of those overreaches when they were proven real and factual.

Yet the capacity of the bucket was a catalyst for the very changes you oppose. So let me ask you this, I have to run so it will be brief:

- Well before the bucket began to overflow (even if you measured its contents by the rhetoric right here) didn't you think it was time to pull back from the brink? And if so, how do you account for the Democrats reluctance to throw wild eyed activist progressives into their own life raft and set them adrift?

The reason I ask is simple enough, the problems created aren't that hard to fix (they're time consuming and expensive to be sure though) and people are going to notice immediate results.

I predict they'll feel safer (whether they are or not) and they'll look around and compare what they see out the kitchen window now with the pictures they took last week. They may not want to go back.

I don't want to put words in your mouth but I think you may be minimizing the effect that stratospheric levels of absurdity have had and the effect (causal or not) those machinations will have on future voting trends. Even if Trump is only moderately successful, the appetite to return to (what I would call) the years of madness will be dampened in direct proportion to the results he achieves.

If I were a progressive, I'd immediately pivot to 

1 hour ago, Venandi said:

framing shared objectives in a manner in which reasonable people can engage with them

and

1 hour ago, Venandi said:

kindness, compassion, tolerance and concern for the rights of neighbours who’s values you don’t even share.

Do you really think that the people you routinely spar with here are opposed to the quoted ideas in principle?

As I see it, they're core values, core sentiments, and the humanity they reflect have been AWOL for years. Doggieman, Roboduh and Herb need their own life raft. They're thirsty brutes and the solar still in your raft clearly can't keep up with their demands.     

Edited January 25 by Venandi

[Michael Hardner]

15 hours ago, Venandi said:

Have you noticed that "you people" is now being used in a pejorative sense by the very folks who cheered when Don got fired?  

Nobody thinks that the term ' you people ' is a pejorative. You could use it to talk about Canadians, CBC executives, anyone. The point was that it was widely inferred that he was talking about new Canadians. 

 

[Michael Hardner]

I don't like arguing that the culture war was anything other than a political football. 

It seems like some are conceding that it's a thing of the past, a battle won.

Okay. Well then let's move on.... Are those billionaires going to help us now? 

How can we actually measure that things are getting better? Inflation rates? How about the GINI index?

 

[myata]

55 minutes ago, Venandi said:

- Well before the bucket began to overflow (even if you measured its contents by the rhetoric right here) didn't you think it was time to pull back from the brink? And if so, how do you account for the Democrats reluctance to throw wild eyed activist progressives into their own life raft and set them adrift?

I not only did think that but said so on many more than a single occasion. I do not consider myself an expert in the U.S. politics; much looked broken in it for a long time, such as the free season for big dough. But yes, staying with sanity always helps regardless of the stripe and ideology.

Still it doesn't explain, nor condone/justify embracing plain and obvious insanity.

58 minutes ago, Venandi said:

The reason I ask is simple enough, the problems created aren't that hard to fix (they're time consuming and expensive to be sure though) and people are going to notice immediate results.

I would base my opinion on facts rather than hearsay and a bucket of anecdotes some unverified. How real was the risk of being prosecuted for failing to embrace the diversity? I'm not convinced it was widespread maybe because I never watched Fox, youtube and such. Some of those problems were certainly real and it's our responsibility as sane and responsible citizens to see and call out every such incident, no exceptions.

1 hour ago, Venandi said:

I don't want to put words in your mouth but I think you may be minimizing the effect that stratospheric levels of absurdity have had and the effect (causal or not) those machinations will have on future voting trends

And one more time, "stratospheric" in propaganda pumped by big dough with most obvious fiscal interests does not yet amount, automatically and by default to the reality. Where overreach happened, factually it had to have been checked, questioned and if necessary stopped by the citizens. Inclusion, diversity, affirmative action programs should have been broadly discussed in the society - that indeed may have dampened if not prevented the knew-jerk reaction. These are very real shortcomings down to outright failures. Still they don't justify giving in to the clear insanity.