Go pick up a Bible said new House Speaker Mike Johnson

[Nationalist]

1 hour ago, robosmith said:

IF ^this was "simple logic," then the "intelligent creator" could not exist without a "cause."

More "simple logic:" the universe ALWAYS existed and changed in complex random ways.

In an infinite universe, the probability that EVERYTHING will happen approaches 100%.

One thing I know for sure.

Forsake Gawd at your own peril.

Bye...

[Guest]

26 minutes ago, Nationalist said:

One thing I know for sure.

Forsake Gawd at your own peril.

Bye...

How do you know that for sure? 

Whoever told you, could you get her to pick some numbers for the next 6/49?

[blackbird]

52 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

This is hilarious!

Stone carvings decorating the temples of Angkor, Cambodia, portray facets of everyday life, including images of animals and people. They are 800 years old...

In 1496 Bishop Bell was buried in the floor of Carlisle Cathedral in the north of England. Engravings in a brass inlay decorated his tomb with depictions of many well-known animals such as a bat,dogs, fish and a bird (see images below). Also engraved on the brass are two unusual animals, with long necks that are interlocked, and long tails. Many have noticed that they resemble sauropod dinosaurs.

Not only were dinosaurs coexisting with humans, but they were doing so as recently as the fifteenth century!

 

 

That is not what the above article says.  It says the portraits or depictions were found in 1496 and about 800 years ago.  It is not saying the depictions mean the animals lived at that time.  They could simply be depictions of animals much further back in history.  Nobody says the animals lived at the time the depictions were found.

[blackbird]

44 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

That would be called progress.  We no longer burn witches, and all that.

I think he is wrong.  There is no God, and even if there was, it wouldn't put a mindless prat like Mike Johnson in charge of a sheep dip.

And if you think it did, why did it take three tries?

Nobody said he supports burning of witches.  What did they call that kind of argument.  Pure invention.

You are free to think he is wrong.  Millions agree with him.  

I am not trying to defend how they choose Speakers.  That is their system as slow as it is.

[Hodad]

1 hour ago, bcsapper said:

This from your link:

3. How did those huge dinosaurs fit on the Ark?

Although there are about 668 names of dinosaurs, there are perhaps only 55 different ‘kinds’ of dinosaurs. Furthermore, not all dinosaurs were huge like the Brachiosaurus, and even those dinosaurs on the Ark were probably ‘teenagers’ or young adults. Indeed, dinosaurs were recently discovered to go through a growth spurt, so God could have brought dinosaurs of the right age to start this spurt as soon as they disembarked...

Teenage Brachiosauruses.  That's how it was done. 

Tell me you don't actually agree with these people?

There are intelligent religious people. None of them are fundamentalists. 

I told my 9 year old about the Ark myth and he laughed out loud at the absurdity of it. Yep, not even children are that simple.

[blackbird]

1 hour ago, bcsapper said:

Does the bible mention them?  I was raised a Roman Catholic, and was severely chastised as a child for insisting on their (prehistoric) existence. 

I would not even want to try to defend the Roman Catholic church.  They don't accept the Bible as their final authority.  They go by what their councils and church leaders have said mainly.  Wouldn't surprise me if the Pope believes in evolution.

[Guest]

20 minutes ago, blackbird said:

That is not what the above article says.  It says the portraits or depictions were found in 1496 and about 800 years ago.  It is not saying the depictions mean the animals lived at that time.  They could simply be depictions of animals much further back in history.  Nobody says the animals lived at the time the depictions were found.

You know, you could easily believe in your God and still think that article is a piece of utter garbage.

If your God exists, it won't hold it against you, because it knows dinosaurs died out 65 million years ago.  Indeed, if it exists, it no doubt sent the asteroid.

The people who wrote that article were clowns.  You don't have to believe them in order to hold on to your faith.

Here endeth the lesson...

Edited October 29, 2023 by bcsapper
Stupid multiple posting tricks

[blackbird]

1 minute ago, bcsapper said:

The people who wrote that article were clowns. 

I will have to try to find that article.  I don't think I actually studied it.  Forgive me if I posted something incorrect.  I am just trying to give you the information that the earth is actually very young.  The Bible doesn't give dates, but it could be ten or fifteen thousand years old.  Just guessing.  I am not trying to put an actual date on the earth, but just pointing out the long earth age is rejected by many, including some scientists.  The fossils could have been formed in a much younger earth than many believe.

[Guest]

15 minutes ago, Hodad said:

There are intelligent religious people. None of them are fundamentalists. 

I told my 9 year old about the Ark myth and he laughed out loud at the absurdity of it. Yep, not even children are that simple.

Agreed.  I've known many people who had faith in their God, but were not extremist at all.

 

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, blackbird said:

I would not even want to try to defend the Roman Catholic church.  They don't accept the Bible as their final authority.  They go by what their councils and church leaders have said mainly.  Wouldn't surprise me if the Pope believes in evolution.

He does seem rather normal, for a Pope.

[blackbird]

12 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

The people who wrote that article were clowns. 

Listen, I actually met Professor Philip Stott myself about 20 years ago and attended his week of slide presentation on creation versus evolution and the long age claims.  His slide presentation was remarkable and definitely casts doubt on evolution and long age from a scientific point of view.   Different aspects of it each night.  He is a scientist-mathematician from South Africa.  He was an atheist until 1976 when he was converted to Jesus Christ.  It totally changed his world view.

"He has been awarded doctorates by Reformation International Theological Seminary and by the Central University of Technology, Bloemfontein. He has practiced as a consulting engineer with several South African consulting firms. After many years as a staunch atheist, Philip Stott was converted to Christ in 1976."

Philip Stott (williamcareybi.com)

Edited October 29, 2023 by blackbird

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, blackbird said:

Listen, I actually met Professor Philip Stott myself about 20 years ago and attended his week of slide presentation on creation.  Different aspects of it each night.  He is a scientist-mathematician from South Africa.  He was an atheist until 1976 when he was converted to Jesus Christ.  It totally changed his world view.

"He has been awarded doctorates by Reformation International Theological Seminary and by the Central University of Technology, Bloemfontein. He has practiced as a consulting engineer with several South African consulting firms. After many years as a staunch atheist, Philip Stott was converted to Christ in 1976."

Philip Stott (williamcareybi.com)

I'm sure he's an absolutely splendid fellow.  Salt of the Earth.

But if he thinks the Earth is 6000 years old, and dinosaurs walked with men, he's up there with the flat earthers.

[blackbird]

6 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

I'm sure he's an absolutely splendid fellow.  Salt of the Earth.

But if he thinks the Earth is 6000 years old, and dinosaurs walked with men, he's up there with the flat earthers.

Before judging something or someone, you need to do a little research and hear their point of view.  If you don't then you are acting like a "flat earther".

How Did We Get Here?

A written debate between Kenneth R. Miller and Philip E. Johnson 

How Did We Get Here? / Kenneth Miller | Evolution | Scripture & Science | Reformation International College

Professor Stott debated and lectured in many parts of the world, even in Russia.

"When the Iron Curtain collapsed and the Soviet Union disbanded, involvement in helping children suffering the consequences of the Chernobyl nuclear disaster led to opportunities to lecture on Creation to state institutions including universities and colleges throughout Russia. These lectures became so popular that up to six different venues had to be fitted into one day. Associations with formerly “underground” churches allowed many of these opportunities to become openings for evangelisation. At present Philip Stott holds a research fellowship at the Central University of Technology in Bloemfontein."

Philip Stott (williamcareybi.com)

I'm sure the many people who heard Professor Stott would laugh at you for calling them "flat earthers'.
 

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, blackbird said:

Before judging something or someone, you need to do a little research and hear their point of view. 

 

Not if he thinks the Earth is 6000 years old, and dinosaurs walked with men, I don't.

[Caswell Thomas]

3 hours ago, blackbird said:

No, that does not fit with the historic, biblical definition of God.

God is omnipotent (all powerful), eternal, that is, God has always existed and always will.

God is not a part of the material universe.  God is a spirit that is present everywhere.  The universe which He created is not a part of God.  It is a material or physical entity.  It is governed by all the laws of physics and science which he created.  Such a complex universe cannot be explained apart from God.

For you to simply say it always existed is really nonsensical because everything had to have a beginning.  We are talking about two things, the supernatural God which is apart from the material universe and the material universe which is governed by intricate laws instituted by God.

This is where your argument falls down.  Your claim that the universe always existed does not explain why.  Why would there be such a thing if there is no purpose for life?  The answer is in the Bible.  God!

The atheist idea falls flat because it explains nothing.  It fails to tell why we are here.  An atheist must assume mankind are just chemicals with no meaning and no purpose.  Therefore there would be morals, no right or wrong.  Everyone just lives and dies and that's the end of it.  This would mean life is just hopeless accident.

It defies logic to claim there was no Creator and claim the universe always existed.  Every material thing changes over time.  The universe changes.  The complexity of the atomic world means energy, and sub atomic particles could not have created themselves.  

What really defies logic are those insisting God was created only in their idea of Him and then exclude everyone else. God IS the Universe, therefore humanity created by God cannot define him.

[Aristides]

2 hours ago, blackbird said:

Of course they lived at the same time as people.  There is evidence to support that.

quote

This pamphlet presents just a tiny selection of the amazing evidence that dinosaurs did not die out millions of years before humans, but, in fact, they lived at the same time. Examples are found all over the world. All sorts of dinosaurs are depicted in all sorts of mediums: carvings, etchings, drawings, tapestries, stone masonry, pottery, etc. The similarity with reconstructions of fossil dinosaurs is astounding. As you travel and read you will discover more examples. The Bible makes sense of dinosaurs, and makes sense of our life—why we are here and where we are going.    unquote

dinosaurs-did-they-die-out.pdf (creation.com)

This appears to be a very interesting article which I have yet to read myself.

?

[Legato]

When it comes to religious beliefs, there are 3 thing we all know. The first points to the second which in turn points to the third which points to the first. Around and around we go.

[blackbird]

1 hour ago, Caswell Thomas said:

What really defies logic are those insisting God was created only in their idea of Him and then exclude everyone else. God IS the Universe, therefore humanity created by God cannot define him.

That sounds like pantheism.

pantheism - a doctrine which identifies God with the universe, or regards the universe as a manifestation of God.

That may be part of some religious systems or beliefs, such as as some aboriginal belief systems.

But it is not the Biblical teaching of God.  The Bible teaches God is transcendent, i.e.  separate from the material universe.  The Bible teaches God is a spirit but yet omnipotent, omniscient, and omnipresent.  God is also eternal;  He had no beginning and has not end.  He always existed. 

What is interesting is that God is referred to as He and He created man in His image.  Exactly what that means does require some study.  The God of the Bible is entirely different than all the other gods of the world's religions.  The God of the Bible is really worth studying.  The Bible reveals that He loves man and sent His Son, Jesus Christ to earth to take on a human body, live on earth, and to provide a way for man to be redeemed or receive eternal life.  The Bible teaches that the shedding of blood was the only form of atonement that God accepts for sin.  But not just any blood.  It had to be the blood of His unique Son.  So Jesus died on a cross and shed His blood for the sins of mankind.  That is how much he cares about mankind.  However, this atonement only applies to those who believe and accept Him as their personal Savior and Lord.   That makes sense. 

[Aristides]

1 hour ago, bcsapper said:

Not if he thinks the Earth is 6000 years old, and dinosaurs walked with men, I don't.

It flys in the face of all the archeological, astronomical and geological evidence we have ever found. 

Edited October 29, 2023 by Aristides

[blackbird]

2 hours ago, bcsapper said:

Not if he thinks the Earth is 6000 years old,

The timeline for the beginning of man, i.e. Adam and Eve, appears to be estimated to be about 4,000 B.C. or 6,000 years ago.  

The Fall of man is estimated in the Thompson Chain Reference (KIng James) Bible to have happened about 4004 B.C.   This is according to the a highly respected theologian, Ussher.  It says it is only a working number, not to be taken as absolutely correct.

Since Genesis says God created the universe in six days and that man was created during this six days.  Therefore, it is correct to say the earth and universe was created about 6,000 years ago.  

The way I see it is, when God created everything in six days, that means the earth was created with a certain age at the moment it was created.  The trees, birds, animals, etc. were created full grown at that moment.  This was a supernatural event.  Nothing unreasonable or irrational about believing that.

So the earth would possibly be 6,000 years old.

[blackbird]

2 hours ago, bcsapper said:

Not if he thinks the Earth is 6000 years old, and dinosaurs walked with men, I don't.

"In 1995, Mary Schweitzer discovered red blood cells in a dinosaur bone, and, in 2005, more blood cells (above) in other bones plus soft tissue that was flexile and stretchy. Carbon dating gives just a few thousand years for dinosaur fossils. This is sensational evidence dinosaurs are not millions of years old."

dinosaurs-did-they-die-out.pdf (creation.com)

If man was created 6,000 years ago and dinosaurs lived a few thousand years ago, not million of years ago, then it is reasonable to believe that some men did walk on earth when dinosaurs were alive several thousand years ago.

The red blood cells found in a dinosaur bone and the carbon dating of a few thousand years is strong evidence.

Edited October 29, 2023 by blackbird

[blackbird]

2 hours ago, bcsapper said:

Not if he thinks the Earth is 6000 years old, and dinosaurs walked with men, I don't.

quote

According to Genesis 6:15, the Ark measured 300 x 50 x 30 cubits, which is about 460 x 75 x 44 feet, with a volume of about 1.52 million cubic feet. Researchers have shown that this is the equivalent volume of 522 standard railroad stock cars (US), each of which can hold 240 sheep. By the way, only 11% of all land animals are larger than a sheep.

Without getting into all the math, the 16,000-plus animals would have occupied much less than half the space in the Ark (even allowing them some moving-around space).

Conclusion

The Bible is reliable in all areas, including its account of the Ark (and the worldwide catastrophic Flood). A Christian doesn’t have to have a blind faith to believe that there really was an Ark. What the Bible says about the Ark can even be measured and tested today.

For answers to other objections about the Biblical account of Noah’s Flood and the Ark (e.g., Where did all the water come from?, How did Noah collect and then care for the animals?, etc.), see the books featured below. The Creation Answers Book—Chapters 12 and 13, in particular, cover these particular ‘problems’ related to Noah’s Flood, and Noah’s Ark: A Feasibility Study covers these and more in detail.

For more information on dinosaurs, read chapter 19 of the The Creation Answers Book on Dinosaurs.   unquote

Were dinosaurs on Noah's Ark (creation.com)

[robosmith]

4 hours ago, blackbird said:

 

Believing what the Bible says is actually far closer to our historic Judeo-Christian culture than the recent woke/progressivism phenomena with same-sex marriage, abortion on demand, medical assistance in dying, sexual orientation, and gender identity ideology.  All those things are an abomination in the true Judeo-Christian culture.  We need to put the brakes on this woke stuff.  If the new Speaker, Mike Johnson, believes the Bible and rejects the woke agenda, that is something to celebrate.  He said God ordained him to be Speaker of the House.  I think he is correct.

Hate to break it to you, but Trump is NOT god, no matter what he told Mike Johnson. 

[blackbird]

1 hour ago, Aristides said:

It flys in the face of all the archeological, astronomical and geological evidence we have ever found. 

That's not true.  I attended a week of evening slide presentations 20 years ago by Professor Philip Stott on the subject.  He presented scientific evidence in the slide presentation that refuted a lot of so-called science and claims about evolution, geological age of the earth etc.  I can't go into on here because I don't have it at my fingertips, but the information is out there if you wish to look at it.

Two places to look are the creation.com website and the Scripture and Science website.

Home - creation.com

Philip Stott: General Science: Table of Contents | Reformation International College

Edited October 29, 2023 by blackbird

[robosmith]

4 hours ago, Nationalist said:

One thing I know for sure.

Forsake Gawd at your own peril.

Bye...

And how do you "know for sure"? You been talking to him or relatives that passed about what happened?