herbie Posted July 11, 2023 Report Share Posted July 11, 2023 Turkey has decided to support Sweden's entry to NATO, removing the last obstacle. Russia's f***ed! Almost completely surrounded, sanctioned and hurting. What do you think will happen in Russia now? Also what do you think of Trudeau offering support for Ukraine joining? It can't because of ongoing hostilities make it ineligible, but what about it? That would leave Moldova like Kaliningrad, behind a NATO wall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perspektiv Posted July 11, 2023 Report Share Posted July 11, 2023 36 minutes ago, herbie said: Also what do you think of Trudeau offering support for Ukraine joining? With an occupying adversary inside the country? Foolish at best. Only one way Russia leaves, and that's with dialogue. Attempting to strong arm them, turns it into an out of control blood bath. 37 minutes ago, herbie said: What do you think will happen in Russia now? Understanding Russia, means they double down, and unless a coup occurs which likely would have them be more reckless, I just don't see how this ends positively without negotiations. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbox Posted July 11, 2023 Report Share Posted July 11, 2023 28 minutes ago, Perspektiv said: Understanding Russia, means they double down, and unless a coup occurs which likely would have them be more reckless, I just don't see how this ends positively without negotiations. Russia has nothing to double down with, and they've been threatening to ESCALATE from the start. "Now we're REALLY mad and REALLY going to try to conquer Ukraine." This sort of dimwit take, of course, supposes that Russia wasn't actually trying hard in the first place, and that 95% of their armed forces aren't already committed in Ukraine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herbie Posted July 11, 2023 Author Report Share Posted July 11, 2023 1 hour ago, Perspektiv said: With an occupying adversary inside the country? I clearly stated that very thing makes them ineligible to join. They'd have to settle with Russia first. As for Russia, to double down they'd need to turn their economy into military production. The very reason Putin's beloved Soviet Empire collapsed. Hell, coming home to your one room apartment and having Gramma scream at you hoe she stood in line all day and couldn't get any bread for year had a little to do with that, didn't it. What I rag my local SaveOn manager: Is like shopping at GUM in Soviet Russia! Empty shelves and only high Party officials can afford what is there... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpankyMcFarland Posted July 11, 2023 Report Share Posted July 11, 2023 I don’t think Erdogan’s Turkey belongs in NATO. Hungary looks dodgy too. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perspektiv Posted July 11, 2023 Report Share Posted July 11, 2023 4 hours ago, herbie said: The very reason Putin's beloved Soviet Empire collapsed. His closest allies would not allow for a full collapse, in their support of him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nationalist Posted July 11, 2023 Report Share Posted July 11, 2023 So Turkey has agreed to Sweden in NATO. In return, the Swedes mad the Kurdish based political party a terrorist organization via a constitutional amendment, and gets F-16s from the USA...which they'll use to bomb the hell outta the Kurds. Hungary is still waffling, which holds up NATO entry for now. We'll see what Urban wants for his vote. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbox Posted July 11, 2023 Report Share Posted July 11, 2023 (edited) Orban will fall in line, because Hungary is a speck in NATO and it can't afford to isolate itself from literally all of its neighbours. Regardless, chalk this up as another big win for Putin and his quest to halt NATO encroachment. ?? Edited July 11, 2023 by Moonbox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristides Posted July 11, 2023 Report Share Posted July 11, 2023 3 hours ago, Nationalist said: So Turkey has agreed to Sweden in NATO. In return, the Swedes mad the Kurdish based political party a terrorist organization via a constitutional amendment, and gets F-16s from the USA...which they'll use to bomb the hell outta the Kurds. Hungary is still waffling, which holds up NATO entry for now. We'll see what Urban wants for his vote. Turkey has had F-16's for years, 240 of them. The US refuses to sell them F-35's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nationalist Posted July 11, 2023 Report Share Posted July 11, 2023 3 minutes ago, Aristides said: Turkey has had F-16's for years, 240 of them. The US refuses to sell them F-35's Quote It’s important to remember that Erdogan’s announcement was not approval of the bid; it was a statement of intent to pass the question of approval to the Turkish parliament, which Erdogan’s party controls. Thus he retains the ability to kill or delay accession if Sweden backs off on counterterror implementation, or if the United States reneges on the F-16 deal. So all in all, he has lost no real leverage, but gained a tremendous optic of Turkey supporting the Atlantic Alliance. https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/new-atlanticist/experts-react/experts-react-erdogan-agrees-sweden-nato-accession/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristides Posted July 11, 2023 Report Share Posted July 11, 2023 I don't know what F-16 deal they are referring to, unless it is selling them more or upgrading the 243 they already have. What the US has done is cancel Turkey's order for F-35's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aristides Posted July 11, 2023 Report Share Posted July 11, 2023 Just found it. Turkey wanted to buy 40 more F-16's and put the money already paid for the cancelled F-35's put toward the F-16 purchase. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herbie Posted July 12, 2023 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2023 On 7/11/2023 at 1:28 AM, Perspektiv said: His closest allies would not allow for a full collapse, in their support of him. I was referring to Putin's collapse, not Russia as a whole. Even the USA wouldn't support that. Talk about a scenario for utter chaos! Japan would try to grab the Kuriles back, China Vladivostok, Mongolia... some 1dot like Trump would offer to BUY Siberia... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perspektiv Posted July 12, 2023 Report Share Posted July 12, 2023 51 minutes ago, herbie said: I was referring to Putin's collapse If he goes, am quite confident whoever takes over will be more brutal and ruthless. I think his measured aggression, is far easier to contend with. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
August1991 Posted July 12, 2023 Report Share Posted July 12, 2023 Turkey agrees to Sweden joining NATO - if Turkey joins the EU. ===== Biden -like Putin- is a tough player. Not my kind of leader. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbox Posted July 13, 2023 Report Share Posted July 13, 2023 53 minutes ago, August1991 said: Turkey agrees to Sweden joining NATO - if Turkey joins the EU. That wasn't the deal. Turkey is still not getting into the EU. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
August1991 Posted July 13, 2023 Report Share Posted July 13, 2023 Moonbox, Increasingly I think that Putin and Biden are similar players. In the case of Putin, I understand why. In the case of Biden, I am terrified , Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbox Posted July 13, 2023 Report Share Posted July 13, 2023 47 minutes ago, August1991 said: Moonbox, Increasingly I think that Putin and Biden are similar players. Maybe you could describe those similarities, because it makes no sense to me. 47 minutes ago, August1991 said: In the case of Putin, I understand why. In the case of Biden, I am terrified Biden scary, Putin not scary. Got it. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
August1991 Posted July 13, 2023 Report Share Posted July 13, 2023 14 minutes ago, Moonbox said: Maybe you could describe those similarities, because it makes no sense to me. Biden scary, Putin not scary. Got it. ? Putin, after 2008, realised that he was Lee Kwan Yew. Now he's a scary tbought: Biden knew it before. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
August1991 Posted July 13, 2023 Report Share Posted July 13, 2023 This is a disaster. I have a map of Europe 1912. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbox Posted July 13, 2023 Report Share Posted July 13, 2023 I have a map of Middle-Earth. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nationalist Posted July 13, 2023 Report Share Posted July 13, 2023 On 7/11/2023 at 11:18 AM, Moonbox said: Orban will fall in line, because Hungary is a speck in NATO and it can't afford to isolate itself from literally all of its neighbours. Regardless, chalk this up as another big win for Putin and his quest to halt NATO encroachment. ?? Moonbat...you have an amusingly consistent habit of underestimating things, situations and people. You know nothing about the Hungarian people yet predict they'll cave. The same people who elect Orban over and over again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbox Posted July 13, 2023 Report Share Posted July 13, 2023 26 minutes ago, Nationalist said: Moonbat...you have an amusingly consistent habit of underestimating things, situations and people. You know nothing about the Hungarian people yet predict they'll cave. The same people who elect Orban over and over again. I don't need to know anything about the Hungarian people. I just need to know they had no leverage, and that they've already greenlit Sweden's NATO bid. It seems that, once again, Tucker Carlson and your Youtube/Twitter feeds have failed to properly inform you of reality. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nationalist Posted July 13, 2023 Report Share Posted July 13, 2023 2 minutes ago, Moonbox said: I don't need to know anything about the Hungarian people. I just need to know they had no leverage, and that they've already greenlit Sweden's NATO bid. It seems that, once again, Tucker Carlson and your Youtube/Twitter feeds have failed to properly inform you of reality. ? Haven't watched Carlson in a few days so...you can stop p1ssing your panties over him. We will see what happens. I have a feeling Sweden's tone towards Hungary will have to do an about face before Hungary signs on the dotted line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbox Posted July 13, 2023 Report Share Posted July 13, 2023 33 minutes ago, Nationalist said: Haven't watched Carlson in a few days so...you can stop p1ssing your panties over him. Wow a whole few days! Great job! 33 minutes ago, Nationalist said: We will see what happens. I have a feeling Sweden's tone towards Hungary will have to do an about face before Hungary signs on the dotted line. Yes but your feelings don't really matter, and Hungary's Foreign Minister already agreed days ago to back Sweden's bid. The dotted line is all that's left. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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