Potential for Nuclear War: Escalation -Biden - Putin - Ukraine -2023 -August 1914

[August1991]

How civilised societies collapse, I don't know.

This is not the 1930s. We are not facing Hitler.

It is the 1910s.

=====

We need a new structure of peace.

[August1991]

We have a peace,

I am struggling  to understand why a civiised society - in 1914-  commits suicide.

[Nationalist]

11 hours ago, August1991 said:

We have a peace,

I am struggling  to understand why a civiised society - in 1914-  commits suicide.

Money.

[User]

What are you rambling on about? 

It would help if you could form complete sentences with whole thoughts. 

[eyeball]

15 hours ago, August1991 said:

We need a new structure of peace.

We need to start from scratch. I'd start by be reflecting on this.

[Nationalist]

9 minutes ago, eyeball said:

We need to start from scratch. I'd start by be reflecting on this.

I disagree. I reject your attempt to belittle humanity.

[eyeball]

1 hour ago, Nationalist said:

I disagree. I reject your attempt to belittle humanity.

Humanity is perfectly capable of belittling itself, even smaller than reality can.

[Nationalist]

2 hours ago, eyeball said:

Humanity is perfectly capable of belittling itself, even smaller than reality can.

Meh...a humanity hater. Something I'll never be able to fathom.

[eyeball]

48 minutes ago, Nationalist said:

Meh...a humanity hater. Something I'll never be able to fathom.

What is it you're trying to fathom?

[Nationalist]

1 hour ago, eyeball said:

What is it you're trying to fathom?

Why someone would hate humanity.

[eyeball]

8 minutes ago, Nationalist said:

Why someone would hate humanity.

I suppose if humanity did something hateful you might have a reason.

I get amused for example when it does something stupid.

 

[myata]

This is again a false analogy and either the author does not understand the difference that is quite obvious, or deliberately attempts to confound it.

1914 was a war that was caused by a conflict of imperial interests and triggered by actions of certain personalities. In the world of that time, there were no mechanisms to prevent it.

Now, we have, purportedly at least, a world security framework and it has clear guidelines and rules that specifically and clearly disallow and prohibit brutal force and aggression in the relations between countries. So when one country decides to violate them, without any rational argument there are no other options for a resolution than: 1) enforce the declared rules and restore the order: by the way, what we have in our everyday life, or 2) let go of the rules, discontinue them and have no order. One simply cannot have a pretense of an order, and its egregious, blatant and obvious violation of it at the same time and place.

It remains to note that the second case would not at all lead to any peace, because the aggressor was rewarded, can repeat same behavior anywhere and any time; any one imitating the aggressor could do the same with no consequences; effectively leading to the state of the 16-18 century, only with nukes. And this is nothing less than a certain, confident setting for an all-out nuke war, nothing would do it more certainly.

Now, what isn't clear here? What could be the confusion?

[Moonbox]

On 6/9/2024 at 9:44 PM, August1991 said:

We have a peace,

I am struggling  to understand why a civiised society - in 1914-  commits suicide.

I am struggling to understand why you insist on using this forum as your diary of half-baked thoughts.  

[August1991]

7 hours ago, myata said:

This is again a false analogy and either the author does not understand the difference that is quite obvious, or deliberately attempts to confound it.

....

Myata,

I suspect that your post was written by AI. Whatever.

====

In summer 1914, Europe was civilised. And then, an elite lead everyone into a disaster that lasted for thirty years.

Make no mistake: Future generations will not refer to WWI, the Depression and WWII. They will refer to the period between 1914-1945 as the "Wars".

Nowadays, if remembered, the 1789-1815 is known as the "Napoleonic Wars".

And the Thirty Years war?  When Sweden intervened? Who knows that.

 

[myata]

Only for the record, I would attempt to answer, if there was even a trace of a meaning in the question or comment. Alas. So again,

In this world now, we have made the rule against unilateral, violent aggression. We do have such cases unfolding. So, our options are limited to, either enforcing the rule; or doing away with it and thus tacitly encouraging this and all future aggressive wars. There are no words-only solutions to this conundrum.

[August1991]

7 minutes ago, myata said:

Only for the record, I would attempt to answer, if there was even a trace of a meaning in the question or comment. Alas. So again,

In this world now, we have made the rule against unilateral, violent aggression. We do have such cases unfolding. So, our options are limited to, either enforcing the rule; or doing away with it and thus tacitly encouraging this and all future aggressive wars. There are no words-only solutions to this conundrum.

Myata,

I disagree

=====

PS. Classic example of hallucination.

[myata]

1 hour ago, August1991 said:

PS. Classic example of hallucination.

Disagreeing with the reality, facts of it and logic? indeed. The classical definition.

[August1991]

4 minutes ago, myata said:

Disagreeing with the reality, facts of it and logic? indeed. The classical definition.

You are wrong, myata. ChatGPT 4,0 is far better.

[Moonbox]

5 hours ago, August1991 said:

I suspect that your post was written by AI. Whatever.

August, I suspect that your post was written by an old man who lost his marbles.  Whatever. 

5 hours ago, August1991 said:

In summer 1914, Europe was civilised.

This is a banal, useless thought, that you repeat like a broken record, screeching it over and over again in posts innumeberable. 

Europe evidently wasn't civilized in summer of 1914, because they embarked in the most disastrous (and pointless) war the world's ever seen shortly thereafter.  

[August1991]

On 6/11/2024 at 10:11 PM, Moonbox said:

August, I suspect that your post was written by an old man who lost his marbles.  Whatever. 

This is a banal, useless thought, that you repeat like a broken record, screeching it over and over again in posts innumeberable. 

Europe evidently wasn't civilized in summer of 1914, because they embarked in the most disastrous (and pointless) war the world's ever seen shortly thereafter.  

IMHO. the civilised world collapsed in the summer 1914.

An elite of the time commit suicide - and lead ordinary people into death and destruction for the next 30 years.

[August1991]

In 1914, players. elite, bureaucrats  call them as you will.

Whether Putin. Biden or Trump. The UN.

===

We have the chance for a sit-down.

 

 

Edited June 22, 2024 by August1991

[Nationalist]

On 6/11/2024 at 6:20 PM, myata said:

Only for the record, I would attempt to answer, if there was even a trace of a meaning in the question or comment. Alas. So again,

In this world now, we have made the rule against unilateral, violent aggression. We do have such cases unfolding. So, our options are limited to, either enforcing the rule; or doing away with it and thus tacitly encouraging this and all future aggressive wars. There are no words-only solutions to this conundrum.

And yet with all your bluster...you sit safely potificating and sacrificing any lives but your own.

You are a snivelling little coward.!

On 6/13/2024 at 8:18 PM, August1991 said:

IMHO. the civilised world collapsed in the summer 1914.

An elite of the time commit suicide - and lead ordinary people into death and destruction for the next 30 years.

During which a small group of bankers solidified their position by playing both sides of the conflicts.

Ergo...money.

[August1991]

On 6/24/2024 at 9:37 AM, Nationalist said:

And yet with all your bluster...you sit safely potificating and sacrificing any lives but your own.

You are a snivelling little coward.!

During which a small group of bankers solidified their position by playing both sides of the conflicts.

Ergo...money.

Money? Motivated by money?

In summer 1914, several heads of state could have avoided catastrophe - and in effect, their own death.

=====

IMHO, this has nothing to do with money.

Kennedy was born in 1917 (Nixon in 1913). Both remembered August 1914. Indeed, Kennedy referred to Tuchman's book.

Biden was born in 1942 (O'Reilly in 1948). Both remember Hitler.

[Nationalist]

52 minutes ago, August1991 said:

Money? Motivated by money?

In summer 1914, several heads of state could have avoided catastrophe - and in effect, their own death.

=====

IMHO, this has nothing to do with money.

Kennedy was born in 1917 (Nixon in 1913). Both remembered August 1914. Indeed, Kennedy referred to Tuchman's book.

Biden was born in 1942 (O'Reilly in 1948). Both remember Hitler.

I said bankers, not heads of state.

[August1991]

12 minutes ago, Nationalist said:

I said bankers, not heads of state.

Bankers want to do deals. They make money on the fees.

Between 1914 and 1945, there were far fewer deals.

====

I reckon that Summer 1914 was male egoism.