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Biggest Lie You've Been Told


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2 hours ago, impartialobserver said:

Religion is not necessary to live let alone live a satisfying life. The lie is that you need to be spiritual in order to feel fulfilled or content. 

That may be true, but it is not the reason for Christianity.  The Bible teaches us that when Adam and Eve sinned by eating the forbidden fruit, they fell out of a good relationship with God and became sinful, fallen beings.  As a result we all inherited a fallen, sinful nature.  Out hearts are corrupt and we now die.  Prior to the fall of Adam and Eve, it was a perfect paradise and there was no death.  Now we have corruption, crime, wars, and hatred through the world and death.

Everyone is heading for damnation because the relationship with God has been destroyed.  The only way that can be restored is by believing in Jesus Christ who came to earth to redeem all those who are fallen and lost.

That doesn't seem to have anything to do with feeling fulfilled or contented.  It is totally different than that.  The reason why men believe the gospel is to be redeemed and given eternal life.  The alternative is hell for eternity.  That is no small thing.

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On 2/9/2024 at 7:25 PM, blackbird said:

That may be true, but it is not the reason for Christianity.  The Bible teaches us that when Adam and Eve sinned by eating the forbidden fruit, they fell out of a good relationship with God and became sinful, fallen beings.  As a result we all inherited a fallen, sinful nature.  Out hearts are corrupt and we now die.  Prior to the fall of Adam and Eve, it was a perfect paradise and there was no death.  Now we have corruption, crime, wars, and hatred through the world and death.

Everyone is heading for damnation because the relationship with God has been destroyed.  The only way that can be restored is by believing in Jesus Christ who came to earth to redeem all those who are fallen and lost.

That doesn't seem to have anything to do with feeling fulfilled or contented.  It is totally different than that.  The reason why men believe the gospel is to be redeemed and given eternal life.  The alternative is hell for eternity.  That is no small thing.

And If someone does not believe that? Then what? In the absence of religion.. I have a fine life. Rose out of poverty, earned a Phd, have a great job, do pretty much all that I want to do, have a close knit family with two kids. So it would appear that I have reached the maximum utility/satisfaction with no religion component. it would appear to not be necessary. I can recognize that all humans are flawed and not need religious scripture to tell me that. It is simple variance in genetics and environment. 

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1 minute ago, impartialobserver said:

And If someone does not believe that? Then what? In the absence of religion.. I have a fine life. Rose out of poverty, earned a Phd, have a great job, do pretty much all that I want to do, have a close knit family with two kids. So it would appear that I have reached the maximum utility/satisfaction with no religion component. it would appear to not be necessary. I can recognize that all humans are flawed and not need religious scripture to tell me that. It is simple variance in genetics and environment. 

You obviously don't know what the Bible teaches.  It doesn't make one iota of difference what you have achieved or how your life has gone on.  It sounds like it has been good.  That is fine.   But it is what the Bible says that matters for eternity.  There is the natural world and there is a spiritual world.  There is a God to whom we are accountable.  Everyone will face a judgment day.

The Bible says we are all sinners and unless a person repents and believes in Jesus Christ he will be facing a lost eternity.

You need to study the New Testament.  The gospel of John is clear.

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Just now, blackbird said:

You obviously don't know what the Bible teaches.  It doesn't make one iota of difference what you have achieved or how your life has gone on.  It sounds like it has been good.  That is fine.   But it is what the Bible says that matters for eternity.  There is the natural world and there is a spiritual world.  There is a God to whom we are accountable.  Everyone will face a judgment day.

The Bible says we are all sinners and unless a person repents and believes in Jesus Christ he will be facing a lost eternity.

You need to study the New Testament.  The gospel of John is clear.

See.. this is where we differ.. I do not care even one iota if you believe or not. I am not going to tell you what you need to do. But you on the other hand... are quite the self important type. I do not believe... never will and yet have a fine and moral life in its absence. 

"You need to study the New Testament.  The gospel of John is clear."

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6 hours ago, impartialobserver said:

See.. this is where we differ.. I do not care even one iota if you believe or not. I am not going to tell you what you need to do. But you on the other hand... are quite the self important type. I do not believe... never will and yet have a fine and moral life in its absence. 

"You need to study the New Testament.  The gospel of John is clear."

Well, there is not much more to say at this point.  I don't think I am being "self-important".  I simply told you some facts or warned you about what the Bible says. 

If I see someone walking blindly toward the edge of a cliff, does it not make sense to warn them?  Or would you just let them walk over the edge?  Telling someone about something that has eternal consequences is not being "self important" the way I see it.  What someone does with the information is his choice.

The Bible says many are called but few are chosen.

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On 2/12/2024 at 3:24 PM, blackbird said:

If I see someone walking blindly toward the edge of a cliff, does it not make sense to warn them?

and the fact that you think that someone not believing in God is absolute proof of this... is your showing your self importance. You feel compelled to tell someone how someone to live their life.. and yet would not take such unsolicited advice is another reason I think most religious types are hypocritical to their very core. 

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1 hour ago, impartialobserver said:

and the fact that you think that someone not believing in God is absolute proof of this... is your showing your self importance. You feel compelled to tell someone how someone to live their life.. and yet would not take such unsolicited advice is another reason I think most religious types are hypocritical to their very core. 

"The gospel of salvation brings a way to discover peace and purpose in life. It proclaims that through Jesus Christ, humanity can be saved from sin and receive eternal life with God. It’s a free gift; not earned by works or merit, but received by grace through faith. This message brings hope, forgiveness, and new life to those who embrace it."

What is the gospel of salvation? › Jesus Salvation

 That is how men are redeemed and delivered from eternal damnation.  I believe the Bible 100% and it is not hypocrisy to spread the good news of salvation in Jesus Christ.  I am sorry you find it offensive.  It is meant for your good.

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1 hour ago, blackbird said:

"The gospel of salvation brings a way to discover peace and purpose in life. It proclaims that through Jesus Christ, humanity can be saved from sin and receive eternal life with God. It’s a free gift; not earned by works or merit, but received by grace through faith. This message brings hope, forgiveness, and new life to those who embrace it."

What is the gospel of salvation? › Jesus Salvation

 That is how men are redeemed and delivered from eternal damnation.  I believe the Bible 100% and it is not hypocrisy to spread the good news of salvation in Jesus Christ.  I am sorry you find it offensive.  It is meant for your good.

And If I was to tell you how to live your life.. it would be for your good IMO, you would tell me off as well. You can lie and say otherwise but it just shows you dishonest you are. 

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3 hours ago, impartialobserver said:

And If I was to tell you how to live your life.. it would be for your good IMO, you would tell me off as well. You can lie and say otherwise but it just shows you dishonest you are. 

You actually made the claim you live a moral life.  But the Bible says:

"23  For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;"   Romans 3:23

I never lied.  That is your fabrication.  I simply told you the truth, which you try to deny.

You are the one who claims I am trying to tell you how to live your life.

What I told you is the simple truth that we are all sinners and need to be born again.  Yes that would change your life and if you want to interpret it as me telling you how to live your life, so be it.  I don't deny that it would change your life.  That is what God does for people.  He gives them a new and better life and an eternal life.

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13 minutes ago, blackbird said:

You actually made the claim you live a moral life.  But the Bible says:

"23  For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;"   Romans 3:23

I never lied.  That is your fabrication.  I simply told you the truth, which you try to deny.

You are the one who claims I am trying to tell you how to live your life.

What I told you is the simple truth that we are all sinners and need to be born again.  Yes that would change your life and if you want to interpret it as me telling you how to live your life, so be it.  I don't deny that it would change your life.  That is what God does for people.  He gives them a new and better life and an eternal life.

Your "truth" is no more valid than anything I say. I love how you dodge things. If I told you how to live your life.. you would not take my unsolicited advice with grace and change your ways. Yeah.. zero chance of that.

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5 hours ago, impartialobserver said:

Your "truth" is no more valid than anything I say. I love how you dodge things. If I told you how to live your life.. you would not take my unsolicited advice with grace and change your ways. Yeah.. zero chance of that.

I don't give you "my truth".   Only God's truth which is revealed in his word the Bible is absolute truth.

Do you think you are a sinner or do you think you are not so bad?  Where do you think you will end up when you pass away?

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On 2/9/2024 at 10:25 PM, blackbird said:

That may be true, but it is not the reason for Christianity.  The Bible teaches us that when Adam and Eve sinned by eating the forbidden fruit, they fell out of a good relationship with God and became sinful, fallen beings.  As a result we all inherited a fallen, sinful nature.  Out hearts are corrupt and we now die.  Prior to the fall of Adam and Eve, it was a perfect paradise and there was no death.  Now we have corruption, crime, wars, and hatred through the world and death.

Everyone is heading for damnation because the relationship with God has been destroyed.  The only way that can be restored is by believing in Jesus Christ who came to earth to redeem all those who are fallen and lost.

That doesn't seem to have anything to do with feeling fulfilled or contented.  It is totally different than that.  The reason why men believe the gospel is to be redeemed and given eternal life.  The alternative is hell for eternity.  That is no small thing.

Too bad the bible says faith alone isn't enough. I suspect you want people to be saved and thats a wonderful thing but you dont heed scripture.

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On 2/12/2024 at 1:27 PM, impartialobserver said:

And If someone does not believe that? Then what? In the absence of religion.. I have a fine life. Rose out of poverty, earned a Phd, have a great job, do pretty much all that I want to do, have a close knit family with two kids. So it would appear that I have reached the maximum utility/satisfaction with no religion component. it would appear to not be necessary. I can recognize that all humans are flawed and not need religious scripture to tell me that. It is simple variance in genetics and environment. 

The best part is you will also reach the "maximum utility/satisfaction" in hell too. What I do love how impressed you are with yourself though. 

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On 2/15/2024 at 1:06 AM, blackbird said:

I don't give you "my truth".   Only God's truth which is revealed in his word the Bible is absolute truth.

Do you think you are a sinner or do you think you are not so bad?  Where do you think you will end up when you pass away?

Yes you do. That's true but you dont abide by your own words 

Do you think you're a sinner. You're guilty of the sin of presumption. 

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6 hours ago, Yakuda said:

The best part is you will also reach the "maximum utility/satisfaction" in hell too. What I do love how impressed you are with yourself though. 

Best part is that you do not actually know this.. you simply believe it to be true. While still living on earth.. your approach and mine are simply different ways of being. The fact that you need to feel superior says a lot about you. 

On 2/14/2024 at 10:06 PM, blackbird said:

I don't give you "my truth".   Only God's truth which is revealed in his word the Bible is absolute truth.

Do you think you are a sinner or do you think you are not so bad?  Where do you think you will end up when you pass away?

I think that I am an average flawed human being. Guess what? everyone else ever born is flawed as well.  Its my belief (belief not knowledge) that when we pass away.. we simply cease to exist and that is the end. No afterlife, no spirits, no anything. So treasure what limited life you have and make the most of it. 

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On 2/16/2024 at 4:55 PM, impartialobserver said:

Its my belief (belief not knowledge) that when we pass away.. we simply cease to exist and that is the end. No afterlife, no spirits, no anything. So treasure what limited life you have and make the most of it. 

You are lost in the biggest lie ever told.

You sound like a diehard Darwinist or atheist.

I would encourage you to get the book "Darwin's Universe - From Nothing, By Nothing, For Nothing, Survival for Nothing" by Yan T. Wee.   Available on Amazon and many other bookstores.  Available at a lower price used at Alibris website.  Alibris has the book used for about $1.61 U.S. plus shipping.  You couldn't beat that price.  It is well worth it.   This is the link to Alibris:

Darwin's Universe - From Nothing, By Nothing, For Nothing - Survival for Nothing by Yan T Wee - Alibris

Part of the preface says:

"This book will walk us through cosmology, biology, philosophy, and end with theology, the queen of the sciences.  Empirical science buries Darwinism and resurrects Creationism.  We are more than cosmic orphans lost in an accidental, uncaring and dying Universe;  we are living souls, made in the image of God, and designed to have a wonderful relationship with an awesome Creator."

This book has a massive amount of food for thought.  If we accept your view, life has no purpose, no meaning, and we are just a cosmic accident that happened for a brief moment in time.  That means your thoughts are just a chemical reaction in your brain.  If there is no purpose or meaning to life, what is the point of existence?  That of course is completely contrary to scientific observation of the complexity of everything in the universe including the massive amount of DNA or genetic information in the simple cell, not to mention all the precise laws of physics which control how the universe functions.

I could spend hours quoting parts of the book to try to make you aware of some things, but I think it would make more sense for you to get a copy and learn for yourself.  There are countless facts that I cannot give you on here.  

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2 hours ago, SkyHigh said:

Would you please define evolution in a couple sentences in the way the evolutionary biologists that have spent years studying would.

Thank you 

My own definition would say the theory of evolution (or Darwinism) is the unproven claim that all living creatures developed through time from some simpler living organism by what is claimed as "natural selection", beginning from some accidental combination of chemicals on the earth.  I would add this is an unproven theory which has been rejected by many scientists because there is no proof and it is an unreasonable theory.  It is a religion to many people. 

The links between species are missing and since the time of Darwin's theory (1859), the complexity of life has been found to be extremely great. Even the simple cell has vast amounts of information stored in it to govern how it functions, grows and multiplies.  Darwin did not know this. The information in living organisms is so great that many conclude that only an intelligent designer could have created life and the universe.

 

 

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11 minutes ago, blackbird said:

My own definition would say the theory of evolution (or Darwinism) is the unproven claim that all living creatures developed through time from some simpler living organism by what is claimed as "natural selection", beginning from some accidental combination of chemicals on the earth.  I would add this is an unproven theory which has been rejected by many scientists because there is no proof and it is an unreasonable theory.  It is a religion to many people. 

The links between species are missing and since the time of Darwin's theory (1859), the complexity of life has been found to be extremely great. Even the simple cell has vast amounts of information stored in it to govern how it functions, grows and multiplies.  Darwin did not know this. The information in living organisms is so great that many conclude that only an intelligent designer could have created life and the universe.

 

 

So you base your understanding of one of the most evidenced theories in science on your opinion?

Using terms like "Darwinism" and confusing abiogenesis with evolution further proves you are completely ignorant on the topic.

If you're not even able to steel man the other side position, you're opinion is not worth anything and make your views irrelevant.

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On 1/31/2024 at 12:40 PM, impartialobserver said:

Its called empathy. I would not like to be raped therefore I do not do it to others. No need to have some fictional god bossing us around. However, I know that you can't accept this answer. Your bias gets in the way. 

So the Golden Rule is the basis of your morality: “Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.” This is a Biblical moral tenet.  

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On 2/9/2024 at 7:38 PM, impartialobserver said:

Religion is not necessary to live let alone live a satisfying life. The lie is that you need to be spiritual in order to feel fulfilled or content. 

Yes you do need it.  What is the meaning and purpose of your life?  If you say that you can see meaning as an atheist because your body feeds the worms that feed the food chain that perpetuates life, including human life, you’re assuming that there are higher and lower forms of consciousness, the higher being the whole point.  That demonstrates that there’s valuation at work, with wisdom at the centre (knowing how to use the information available to live life in the best way possible), which brings us health, ethics, and the search for greater meaning and purpose.  All arrows in this teleological thinking point to the idea of perfection or God, because though we may not be perfect, we can see better and worse ways of living, identify mistakes, learn from them hopefully, and strive to be better.  One must be able to conceive at least in a vague sense of the perfect to do this.  That’s what we mean when we talk about virtue, leading a moral life, being faithful, and making an effort to use our talents to achieve what we can.   Yes we fall short, but belief in a better life spurs the journey forward.  

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1 hour ago, SkyHigh said:

So you base your understanding of one of the most evidenced theories in science on your opinion?

No, I base my understanding on empirical science and reason.

The theory of evolution is not "one of the most evidenced theories".   It is only a theory which has been rejected by many scientists.

There is a good article explaining this at this website:

Created or evolved (creation.com)

1 hour ago, SkyHigh said:

Using terms like "Darwinism" and confusing abiogenesis with evolution further proves you are completely ignorant on the topic.

I don't know how you can make that claim.   I simply stated what evolutionists claim, which is that the first life forms came about by the accidental coming together of certain molecules or chemicals.  Evolution is the theory that says life progressed from very simple cells to more advanced life forms.  This is part of the theory of evolution.  Evolution is the theory of how life today came to be from simple life forms.  If your only purpose is to come on here to call someone ignorant, you are wasting your time.  You should be intelligent enough to contribute some worthwhile comments without calling someone ignorant because they don't share your views.

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1 hour ago, Zeitgeist said:

Yes you do need it.  What is the meaning and purpose of your life?  If you say that you can see meaning as an atheist because your body feeds the worms that feed the food chain that perpetuates life, including human life, you’re assuming that there are higher and lower forms of consciousness, the higher being the whole point.  That demonstrates that there’s valuation at work, with wisdom at the centre (knowing how to use the information available to live life in the best way possible), which brings us health, ethics, and the search for greater meaning and purpose.  All arrows in this teleological thinking point to the idea of perfection or God, because though we may not be perfect, we can see better and worse ways of living, identify mistakes, learn from them hopefully, and strive to be better.  One must be able to conceive at least in a vague sense of the perfect to do this.  That’s what we mean when we talk about virtue, leading a moral life, being faithful, and making an effort to use our talents to achieve what we can.   Yes we fall short, but belief in a better life spurs the journey forward.  

Why is it necessary to have meaning or purpose? In my opinion the need for one's life to have purpose is just a lack of humility, the universe cares nothing about the life of either a single human or the collective. 

We only have one life we know about, so if you need meaning why not just live a good life?

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6 minutes ago, blackbird said:

No, I base my understanding on empirical science and reason.

The theory of evolution is not "one of the most evidenced theories".   It is only a theory which has been rejected by many scientists.

There is a good article explaining this at this website:

Created or evolved (creation.com)

I don't know how you can make that claim.   I simply stated what evolutionists claim, which is that the first life forms came about by the accidental coming together of certain molecules or chemicals.  Evolution is the theory that says life progressed from very simple cells to more advanced life forms.  This is part of the theory of evolution.  Evolution is the theory of how life today came to be from simple life forms.  If your only purpose is to come on here to call someone ignorant, you are wasting your time.  You should be intelligent enough to contribute some worthwhile comments without calling someone ignorant because they don't share your views.

No sir , I asked you to define evolution in the way biologists do . You couldn't, therefore anything you say is the literal definition of ignorant.

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