Ontario to allow more booze sold in grocery, big box and convenience stores, $225M subsidy for The Beer Store

[CdnFox]

1 hour ago, herbie said:

OMG standing up to support 7-11 ?
FFS are you brainwashed to the idea that exploiting the employees is gonna save you a nickel?

You mean exploiting people who are already willingly working at the job selling things to sell something?

You're a frikkin' loon.  No wonder you're pro union - nobody in their right mind would hire you without one  

[ExFlyer]

18 hours ago, herbie said:

OMG standing up to support 7-11 ?
FFS are you brainwashed to the idea that exploiting the employees is gonna save you a nickel?
Fine in the Superstore where there's multiple trained staff who give a shit, but 7-11? Come on let's get real here.
The private liquor stores can be bad enough with any bozo who can show up the day after payday and recommend beers 'cuz they're hitests' or 'cuz they only come in tallboy cans', wines named Dead Frog or Rotten Grape cuz they have screwtop and are cheap.

Check out a modernized BC LCB with a huge selection, sample tastngs, walls of chilled beer & drinks, staff that knows WTF they're talking about and extended hours. Or small town Alberta where there's a church on every corner with 2 liquor stores between.

yeah it's 'convenient' but very little advantage to people that don't drink A LOT.

This is bizarre post.

Support 7-11? Any convenience store that want to can, if they so choose, sell alcohol.

Trained staff in what?? How to operate the cash register or debit machine? Do corner stores train their staff in the difference of potato chips or soda pop??

What makes you thinkprivate liquor stores ave some sort of specialist in alcohol brands or styles?  Been into many in the US and Europe and most staff are just workers and not connoisseurs or specialists.

N idea what you are implying with BC or especially the Alberta comments.

The entire purpose is convenience and nothing to do with who or how much they drink.

 

 

 

 

 

[Boges]

21 hours ago, Legato said:

LCBO's also don't take empties.

Honestly, I've given up on this program. 

My empties go into the recycling bin now.

Collecting bottles and cans and driving over to The Beer Store, then putting all the bottles in other containers, then putting them on a dolly and hoping they don't fall over going up a ramp as I enter the store only to put them on a platform to maybe get $20 off a case of beer or cash. 

My storage room was filled with empties I couldn't be bothered to take back. I ended up just donating them for some bottle rally. 

There are also people who scavenge recycling bins for these items for money. Let them have the empties. 

Edited July 18, 2024 by Boges

[impartialobserver]

I know... not Canada but here in NV, we have 24-hour alcohol sales and you can purchase beer, wine, liquor at any gas station, grocery store, etc. Within 2 miles of my house (radius).. there are 26 places I can buy alcohol. 22 of which are 24 hour operations. This tends to drive the price down. 

[CdnFox]

3 minutes ago, impartialobserver said:

I know... not Canada but here in NV, we have 24-hour alcohol sales and you can purchase beer, wine, liquor at any gas station, grocery store, etc. Within 2 miles of my house (radius).. there are 26 places I can buy alcohol. 22 of which are 24 hour operations. This tends to drive the price down. 

Unfortunately our booze prices tend to be high due to 'sin taxes" rather than price gouging.   the gov't taxes the hell out of booze in canada.

 

[ExFlyer]

31 minutes ago, impartialobserver said:

I know... not Canada but here in NV, we have 24-hour alcohol sales and you can purchase beer, wine, liquor at any gas station, grocery store, etc. Within 2 miles of my house (radius).. there are 26 places I can buy alcohol. 22 of which are 24 hour operations. This tends to drive the price down. 

I think that your retailers have the option to buy from many importers and wholesalers.

Ontario is the largest buyer of wine and alcohol in the world. Only the government can buy and import (few exceptions for import but you must get governmental permission to import).

They are the only wholesalers and set all the prices. Every9ne has to buy form them.  I am not sure what , in the future will happen with wholesale and retail pricing but am pretty sure the government will not lose money. If they lay off workers and close stores, they will actually save money.

[impartialobserver]

38 minutes ago, ExFlyer said:

I think that your retailers have the option to buy from many importers and wholesalers.

Ontario is the largest buyer of wine and alcohol in the world. Only the government can buy and import (few exceptions for import but you must get governmental permission to import).

They are the only wholesalers and set all the prices. Every9ne has to buy form them.  I am not sure what , in the future will happen with wholesale and retail pricing but am pretty sure the government will not lose money. If they lay off workers and close stores, they will actually save money.

That explains a lot. Some claim that opening the flood gates will make for more alcoholics and all that comes with it. There is some truth to that. A person has limited income and if that bottle of Jack Daniels is $12 and not $26.. they will buy more of it and more often. My home state of Idaho has state run liquor stores and therefore have higher prices than what we do in NV. 

[Boges]

2 hours ago, ExFlyer said:

I think that your retailers have the option to buy from many importers and wholesalers.

Ontario is the largest buyer of wine and alcohol in the world. Only the government can buy and import (few exceptions for import but you must get governmental permission to import).

They are the only wholesalers and set all the prices. Every9ne has to buy form them.  I am not sure what , in the future will happen with wholesale and retail pricing but am pretty sure the government will not lose money. If they lay off workers and close stores, they will actually save money.

This strike has nothing to do with changes to this. 

The union is upset that they can't be the sole source RTD cocktails and that more places will be able to sell alcohol. They want their vice grip on their monopoly. All these new locations would still have to buy from the LCBO. 

[ExFlyer]

Just now, Boges said:

This strike has nothing to do with changes to this. 

The union is upset that they can't be the sole source RTD cocktails and that more places will be able to sell alcohol. They want their vice grip on their monopoly. All these new locations would still have to buy from the LCBO. 

So, the union is pissed that the government has a monopoly and yet it wants the LCBO to be the sole retailer of ready to drink cocktails? How much sense does that make??  LOL The LCBO is a monopoly and always has been and always will be. How stupid are you if you cannot see that? LOL

I just walked past a LCBO and the union stuck posters on the door stating there are billionaire profits.   Who are those profits for? Oh yeah, to the government...you and me  LOL

The union wants more full tome jobs. Why, there is not full time work. They only need full time for a few hours a day and a few days a week. They need workers at night and weekends...why should there be a bunch of folks standing around doing nothing but getting paid?? Also, each store manager decides when they need workers and  for how long.

[Boges]

46 minutes ago, ExFlyer said:

The union wants more full tome jobs. Why, there is not full time work. They only need full time for a few hours a day and a few days a week. They need workers at night and weekends...why should there be a bunch of folks standing around doing nothing but getting paid?? Also, each store manager decides when they need workers and  for how long.

This is like most retail. But because it's gumint they want it to be a secure job. 

The messaging has been about expanding access to beer, wine and RTD cocktails. They think this will eat away at their profits. Will someone think of the hospitals and schools!!! 

[ExFlyer]

1 hour ago, Boges said:

This is like most retail. But because it's gumint they want it to be a secure job. 

The messaging has been about expanding access to beer, wine and RTD cocktails. They think this will eat away at their profits. Will someone think of the hospitals and schools!!! 

I am not sure where you are but where I am, on the evening news when they interview and speak with the union members there is not talk of RTD cocktails. It is all about money and becoming full time. Even time with family and COLA.

As always, it is money. As you (or someone) noted, retail is a part time employer. There will be LCBO store shut downs.
There will be no loss in profits for the LCBO or government because all the new retailers will still have to buy from the LCBO. The profit will probably rise if they get rid of stores and employees and the money goes to the taxpayer.

Face it, the union tactic backfired, big time.  No one cares if the workers lose as long as they can get their booze.

 

Edited July 18, 2024 by ExFlyer

[herbie]

After discovering there is no deposit & return on pop bottles in Ontario in 2024, I have determined that province is so far behind the time's it's obscene.

This Doug Ford attempt at 'progress" and modernization regardless of all cost utterly convinced me. Pandering to pisstanks and the already-beyond-small business votes.

But after going to the hardware store and asking what kind of paint to use on a steel outside door and seeing the store owner respond with an open mouthed drool and a shrug, I can only presume some of you want to modernize and get the same response asking what's a good wine to serve with cedar planked salmon.......all to walk a few less feet and maybe, just maybe save enough to buy a bubble gum.

[ExFlyer]

19 hours ago, herbie said:

After discovering there is no deposit & return on pop bottles in Ontario in 2024, I have determined that province is so far behind the time's it's obscene.

This Doug Ford attempt at 'progress" and modernization regardless of all cost utterly convinced me. Pandering to pisstanks and the already-beyond-small business votes.

But after going to the hardware store and asking what kind of paint to use on a steel outside door and seeing the store owner respond with an open mouthed drool and a shrug, I can only presume some of you want to modernize and get the same response asking what's a good wine to serve with cedar planked salmon.......all to walk a few less feet and maybe, just maybe save enough to buy a bubble gum.

No refund on non alcoholic containers in Ontario is not a Ford invention. There has never been one no matter who was in power.

Panderign to pisstanks??? I am an occasional drinker and do not consider ourselves "pisstanks". As for allowing small stores to carry liquor, for sure as small stores are the core to our business , employment and livelihood. When the government already has the monopoly of import and export and wholesale, they can share the retail with small business.

Don't know where you are but is the provincial liquor store the only place you can get your alcohol??

It is not a matter of saving a few steps, it is a matter of getting in step with the rest of the world and reducing government control.

I am very pro allowing store to sell alcohol and am very anti union, especially when they are screwing their members.

It is all moot as the LCBO and union have struck a tentative deal. The members will accept because they have lost anyway. Booze will be sold at corner stores and now, it will pnly be a matter of ho many LCBO stores close and how many part timers will lose their jobs. Not today or tomorrow but wait for it. By next summer the alcohol sales foot print will be much different.

LCBO, union reach tentative deal after two-week strike

https://toronto.citynews.ca/2024/07/19/lcbo-union-reach-tentative-deal-two-week-strike/

Edited July 19, 2024 by ExFlyer

[Boges]

59 minutes ago, ExFlyer said:

No refund on non alcoholic containers in Ontario is not a Ford invention. There has never been one no matter who was in power.

Panderign to pisstanks??? I am an occasional drinker and do not consider ourselves "pisstanks". As for allowing small stores to carry liquor, for sure as small stores are the core to our business , employment and livelihood. When the government already has the monopoly of import and export and wholesale, they can share the retail with small business.

Don't know where you are but is the provincial liquor store the only place you can get your alcohol??

It is not a matter of saving a few steps, it is a matter of getting in step with the rest of the world and reducing government control.

I am very pro allowing store to sell alcohol and am very anti union, especially when they are screwing their members.

It is all moot as the LCBO and union have struck a tentative deal. The members will accept because they have lost anyway. Booze will be sold at corner stores and now, it will pnly be a matter of ho many LCBO stores close and how many part timers will lose their jobs. Not today or tomorrow but wait for it. By next summer the alcohol sales foot print will be much different.

LCBO, union reach tentative deal after two-week strike

https://toronto.citynews.ca/2024/07/19/lcbo-union-reach-tentative-deal-two-week-strike/

It's crazy that they need four days to re-open the stores. 

[ExFlyer]

21 hours ago, Boges said:

It's crazy that they need four days to re-open the stores. 

Need the days for workers to get back to work and the union needs to ratify the deal and, the workers have to vote.  The r4 days are for the workers to get their shit together. LOL  Plus to sort out and make up the shifts, to get the stock and to stock the shelves.

LCBO is, after all, sending stock to all other the stores that signed up. The LCBO stores are now just another store. LOL

Yup, thank you OPSEU but hey, the union gets to collect its union dues again LOL

Edited July 20, 2024 by ExFlyer

[herbie]

two things

2 hours ago, ExFlyer said:

No refund on non alcoholic containers in Ontario is not a Ford invention.

I only became aware of this because it made the news his govt rejected the idea recently. FFS! When other provinces have deposits to recycle wine bottles, paper & plastic milk cartons,juice containers your Coke cans get toissed? SHAME

\and

2 hours ago, ExFlyer said:

As for allowing small stores

You have small stores? I mean really I grew up with Chinese Mom&Pop stores on the corner where they lived upstairs or in the back. They aren't around anymore. there are bigger privately owned stores that might benefit, but you know like I do "small business" to govt means Southland and other 'smaller' corporate chains. Just like it does for other incentives like fibre optics, cell service, last mile ISPs etc.

And I'm not all that sorry for the pisstank comment I have half my highschool buds who are now blithering alcoholic retirees and an ex that worked directly across the street from an LCB and would raise a shit fit over needing beer when I got home at 6:30 and only the private liquor store 10 miles away was open.
I'm a seldom user raised where unless it was a wedding or Silver Anniversary party, the family would ask if you'd like another drink. ONCE. If they finished that they'd be asked coffee or tea.

I'm not at all against the private sales - I'm telling you it will be convenient for some - that's all. And if you're expecting cheaper liquor you are a total fool.

[ExFlyer]

1 hour ago, herbie said:

two things

I only became aware of this because it made the news his govt rejected the idea recently. FFS! When other provinces have deposits to recycle wine bottles, paper & plastic milk cartons,juice containers your Coke cans get toissed? SHAME

\and

You have small stores? I mean really I grew up with Chinese Mom&Pop stores on the corner where they lived upstairs or in the back. They aren't around anymore. there are bigger privately owned stores that might benefit, but you know like I do "small business" to govt means Southland and other 'smaller' corporate chains. Just like it does for other incentives like fibre optics, cell service, last mile ISPs etc.

And I'm not all that sorry for the pisstank comment I have half my highschool buds who are now blithering alcoholic retirees and an ex that worked directly across the street from an LCB and would raise a shit fit over needing beer when I got home at 6:30 and only the private liquor store 10 miles away was open.
I'm a seldom user raised where unless it was a wedding or Silver Anniversary party, the family would ask if you'd like another drink. ONCE. If they finished that they'd be asked coffee or tea.

I'm not at all against the private sales - I'm telling you it will be convenient for some - that's all. And if you're expecting cheaper liquor you are a total fool.

Yes, they have to convince the stores to take n=back the  empties and th estores (grocery and otherwise) have balked at it. It has to do with "unclean" empties piling up in a place that sells food and also the space requirement. The pushback by the stores is why it never went forward.

Yes we do have "small" stores. Every little strip mall has a 7-11 or equivalent (we have different brands). They are "small "stores as they are franchised to the owner.

Convenience is the entire goal. I and no one ever expected cheaper booze as the Province controls the wholesale price and maybe even the retail prices. That is yet to be seen.

[herbie]

The point I'm trying to make is 7-11s might be small in size, they are NOT small business they are the among the WORST of chains.

As far as 'convincing' small store to take back bottles. f that. They've taken bottles back in BC since the 1950s at least. We'd take them back in 1959 1960 to get our two bubble gums or 8 licorice babies.

A friend's daughter makes a living running the Bottle Depot in our small town. Even has a full time employee. You can put in a card and dump your bags of empties in, they sort and direct deposit the money to you. Mine goes into the local Humane Society account for animal rescue.

I mean really, the Province doesn't even push for BASIC recycling? Had to yell at the 6 kids that worked for me years ago constantly to put their pop cans in the recycle bin shouting "It's not about the f*cking nickel" until they clued in. Mom & Dad were hicks that tossed beer cans out the truck window and only "rummies" picked up bottles.
Even now with a dime a can or bottle deposit, one guy told me every spring after the snow melt he walks the road from the mill to town and one year made $400 from tossed empties. Every time I mow my front lawn there's at least one mangled can I have to pick up.

I mean I'm starting to understand the whining and snivelling over the carbon tax if the population just won't do SFA about environmental issues. FFS I visited Ont in 1969 and people were saying "It's either jobs OR the environment" and the song seems to have changed little 55 years later for many.

Edited July 19, 2024 by herbie

[ExFlyer]

15 hours ago, herbie said:

The point I'm trying to make is 7-11s might be small in size, they are NOT small business they are the among the WORST of chains.

As far as 'convincing' small store to take back bottles. f that. They've taken bottles back in BC since the 1950s at least. We'd take them back in 1959 1960 to get our two bubble gums or 8 licorice babies.

A friend's daughter makes a living running the Bottle Depot in our small town. Even has a full time employee. You can put in a card and dump your bags of empties in, they sort and direct deposit the money to you. Mine goes into the local Humane Society account for animal rescue.

I mean really, the Province doesn't even push for BASIC recycling? Had to yell at the 6 kids that worked for me years ago constantly to put their pop cans in the recycle bin shouting "It's not about the f*cking nickel" until they clued in. Mom & Dad were hicks that tossed beer cans out the truck window and only "rummies" picked up bottles.
Even now with a dime a can or bottle deposit, one guy told me every spring after the snow melt he walks the road from the mill to town and one year made $400 from tossed empties. Every time I mow my front lawn there's at least one mangled can I have to pick up.

I mean I'm starting to understand the whining and snivelling over the carbon tax if the population just won't do SFA about environmental issues. FFS I visited Ont in 1969 and people were saying "It's either jobs OR the environment" and the song seems to have changed little 55 years later for many.

I do not know what they are named in Ontario, I used 7-11 as an example. (Circle K, On The Run a nd all the independent ones) . Fact is, as i said, some are independently owned franchises and others are just "corner" stores. They are small business.

BC is BC and Ontario has never done it because, well, it is Ontario. In Ontario, the stores are against it and so it is what it is. You do not have to like it. Continually preaching what another province does is absolutely immaterial.

Carbon tax???

So, you came to Ontario in 1969?  55years ago??? I really do not know what to say about that. We miss you?? All 14.5 million of us. NOT LOL

So, you do what you do there and the rest of Canada does what it dies.

Oh and I am from BC.   

 

Lastly, I just saw on the news the LCBO strike is still on. Seems the union added some things (money issue) after they left the bargaining table so the LCBO pulled the agreement..

 

Tentative deal to end LCBO strike on hold as province accuses union of introducing new demands

https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/union-says-lcbo-strike-will-continue-until-ford-government-signs-return-to-work-protocol-1.6970420

 

Edited July 20, 2024 by ExFlyer
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[herbie]

Meh,that was the first time in Ontario. Not my top pick of destinations being from the west and after visiting the Maritimes.

When I was in Oregon in the early 1990s I couldn't believe they had no deposit on cans then. They did have these machines you stuffed your cans in, they shredded them and spit out money based on the weight of aluminum.
Makes a hell of a lot more sense hauling pallets of shredded metal than hauling and repeatedly handling huge bags with 10 lbs of cans in each thousands of miles. The local SaveOn needs a huge floor space to store those returns.
BTW those ReturnIt Centres relieve small store owners of that problem.

So you're from BC. So you realize there's no point voting for PP to get rid of the carbon tax, eh? Cuz it's provincial.
You'd have to vote for that backstabbing self serving populist Rustad to get rid of it.

[QuebecOverCanada]

On 5/26/2024 at 2:43 PM, ironstone said:

I wouldn't mind seeing the entire market for booze open up so we could actually have some real competition for a change. Why not let businesses like Walmart or Costco sell booze?

Governments do not always know what's best.

'Socialist' Quebec doesn't even have this kind of ridiculous restriction when it comes to beer and alcohol.

It's incredible how dated Ontario is when it comes to alcohol sale.

[ExFlyer]

1 hour ago, QuebecOverCanada said:

'Socialist' Quebec doesn't even have this kind of ridiculous restriction when it comes to beer and alcohol.

It's incredible how dated Ontario is when it comes to alcohol sale.

You are aware that LCBO Ontario is the only wholesaler in the Province??  Just like the SAQ is the only wholesaler in Quebec.

In Ontario, the brewers own the Beer Stores.l

Everybody pays the same.

[herbie]

That's the way it usually is. It takes a special kind of stupid for any govt to hand away control over that kind of revenue.

Just went into the LCB for the first time this year. Didn't like the selection in the other place. 6pk of hard lemonade was $1.25 cheaper in the LCB but OMG I had to take it home and put it in the fridge all by myself. I couldn't chug it cold while I drove home.... how awful

[ExFlyer]

15 hours ago, herbie said:

That's the way it usually is. It takes a special kind of stupid for any govt to hand away control over that kind of revenue.

Just went into the LCB for the first time this year. Didn't like the selection in the other place. 6pk of hard lemonade was $1.25 cheaper in the LCB but OMG I had to take it home and put it in the fridge all by myself. I couldn't chug it cold while I drove home.... how awful

As I have told you before, there is no revenue loss. The government in Ontario is the only wholesaler in the province. All retailers have to buy form them. If they close stores, they save money. There is no loss of revenue. It is win win for the government.

Are you speaking of BC or Ontario? You said you have not been to Ontario.

Also, as I told you already, every LCBO has to stock it's own selection of products. The manager is responsible for sales and sticks what sells. If you did not get your favourite brand , maybe it is not available in Ontario or, the manager did not stock it. Again, not a government issue but the local store choices.

 

[herbie]

Yeah I know how it works, i'm agreeing with you or at least trying to.