dialamah Posted June 24, 2017 Report Posted June 24, 2017 16 minutes ago, CITIZEN_2015 said: If you read my post which you quoted I did say that if they serve Canada then in spite of covering their head they should be allowed in. Please do not compare head turban with hijab. The head turban is a CHOICE. Many wear that and still do by choice after they come here. They are educated and successful. Hijab is FORCED and represents symbol of oppression. So the women who choose to wear the niqab or hijab in Canada don't exist or can't be accommodated because there are women who are forced to wear it? Is that what you are saying? Quote
CITIZEN_2015 Posted June 24, 2017 Report Posted June 24, 2017 (edited) They do exist. A tiny minority of Muslim women wear niqab and a minority the hijab either by own choice or family and cultural pressure. Whether they realize it or not they represent a symbol of women's oppression. Whether they can be allowed to immigrate as I said I don't understand why they wish to come to a country where it is totally alien to them and be stared at and likely insulted too. Though if they wish to come here again they have to qualify like other immigrants based on education, wealth adaptability and contributions they are anticipated to make. If they do quallify then they cannot be rejected based on cover alone. Edited June 24, 2017 by CITIZEN_2015 Quote
Argus Posted June 24, 2017 Report Posted June 24, 2017 3 hours ago, bcsapper said: I did say, meets all the requirements. If they don't, the head covering is moot. The requirements should most definitely include something on the order of 'best cultural fit with Canadian values'. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted June 24, 2017 Report Posted June 24, 2017 2 hours ago, dialamah said: How is the choice of "head covering" not serving Canada? Consider all the people who wear turbans; they seem to be pretty damn successful economically and politically. According to Canada immigration, Indians, after Europeans, are the most economically successful group among our source countries. People from the middle east are the LEAST economically successful. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted June 24, 2017 Report Posted June 24, 2017 24 minutes ago, CITIZEN_2015 said: They do exist. A tiny minority of Muslim women wear niqab and a minority the hijab either by own choice or family and cultural pressure Actually, according to the most recent polls, the majority of Muslim women in Canada now wear either the niquab or the hijab. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Omni Posted June 24, 2017 Report Posted June 24, 2017 7 minutes ago, Argus said: Actually, according to the most recent polls, the majority of Muslim women in Canada now wear either the niquab or the hijab. What "polls" would that be (you do quote some dubious sources), and was the question asked whether or not they do so by choice? Quote
CITIZEN_2015 Posted June 24, 2017 Report Posted June 24, 2017 (edited) 49 minutes ago, Argus said: Actually, according to the most recent polls, the majority of Muslim women in Canada now wear either the niquab or the hijab. All these decades in Canada I have never come across anyone who wears neqap (if that is what I think it is like a mask covering the face and only two eyes are out. Very scary). But yes I see an increasing number of hijab wearing women. What I say is that there are also a large number of Muslim women mainly from Iran, Turkey, Lebanon, Morocco, Bosnia, Tunisia who don't but we never know they are Muslims. That said I don't have a number as how many wear and how many don't wear hijab. Edited June 24, 2017 by CITIZEN_2015 Quote
Argus Posted June 24, 2017 Report Posted June 24, 2017 (edited) 13 minutes ago, CITIZEN_2015 said: All these decades in Canada I have never come across anyone who wears neqap (if that is what I think it is like a mask covering the face and only two eyes are out. Very scary). But yes I see an increasing number of hijab wearing women. What I say is that there are also a large number of Muslim women mainly from Iran, Turkey, Lebanon, Morocco, Bosnia, Tunisia who don't but we never know they are Muslims. That said I don't have a number as how many wear and how many don't wear hijab. According to Environics over half of Muslim women now wear head coverings. Head coverings worn by Muslim women have been a flash point in western countries including Canada. Some non-Muslims view this practice as an indication of religious subjugation of women, and others have been offended by the niqab because it covers the face except for the eyes. Despite such controversy the practice of wearing head coverings is widespread and growing in Canada. More than half (53%) of Muslim women surveyed say they wear a hijab, chador or niqab in public, with this proportion up from 42 percent in 2006. Most wear the hijab (48%, up 10 points since 2006), with comparatively fewer wearing the chador (3%, unchanged) or niqab (3%, up 2). http://www.environicsinstitute.org/uploads/institute-projects/survey of muslims in canada 2016 - final report.pdf Edited June 24, 2017 by Argus Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
dialamah Posted June 24, 2017 Report Posted June 24, 2017 21 minutes ago, Argus said: According to Environics over half of Muslim women now wear head coverings. Head coverings worn by Muslim women have been a flash point in western countries including Canada. Some non-Muslims view this practice as an indication of religious subjugation of women, and others have been offended by the niqab because it covers the face except for the eyes. Despite such controversy the practice of wearing head coverings is widespread and growing in Canada. More than half (53%) of Muslim women surveyed say they wear a hijab, chador or niqab in public, with this proportion up from 42 percent in 2006. Most wear the hijab (48%, up 10 points since 2006), with comparatively fewer wearing the chador (3%, unchanged) or niqab (3%, up 2). http://www.environicsinstitute.org/uploads/institute-projects/survey of muslims in canada 2016 - final report.pdf Isn't this the same report that has a higher percentage of Muslims claiming pride in Canada than do non-Muslim Canadians? And isn't that the part of the survey that you claim Muslims are lying about, since as far as you are concerned a woman can't both wear a head-covering and be proud to be Canadian. Quote
Argus Posted June 25, 2017 Report Posted June 25, 2017 (edited) 21 hours ago, dialamah said: Isn't this the same report that has a higher percentage of Muslims claiming pride in Canada than do non-Muslim Canadians? And isn't that the part of the survey that you claim Muslims are lying about, since as far as you are concerned a woman can't both wear a head-covering and be proud to be Canadian. I didn't say they were lying. I pointed out that in a similar survey in the UK even more Muslims said they were proud to be British, yet when also asked questions not asked in the Canadian version, half of them said gays should be in prison (for example). In other words, being proud to be Canadian does not mean you are not a devout Muslim who is dedicated to Muslim laws and social value rules. Edited June 25, 2017 by Argus Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
jacee Posted June 26, 2017 Report Posted June 26, 2017 On 2017-6-24 at 4:10 PM, Argus said: The requirements should most definitely include something on the order of 'best cultural fit with Canadian values'. Must never wear a balaclava? Quote
jacee Posted June 26, 2017 Report Posted June 26, 2017 8 hours ago, Argus said: I didn't say they were lying. I pointed out that in a similar survey in the UK even more Muslims said they were proud to be British, yet when also asked questions not asked in the Canadian version, half of them said gays should be in prison (for example). In other words, being proud to be Canadian does not mean you are not a devout Muslim who is dedicated to Muslim laws and social value rules. Some Christians say that about homosexuals too. What was your point? Quote
DogOnPorch Posted June 26, 2017 Report Posted June 26, 2017 35 minutes ago, jacee said: Must never wear a balaclava? Do you vote in one? How about walk near an armored car wearing one? Waltz into the bank wearing one? Or is it reserved for those rare -40 C mornings and you still pull it-up like a toque when you get to Timmy's BECAUSE IT'S HOT AND ANNOYING? Hmmm? Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Omni Posted June 26, 2017 Report Posted June 26, 2017 3 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: Do you vote in one? How about walk near an armored car wearing one? Waltz into the bank wearing one? Or is it reserved for those rare -40 C mornings and you still pull it-up like a toque when you get to Timmy's BECAUSE IT'S HOT AND ANNOYING? Hmmm? You're free to enter Timmy's dressed as you like. I like the tractor wheels myself. Quote
DogOnPorch Posted June 26, 2017 Report Posted June 26, 2017 Just now, Omni said: You're free to enter Timmy's dressed as you like. I like the tractor wheels myself. I challenge you to wear one near those itchy armored car guards. You might find your freedoms mixing with the guard's desire to stop you from steeling. I'll be over here. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
OftenWrong Posted June 26, 2017 Report Posted June 26, 2017 In retrospect, there might be good reason for Muslim men to insist their women cover their faces... Quote
Omni Posted June 26, 2017 Report Posted June 26, 2017 1 minute ago, DogOnPorch said: I challenge you to wear one near those itchy armored car guards. You might find your freedoms mixing with the guard's desire to stop you from steeling. I'll be over here. Those "itchy armored car guards" have absolutely no authority to tell you what you can wear. Quote
DogOnPorch Posted June 26, 2017 Report Posted June 26, 2017 Just now, Omni said: Those "itchy armored car guards" have absolutely no authority to tell you what you can wear. Bang. Authority? Your authority is now a sucking chest wound. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Omni Posted June 26, 2017 Report Posted June 26, 2017 1 minute ago, DogOnPorch said: Bang. Authority? Your authority is now a sucking chest wound. You watch a lot of cartoons I bet eh? Quote
DogOnPorch Posted June 26, 2017 Report Posted June 26, 2017 Just now, Omni said: You watch a lot of cartoons I bet eh? I accept your surrender, General Bragg. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Omni Posted June 26, 2017 Report Posted June 26, 2017 4 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: I accept your surrender, General Bragg. I bet you're a Popeye fan. Quote
DogOnPorch Posted June 26, 2017 Report Posted June 26, 2017 Bragg was one of the South's losingest generals. Not a cartoon character. But, this is your standard thing to do once you lose. Make personal attacks and such. Parting shots from the Reb's tattered battle-line as they skedaddle...again. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Omni Posted June 26, 2017 Report Posted June 26, 2017 (edited) 7 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: Bragg was one of the South's losingest generals. Not a cartoon character. But, this is your standard thing to do once you lose. Make personal attacks and such. Parting shots from the Reb's tattered battle-line as they skedaddle...again. I think we all know who Bragg is. Now back to your Popeye... And I'm sure you'll eventually get around to telling us what he has to do with the topic of the thread? Edited June 26, 2017 by Omni Quote
Argus Posted June 26, 2017 Report Posted June 26, 2017 15 hours ago, jacee said: Some Christians say that about homosexuals too. What was your point? Poll? Cite? How many Christians in the UK or Canada think gays should be imprisoned? Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
DogOnPorch Posted June 26, 2017 Report Posted June 26, 2017 14 hours ago, Omni said: I think we all know who Bragg is. Now back to your Popeye... And I'm sure you'll eventually get around to telling us what he has to do with the topic of the thread? More scattered musket fire from the trees. I'm all for you wearing a balaclava while getting in-between an armored car guard and a bank's money. It's a free country...shouldn't be a problem at all. I'll be over here. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
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