Jump to content

Complicit in War Crimes


Recommended Posts

3 hours ago, Gaétan said:

Then they'd have to arrest you for supporting the hamas terrorists they want to arrest.  You don't want to get arrested do you? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, CdnFox said:

Then they'd have to arrest you for supporting the hamas terrorists they want to arrest.  You don't want to get arrested do you? 

The terrorists are the israeli soldiers, doen't get mixed up.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

27 minutes ago, Gaétan said:

The terrorists are the israeli soldiers, doen't get mixed up.

So you don't think it's terrorism to attack without warning or declaration and rape and mutilate and kill women and burn babies alive?

That's not terrorism in your mind?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, CdnFox said:

So you don't think it's terrorism to attack without warning or declaration and rape and mutilate and kill women and burn babies alive?

That's not terrorism in your mind?

You exaggerate terrorism are the acts committed by Israel and their accomplices, including Trudeau  and Biden. There is no comparison to be made between the crimes of Israel and the crimes of Hamas. There is 200 times more victimes on the palestinians side and the complete detruction of Gaza.

Edited by Gaétan
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Gaétan said:

You exaggerate

That's the verified truth, no exaggeration. 

So - you're fine with that behavior then.  Won't speak against it? fair enough

Quote

There is no comparison to be made between the crimes of Israel and the crimes of Hamas.

That's quite true. The crimes of Hamas are a million times worse. There really is no comparison. That kind of evil deserves to be wiped from the face of the earth. But at least you have made your position clear, that you are in support of the slaughter of innocents, women and children

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Gaétan said:

On the contrary there are more than a million of victimes of Israel crimes.

Nope. Doesn't sound like there's very many at all. Most of the people that Israel kills they do so lawfully and they had it coming. No crime at all.

On the other hand, attacking another country without warning or declaration and slaughtering women and children in the most horrible fashion possible after raping and torturing them is it pretty serious crime. It is also a crime to hide behind civilian populations during times of war. Which means every death that has occurred during this war amongst the civilians is also the crime of Hamas and not Israel

Gaza and A mass have the blood of tens if not hundreds of thousands on their hands. And seeing as you support the criminals, you don't really get a say in who else is a criminal.

These criminals will be wiped from the face of the earth shortly.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, CdnFox said:

Nope. Doesn't sound like there's very many at all. Most of the people that Israel kills they do so lawfully and they had it coming. No crime at all.

 

According to criminals, they don't commit crimes.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

33 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

True - you and hamas both say slaughtering mutilating and raping women and burning children isn't a crime.  But it kinda  is. 

No, they say these are crimes but justified by the crimes of their opponents and they never burned chlidren or raped women but there are a lot of chlidren burned by american bombs and women raped by israeli soldiers in Gaza.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, Gaétan said:

No, they say these are crimes but justified by the crimes of their opponents 

Something that is justified is not a crime. So you're not saying it's a crime at all. You're saying it's perfectly acceptable because it's justified.

And they absolutely merge children and raped women and murdered them. Intentionally. That was the intentional goal.

4 hours ago, Gaétan said:

there are a lot of chlidren burned by american bombs and women raped by israeli soldiers in Gaza.

Nope. The children who are killed are killed by the same terrorists who choose to hide behind them knowing full well that they will die as a immediate result. That's why it's illegal to do what they do. It is not illegal to kill children or women if it is necessary to do so in order to destroy the enemy. It's not even immoral. The Israelis don't do it in order to kill women and children, they do it to kill Hamas and women and children happen to be in the way.

So you support the targeting rape murder and burning of women and children and you feel it's justified because of some reason in the past. That would make you a monster. Enjoy going to hell.

Edited by CdnFox
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

The accusations against the Hamas leaders by the International Tribunal are a real shame and are aimed above all at punishing them while absolutely nothing will be done against the Israeli leaders who have caused more than two million victims. And nothing will be done against their accomplices like Trudeau, Biden and European leaders who have supplied them with weapons. There is no justice and it's a sign that the end of the world is approaching sooner than expected

Edited by Gaétan
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Gaétan said:

The accusations against the Hamas leaders by the International Tribunal are a real shame and are aimed above all at punishing them while absolutely nothing will be done against the Israeli leaders who have caused more than two million victims. And nothing will be done against their accomplices like Trudeau, Biden and European leaders who have supplied them with weapons. There is no justice and it's a sign that the end of the world is approaching sooner than expected

Hamas is the cause for all the victims. Frankly the judges in this world are not the ones I would be worried about if I were them.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...
7 hours ago, Gaétan said:

In the next election Canadians will replace Satan with the devil, this is one of the consequences of using the instrument of the evil one, money

I'm sure the voices in your head will tell you that's what happened at any rate.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, Gaétan said:

In the next election Canadians will replace Satan with the devil, this is one of the consequences of using the instrument of the evil one, money

Don't you mean replace the devil with Satan? You should be over there handing out Bibles to Hamas.

Did you grow a beard yet?

  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The worst thing Hamas did besides murdering 1,200 Israeli citizens on Oct. 7th, was to take aprox 230 or 250 hostages and then start killing them.  The Oct. 7th attack was an extremely inhumane thing to do and proved Hamas are nothing more than savages.  What did they accomplish?  For some strange reason, they got a lot of sympathy from the world's reprobate countries and populations.  But that is worthless.  They destroyed Gaza in the process.  On Oct. 6th there was no war going on.  Hamas made their choice.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, blackbird said:

For some strange reason, they got a lot of sympathy from the world's reprobate countries and populations.  But that is worthless.

Historically they have gotten far more sympathy, and it has always been insanely valuable. Which is inevitably why they launched this attack as well.

In the past they attack Israel, Israel retaliates, hamas make sure that all of its rocket launchers and military facilities are on top of schools or hospitals or the like so there's High civilian casualties, and the world turns around and goes oh my goodness look at how terrible the people of Gaza have it.

Then the UN and all of the other countries start showering Hamasand Gaza with goodies. They recognize them, they give them additional political power, there's additional funding and support, the works. And then they force Israel to leave before the job is done and Hamas gets to rebuild.

I suspect they are absolutely shocked that they are not getting that kind of support this time. While there is some sympathy in the world that hasn't been even a tiny fraction of what has been the case in the past. And well two countries have recognized them, that doesn't really actually do anything for them on its own. And while Israel is getting lots of warnings, nobody is forcing it to leave. And the worldwide protests aren't doing much good either.

The simple fact is they went way overboard this time and instead of just incurring the wrath of Israel, they committed an atrocity that the whole world recognizes as being grounds for Israel to wipe them out.

As long as Israel Treads relatively carefully they should be allowed to finish the job.

  • Thanks 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

IMO, the comments here actually provide a glimpse into the difficulties of obtaining a negotiated settlement. After 34 pages, those opinions appear to be just as entrenched as they were at the start. Worthy of reflection I think.

If everyone can agree that any peaceful (and lasting) resolution boils down to the willingness of belligerent parties to achieve it, then there are a few fundamental questions that should come immediately to mind.

If Hamas is allowed to remain as a governing entity:

- Does anyone actually believe that they will change the political objectives and stated goals that are clearly reflected in their motto?

- Do you believe that Hamas will acknowledge Israels right to exist as a nation?

- Do you believe that they will stop diverting foreign aid toward munitions of war? 

- Do you believe that they are now ready to negotiate the legitimate grievances of the Palestinian people in a constructive and peaceful manner?

Personally, I'd assert that a sincere yes answer to any of the above questions is just as unlikely as achieving any sort of consensus of opinion on this thread within an imposed limitation of (say) 40 pages.

When considering the establishment of any road map toward lasting peace in the area, it eventually boils down to the willingness of the partners to achieve it. So, if peaceful resolution is the objective here, Hamas sympathizers are pretty much forced to support the idea that Hamas (as a governing entity) is now willing to accept the existence of the Jewish state and that they are ready to negotiate on behalf of the Palestinian people.

For the record, I don't believe that for a second.

I know quite a few multi-tour veterans of various missions in the area. Some of us go back as far as UNEF II circa 1977. That certainly doesn't qualify any of us as experts in the geo political forces or cultural topography in play there... and lest there be any confusion, I'm not suggesting for a second that it does.

But, BUT , I don't know a single veteran who believes that any sort of future peace deal is possible if Hamas is left as a viable entity. I would suggest that most of these folks are (and were) neutral observers, or at least they were when they arrived in theatre. Their opinions were largely forged by non partisan experience in the area,  they had eyes to see and ears to hear. In fact, watching, listening and low level conflict resolution was a big part of the collective effort there. In any case, the consensus of opinion that I've observed (while clearly anecdotal) is at least worthy of passing consideration isn't it?

How can so many people who initially arrived there with no dog in the fight all end up having the same opinion? And why does (non native) support for Hamas seem to be (anecdotally again) the exclusive domain of those who have never set foot in the area? Could it be that experience is an essential part of forming an opinion?

For the most part though, humanitarian issues are a shared concern here and those who advocate for eliminating Hamas (and establishing an entity willing to actually negotiate) certainly aren't blind to the cost of doing it. Accusing them of warmongering is usually the beginning of the end of productive discussion and it's usually more of an argument technique than any sort of sincere belief in the accusation itself. 

If you can find anyone who has actually served in a TOC or CAOC position during an active conflict, they will all tell you that great efforts are taken to avoid collateral damage. They will also tell you that the term itself is more than a euphemistic reference to women and children. There is an entire section of people (24/7) that provide advice to the commander on everything from under ground infrastructure (electricity, water, sewage, fiberoptic etc) above ground infrastructure (type, use etc), and all of that is a bigger consideration than most would think. There are also lawyers present specifically to advise the commander of the rules of armed conflict as they pertain to specific engagements. 

In short, it isn't a blood thirsty, vengeful free for all and those who think it is would likely be surprised by the efforts undertaken to ensure that it isn't.

 

Edited by Venandi
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

Hamas cannot release the hostages if the army of Israel comes back 6 weeks later and it is impossible to get rid of Hamas, war will recrut more fighthers, repression never works but only make things worse. Israel don't want the peace but to take the palestian land and this is exactly what they do. There is 30 millions in arms delivered in Israel in 2023 and the justice must put Trudeau in prison. You can't do business with Israel as long as their crimes persist.

Edited by Gaétan
Link to comment
Share on other sites

47 minutes ago, Gaétan said:

Hamas cannot release the hostages if the army of Israel comes back 6 weeks later and it is impossible to get rid of Hamas, war will recrut more fighthers, repression never works but only make things worse. Israel don't want the peace but to take the palestian land and this is exactly what they do. There is 30 millions in arms delivered in Israel in 2023 and the justice must put Trudeau in prison. You can't do business with Israel as long as their crimes persist.

Nothing in my experience causes me to agree with that. It does reinforce my opinion about the elusive nature of solutions though:

3 hours ago, Venandi said:

...the comments here actually provide a glimpse into the difficulties of obtaining a negotiated settlement. After 34 pages, those opinions appear to be just as entrenched as they were at the start

The post above was simply my own perspective on the matter (for what that may be worth) and I won't pursue the matter further. I suspect I could write a book on the subject to no avail.

 I am curious what your solution is though. What do you recommend? How would you proceed ? What would you do as King of Israel and why?

If you want to keep Hamas as a governing entity how do you propose to proceed?

Yes, it will certainly take a while to remove an entrenched Hamas ideology, a generation has grown up under it and they will need to see a measure of success to conclude that there is the possibility for more.

IMO though, removing Hamas capabilities, and Hamas as a functioning entity is a worthy effort.  Frankly, I've never been a fan of regime change objectives but I see no alternative, there is literally no road ahead with Hamas at the helm.

They have turned this into a religious / ideology based event and for them, only the destruction of Israel and building on the rubble will suffice. If they had political objectives they could be negotiated with, they don't though...  religious dogma will prevail until such time as it doesn't. It's an obstacle to be overcome and the question is how do you propose to do that?

The bottom line in this is the Palestinians (meaning the people, not Hamas) can have peace anytime they want it but supporting Hamas is not the venue for achieving it and wishing won't make it so. 

For many there (more than you likely think), wishes are defined as a state of being where they are not, unfortunately, these folks have little influence with the granter of wishes.

 

Edited by Venandi
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Venandi said:

Nothing in my experience causes me to agree with that. It does reinforce my opinion about the elusive nature of solutions though:

The post above was simply my own perspective on the matter (for what that may be worth) and I won't pursue the matter further. I suspect I could write a book on the subject to no avail.

 I am curious what your solution is though. What do you recommend? How would you proceed ? What would you do as King of Israel and why?

If you want to keep Hamas as a governing entity how do you propose to proceed?

Yes, it will certainly take a while to remove an entrenched Hamas ideology, a generation has grown up under it and they will need to see a measure of success to conclude that there is the possibility for more.

IMO though, removing Hamas capabilities, and Hamas as a functioning entity is a worthy effort.  Frankly, I've never been a fan of regime change objectives but I see no alternative, there is literally no road ahead with Hamas at the helm.

They have turned this into a religious / ideology based event and for them, only the destruction of Israel and building on the rubble will suffice. If they had political objectives they could be negotiated with, they don't though...  religious dogma will prevail until such time as it doesn't. It's an obstacle to be overcome and the question is how do you propose to do that?

The bottom line in this is the Palestinians (meaning the people, not Hamas) can have peace anytime they want it but supporting Hamas is not the venue for achieving it and wishing won't make it so. 

For many there (more than you likely think), wishes are defined as a state of being where they are not, unfortunately, these folks have little influence with the granter of wishes.

 

My solution is one country, two nations, but the subject is war crimes and their accomplices. Do you say that there is no war crimes in Gaza?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Unfortunately, your content contains terms that we do not allow. Please edit your content to remove the highlighted words below.
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Tell a friend

    Love Repolitics.com - Political Discussion Forums? Tell a friend!
  • Member Statistics

    • Total Members
      10,750
    • Most Online
      1,403

    Newest Member
    Betsy Smith
    Joined
  • Recent Achievements

    • CrazyCanuck89 earned a badge
      Reacting Well
    • CrazyCanuck89 went up a rank
      Rookie
    • wwef235 earned a badge
      Week One Done
    • phoenyx75 went up a rank
      Apprentice
    • User went up a rank
      Mentor
  • Recently Browsing

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...