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More Voter Suppression efforts by Republicans


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Just now, WestCanMan said:

So, exactly like I said above..... Things that you can get from a phone book.

Do they still require ID?

Nope. And it works. Trump's army of fashy lawyers were unable to find cases of voter fraud.

There were a few cases here and there, of course. No system is perfect. But those were all cases of people illegally voting for Republicans, because duh.

Just now, WestCanMan said:

Less time? Really? Not enough time to get a DL that lasts for 4-5 years? Do they all work 6 jobs? 

The sad thing is a lot of poor people do work two or three jobs. And registering to get an ID usually takes a full day. That's ok if you're doing well, but if you're poor, you can't afford to lose a day's pay.

By the way, even though voter ID laws would be addressing a non-issue, I wouldn't be against them if it was done in a way that wasn't just trying to limit people from voting. If the government just sent every legal resident an ID in order to ensure voting security, I'd be fine with that. I'd be fine with requiring people to have their ID to vote. In theory, it's not a terrible idea. But the way it's being done is just a bad faith attempt at restricting voting, much like all of the other anti-democracy laws the Republicans are trying to do.

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3 minutes ago, Americana Antifa said:

Nope. And it works. Trump's army of fashy lawyers were unable to find cases of voter fraud.

So millions of people showed up to vote with no ID, and then flashy lawyers were unable to find cases of voter fraud. Hmmmmm.

You're so stupid I can't even believe I'm having a conversation with you. 

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Just now, WestCanMan said:

So millions of people showed up to vote with no ID, and then flashy lawyers were unable to find cases of voter fraud. Hmmmmm.

Um... yes?

Don't you think if millions of people voted illegally there'd be like even a trace of evidence?

We have found cases of voter fraud, it is possible, we know it can happen. But the cases were way way too rare to make a difference.

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3 minutes ago, Americana Antifa said:

Um... yes?

Don't you think if millions of people voted illegally there'd be like even a trace of evidence?

We have found cases of voter fraud, it is possible, we know it can happen. But the cases were way way too rare to make a difference.

El faceplant.

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4 minutes ago, Americana Antifa said:

Deflection.

If the cases of voter fraud were anywhere near close enough to affect the outcome, Trump's lawyers would have found evidence. 

There are people who have never voted for the last 50 years. The Dems know who they are. Now all they need is a phone book....

Or some ballots to mail out, "unsolicited".

1) Anyone can get ID. Anyone that's a legal citizen that is. Being black or poor is no excuse, period. 

2) The only thing that Dem voter changes do is make fraud easier.

3) No fraud detected...

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Just now, WestCanMan said:

There are people who have never voted for the last 50 years. The Dems know who they are. Now all they need is a phone book....

Or some ballots to mail out, "unsolicited".

It's funny how this didn't become a talking-point until rather recently. When the Republicans were still able to get majority support, they didn't seem to care about voter ID laws.

Anyway, that's not how it works. In many states if someone hasn't voted for years, they have to reregister. They also have things like signature and witness requirements. Some states even require a photo which they keep to make sure that you're the same person who voted ten years earlier.

Seriously, we have so many laws in place to prevent voter fraud, it's a miracle as many Americans vote as they do.

Just now, WestCanMan said:

1) Anyone can get ID. Anyone that's a legal citizen that is. Being black or poor is no excuse, period. 

Anyone can get an ID, it's physically possible, but it's a lot harder if you're poor. The Republicans know this, that's the point. That's why they're offering no ideas on how to make it easier to get an ID.

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8 minutes ago, Americana Antifa said:

Anyone can get an ID, it's physically possible, but it's a lot harder if you're poor. 

No, it isn't. Not at all. Everyone can get $35 together for an ID. Everyone.

You can get ID in the evening or on a Saturday. Literally anyone can do it. 

Call me a meanie, but I have no sympathy for anyone that lazy/stupid. They actually shouldn't be voting. 

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1 hour ago, WestCanMan said:

No, it isn't. Not at all. Everyone can get $35 together for an ID. Everyone.

You can get ID in the evening or on a Saturday. Literally anyone can do it. 

Call me a meanie, but I have no sympathy for anyone that lazy/stupid. They actually shouldn't be voting. 

Poll taxes ARE ILLEGAL in the US.

Of course IDK where you got the $35 figure.

The problem is that the poor and elderly have a much harder time getting to the DMV or wherever they have to go to get an ID, esp if they have to take off work, and that is what Republicans are counting on to suppress the Democratic vote: statistical discouragement.

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2 hours ago, Americana Antifa said:

You said twice that I was arguing that poor people are too stupid to get an ID even after I clarified that it had nothing to do with intelligence, it's purely about poor people having less time and money.

But it isn't. You really are saying they're too stupid - OR too lazy and just don't care.

And you haven't made your case that somehow all poor people vote democrat.

You lie and you try to twist the truth to your agenda and then you get cranky when you get caught at it.

And if there's no voter fraud - then you won't care about efforts to make sure of it right? Unless there is and you'd like to keep that door open.

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2 minutes ago, robosmith said:

Poll taxes ARE ILLEGAL in the US.

Of course IDK where you got the $35 figure.

The problem is that the poor and elderly have a much harder time getting to the DMV or wherever they have to go to get an ID, esp if they have to take off work, and that is what Republicans are counting on to suppress the Democratic vote: statistical discouragement.

No they don't. IT's as easy for them as anyone else. Just like here in Canada where people need id as well. It's just not complicated.

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49 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

But it isn't. You really are saying they're too stupid - OR too lazy and just don't care.

No, I'm saying if you're poor and work 2 or 3 jobs, you can't afford to take a day off work to stand in line to get an ID.

49 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

And you haven't made your case that somehow all poor people vote democrat.

I didn't say they did. I said black people are more likely to be poor and more likely to vote for Democrats. But I understand fascists have to strawman because they lose on the actual arguments.

49 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

And if there's no voter fraud - then you won't care about efforts to make sure of it right? Unless there is and you'd like to keep that door open.

Like I said earlier, I'd be fine with voter ID laws if the government made getting an ID really easy. If they just mailed one to every registered voter then required them to have their ID to vote, that'd be ok.

But they're not doing that because it's not really about voter integrity. It's just another voter restriction law that Republicans are trying to do.

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This is so stupid. ID is required to vote. That goes for every American citizen. To drop that basic rule, opens elections up to fraud. Anyone who argues otherwise is plain old lying.!

Mailin ballots are an obvious Libbie attempt to make fraud undetectable.

And as for collage polling stations...

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/restoring-america/fairness-justice/northwestern-college-republicans-blocked-funding

https://m.facebook.com/TheFirstonTV/videos/conservatives-attacked-on-campus/634973354023024/

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/restoring-america/faith-freedom-self-reliance/i-was-literally-attacked-for-holding-a-conservative-political-event-on-my-campus

Now...would it a good idea to put polling stations on collage campuses? No. In fact  it would be dangerous.

But you Tweenkies and wannabes scream foul every time election laws curb your...more than obvious attempts to cheat.

Frankly...your efforts in this thread only serve to further prove that your goal is to win by hook or by crook.

But half the nation, or more, sees through your BS and will stand in your way by restoring fairness and honesty. Both of which are completely foreign concepts to you...and your immorality. 

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7 hours ago, Americana Antifa said:

No, I'm saying if you're poor and work 2 or 3 jobs, you can't afford to take a day off work to stand in line to get an ID.

First off sure you can.  It ain't hard.  It's not like you have to do it every week.

Second, the percentage of people who work multiple jobs is tiny:

https://www.census.gov/library/stories/2019/06/about-thirteen-million-united-states-workers-have-more-than-one-job.html

AND many do so not because they're poor but because the want a little extra for something OR they're learning a new skill or trade or the like.

So you're talking less than ONE PERCENT of the population - OF WHICH A SIZABLE HUNK WILL VOTE REPUBLICAN.

You're trying you claim that Republicans are making a major effort to suppress a group of people who are so small that there is NO chance they'll make a difference in an election.

You're a lying sack of socialist.

7 hours ago, Americana Antifa said:

I didn't say they did. I said black people are more likely to be poor and more likely to vote for Democrats. But I understand fascists have to strawman because they lose on the actual arguments.

What you mean is you mean is you understand YOU have to lie to try to make your point. Which means you don't have a very good point.

As noted - in terms of numbers theres MORE poor white people and they're just as likely to vote republican. So your logic makes no sense, they'd hurt themselves more than they'd hurt the democrats.

So, more lies from the left.  Yawn.

7 hours ago, Americana Antifa said:

Like I said earlier, I'd be fine with voter ID laws if the government made getting an ID really easy. If they just mailed one to every registered voter then required them to have their ID to vote, that'd be ok.

So - if it was easy to fake it and get false id so you could still steal votes then you'd be for it.  Gotcha.

As has been noted - ALL of this stuff already exists in Canada  and we have higher voter turn outs than the US on average. So EVERYTHING you're saying we already know is untrue.

7 hours ago, Americana Antifa said:

But they're not doing that because it's not really about voter integrity. It's just another voter restriction law that Republicans are trying to do.

The truth is you and the dems are angry because you know it will hamper illegal voting. And if it's done federally it may become common in the gubernatorial races or even (gasp!) mayoral races etc.

The last thing the dems want is their ace in the hole to vanish.

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1 minute ago, CdnFox said:

First off sure you can.  It ain't hard.  It's not like you have to do it every week.

I really wish schools taught kids what it's like to be poor. Y'all really think that poor people can take off and lose a day's pay. And we're also assuming they don't have kids that might make getting to the DMV even harder.

1 minute ago, CdnFox said:

So you're talking less than ONE PERCENT of the population - OF WHICH A SIZABLE HUNK WILL VOTE REPUBLICAN.

According to your source: Even though the majority of workers held a single job in 2013, 8.3% of workers had more than one job — and most held both jobs for the entire year.

Also, the amount is increasing: https://www.insidehook.com/daily_brief/health-and-fitness/americans-have-more-than-one-job

1 minute ago, CdnFox said:

You're trying you claim that Republicans are making a major effort to suppress a group of people who are so small that there is NO chance they'll make a difference in an election.

You're forgetting that America has the electoral college. If we didn't have that, then you'd be correct, the amount wouldn't be enough to change the outcome. But with our system, which basically rigs every election for the Republicans, an amount that small can easily make a difference in swing states.

1 minute ago, CdnFox said:

As noted - in terms of numbers theres MORE poor white people and they're just as likely to vote republican. So your logic makes no sense, they'd hurt themselves more than they'd hurt the democrats.

No, because poor white people are generally split on who they vote for. Within the white population, it depends more on region. So while voter ID laws would stop some Republican voters, it would stop way more Democrat voters.

1 minute ago, CdnFox said:

So - if it was easy to fake it and get false id so you could still steal votes then you'd be for it.  Gotcha.

This isn't even strawmanning. This is beyond strawmanning. This is like, I don't know, glassmanning.

1 minute ago, CdnFox said:

As has been noted - ALL of this stuff already exists in Canada  and we have higher voter turn outs than the US on average. So EVERYTHING you're saying we already know is untrue.

Ohhhhhh really, now?

https://www.brennancenter.org/our-work/analysis-opinion/three-things-us-could-learn-canadas-election

In Canada, unlike in American states with voter ID laws, voters may prove their identity at the polls using a broad range of 40 forms of ID. The Canadian government has modified this list several times since its creation in 2007, adding documents to allow more eligible voters to cast ballots.. Accepted IDs include driver’s licenses and other types of government-issued ID similar to those required in many U.S. states. But voters in Canada also may identify themselves using student IDs, employee cards, and various forms of non-photo IDs, as long as one of them has a current address. Unlike many U.S. jurisdictions, Canada also allows the use of expired driver’s licenses, which many seniors and others who no longer drive continue to use for identification. The wide range of documents accepted limits the possibility of the ID requirement disenfranchising voters.

By contrast, U.S. voter ID laws are unduly restrictive in ways that can disenfranchise eligible voters. Alabama, for example, accepts only 10 forms of ID. Texas accepts only seven, including a concealed handgun license but not a University of Texas ID, which is available to over 200,000 students. Neither state accepts expired IDs.

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18 minutes ago, Americana Antifa said:

I really wish schools taught kids what it's like to be poor. Y'all really think that poor people can take off and lose a day's pay. And we're also assuming they don't have kids that might make getting to the DMV even harder.

I've been poor. I've missed meals.  Have you? Don't think so - you just like speaking for others.

EVERYONE knows how to juggle that crap. You have to. People working two jobs are doing one full time and one part time. You either juggle the shift on the part time or yo work a deal on the full time with the boss to miss a few hours and make it up.

Only someone who has NEVER been poor would pretend that it's somehow impossible to do this. You have to do it for all KINDS of things.

18 minutes ago, Americana Antifa said:

According to your source: Even though the majority of workers held a single job in 2013, 8.3% of workers had more than one job — and most held both jobs for the entire year.

Yeah.  And not all voters are workers.  So we're talking about a very TINY percent of the population - and THEN not ALL of THEM vote democrat. Close to half will vote republican - same as the rest of the population. So now the net gain by repressing this vote is TINY

 

18 minutes ago, Americana Antifa said:

You're forgetting that America has the electoral college. If we didn't have that, then you'd be correct, the amount wouldn't be enough to change the outcome. But with our system, which basically rigs every election for the Republicans, an amount that small can easily make a difference in swing states.

Nope.  And you're forgetting that we've got the electoral college on steroids in canada, we use a riding system exclusively. So we can look at how these kinds of things affect outcomes evne better.

You're still talking about hundreds of votes in situations that are decided by hundreds of thousands of people.' 

And the idea that the college 'rigs the election' shows a lack of understanding of yoru own gov't system that is horrific and shameful.

18 minutes ago, Americana Antifa said:

No, because poor white people are generally split on who they vote for. Within the white population, it depends more on region. So while voter ID laws would stop some Republican voters, it would stop way more Democrat voters.

Not way more. Sorry. Even in areas that are strongly democrat it's not 'way' more.

lets look at new york - arguably one of the most democrat areas in the country.

https://www.cnn.com/election/2020/results/state/new-york

2020 - where there was a strong dem vote.  Dems got 61 - reps got 38.

So the entire difference between them - and this is about as high as it's possible to get -  is 23 percent.

So.. with people working 2 jobs representing about 1 percent of the population (about 2 percent of the votng population), and assuming you managed to repress ALL OF THEM ENTIRELY, you MIGHT get  0.4 percent OF one percent more votes for the republicans.

Which isn't even a rounding error.

It's a joke. And you're a joke for not knowing how your own system works.

18 minutes ago, Americana Antifa said:

This isn't even strawmanning. This is beyond strawmanning. This is like, I don't know, glassmanning.

Sorry did your word of the day calander fail you? Are you going to need to post a meme?

You got called out for a truth and now you're sputtering mad.  Big shock.

18 minutes ago, Americana Antifa said:

Ohhhhhh really, now?

https://www.brennancenter.org/our-work/analysis-opinion/three-things-us-could-learn-canadas-election

In Canada, unlike in American states with voter ID laws, voters may prove their identity at the polls using a broad range of 40 forms of ID. The Canadian government has modified this list several times since its creation in 2007, adding documents to allow more eligible voters to cast ballots.. Accepted IDs include driver’s licenses and other types of government-issued ID similar to those required in many U.S. states. But voters in Canada also may identify themselves using student IDs, employee cards, and various forms of non-photo IDs, as long as one of them has a current address. Unlike many U.S. jurisdictions, Canada also allows the use of expired driver’s licenses, which many seniors and others who no longer drive continue to use for identification. The wide range of documents accepted limits the possibility of the ID requirement disenfranchising voters.

By contrast, U.S. voter ID laws are unduly restrictive in ways that can disenfranchise eligible voters. Alabama, for example, accepts only 10 forms of ID. Texas accepts only seven, including a concealed handgun license but not a University of Texas ID, which is available to over 200,000 students. Neither state accepts expired IDs.

Yep. Really now.  Turns out none of what was in that article refutes what i said.

Nice try at obfuscating  :)  FAIL!

What the article fails to mention is someo fo that is only true if you're on the voters list - in other words you've confirmed who you are before hand.  And they still have to have a picture on one of the forms of id.

And the dems aren't arguing for MORE id to be recognized, they want NO id to be necessary :)

 

So yes,.. RREEEEEEaeaaaaaaallllly :)

You're such a liar :)

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4 hours ago, CdnFox said:

EVERYONE knows how to juggle that crap. You have to. People working two jobs are doing one full time and one part time. You either juggle the shift on the part time or yo work a deal on the full time with the boss to miss a few hours and make it up.

It's funny how you're arguing that voter ID laws don't make it harder for poor people to vote, while at the same time seem to be acknowledging how difficult it is for a poor person to get to the DMV.

Don't get me wrong, I appreciate you helping to make my point, I just hope you can enjoy the humor here.

4 hours ago, CdnFox said:

Nope.  And you're forgetting that we've got the electoral college on steroids in canada, we use a riding system exclusively. So we can look at how these kinds of things affect outcomes evne better.

Maybe that's why Canada has less strict voter ID laws than the American states that have them. One can only wonder. Though, considering how you lied a lot in your last power, you might be lying about this too.

4 hours ago, CdnFox said:

And the idea that the college 'rigs the election' shows a lack of understanding of yoru own gov't system that is horrific and shameful.

An honest democratic election is simple. One person = one vote. The electoral college is only in place because it helps right-wing candidates. It's the same reason that the District of Columbia isn't a state. The Republicans aren't allowing that because DC is full of black people, which means they'll vote for Democrats. 

4 hours ago, CdnFox said:

Not way more. Sorry. Even in areas that are strongly democrat it's not 'way' more.

lets look at new york - arguably one of the most democrat areas in the country.

https://www.cnn.com/election/2020/results/state/new-york

2020 - where there was a strong dem vote.  Dems got 61 - reps got 38.

Duh. The point is to steal purple states, not blue states. Republicans know the voter ID laws won't make a difference in New York or California.

Here's a better overall view:

Screen_Shot_2021_05_07_at_12.27.09_PM.jp

Republicans target black voters however they can because they know that this 20% matters. Especially in places like Georgia which is becoming a blue state.

And it's not just voter ID laws. This needs to be looked at with all of the other voter restriction laws that target people who are black, poor, or young.

4 hours ago, CdnFox said:

So.. with people working 2 jobs representing about 1 percent of the population

Your own source said it was a little over 8%

4 hours ago, CdnFox said:

So yes,.. RREEEEEEaeaaaaaaallllly :)

So you're just not going to address my link that debunks your claim.

Alright. ?‍♀️

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1 hour ago, Americana Antifa said:

It's funny how you're arguing that voter ID laws don't make it harder for poor people to vote, while at the same time seem to be acknowledging how difficult it is for a poor person to get to the DMV.

It's funny that you're lying about my saying that :)

1 hour ago, Americana Antifa said:

 

Maybe that's why Canada has less strict voter ID laws than the American states that have them. One can only wonder. Though, considering how you lied a lot in your last power, you might be lying about this too.

I guess just pretending that people who prove you wrong were lying is one way to try to cope. Certainly the democrats believe that :)

1 hour ago, Americana Antifa said:

An honest democratic election is simple. One person = one vote.

Nope. That's not really 'honest' at all. That's what's called the 'tyranny of the majority' it's a bad idea. To be honest we've had a problem with that in canada.  True democracy is anything BUT honest - true democracy is two wolves and a sheep voting on whats for dinner.  Which is why we have constitutional democracies, and why it's critical to level the playing field.

1 hour ago, Americana Antifa said:

Republicans target black voters however they can because they know that this 20% matters. Especially in places like Georgia which is becoming a blue state.

You mean half of one percent. We did the math as you'll recall.

1 hour ago, Americana Antifa said:

And it's not just voter ID laws. This needs to be looked at with all of the other voter restriction laws that target people who are black, poor, or young.

Like what? Making them vote in the same place everyone else votes? Having to carry id? All the crap that's already been debunked? Sorry kiddo - anyone who wants to vote can vote.

1 hour ago, Americana Antifa said:

Your own source said it was a little over 8%

Of working people. Not everyone who votes works. Remember you were talking about students and such? :) If you look at the actual numbers there s a LOT of people who AREN'T working. Like retired people for example.

 

1 hour ago, Americana Antifa said:

So you're just not going to address my link that debunks your claim.

It didn't.  At all. And i did address it.  Sorry kiddo :)  Try again :)  

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17 hours ago, Americana Antifa said:

Once again, many poor people have 2 or 3 jobs. You're thinking like a person who doesn't understand poverty in America.

No one who has the work ethic that you're talking about is poor. Especially in this day and age, where the younger generations are basically useless.  

Hard-working employees are more valuable than ever. People who can put their back into it are like gold now. 

Would you like to take 1 guess at why wages are low enough in America that there can even be such a thing as "working poor"? 

It's because of the Democrats' open-door policy at the border. There are literally millions of people who work under the table, undercutting people who need to get paid on the books. Those people also compete for low-rent housing.

If the poor people in the US really are voting for the Dems they're dumb AF.  

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22 hours ago, CdnFox said:

No they don't. IT's as easy for them as anyone else. Just like here in Canada where people need id as well. It's just not complicated.

Having fewer resources mean greater difficulty whether you understand that or not.

I can easily jump in my car and drive to the DMV ANYTIME I want. It would be more difficult for anyone taking a bus, IF THEY HAVE BUS in their town like I do. No bus means an Uber trip or MAYBE a bicycle.

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16 hours ago, Nationalist said:

This is so stupid. ID is required to vote. That goes for every American citizen. To drop that basic rule, opens elections up to fraud. Anyone who argues otherwise is plain old lying.!

Mailin ballots are an obvious Libbie attempt to make fraud undetectable.

And as for collage polling stations...

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/restoring-america/fairness-justice/northwestern-college-republicans-blocked-funding

https://m.facebook.com/TheFirstonTV/videos/conservatives-attacked-on-campus/634973354023024/

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/restoring-america/faith-freedom-self-reliance/i-was-literally-attacked-for-holding-a-conservative-political-event-on-my-campus

Now...would it a good idea to put polling stations on collage campuses? No. In fact  it would be dangerous.

But you Tweenkies and wannabes scream foul every time election laws curb your...more than obvious attempts to cheat.

Frankly...your efforts in this thread only serve to further prove that your goal is to win by hook or by crook.

But half the nation, or more, sees through your BS and will stand in your way by restoring fairness and honesty. Both of which are completely foreign concepts to you...and your immorality. 

Once again, you're IGNORANT about the US. SOME states require ID, but MANY DON'T, like California.

There are OTHER reliable ways to combat voter impersonation fraud and THEY WORK.

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1 hour ago, robosmith said:

Having fewer resources mean greater difficulty whether you understand that or not.

it really doesn't. If a goal is easily achievable then arguing whether it's a tiny bit more difficult or not is pointless.  It's easily in reach for all.

1 hour ago, robosmith said:

I can easily jump in my car and drive to the DMV ANYTIME I want.

Really? Most people work and have to plan that a bit.  But - almost all people figure it out :) It's not hard. If necessary you can even go to one of the ones open on the weekends

1 hour ago, robosmith said:

 

It would be more difficult for anyone taking a bus, IF THEY HAVE BUS in their town like I do.

If they don't i guarantee they have a car or have someone who does close at hand.

1 hour ago, robosmith said:

 

No bus means an Uber trip or MAYBE a bicycle.

Or a friend or taxi or whatever. They're getting groceries, they're buying necessities - they've figured out how to get around long before that point haven't they.

It's really not hard. People do it every single day. In both countries.

Pretending black people aren't smart enough to figure out how to get ID is just kind of comical.  ANd to pretend that black people are the only poor people or that all poor people vote democrat is just delusional.

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6 hours ago, robosmith said:

Once again, you're IGNORANT about the US. SOME states require ID, but MANY DON'T, like California.

There are OTHER reliable ways to combat voter impersonation fraud and THEY WORK.

Like California huh? Bully for California. How's that exodus of people going down there?

You want voter fraud so you Libbies can cheat.!

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On 5/5/2023 at 8:45 PM, WestCanMan said:

No one who has the work ethic that you're talking about is poor.

OMG. This is capitalism brain over 9000.

But this is what the establishment wants, so I guess in that sense, capitalism has succeeded.

The truth is, the amount a job pays is not reflected in how difficult the job is. Wages are kept low so that the rich have a permanent under-class that they can extract labor from.

On 5/5/2023 at 8:45 PM, WestCanMan said:

It's because of the Democrats' open-door policy at the border. There are literally millions of people who work under the table, undercutting people who need to get paid on the books. Those people also compete for low-rent housing.

First of all, the border isn't open, no matter how many times Fox says it is.

Secondly, the two parties are pretty much the same when it comes to immigration. That's why immigration has been consistently increasing regardless of who the president is.

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