eyeball Posted May 13, 2018 Report Share Posted May 13, 2018 28 minutes ago, Army Guy said: This is one of Justin's Campaign promises, to try and get our nation a temporary seat on the UN council. Canadians will remember the election, anyone but Harper election.... This is the path that the liberals chose to get this seat, remember his speech to the UN council and to Canadians he was going to rebrand DND's image from war fighters to "peace keepers" by investing Canadian soldiers and equipment in UN peacekeeping missions. See the massive list of UN failures around the globe.... The answer to your question is very little, other than perhaps a seat on the UN council, which offers very little really. However one would think we as a G-8 nation, with all our resources, including financial and material could afford to help around the world, without any undo hardship... unless your suggesting we should remain within our borders and close our eyes to problems outside borders and say fuck the rest of the world ?....pretty sure that is not a typical Canadian value let alone a liberal value, nor NDP or green party for that matter..... No, we should say fuck the UN security council, the biggest gang of shit disturbers in the known galaxy, and encourage others like ourselves to stop dealing with them. I'm quite certain it will comfort you to know that Justin would be as appalled as you at the suggestion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted May 14, 2018 Report Share Posted May 14, 2018 If you had read my post, you would see i agree with you, most likely for different reasons i 'm sure, but i think the UN is over rated, a waste of time and money, that does not produce anything of substance, on most topics.... I don't think Justin would be appalled, like all the rest of his promises they were" votes" , i mean has he kept any promises todate......they were not because it was good or beneficial for the country, because most liberals eat that UN shit up...they like the idea of our military being neutered, posing no threat to anyone....handing out blankets and teddy bears.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted May 14, 2018 Report Share Posted May 14, 2018 3 hours ago, Army Guy said: ...the UN is over rated, a waste of time and money... Affording a veto to shit-disturbers will do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted May 14, 2018 Report Share Posted May 14, 2018 15 hours ago, Army Guy said: This is one of Justin's Campaign promises, to try and get our nation a temporary seat on the UN council. Canadians will remember the election, anyone but Harper election.... This is the path that the liberals chose to get this seat, remember his speech to the UN council and to Canadians he was going to rebrand DND's image from war fighters to "peace keepers" by investing Canadian soldiers and equipment in UN peacekeeping missions. See the massive list of UN failures around the globe.... The answer to your question is very little, other than perhaps a seat on the UN council, which offers very little really. However one would think we as a G-8 nation, with all our resources, including financial and material could afford to help around the world, without any undo hardship... unless your suggesting we should remain within our borders and close our eyes to problems outside borders and say fuck the rest of the world ?....pretty sure that is not a typical Canadian value let alone a liberal value, nor NDP or green party for that matter..... I am not saying fuck the rest of the world. We've been dragged into conflicts due to international obligations, and none of that has really helped us here, in fact it may have hurt us more in the long run. But as I said, we will be there for way more than a year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted May 14, 2018 Report Share Posted May 14, 2018 Gosthacked. Then what are you trying to say, If we can't help out with a UN mandate, we can't help out with a NATO mandate, we can't help out if there is oil or resources to be had, then where does Canada fit in where can it help. We have obligations from all the defensive pacts we have sighed onto, these defensive pacts allows Canada to cheap out on defensive spending. getting dragged into all these conflicts is the price we pay for being so cheap....If we decided to cut all these strings Canada would have to pay for it's own defenses, and they would be hit with more than a 2 % of GDP bill... If we opted out of thee arrangements and paid our own way for security, and sovereignty we could also decide which of these world problems we wanted to assist in. we can't have both.. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted May 14, 2018 Report Share Posted May 14, 2018 1 hour ago, Army Guy said: Gosthacked. Then what are you trying to say, If we can't help out with a UN mandate, we can't help out with a NATO mandate, we can't help out if there is oil or resources to be had, then where does Canada fit in where can it help. We have obligations from all the defensive pacts we have sighed onto, these defensive pacts allows Canada to cheap out on defensive spending. getting dragged into all these conflicts is the price we pay for being so cheap....If we decided to cut all these strings Canada would have to pay for it's own defenses, and they would be hit with more than a 2 % of GDP bill... If we opted out of thee arrangements and paid our own way for security, and sovereignty we could also decide which of these world problems we wanted to assist in. we can't have both.. We need to follow our own mandate. And as to the spending on the military, I said just that in another thread and you raked me over the coals for it saying I was wrong and had no idea what I was talking about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted May 15, 2018 Report Share Posted May 15, 2018 9 hours ago, Army Guy said: If we can't help out with a UN mandate, we can't help out with a NATO mandate, we can't help out if there is oil or resources to be had, then where does Canada fit in where can it help. The most effective thing Canada could do to help the planet is to speak truth to power in the UN, stop dealing with dictators and start applying trade sanctions and with-hold resources from allies that refuse to get with the program. Our grandparents devoted some 25% of their GDP fighting tyranny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted May 15, 2018 Report Share Posted May 15, 2018 (edited) 6 hours ago, eyeball said: The most effective thing Canada could do to help the planet is to speak truth to power in the UN, stop dealing with dictators and start applying trade sanctions and with-hold resources from allies that refuse to get with the program. Our grandparents devoted some 25% of their GDP fighting tyranny. Until that happens, we are part of the problem (meaning Canada). But even you note that the UN is useless, so I am confused as to why you would entertain engaging them in any way. Even we love tyranny by supplying weapons to Saudi Arabia. We might as well sell weapons to Iran to make things even. It's been done before where western nations supported both opposing sides with arms or some other equipment/materials. Edited May 15, 2018 by GostHacked Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted May 15, 2018 Report Share Posted May 15, 2018 The UN, like government, is a good idea even if it sucks in practice. I'm more inclined towards anarchy and the creative destruction of our stupid civilisation but I do like to retain a shred of hope for sanity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PIK Posted May 15, 2018 Author Report Share Posted May 15, 2018 11 hours ago, eyeball said: The most effective thing Canada could do to help the planet is to speak truth to power in the UN, stop dealing with dictators and start applying trade sanctions and with-hold resources from allies that refuse to get with the program. Our grandparents devoted some 25% of their GDP fighting tyranny. Get rid of the dictators that run the UN. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxme Posted May 15, 2018 Report Share Posted May 15, 2018 13 hours ago, eyeball said: The most effective thing Canada could do to help the planet is to speak truth to power in the UN, stop dealing with dictators and start applying trade sanctions and with-hold resources from allies that refuse to get with the program. Our grandparents devoted some 25% of their GDP fighting tyranny. Canada has been dealing with dictators for decades starting with papa Trudeau and now his kid does the same thing. And tyranny around the world still exists. Where or what happened to that 25% and probably more today go to help fight tyranny? In some dictators pockets? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxme Posted May 15, 2018 Report Share Posted May 15, 2018 1 hour ago, PIK said: Get rid of the dictators that run the UN. The whole bloody world is full of dictators. They call them politicians. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted May 15, 2018 Report Share Posted May 15, 2018 6 hours ago, PIK said: Get rid of the dictators that run the UN. What about the dictators and their democratic freedom loving allies on the security council, you know, the ones setting the bad example the rest follow? PIK, is there any reason whatsoever to believe you still wouldn't be complaining and calling Canada a laughing stock if we placed virtue above the power games the real assholes at the UN play? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted May 15, 2018 Report Share Posted May 15, 2018 4 hours ago, taxme said: Where or what happened to that 25%... We helped defeat Hitler with it. Then we threw it all away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PIK Posted May 16, 2018 Author Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 (edited) 19 hours ago, eyeball said: What about the dictators and their democratic freedom loving allies on the security council, you know, the ones setting the bad example the rest follow? PIK, is there any reason whatsoever to believe you still wouldn't be complaining and calling Canada a laughing stock if we placed virtue above the power games the real assholes at the UN play? You mean the council that trudeau wants to get on by selling out our country? The same one that is run by dictators? And the UN is not the pearson UN, it is corrupted by dictators. Edited May 16, 2018 by PIK 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PIK Posted May 16, 2018 Author Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 On 5/15/2018 at 3:02 PM, taxme said: Canada has been dealing with dictators for decades starting with papa Trudeau and now his kid does the same thing. And tyranny around the world still exists. Where or what happened to that 25% and probably more today go to help fight tyranny? In some dictators pockets? Actually the world is a safer place , more than ever. Now it is time to civilized the M.E. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxme Posted May 16, 2018 Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 (edited) 19 hours ago, eyeball said: We helped defeat Hitler with it. Then we threw it all away. We helped defeat Japan also which most people seem to want to ignore for some reason and never bring up. I guess for multicultural reasons we are not suppose to bring that up. It may appear to be a racist thing to say. Just saying. Indeed. Our politicians certainly know how to throw tax dollars away alright. Hundreds of billions down the drain every year. Just think if we had back all those tax dollars that our dear leaders have blown maybe we could all be filthy rich. Just a thought. Edited May 16, 2018 by taxme Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxme Posted May 16, 2018 Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 14 minutes ago, PIK said: Actually the world is a safer place , more than ever. Now it is time to civilized the M.E. Good luck on that one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted May 16, 2018 Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 On 5/14/2018 at 6:56 PM, GostHacked said: We need to follow our own mandate. And as to the spending on the military, I said just that in another thread and you raked me over the coals for it saying I was wrong and had no idea what I was talking about. I'm sorry, i did articulate my idea well enough. Today Canada as a nation belongs to several defensive pacts, Norad, NATO, ABCANZ,(America, Britain, Australia, Canada, New Zealand), plus a separate North American treaty with the US, and Mexico. all of them have rules and caveats, all of them have one common thread that the US does most of the lifting and expenditures. They allow Canada to spend just over 1% of GDP on defense, even though NATO has said membership should spend a minimum of 2 % on defense ,we just ignore that and shrug maybe next year....we have big plans though, according to our PM, NATO just smiles and grins but when they talk to the media, it is Canada they refer to as being cheap, or taking advantage of the rest of NATO Yes, there are other nations on that list as well....... just over 1% of GDP is a ridiculously low expenditure for a nation with the largest coast line in the world , even when we count in Coast guard ves, we fall extremely short of means to just patrol it.... i mean we are a G-8 nation, we are approaching a 40 million in population, Most of our military expenditures goes to wages, very little goes into new equipment purchases, every year we loss capabilities due to obsolete equipment .....Canada ranks number 2 in the entire world for the highest paid military...second only to Australia, who has approx. the same stats as Canada but when we look at their military there is NO comparison....and it is growing stronger everyday...Their actions proves it can be down, over time, you just need the will, oh did i mention funding. If Canada was to withdrawal from all this pacts and go it's own way , make it's own mandates , the cost of defense would require much more than 2 % GDP. that's not me talking that is Canadian defense dept along with other high ranking NATO members who have contemplated the same thing. If we continue to under fund our military there will come a point where it will be to broken to fix....the bill will not be affordable....And while some Canadians can not wait for that day....they do not know what the consequences are going to be, loss of sovereignty, is just the tip of the ice burg.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted May 16, 2018 Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 On 5/15/2018 at 9:00 AM, GostHacked said: Until that happens, we are part of the problem (meaning Canada). But even you note that the UN is useless, so I am confused as to why you would entertain engaging them in any way. Even we love tyranny by supplying weapons to Saudi Arabia. We might as well sell weapons to Iran to make things even. It's been done before where western nations supported both opposing sides with arms or some other equipment/materials. Selling Wpns to Saudi Arabia just confirmed that money does make the world go round, and regardless of liberal values , enough money changes everything... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted May 16, 2018 Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 On 5/15/2018 at 2:46 AM, eyeball said: The most effective thing Canada could do to help the planet is to speak truth to power in the UN, stop dealing with dictators and start applying trade sanctions and with-hold resources from allies that refuse to get with the program. Our grandparents devoted some 25% of their GDP fighting tyranny. We Can not even get our government to speak the truth to it's own citizens....let alone to the UN...I wonder how the US would react TO TRADE SANCTIONS..I think we depend more on them than they do on us....tariffs on softwood, and we almost lost our minds....revamping NAFTA and our heads almost exploded... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted May 16, 2018 Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 2 hours ago, PIK said: You mean the council that trudeau wants to get on by selling out our country? The same one that is run by dictators? And the UN is not the pearson UN, it is corrupted by dictators. Yes that's the council I mean alright. Quit making excuses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted May 16, 2018 Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, taxme said: We helped defeat Japan also which most people seem to want to ignore for some reason and never bring up. I guess for multicultural reasons we are not suppose to bring that up. It may appear to be a racist thing to say. Just saying. Racism has fuck all to do with anything.. Quit making excuses. Edited May 16, 2018 by eyeball Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted May 16, 2018 Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 1 hour ago, Army Guy said: We Can not even get our government to speak the truth to it's own citizens....let alone to the UN...I wonder how the US would react TO TRADE SANCTIONS..I think we depend more on them than they do on us....tariffs on softwood, and we almost lost our minds....revamping NAFTA and our heads almost exploded... Quit making excuses. Your grandparents should be ashamed of you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted May 16, 2018 Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 3 minutes ago, eyeball said: Quit making excuses. Your grandparents should be ashamed of you. Wrong....grandparents are very proud. Go find out what Canadian pension plans are invested in.....no excuses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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