Please sign this Canada e-petition (sanction against key officials of HK government and police force)

[egghead]

HK people need our help 

Quote

https://petitions.ourcommons.ca/en/Petition/Details?Petition=e-2268&fbclid=IwAR2nY8iy_x_D-q2MP9MLFFI9oUInn6sY_8pAYJzg6jaIcFXe8M0oowr_B_c

Petition to the Government of Canada
Whereas:

On July 17, 2019, the European Parliament adopted a resolution on the situation in Hong Kong, calling for “appropriate export control mechanisms” on technologies that could be used to violate human rights;

Since June 12, 2019, the Hong Kong Police has been using excessive force against protestors and journalists. Many incidents were reported regarding firing tear gas directly into the crowd, and shooting protesters and journalists in their heads;

On July 21, 2019, hundreds of triad members dressed in white attacked commuters and protesters in a metro station, which leaving 45 people hospitalized. The HK police had deliberately turned a blind eye to prevent the bloodshed. Later in that evening, only two men were arrested for unlawful assembly;

The safety of approximately 300,000 Canadian residing in HK is at great risk due to the escalating situation between protestors and HK government.

We, the undersigned, Citizens of Canada, call upon the Government of Canada to

1) Impose appropriate export control to deny access to technologies that could be used to violate human rights.
2) Urge HK government to completely withdraw the controversial extradition bill, and express serious concern on the deteriorating freedom of press, speech and rule of law.
3) Ban and/or sanction key officials of HK government and police force who are responsible for human rights violation and corruption as per the Justice for the Victims of Corrupt Foreign Officials Act.

 

[Dougie93]

I don't think the powers that be in this land, which is narrowly vested entrenched interests, are at all eager to throw themselves in front of HK, moreover, since the Chinese can pummel the shit out of Canada and there's not much Canada can do to strike back, the Government is unlikely to go do more than just blah, blah, blah here, calling a superpower out for a fight, is the big leagues, which is not the league Canada is in.

Edited August 19, 2019 by Dougie93

[Dougie93]

Also bear in mind that the Americans are not likely to jump to Canada's defence, at least not right away, Washington would like to see China pummel the shit out of Canada for awhile, just to teach Canada the lesson of what its like to be in No Man's Land without Washington backing you up.

Washington would like to see Canada come begging on hands and knees to be saved from the Chinese, and Washington would demand concessions in return.

If there was an actual military threat, the Americans would step in, but China doesn't need to use its military to pummel the shit out of Canada.

It is Canada which has actively hitched its economic wagon to China, so now China is one of the entrenched interests in Canada, the Americans are bound by treaty to defend you from a shooting war, but they're not bound to defend you from economic war,  in fact its in their interests, they can profit from it, Canada becoming persona non grata with the Chinese will drive firms out of Canada to the USA to seek the protection of Washington, last safe haven, Flight to Quality.

Edited August 19, 2019 by Dougie93

[Dougie93]

And this is why I am not invested in Canada, other than my property, which I claim for the House of Windsor, I don't want to be hitched to this la la land banana republic as it bumbles into no man's land between superpowers, no thanks, United Kingdom - United States Security Agreement, f*ck Canada, Canada is a rogue state.

To the Hong Kong Chinese, I say get out now, he is Stalin, get out before they slam the Bamboo Curtian down around you.

Come to Canada, claim some property in the name of the House of Windsor, help us claim this land back from the Canadian commies, and invest in America, Flight to Quality.

Edited August 19, 2019 by Dougie93

[QuebecOverCanada]

I wholeheartedly support the demonstrations in Hong Kong against the Communist regime.

But I won't sign the petition. First off, it's - by it I mean the petition- going to be used by the Communist Party as an example of outsiders interference in Hong Kong, and that the riots and peaceful demonstrations were orchestrated by the West. Secondly, it's counter-productive to give our name to a petition of this kind. It won't do a damn difference for Beijing that we sign this petition. It also may bar you from entry to China, or get you arrested when you land in mainland China. So think before signing the petition.

 

[Dougie93]

I support them, but it's doomed, Xi JinStalin is taking names and making lists, they can't win, there is no nuclear deterrent, so for the sake of their children, leave now, or cease protesting, the PRC is a vengeful lord, save yourselves, one way or the other.

Even if they manage to gain concessions, they are not real, Stalin honors no deals, the Communists will be back later, and when they come, they will come with a vengeance, these Communist elites in Beijing are evil.

Never mind the Orwellian Panopticon, these people will have you executed on false charges, then sell your organs to the rich.

Edited August 19, 2019 by Dougie93

[OftenWrong]

My signature would be almost as useless as any virtue-signalling tweets sent from Christa Freeland or PM Trudeau directly to Chinese President Xi Jinping.
Almost.

[Dougie93]

I am prepared to nuke Beijing into the stone age as necessary, but that wouldn't save one freedom fighter in HK, there is no nuclear deterrent here, and that's the only thing that keeps this monster at bay, Hong Kong is outside the wire, we can't save them, all we can do is encourage them to save themselves, by fleeing to the protection of UKUSSA and the Anglo-American strategic deterrent.

[Yzermandius19]

5 hours ago, Dougie93 said:

I support them, but it's doomed, Xi JinStalin is taking names and making lists, they can't win, there is no nuclear deterrent, so for the sake of their children, leave now, or cease protesting, the PRC is a vengeful lord, save yourselves, one way or the other.

Even if they manage to gain concessions, they are not real, Stalin honors no deals, the Communists will be back later, and when they come, they will come with a vengeance, these Communist elites in Beijing are evil.

Never mind the Orwellian Panopticon, these people will have you executed on false charges, then sell your organs to the rich.

Well, at least the Taiwanese offered them asylum, would be nice if Canada got on that bandwagon sooner rather than later.

Edited August 20, 2019 by Yzermandius19

[Dougie93]

51 minutes ago, Yzermandius19 said:

Well, at least the Taiwanese offered them asylum, would be nice if Canada got on that bandwagon sooner rather than later.

I don't think that many will flee, people tend to hope for the best and so wait until it is too late, frogs in slowly boiling water, hence why Stalin is moving surely, but slowly.

[Yzermandius19]

Just now, Dougie93 said:

I don't think that many will flee, people tend to hope for the best and so wait until it is too late, frogs in slowly boiling water, hence why Stalin is moving surely, but slowly.

Yeah, it's unfortunate that most won't flee until it's too late, but a concerted effort should be made to encourage as many to flee as possible and that Ontario takes as many who do flee as they can. 

[Dougie93]

2 minutes ago, Yzermandius19 said:

Yeah, it's unfortunate that most won't flee until it's too late, but a concerted effort should be made to encourage as many to flee as possible and that Ontario takes as many who do flee as they can. 

The mistake people are making is based on the myth that Beijing is not the Communists anymore and so Stalin cares about saving Milton Friedman's Hong Kong because he needs it.

This is a fundamental misjudgement of both the Communists and Stalin.

[Yzermandius19]

Just now, Dougie93 said:

The mistake people are making is based on the myth that Beijing is not the Communists anymore and so Stalin cares about saving Milton Friedman's Hong Kong because he needs it.

This is a fundamental misjudgement of both the Communists and Stalin.

Some people learned nothing from Tiananmen Square. It's like I always say, wishful thinking is a helluva drug.

[OftenWrong]

2 minutes ago, Yzermandius19 said:

Yeah, it's unfortunate that most won't flee until it's too late, but a concerted effort should be made to encourage as many to flee as possible and that Ontario takes as many who do flee as they can. 

Many do not want to flee. Actually many support the Chinese government on this. I spoke to a chinese guy at my work the other day about it. I asked him what was going on in Hong Kong. I couldn't really understand what he said though. Pretty sure he said he doesn't agree with the protesters in HK. He thinks they are being ridiculous and extreme. From what I gather, he downplayed the issue of deportation of criminals to mainland China as not very important. I thought this was an interesting view as he is a young person probably about 25 y.o. But most of the Chinese I have met are highly conservative.

[Yzermandius19]

4 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

Many do not want to flee. Actually many support the Chinese government on this. I spoke to a chinese guy at my work the other day about it. I asked him what was going on in Hong Kong. I couldn't really understand what he said though. Pretty sure he said he doesn't agree with the protesters in HK. He thinks they are being ridiculous and extreme. From what I gather, he downplayed the issue of deportation of criminals to mainland China as not very important. I thought this was an interesting view as he is a young person probably about 25 y.o. But most of the Chinese I have met are highly conservative.

Many do not want to flee, and some are useful idiots who side with the Chicoms. It's unfortunate.

If anyone is ridiculous and extreme though, it's the Chicoms, not the protesters, the useful idiots should be careful what they wish for. Deportation of criminals to China is a big deal, downplaying that is asinine.

Edited August 20, 2019 by Yzermandius19

[Dougie93]

11 minutes ago, Yzermandius19 said:

Some people learned nothing from Tiananmen Square. It's like I always say, wishful thinking is a helluva drug.

They also mistake the centrally planned state run economy with a Potemkin Village facade of private business as being "capitalism", when it's still the same old same old Communist dictatorship, with some front "companies" propped up on display.

The Chinese Communists simply learned from the mistakes of the Soviet Communists, and adapted.

But it's not really the capitalist free market, that part is what the Soviets called Maskirovka.

Edited August 20, 2019 by Dougie93

[Yzermandius19]

2 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

They also mistake the centrally planned state run economy with a Potemkin Village facade of private business as being "capitalism", when it's still the same old same old Communist dictatorship, with some front "companies" propped up on display.

 

 

They sure do. Even Fukuyama doesn't believe in the End of History anymore, guess they didn't get the memo.

[Dougie93]

6 minutes ago, Yzermandius19 said:

They sure do. Even Fukuyama doesn't believe in the End of History anymore, guess they didn't get the memo.

Interestingly, Trump got the memo, but he rejected its conclusions, years ago,  Trump has, for years, been saying that while America has been thinking they have been doing business, what has actually been happening is a war and the Chinese have been winning.   And lo and behold when Ohio came to the same conclusion, presto; President Trump.

Edited August 20, 2019 by Dougie93

[Yzermandius19]

8 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

Interestingly, Trump got the memo, but he rejected its conclusions, years ago,  Trump has, for years, been saying tha  while America has been thinking they have been doing business, what has actually been happening is a war and the Chinese have been winning.   And lo and behold when Ohio came to the same conclusion, presto; President Trump.

Not that hard to come to that conclusion, simply look at the disparity between American tariffs on Chinese products, and Chinese tariffs on American products, also the restrictions on Chinese foreign investment in America, and the restrictions on American foreign investment in China, and it becomes pretty clear that one side is doing business with the other, and the other side wouldn't know what reciprocity or a free market was if it slapped them in the face.

Edited August 20, 2019 by Yzermandius19

[Dougie93]

8 minutes ago, Yzermandius19 said:

Not that hard to come to that conclusion, simply look at the disparity between American tariffs on Chinese products, and Chinese tariffs on American products, and it becomes pretty clear that one side is doing business with the other, and the other side wouldn't know what reciprocity was if it slapped them in the face.

People still viewed it as the Chinese becoming capitalists, when in fact the Communists were simply massing their might for war, it's Detente all over again, the real purpose of Detente being to close the gap with the Americans after the failure in Cuba.

Now that Stalin has taken over, you can see that they are not so concerned about maintaining the facade that they are all business, the fangs are coming out now, because things were starting to liberalize in China, little too much for the tastes of the Communists who are still running the place, so now it's being reined in.

Edited August 20, 2019 by Dougie93

[SpankyMcFarland]

8 hours ago, QuebecOverCanada said:

I wholeheartedly support the demonstrations in Hong Kong against the Communist regime.

But I won't sign the petition. First off, it's - by it I mean the petition- going to be used by the Communist Party as an example of outsiders interference in Hong Kong, and that the riots and peaceful demonstrations were orchestrated by the West. Secondly, it's counter-productive to give our name to a petition of this kind. It won't do a damn difference for Beijing that we sign this petition. It also may bar you from entry to China, or get you arrested when you land in mainland China. So think before signing the petition.

 

I’m tempted to sign it myself but I would advise younger people to be cautious. China’s influence is spreading across the world. Years down the road, you could find yourself in trouble in some developing country that has signed itself over to the PRC. Lord knows what even Canada will look like by then 

[egghead]

3 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

Interestingly, Trump got the memo, but he rejected its conclusions, years ago,  Trump has, for years, been saying that while America has been thinking they have been doing business, what has actually been happening is a war and the Chinese have been winning.   And lo and behold when Ohio came to the same conclusion, presto; President Trump.

China creates the Belt and Road with AIIIB and Obama answers it with a weak CPTPP. Don't know, US usually wins the trade war at the end (Mexico, Asian countries ...). May be US runs out of luck this time.

 

[Yzermandius19]

8 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

People still viewed it as the Chinese becoming capitalists, when in fact the Communists were simply massing their might for war, it's Detente all over again, the real purpose of Detente being to close the gap with the Americans after the failure in Cuba.

Now that Stalin has taken over, you can see that they are not so concerned about maintaining the facade that they are all business, the fangs are coming out now, because things were starting to liberalize in China, little too much for the tastes of the Communists who still running the place, so now it's being reined in.

The Commies simply got better at PR, but they are still Commies.

[Dougie93]

6 minutes ago, egghead said:

China creates the Belt and Road with AIIIB and Obama answers it with a weak CPTPP. Don't know, US usually wins the trade war at the end (Mexico, Asian countries ...). May be US runs out of luck this time.

No, because the Communists were never liberalizing and they did not become capitalists.

They need money and technology for the PLA so they could close the gap with the US military.

The Communists were never worried about the masses overthrowing them because the masses were too poor, because that never happens.

The Communists know that revolutions happen when the masses get a taste of freedom and those revolutions are led by elites like the Jacobins.

So now that they have closed the gap with the Americans to the point where the Americans are deterred,  Stalin is back and he's killed off the Jacobins and he's cracking down on the masses.

This may someday lead to a shooting war with the Americans, but the Chinese can't beat them economically, because there will never be a Flight to Quality to Communist Beijing.

Edited August 20, 2019 by Dougie93

[egghead]

8 hours ago, QuebecOverCanada said:

I wholeheartedly support the demonstrations in Hong Kong against the Communist regime.

But I won't sign the petition. First off, it's - by it I mean the petition- going to be used by the Communist Party as an example of outsiders interference in Hong Kong, and that the riots and peaceful demonstrations were orchestrated by the West. Secondly, it's counter-productive to give our name to a petition of this kind. It won't do a damn difference for Beijing that we sign this petition. It also may bar you from entry to China, or get you arrested when you land in mainland China. So think before signing the petition.

 

 

7 minutes ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

I’m tempted to sign it myself but I would advise younger people to be cautious. China’s influence is spreading across the world. Years down the road, you could find yourself in trouble in some developing country that has signed itself over to the PRC. Lord knows what even Canada will look like by then 

(1) and (3) has nothing to do with HK gov't . You believe you will safe if you don't provoke China. It is "too young, too simple, sometimes naive"