EVIDENCE FOR GOD

[taxme]

22 hours ago, blackbird said:

This is where it gets political.  Liberals (and with NDP support I assume) and maybe Conservatives as well,  banned the death penalty for murderers.  So we saw some prisoner murder another young prisoner on TV recently and no guards did anything to stop it.

Then there is the case of the government allowing returning ISIS fighters to return to Canada without question and saying they may offer re-integration to them.  While other countries are saying they shot them in Syria if they can, Canada says their Charter rights must be respected. 

When I see all these things going on, it just reinforces my belief that Canada has becoming a more heathen, humanist country that is losing it's way (if it ever had a good way).  It is following the humanism from the UN and progressives.

Canada has become the land of liberalism. Wherever liberalism or even communism is allowed to become the rulers of the land all things that were once considered normal, decent and moral begin to go abnormal, indecent and immorality takes over. It is for sure that common sense and logic is removed and thrown out the liberal back door. Even the conservatives have appeared to have gone bonkers and are going along with the liberals in trying to assist in the destruction of Canada. The majority of our politicians have appeared to have contracted that disease called political correctness. A very bad disease indeed to get because once one gets that disease it has a tendency of making people become nothing more than a bunch of brainless zombies. And there is no doubt about it that the zombies are on the increase in Canada. They voted in the liberals and that should say it all. Batter try and find some zombie spray because you are going to need it very soon. 

[taxme]

On 12/15/2017 at 9:04 AM, Omni said:

Which tells me that none of them are true since they were all created by humans.

It was a curse put on all humanity when God created you. Now I do believe in the devil. 

[taxme]

23 hours ago, blackbird said:

"how does anything come from nothing?"  Good question.  God is omnipotent which means he is all powerful.  God's power is infinite and beyond our comprehension.  When you say it is impossible for something to come from nothing, you are thinking in earthly terms.  God is a person infinitely greater than what we could even begin to imagine.  I don't think the Bible tells us how God created things out of nothing but just says that he did.  He spoke the universe into existence.  It is not a normal or natural event.  That is why it is called supernatural. 

You refer to some believing we are part of a computer game.   Actually I believe God is in control of the universe because his power is infinite.  But the Bible does not explain exactly why certain things happen.  He may allow certain things to happen but the Bible says God is not the author of evil.  So he does not order or cause evil to occur.

Again nothing can be created from nothing. It defies logic and the laws of physics. Well, I know that if I were the God I would never have allowed the continuation of all the evil that humans have done to other humans since humans were created. No normal, decent and moral God would allow this to go on. Either we have a creator who is just plain evil and enjoys watching people suffer and die or do we have a loving and caring God who is suppose to love and cherish all his children. Right now it looks to me like we have the former going on here. Just saying.  

[taxme]

On 12/14/2017 at 8:39 PM, Omni said:

Yep, everybody who gets sucked into the god bullshit believes their god is the only god, and then millions of people get killed. When will we evolve I wonder?

Maybe when you and that ilk that you appear to support have all their power taken away from them, then maybe mankind will no doubt evolve into better humans beings. Yup, sir. 

[blackbird]

2 hours ago, Ginsy said:

That's my concern. This line of thinking literally horrifies me. What if God said that the morally right thing to do is to kill those who don't believe in him? Would you seriously accept that then? Just because he said it? My point is that anyone who is willing to follow anything that blindly without ever questioning it concerns the hell out of me.

Again, you are making nonsensical assumptions.  God has given a complete and final revelation in the Bible.  The ten commandments says thou shalt not kill.  It is a basic teaching of the Bible.  That does not change.  So God will not be saying to anyone to kill those who don't believe in him.  That is not how God operates.  There are people who sometimes claim god spoke to them personally and told them to do some evil thing, but this doesn't come from God.  It is more likely from the devil.  So people who properly understand the Bible and obey it will not be doing anything that should concern you.  It's people who follow other false religions, a cult, or their own imagination that might concern us.  We have seen plenty of that in the world.

[taxme]

23 hours ago, blackbird said:

You are generalizing.  Believing in the God of the Bible means one believes killing is wrong.  If one does not follow the God of the Bible possibly he would be living by his own morality and could justify anything.

Maybe if we the people could get rid of all the warmongers in the world, and all the religions on earth, maybe then peace will be finally achieved. Waiting for God to try and fix the problem is just not working. But then again maybe God is off somewhere in the universe and has forgotten all about us. God left us all orphans with many of those orphans having growing up and have been allowed to become the bullies and warmongers and religion pushers of the place called earth. Hey, you never know. 

[blackbird]

17 minutes ago, taxme said:

Again nothing can be created from nothing. It defies logic and the laws of physics. Well, I know that if I were the God I would never have allowed the continuation of all the evil that humans have done to other humans since humans were created. No normal, decent and moral God would allow this to go on. Either we have a creator who is just plain evil and enjoys watching people suffer and die or do we have a loving and caring God who is suppose to love and cherish all his children. Right now it looks to me like we have the former going on here. Just saying.  

Actually God is in control and according to the Bible is planning to return to put down all evil and create a new earth.  A day of reckoning is coming.  The only way to be spared is to be born again and receive forgiveness and remission of sins. 

[blackbird]

22 minutes ago, taxme said:

Again nothing can be created from nothing. It defies logic and the laws of physics. Well, I know that if I were the God I would never have allowed the continuation of all the evil that humans have done to other humans since humans were created. No normal, decent and moral God would allow this to go on. Either we have a creator who is just plain evil and enjoys watching people suffer and die or do we have a loving and caring God who is suppose to love and cherish all his children. Right now it looks to me like we have the former going on here. Just saying.  

Logic and the laws of physics have no meaning with supernatural acts occur,  when God operates the supernatural.  You keep forgetting God created the laws of physics and created the universe.  He is not limited to what he can do.  Recall some of the supernatural events that took place when Moses was getting ready to leave Egypt with the children of Israel.  Didn't you see the movie "Ten Commandments".  Most people have seen that if they haven't read Exodus in the Bible.

Edited December 18, 2017 by blackbird

[Ginsy]

15 minutes ago, blackbird said:

Again, you are making nonsensical assumptions.  God has given a complete and final revelation in the Bible.  The ten commandments says thou shalt not kill.  It is a basic teaching of the Bible.  That does not change.  So God will not be saying to anyone to kill those who don't believe in him.  That is not how God operates.  There are people who sometimes claim god spoke to them personally and told them to do some evil thing, but this doesn't come from God.  It is more likely from the devil.  So people who properly understand the Bible and obey it will not be doing anything that should concern you.  It's people who follow other false religions, a cult, or their own imagination that might concern us.  We have seen plenty of that in the world.

I guess you don't think God is from your imagination then? Where is your proof? Objective evidence? If he is not imagined then show me tangible evidence. No, really. I want to see it! 

11 minutes ago, blackbird said:

Actually God is in control and according to the Bible is planning to return to put down all evil and create a new earth.  A day of reckoning is coming.  The only way to be spared is to be born again and receive forgiveness and remission of sins. 

Best thing I've read all day. Can the day of reckoning happen before March so I don't have to write my economics midterm? I'd rather God condemn me than to plot those graphs. Do you have any idea if this is happening anytime soon? 

 

[taxme]

33 minutes ago, blackbird said:

Logic and the laws of physics have no meaning with supernatural acts occur,  when God operates the supernatural.  You keep forgetting God created the laws of physics and created the universe.  He is not limited to what he can do.  Recall some of the supernatural events that took place when Moses was getting ready to leave Egypt with the children of Israel.  Didn't you see the movie "Ten Commandments".  Most people have seen that if they haven't read Exodus in the Bible.

Oh ya, that parting of the seas nonsense?  But why would God come down and show his face at that time just to rescue Moses and his followers? When was the last time you saw something like that happen again on erath? When was the last time God came to the rescue of any gentiles? There are plenty of historical events in the past where God could have come to the rescue but did not. God could have come to the rescue of the people on the Titanic or the Lusitania but did not. Thousands of lives were lost. So, does this God pick and choose as to who he is going to come and save? 

Even the story about Noah's Ark sounds a little far-fetched. How is one old man able to go around the world and is told by God to go collect two of every animal on earth, and how was he able to know what animals and birds were out there, catch them, and then get them all on to the boat before the rains begin? And then Noah would have to gather enough food to feed them all for 40 days and forty nights. Quite the task for a few men to be able to do and be able to go to all the continents on earth where he could get all these animals and birds. Lucky Noah did not have to worry about the fish. The Bible is full of silly stories that if one reads it should be able it is full of nonsense stories like Noah.

Why one can even associate UFO's in the scriptures of the Bible if they wanted too. Eric Von Donagan's book " The Chariots of the Gods" has explained this well in his book that UFO's are pretty much mentioned in the Bible. But hey, what do I know, eh? 

[blackbird]

40 minutes ago, Ginsy said:

I guess you don't think God is from your imagination then? Where is your proof? Objective evidence? If he is not imagined then show me tangible evidence. No, really. I want to see it! 

Best thing I've read all day. Can the day of reckoning happen before March so I don't have to write my economics midterm? I'd rather God condemn me than to plot those graphs. Do you have any idea if this is happening anytime soon? 

 

"The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handiwork."  Psalm 19:1

Simply look around you.  Everything that exists has been created by God.

Nobody knows when the Lord will physically return, but it is guaranteed to happen.

[blackbird]

32 minutes ago, taxme said:

Oh ya, that parting of the seas nonsense?  But why would God come down and show his face at that time just to rescue Moses and his followers? When was the last time you saw something like that happen again on erath? When was the last time God came to the rescue of any gentiles? There are plenty of historical events in the past where God could have come to the rescue but did not. God could have come to the rescue of the people on the Titanic or the Lusitania but did not. Thousands of lives were lost. So, does this God pick and choose as to who he is going to come and save? 

Even the story about Noah's Ark sounds a little far-fetched. How is one old man able to go around the world and is told by God to go collect two of every animal on earth, and how was he able to know what animals and birds were out there, catch them, and then get them all on to the boat before the rains begin? And then Noah would have to gather enough food to feed them all for 40 days and forty nights. Quite the task for a few men to be able to do and be able to go to all the continents on earth where he could get all these animals and birds. Lucky Noah did not have to worry about the fish. The Bible is full of silly stories that if one reads it should be able it is full of nonsense stories like Noah.

Why one can even associate UFO's in the scriptures of the Bible if they wanted too. Eric Von Donagan's book " The Chariots of the Gods" has explained this well in his book that UFO's are pretty much mentioned in the Bible. But hey, what do I know, eh? 

The fact is that Israel was God's chosen people.  I know that doesn't sit well with a lot of people, but the Bible shows clearly that Israel was God's chosen people at that time.  It gives the genealogy of the 12 tribes of Israel.  Jacob was the father of the 12 tribes of Israel.  Abraham's son was Isaac and Isaac's son was Jacob whom God renamed Israel.  Jacob had twelve sons that the twelve tribes of Israel came from.   Ephraim and Manaseh were half tribes that go to make up the twelve tribes.

The rescue of the animals by Noah was a supernatural event and Noah would have had to have God's supernatural intervention to do it.

The father of the Jews and the Arabs was Abraham.   Abraham wife Sarai couldn't have children earlier in her life and told Abraham to sleep with their handmaiden, Hagar, an Egyptian woman.  So Abraham slept with her and she had a son named Ishmael.  Ishmael is the father of the Arabs.  Later when Sarai was about 99 and Abraham was about 100, God intervened and Sarai had a son they names Isaac.  Isaac was the father of the Israel or the Jews.   So both Jews and Arabs share the same patriarchal father, Abraham.   Both Arabs and Jews are also descendants of Shem, who lived before Abraham.   Shem's father was Noah.  That is why Jews and Arabs are called Semites.  The word Semite comes from Shem.    So you can trace these people right back to Noah.   Fairy tale?  NO!

Edited December 18, 2017 by blackbird

[Ginsy]

39 minutes ago, blackbird said:

"The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handiwork."  Psalm 19:1

Simply look around you.  Everything that exists has been created by God.

Nobody knows when the Lord will physically return, but it is guaranteed to happen.

"I declare the inanity of God; and my brain sheweth my handiwork." Ginsy (1, 2017). See how easy it is to write something? I could write 300 pages of this and sell it as a hard copy and title it Ginsy's Book of Prophecy: The Principles to a Moral Life. Is starting my own religion really that simple? 

Like I said before,  if he's seriously going to return and fuck shit up he needs to do it ASAP because I really don't want to write this economics midterm. Since you two seem to have a close relationship can you do a favour for me and ask him to come sooner? Have you ever done an average cost graph? It's actually brutal and I have no idea what's going on. What kind of God would put me through this? I wouldn't put my people through ECON112.

[Kerfuffle]

10 hours ago, taxme said:

Oh ya, that parting of the seas nonsense?  But why would God come down and show his face at that time just to rescue Moses and his followers? When was the last time you saw something like that happen again on erath? When was the last time God came to the rescue of any gentiles? There are plenty of historical events in the past where God could have come to the rescue but did not. God could have come to the rescue of the people on the Titanic or the Lusitania but did not. Thousands of lives were lost. So, does this God pick and choose as to who he is going to come and save? 

Even the story about Noah's Ark sounds a little far-fetched. How is one old man able to go around the world and is told by God to go collect two of every animal on earth, and how was he able to know what animals and birds were out there, catch them, and then get them all on to the boat before the rains begin? And then Noah would have to gather enough food to feed them all for 40 days and forty nights. Quite the task for a few men to be able to do and be able to go to all the continents on earth where he could get all these animals and birds. Lucky Noah did not have to worry about the fish. The Bible is full of silly stories that if one reads it should be able it is full of nonsense stories like Noah.

Why one can even associate UFO's in the scriptures of the Bible if they wanted too. Eric Von Donagan's book " The Chariots of the Gods" has explained this well in his book that UFO's are pretty much mentioned in the Bible. But hey, what do I know, eh? 

I agree....Noah would have needed a fleet of Ark's to carry the animals and feed....What about the marsupials and such that lived on the other side of the earth....Noah would not know to pick them up as he thought the earth was flat.Who ever wrote the bible got the idea of a great flood when he seen fish fossil's on top of mountains and determined there had to be a great flood for fish to get at those heights....we know now that the ocean floor was raised up by tectonic plates forming mountains and carrying the fossils with it.....also why did god create the fly.which has caused more death and misery than all the wars and violence on earth...

 

When one person suffers from a delusion, it is called insanity. When many people suffer from a delusion, it is called religion

Edited December 18, 2017 by Kerfuffle

[?Impact]

16 hours ago, blackbird said:

The ten commandments says thou shalt not kill.  It is a basic teaching of the Bible.

Unless we are talking about homosexuals: If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them. - Leviticus 20:13

... or fortune tellers: A man also or woman that hath a familiar spirit, or that is a wizard, shall surely be put to death: they shall stone them with stones: their blood shall be upon them. - Leviticus 20:27

... or if you hit your parents: And he that smiteth his father, or his mother, shall be surely put to death. - Exodus 21:15

... or even if you curse them: For every one that curseth his father or his mother shall be surely put to death: he hath cursed his father or his mother; his blood shall be upon him. - Leviticus 20:9 & Whoso curseth his father or his mother, his lamp shall be put out in obscure darkness. - Proverbs 20:20

... don't even think of sleeping around: And the man that committeth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbour's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.  - Leviticus 20:10

... daughters of priests are to be burnt to death for their sexual transgressions: And the daughter of any priest, if she profane herself by playing the whore, she profaneth her father: she shall be burnt with fire. - Leviticus 21:9

Do we need to get into the countless passages for non-believers, blasphemy, and working on Sunday?

Some of my personal favorites however are:

Murdering little children for calling someone baldy: And he went up from thence unto Bethel: and as he was going up by the way, there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head. And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them. - 2 Kings 2:23-24

How about being mauled by a lion for refusing to hit someone: And a certain man of the sons of the prophets said unto his neighbour in the word of the Lord, Smite me, I pray thee. And the man refused to smite him. Then said he unto him, Because thou hast not obeyed the voice of the Lord, behold, as soon as thou art departed from me, a lion shall slay thee. And as soon as he was departed from him, a lion found him, and slew him. - 1 Kings 20:35-36

I could write an entire book on all the murder God has done or commanded to be done­.

Edited December 18, 2017 by ?Impact

[taxme]

17 hours ago, blackbird said:

The fact is that Israel was God's chosen people.  I know that doesn't sit well with a lot of people, but the Bible shows clearly that Israel was God's chosen people at that time.  It gives the genealogy of the 12 tribes of Israel.  Jacob was the father of the 12 tribes of Israel.  Abraham's son was Isaac and Isaac's son was Jacob whom God renamed Israel.  Jacob had twelve sons that the twelve tribes of Israel came from.   Ephraim and Manaseh were half tribes that go to make up the twelve tribes.

The rescue of the animals by Noah was a supernatural event and Noah would have had to have God's supernatural intervention to do it.

The father of the Jews and the Arabs was Abraham.   Abraham wife Sarai couldn't have children earlier in her life and told Abraham to sleep with their handmaiden, Hagar, an Egyptian woman.  So Abraham slept with her and she had a son named Ishmael.  Ishmael is the father of the Arabs.  Later when Sarai was about 99 and Abraham was about 100, God intervened and Sarai had a son they names Isaac.  Isaac was the father of the Israel or the Jews.   So both Jews and Arabs share the same patriarchal father, Abraham.   Both Arabs and Jews are also descendants of Shem, who lived before Abraham.   Shem's father was Noah.  That is why Jews and Arabs are called Semites.  The word Semite comes from Shem.    So you can trace these people right back to Noah.   Fairy tale?  NO!

There should be no favorites with God. That is not right. If Jews are the chosen people than what Am I? Chopped gentile liver? 

So, what you are saying here is that God then brought all the animals and birds and insects to the boat. But yet didn't it say in the bible that Noah had to go out and get them all by himself? I am confused? But then the bible can be quite confusing at times trying to make heads or tails out of what is being said in the bible. 

Well, as a gentile then, why should I care about God or what is said in the bible. God preferred Jews over me a gentile so the heck with him. I could not careless who had who and who is related to who or not. Personally, the bible is all just a fairy tale and was written by a bunch of Jewish old men and was then fed to people who would listen to their nonsense. Just saying. 

 

[taxme]

7 hours ago, Kerfuffle said:

I agree....Noah would have needed a fleet of Ark's to carry the animals and feed....What about the marsupials and such that lived on the other side of the earth....Noah would not know to pick them up as he thought the earth was flat.Who ever wrote the bible got the idea of a great flood when he seen fish fossil's on top of mountains and determined there had to be a great flood for fish to get at those heights....we know now that the ocean floor was raised up by tectonic plates forming mountains and carrying the fossils with it.....also why did god create the fly.which has caused more death and misery than all the wars and violence on earth...

 

When one person suffers from a delusion, it is called insanity. When many people suffer from a delusion, it is called religion

God hates you and me, and it would appear as though you and I are not alone. God also appears to hate everything else he has created because why would he constantly keep destroying everything he creates? I can just see judgement day when it gets here. Billions upon billions upon billions of alive people standing, and dead people rising, all of whom will have to get in line and have to wait for their turn to find out after judgement as to whether who will be going to heaven or will be going to hell. God is going to have a busy time of it when that day comes. I wonder if coffee and goodies will be served while we all are standing in line and waiting for our turn to get judged? Aw well. 

[Michael Hardner]

5 hours ago, ?Impact said:

I could write an entire book on all the murder God has done or commanded to be done­.

Nobody's perfect.

[blackbird]

6 hours ago, ?Impact said:

Unless we are talking about homosexuals: If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them. - Leviticus 20:13

... or fortune tellers: A man also or woman that hath a familiar spirit, or that is a wizard, shall surely be put to death: they shall stone them with stones: their blood shall be upon them. - Leviticus 20:27

... or if you hit your parents: And he that smiteth his father, or his mother, shall be surely put to death. - Exodus 21:15

... or even if you curse them: For every one that curseth his father or his mother shall be surely put to death: he hath cursed his father or his mother; his blood shall be upon him. - Leviticus 20:9 & Whoso curseth his father or his mother, his lamp shall be put out in obscure darkness. - Proverbs 20:20

... don't even think of sleeping around: And the man that committeth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbour's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.  - Leviticus 20:10

... daughters of priests are to be burnt to death for their sexual transgressions: And the daughter of any priest, if she profane herself by playing the whore, she profaneth her father: she shall be burnt with fire. - Leviticus 21:9

Do we need to get into the countless passages for non-believers, blasphemy, and working on Sunday?

Some of my personal favorites however are:

Murdering little children for calling someone baldy: And he went up from thence unto Bethel: and as he was going up by the way, there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head. And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them. - 2 Kings 2:23-24

How about being mauled by a lion for refusing to hit someone: And a certain man of the sons of the prophets said unto his neighbour in the word of the Lord, Smite me, I pray thee. And the man refused to smite him. Then said he unto him, Because thou hast not obeyed the voice of the Lord, behold, as soon as thou art departed from me, a lion shall slay thee. And as soon as he was departed from him, a lion found him, and slew him. - 1 Kings 20:35-36

I could write an entire book on all the murder God has done or commanded to be done­.

The answer is those verses you quoted only applied to Israel at a particular time in ancient history.  God chose Israel as his chosen people and gave them the land and commanded them to do certain things which you quoted.  None of that applies to anyone today.  God had a covenant with the children of Israel and those regulations was the way they were to live.  They are not applicable to people or christians living today.  Much of the Old Testament is a history of God's dealing with Israel and those things can only be looked at from that point of view.  No christian church believes that they apply to christians.  That period ended at least two thousand years ago.

The only exception would be the ten commandments listed in Deuteronomy and Exodus.  These are believed to be reiterated in the New Testament and most christians believe the ten commandments are a guide.  There is nothing radical or extreme in the ten commandments and some of them are incorporated into the legal system.

Edited December 19, 2017 by blackbird

[blackbird]

1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said:

Nobody's perfect.

Simply a lack of understanding of what the Bible is all about.  I've explained it above about Israel and God having a covenant relationship.

[blackbird]

Quote

10  For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

19 For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent.

20 Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?

21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.

22 For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:

23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;

24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.

   1 Corinthians ch1 18-24 King James Bible (1611)

Quote

10  But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.

12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.

13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

    1 Corinthians ch2 vs10-14 KJV (1611)

    This teaches that the natural man will not understand the things of God (which are in the Bible) because they are spiritually discerned.  One must be given eyes or vision that comes from God.  If one is sincere and wants to know, I believe God will give him spiritual eyes and understanding.

kingjamesversiononline.org

 

 

Edited December 19, 2017 by blackbird

[blackbird]

4 hours ago, taxme said:

There should be no favorites with God. That is not right. If Jews are the chosen people than what Am I? Chopped gentile liver? 

So, what you are saying here is that God then brought all the animals and birds and insects to the boat. But yet didn't it say in the bible that Noah had to go out and get them all by himself? I am confused? But then the bible can be quite confusing at times trying to make heads or tails out of what is being said in the bible. 

Well, as a gentile then, why should I care about God or what is said in the bible. God preferred Jews over me a gentile so the heck with him. I could not careless who had who and who is related to who or not. Personally, the bible is all just a fairy tale and was written by a bunch of Jewish old men and was then fed to people who would listen to their nonsense. Just saying. 

 

Since Christ came 2000 years ago, the gospel was open to Gentiles.  The apostle Paul explains this in Romans.  Prior to Christ's coming, the Jews were God's chosen people.  Some of the promises God gave regarding the Jews are still in effect.  But they cannot be saved without believing in Jesus as their Savior.   Today God wishes for all to be saved.  Jews are not the chosen people for salvation today.  It is available to anyone who believes.

Now you've made it clear I must go back and read about Noah and the flood in Genesis. 

Edited December 19, 2017 by blackbird

[Goddess]

13 hours ago, blackbird said:

Now you've made it clear I must go back and read about Noah and the flood in Genesis. 

 

https://app.box.com/s/uclytd91jd

 

THE FLOOD

 

One of the more colorful stories in the Bible is the story of the flood. It is a story that appeals to the imagination. It contains all the elements of a good children’s story - animals, crime and punishment, sweeping events that captivate the reader’s interest, and a happy ending. In fact, children’s literature is precisely where the flood story should end up, placed along side Mother Goose and Cinderella.

There are many reasons why the flood story as told by the Bible could never have happened. For instance, the amount of water required to cover the highest mountains would be astronomical. It is physically impossible for the atmosphere to absorb that much water, and drop it as rain. Even if it could be done, five miles of water hovering over the heads of the pre-deluge earth would have created atmospheric pressure so intense that they would have been as flat as pancakes, not to mention the fact that they would be in complete darkness due to the blocking of light from the sun. Core samples of arctic ice show no evidence of either a global flood or a pre-flood tropical climate.

Then there is the fact that several civilizations, such as the Egyptian and the Chinese, have written histories that predate the flood. The pyramids were built about two hundred years before the flood, and show no water damage. And, of course, the zoological difficulties are huge. How could fresh water and salt water fish survive in a common pool? And, did Noah drop off kangaroos in Australia on his way to Ararat?

 

The list of arguments against the literal interpretation of the flood account is so long that it would be tiresome to go through it all. Besides, others have already done this better than I can. Most people don’t take it seriously, anyway.

I would like to take a completely different approach. I will assume that the flood story is literally true in all of its details, and follow the logic through to its inevitable conclusion.

 

Particularly, I am concerned with its motivation. To begin, a short recap of the events is in order.

The Story of the Flood

 After the creation of the human race, things went along on their merry way for a long time.  If you follow the list of who begat whom, and how long each of them lived, you come to the conclusion that Adam was created around 4000 BC. But, after about a millennium and a half, trouble started to brew.  Some angels became inflamed with lust for human women and took on human form.  They mated with humans, forming a race of huge bullies. Things got so bad that God decided that he would wipe out all life from the earth and start over again. It turns out that in all the earth, there was only one good man.  So, God told this man, Noah, to build a huge boat that would house samples of every form of non-water based life. 

Then, after working for 100 years, God loaded Noah, his family, and all the animals onto the ark, and then it started to rain.  By this time, it was around the year 2400 BC.  It rained for 40 days and nights, during which time, enough water fell to cover even the highest mountains. When the earth was wiped clean, the waters receded, and Noah let his family and the

animals out of the ark to begin repopulating the planet.

At this point, we must pause a moment to consider the nature of angels.  According to the Bible, angels are direct creations of God.  They do not reproduce.  As well, they do not have the inherited original sin of Adam and Eve to taint them.  They are perfect. This does not mean that they are incapable of sin.  It merely means that they are incapable of accidental sin.  If an angel sins, it is because he meant it.  It also means that if an angel feels sexual desire, it must have been placed there by his creator.

In order for an angel to become inflamed with lust for a human woman, it would be necessary for the angel to have a sex drive of some sort.  If they were completely neuter in every way, they would find human women about as attractive as we find rocks.  For this story to function, God must have created angels with sex drives.

Conclusion # 1:  Angels are created with a sex drive.

Now that we have established this unusual fact, let’s continue.  Notice that the Bible says that the angels found human women attractive, and they took on the bodies of men.  Also, notice that it does not say that any of them found human men attractive, and none of them took on the bodies of women.  This leads us inescapably to our next conclusion.

Conclusion # 2:  All angels are men.

Some of you may be tempted to jump ahead of me, but let’s go slow, and develop this carefully.  Our next area of inquiry is regarding the possibility of angelic reproduction. Jesus gives us some insight into the nature of angelic interrelationships:

 “For in the resurrection, neither do men marry, nor are women given in marriage, but are as the angels in heaven.” - Matthew 22:30 (NWT)

In addition to this direct statement, we note that there is no reference anywhere in the Bible to female angels, angelic marriage, or angelic reproduction of any sort.  This leads us to our next conclusion:

Conclusion # 3:  Angels have no natural outlet for their sexual urges.

Finally, I must add some information regarding the quantities of angels.

The book of Daniel makes reference to “ten thousand times ten thousand” standing before God.  A quick multiplication shows that there are one hundred million angels present in this scene, and there may be others as well. Also, angels have been in existence for a long time.  The Bible says that God rested after creating Adam and Eve, so any angels that exist must have been created before them; therefore, angels are ancient.

Conclusion # 4:  There are lots and lots of angels and they have a lot of time on their hands.

Now, for the slower ones among us, who have not yet figured out what I am getting at, let’s put all four conclusions together, and finish this off:

·        Angels are created with a sex drive

·        All angels are men

·        Angels have no natural outlet for their sexual urges

·        There are lots and lots of angels, with lots and lots of time

 With this logic in mind, we can deduce that heaven must be like a huge prison shower room.  I suppose that there are some people who have always had this concept of heaven, or at least hoped for it, but you will have to admit that this is not the mainstream viewpoint.  If it were, the Cistine Chapel would be restricted to adults only. I think it’s safe to say that this exercise illustrates just how ridiculous is the story of the

flood.  These conclusions, although absurd, are the natural outgrowth of the story, itself.

In order for the events of the flood to get off the ground, this must be true. 

So, choose for yourself:  either heaven is a massive San Francisco bath house, or the story of the flood is just another yarn.

 

Update

 Subsequent to publishing this article, one of my loyal readers took me to task regarding the proper view of angelic sexuality.  Here is how he explained it to me:

The angels were able to observe humans. They saw humans, particularly the males, having a jolly good time engaging in sex. Therefore, they decided to get in on it - sort of as a detached experiment regarding what they were missing.

Now, this explanation has a couple of problems with it. First of all, this is not what the text says. The text plainly says that they found women attractive while they were still in heaven.  Also, if they weren’t all stuck on the idea of sex with women, some of them could have materialized as men, some as women, and they could have come to earth and boinked each other’s brains out.  No harm done, and no need for a flood.

 Secondly, using this logic, there would be no reason for angels to take on human form. Based on my keen observations around the barnyard, bulls seem to enjoy sex every bit as much as humans, and considerably more frequently. If angels just wanted to go slumming, they would have been better off to join the cattle family. Now that I think about it, I would really like to hear this story retold with a bovine variation. 

Face it, people.  If you believe in the story of the flood, there is just no getting around the idea of horny angels.  When you get to heaven, don’t drop your harp.

Edited December 19, 2017 by Goddess
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[?Impact]

15 hours ago, blackbird said:

The only exception would be the ten commandments listed in Deuteronomy and Exodus.  These are believed to be reiterated in the New Testament and most christians believe the ten commandments are a guide.  There is nothing radical or extreme in the ten commandments and some of them are incorporated into the legal system.

I see 17 verses in Deuteronomy & Exodus, not 10 commandments. If I was Catholic I would have a different interpretation of them then if I were Anglican, let alone Orthodox Christian, Jewish, Lutheran, etc. Depending on my religion, the first 3 or 4 are completely self serving - God proclaiming his omnipotence and demanding everyone supplicate themselves before him (her/it); I would say that is very radical or extreme. Only two are really incorporated into the legal system (prohibition on killing and stealing), and one might conjuncture that false witness does have some limited in context applicability. Coveting is more a quality of capitalism, so I would say it is pretty radical to prohibit it.

[Hawkins]

2 hours ago, Goddess said:

 

https://app.box.com/s/uclytd91jd

 

he story of the flood, there is just no getting around the idea of horny angels.  When you get to heaven, don’t drop your harp.

 

What? To me, the "sons of god" refers to other homo erectus existed. That's why even scientists found Neanderthal genes inside humans.

 

Face it, the Bible is not always straight forward due to limited human knowledge through which a message was intended to be brought forward.

As for the flood, it's humans' arrogance to think that they understand all kinds of catastrophes ever happened. By Noah's description, the "flood" covered the top of a high mountain. We however never speculated a flood which can cover the top of a high mountain. So apparently the "flood" is not a flood we commonly encounter but possibly a kind of catastrophes we never knew of.

Edited December 19, 2017 by Hawkins