What policies would YOU propose on both a Federal and Provinical level to aid the housing crisis?

[Ronaldo_]

Title says it all.

I personally thinking reducing immigration would be a start, but it would also help to reduce zoning and building height regulations especially for Urban Centres. Greater subsidies of public housing would honestly be a lot better too.

[herbie]

Go back to ditches, gravel roads, telephone poles and septic tanks and a $50,000 provincial first time home buyer grant? F^ck zoning laws and allow manufactured homes on slabs or foundations anywhere?
They could release federal/provincial land and ask builders to bid to build on it and sell it only through a govt agency. Void the GST on them. No land speculation, lowest building markups and no real estate agency fees.... You know the GST on a new $1M home is $70,000 and a home across the street sold for that a month ago.

[CdnFox]

26 minutes ago, herbie said:

Go back to ditches, gravel roads, telephone poles and septic tanks and a $50,000 provincial first time home buyer grant? F^ck zoning laws and allow manufactured homes on slabs or foundations anywhere?
They could release federal/provincial land and ask builders to bid to build on it and sell it only through a govt agency. Void the GST on them. No land speculation, lowest building markups and no real estate agency fees.... You know the GST on a new $1M home is $70,000 and a home across the street sold for that a month ago.

Anything you do to make it easier to buy a home, first time or otherwise, drives up the price unfortunately. 

I'm not sure what gravel roads do ??

Freeing up gov't land is only valuable if they either give it away cheap or reduce the red tape to build on it.  There's land available, we're building homes now. The problem is the process.

 

The answer in the short term is cut immigration substantially.  That will help tremendously - for about 3 years only.

THe longer term plan would be to induce a massive building program.  Right now developers must spend hundreds of thousands of dollars just applying to build , it takes 3 years, and then they're punished if they complete a home and it's not sold so they're ALWAYS building fewer than is needed.

Provinces have to cut the application time down - roughly in half.  THat's not hard but it may mean stepping on some cities toes here and there - too bad.

And the feds have to look at how to make it worth while to build homes in excess of what we need or can be presold. One idea might well be a promise that the gov't will buy any unoccupied homes if they're completed but not pre sold. That encourages developers to build as fast as they can and as many as they can.  The gov't can then sell the homes and do a specific 'first time one time' deal for new home buyers or retirees OR rent it out - then they can help set the rental rates in the area and drive down the costs of rentals.  which also puts a cap on the value of homes for sale because you wont' buy for more than you can rent for as an investor.

That would encourage far more homes to be built and the gov't would control the price that the 'excess' sells for or rents for.  But because they own the homes and pocket the rental the actual cost to the taxpayers over time is probably zero.

[ExFlyer]

I would propose a national apprenticeship program so young people can get into the trades.

In every building sector in Canada the most common complaint it here are no workers and tradesmen are in desperately short  supply.

We could build more homes if we had more trades people.

[CdnFox]

25 minutes ago, ExFlyer said:

I would propose a national apprenticeship program so young people can get into the trades.

In every building sector in Canada the most common complaint it here are no workers and tradesmen are in desperately short  supply.

We could build more homes if we had more trades people.

I mean, it's a great idea regardless,  but i don't think that's the biggest bottleneck at the moment.

[Nationalist]

Good ideas all. But housing is only part of the problem. The biggest obstacle to Canada's economy...and the entire northwestern hemisphere...is this "green" BS. This touches everything. It adds to the zoning issues and the supply line issues. It is adversely affecting every facet of our nation.

Let business do its thing. Get off it's back and the economy will bounce back faster than you can imagine.

[herbie]

3 hours ago, ExFlyer said:

In every building sector in Canada the most common complaint it here are no workers and tradesmen are in desperately short  supply.

We could build more homes if we had more trades people.

So we can build more million dollar homes... granted, workers are needed but that doesn't solve the underlying issue. They're buying $1M properties in Vancouver as tear downs. Release federal/provincial land for building, the developers are gonna sell for $1M a lot.

That won't help any new home buyers, just feed the frenzy. But that's the only thing they can come up with, right? More of the same, and swallow the blame.

[ExFlyer]

58 minutes ago, herbie said:

So we can build more million dollar homes... granted, workers are needed but that doesn't solve the underlying issue. They're buying $1M properties in Vancouver as tear downs. Release federal/provincial land for building, the developers are gonna sell for $1M a lot.

That won't help any new home buyers, just feed the frenzy. But that's the only thing they can come up with, right? More of the same, and swallow the blame.

It takes a tradesman to build a =million dollar home and a garden shed.

No tradesmen no or very reduced building of anything, big little multi family homes.

As far as buying 1 million dollar homes, well, the market and customers will decide. Or do you want the government to ban million dollar  homes?? LOL

Having the people to build homes will most certainly help relieve the shortage. No tradesmen, no homes being built and the prices go up. Regardless, the price is determined by the buyers and what they are willing to pay. That is what bidding wars are all about....

[herbie]

I was under the impression that the problem was homes that people could live in. Yeah we could build millions of home no one can afford.
Or ones they could.
Either will require way more tradespeople. So your choice.
Homes that even skilled tradespeople can't afford or homes average people can.

I mentioned some ways to do that, no one else has.

[CdnFox]

3 hours ago, herbie said:

I was under the impression that the problem was homes that people could live in. Yeah we could build millions of home no one can afford.

Sigh.  Once again i'm forced to explain basic economics to you

If you build millions of homes - the price will come down and people can afford them.

you honestly think if we dropped a million homes in the market today that prices wouldn't plummet?  If we increased our output by a million homes over 4 years prices would fall fairly dramatically.

And rents would go with them.  Making it easier to buy homes.

That's the whole frikkin point.

 

[herbie]

19 hours ago, CdnFox said:

If you build millions of homes - the price will come down and people can afford them.

A simpleton's interpretation of everything free market, eh?

[CdnFox]

7 minutes ago, herbie said:

A simpleton's interpretation of everything free market, eh?

An intelligent person's grasp of economics and history.  That IS how it works.  IF you flood the market with supply it impacts price.

But i love that you think that somehow isn't true    Wow.

[Moonbox]

2 hours ago, CdnFox said:

An intelligent person's grasp of economics and history.  That IS how it works.  IF you flood the market with supply it impacts price.

But i love that you think that somehow isn't true    Wow.

Wow indeed.  You just responded to him mocking you for oversimplifying and stating the obvious, by further insisting that the obvious is, in fact, true! 

Supply and demand affects prices.  Water is wet.  The sun is hot.  Nobody argued otherwise.  🙄

[CdnFox]

1 hour ago, Moonbox said:

Wow indeed.  You just responded to him mocking you for oversimplifying and stating the obvious, by further insisting that the obvious is, in fact, true! 

 

Always amusing to see stupid ride to the rescue of dumb  

Yes. I'm mocking him for calling the obvious and truthful facts 'oversimplifications".  They're not - they obvious and factual   So i'm mocking his rather dumb comment that a simple fact is somehow 'oversimplified' because it's a simple fact. 

Now i'm mocking you for being angry that i pointed out that a simple and obvious fact is in fact a simple and obvious fact     I have to say i find the tag-team stupidity delightful  

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Supply and demand affects prices.  Water is wet.  The sun is hot.  Nobody argued otherwise. 

Sigh - he did of course.  But as always - when you (or someone you're defending) says something stupid your first instinct is to say that they never said the thing they very clearly said.

You just never miss a chance to look stupid do you

Just to make sure you both understand.... if you dump millions of homes on the market, prices will go down. That's not 'oversimplification', it's just the way it is.  That's not 'simplifying' anything - that's a basic fact.

 

[Moonbox]

5 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

Yes. I'm mocking him for calling the obvious and truthful facts 'oversimplifications".  They're not - they obvious and factual  

These obvious and truthful facts didn't need stating.  That's why they're called obvious.   

59 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

Sigh - he did of course.  But as always - when you (or someone you're defending) says something stupid your first instinct is to say that they never said the thing they very clearly said.

He didn't.  You can't quote him saying it either, just like you never again.  As usual, you've distilled what he did say down to the most retarded possible interpretation, and elected to argue with yourself about it.  🙄

[herbie]

Yeah when the prices drop so low I'll buy up a couple and register Borg Inc. Rent ya one for $5000 a month too! Or you can line up to bid on buying it.

Don't forget Rule #2: you only gotta underprice the guy enough to win the customer. Look how they line up across the street to save 2¢ a litre. Switch to Bell and save $1 a month: switch to Rogers get an extra 1GB

"SAVE NOW" - $998,999 studio apartments.

[CdnFox]

1 hour ago, Moonbox said:

These obvious and truthful facts didn't need stating.  That's why they're called obvious.   

Apperently they did.  I stated them in response to his comment that there's no point in building millions of homes because homes are too expensive for people to afford

If you don't dig holes for a living you've missed your calling in life   ROFLMAO!!!!

1 hour ago, Moonbox said:

He didn't

He did.  If we build millions of new homes people can't afford them. But the fact is if we do the price comes down.  it's like 4 posts up or so, you can see it without even scrolling back a page.

Swing and a miss again kiddo.   

If we dump a million homes on the market the price will go down. That's pretty simple

[Moonbox]

11 hours ago, CdnFox said:

Apperently they did.  I stated them in response to his comment that there's no point in building millions of homes because homes are too expensive for people to afford

He didn't say that.  That's what you imagined he said.  

12 hours ago, CdnFox said:

He did.  If we build millions of new homes people can't afford them.

Yes he said something about that.   The giant, farcical leap of logic you made to  transform this comment into a denial of supply and demand mechanics is the problem.  As usual, you've invented something stupid to argue with yourself about.  

[CdnFox]

1 hour ago, Moonbox said:

He didn't say that.  That's what you imagined he said. 

He didn't? So he didn't say if we dump millions of homes on the market they'd be unaffordable?

I"m pretty sure he did. 

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Yes he said something about that. The giant, farcical leap of logic you made to  transform this comment into a denial of supply and demand mechanics is the problem.

He said THAT.

Speaking of making shit up tho - can you point out in my comment to him where i claimed he denied it?  In fact - what i said is that obviosuly i need to explain it - if you dump millions on the market the price will go down. 

I didn't say he denied it. 

So once again you have to lie to try to make your non-existent point  

And that's AFTER yelling at me for being right and getting angry that i said something correct   Which is pretty weird

Then he called my view 'simplistic' and i pointed out that it's actually not - it's entirely factual. Which is where you jumped in and angrily agreed with me and how DAAAARE  i point that out !!    

You're frikkin' hilarious kiddo in one thread you've accused me of making up what someone said while in the SAME post making up something i said,  you've accused me of being excessively right and unnecessarily pointing out facts when Herbie didn't realize them (which made it necessary) and are the end of the day - I"M STILL CORRECT  

Sigh - you just can't even buy that kind of entertainment  

[CdnFox]

16 hours ago, herbie said:

Yeah when the prices drop so low I'll buy up a couple and register Borg Inc. Rent ya one for $5000 a month too! Or you can line up to bid on buying it.

 "Borg Inc"? LOL - oddly specific. 

And why would i rent one of yours?  If the price comes down then A) people can buy their own and b) i can just stay in one of mine.
 

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Don't forget Rule #2: you only gotta underprice the guy enough to win the customer.

Ummm suuuurrreee - nobody wants to buy from the guy with the LOWEST price.  I mean... .eveyrone knows that.  (????)

Quote

Look how they line up across the street to save 2¢ a litre. Switch to Bell and save $1 a month: switch to Rogers get an extra 1GB

Sooo  - you're saying being the lowest price DOES work?

 

Quote

"SAVE NOW" - $998,999 studio apartments.

Again - and i'll go slowly here - if you build a million of them and drop them on the market, the price  nosedives.

Sigh - you know - @Moonbox is making himself look like a complete lame-ass tard trying desperately to convince me that you DO understand that concept.  You're kind of ruining it for him by failing to do so.  

[Moonbox]

2 hours ago, CdnFox said:

So he didn't say if we dump millions of homes on the market they'd be unaffordable?

No, he didn't.  He said:

On 4/30/2024 at 4:57 PM, herbie said:

Yeah we could build millions of home no one can afford.
Or ones they could.

You decided that this meant he was saying millions of homes being dumped wouldn't affect prices.  🤡

2 hours ago, CdnFox said:

Speaking of making shit up tho - can you point out in my comment to him where i claimed he denied it? 

Sure:

On 5/1/2024 at 3:35 PM, CdnFox said:

IF you flood the market with supply it impacts price.

But i love that you think that somehow isn't true

The quote function is magical, though it's no mystery why you so often refuse to use it.  

[herbie]

Do you comprehend that in order for free market prices to go down, supply must exceed demand? And the market being discussed is housing, not widgets or potatoes?

They are trying to build millions of homes, but the time period is over years, not for the next Christmas sales season.
If you release 100 new homes on the market in Vancouver tomorrow morning, that's barely going to affect the cost of housing in Vancouver. The next handful may be ready months or even years later.

Build all the houses you want, if people can't afford to buy or rent them the problem isn't solved, is it?

You do know we could bild millions of $100K manufactured homes and have millions and millions of hectares of land that could be given out free if we wanted to, don't you? Bu we won't. Just like we could build $15,000 EVs, there's just no financial incentive for anyone to do so. The real incentive is for everyone to make as much as the can.

Even if they do as some imagine dump 1,000,000 new homes on the market all at once, if the average house price drops to $750,000- you still can't afford that can you?

[Army Guy]

1 hour ago, herbie said:

Do you comprehend that in order for free market prices to go down, supply must exceed demand? And the market being discussed is housing, not widgets or potatoes?

They are trying to build millions of homes, but the time period is over years, not for the next Christmas sales season.
If you release 100 new homes on the market in Vancouver tomorrow morning, that's barely going to affect the cost of housing in Vancouver. The next handful may be ready months or even years later.

Build all the houses you want, if people can't afford to buy or rent them the problem isn't solved, is it?

You do know we could bild millions of $100K manufactured homes and have millions and millions of hectares of land that could be given out free if we wanted to, don't you? Bu we won't. Just like we could build $15,000 EVs, there's just no financial incentive for anyone to do so. The real incentive is for everyone to make as much as the can.

Even if they do as some imagine dump 1,000,000 new homes on the market all at once, if the average house price drops to $750,000- you still can't afford that can you?

Your never going to build enough homes in any city in a short period of time, to ease pricing, Thats not how real estate works they base price on market value in the area, demand...there is always someone that can afford to pay 0ne million, or pricing would have dropped already.

If one is looking for a cheaper housing then one must look outside the area that homes are already priced at one million, ..supply and demand......that might be 30 to 70 kms away...if you don't want to drive then expect to pay more...

 

 

[CdnFox]

2 hours ago, Moonbox said:

No, he didn't.  He said:

Dude  - listen to yourself " He didnt say that'! He said that! And then something else".

So he did say what i said.

Man, you can't even keep your story straight for one sentence  

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You decided that this meant he was saying millions of homes being dumped wouldn't affect prices. 

Sorry kiddo, but i did not say that.  I said that they would. I didn't say he claimed otherwise just that i had to explain it to him  

Quote

he quote function is magical, 

LOL _ well first off it doesn't say anywhere there that i claimed he denied it   and further that was in response to ANOTHER comment later on where he said that it was a 'simpletons veiw' to think it worked like that.

So yeah  the quote feature is magical  - it lets you take what i said from one place and pretend i said it somewhere else You have a whole new way to lie

You agree with me right?

2 hours ago, Moonbox said:

Sure:

well there you go  it's magical indeed    ROFLMAO!!!!!!!

[CdnFox]

1 hour ago, herbie said:

Do you comprehend that in order for free market prices to go down, supply must exceed demand?

Do i comprehend the thing i had to explain to you above? Yep.

1 hour ago, herbie said:

They are trying to build millions of homes, but the time period is over years, not for the next Christmas sales season.

And?

1 hour ago, herbie said:

If you release 100 new homes on the market in Vancouver tomorrow morning, that's barely going to affect the cost of housing in Vancouver. The next handful may be ready months or even years later.

100 thousand homes tomorrow would crash the vancouver real estate market.  Prices would drop radically. In a good year GREATER vancouver (never mind vancouver) builds about 30 k homes. So you're talking about 3 to 4 year's worth od production all at once.  In a day.  It would have a massive massive impact.

Sigh. THis isn't complicated.  if you drop a bunch of homes like that anywhere in canada it will severely impact the local market and prices will drop.