betsy Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 (edited) That's the only difference. I agree that it shouldn't happen. My question is more around segregation in general. If a Muslim parent wanting the sexes segregated is "lunacy", is that also true for Christian parents who choose segregated schools? I think it's a backwards practice and isn't good for development as a person. But I hold that view for segregated schools as well. Do you? Or Betsy? No, it's not the same! There are schools for girls or boys! It's not mandatory for you to enroll your child in an all-girl or all-boy school! It's not mandatory for Christians, either! No, there's nothing wrong with that. Christianity doesn't demand that you provide a segregated service to us! I don't think any Christian denomination demand any pray-time in work sites as a right, at the employer's or tax-payer's expense! Edited August 9, 2016 by betsy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 Not me. I think it stinks regardless of who wants to discriminate based on sex because their religion tells them to. So it's okay to discriminate against women as long as it's not due to religion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 No Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 (edited) Is it okay to do so based on religious beliefs? Edited August 9, 2016 by bcsapper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 I just don't like the idea of a religion making decisions for people who aren't of that religion. You're okay with it? How does this do that exactly? Look, I don't think there should be segregated swim times but I also recognize that the purpose of this isn't racial hatred like the Jim Crow era. This is to make children who've been subjected to war and hardships unthinkable to your average Canadian more comfortable as they adjust to a new culture. Complaining about this is like throwing a fuss that when you go to the bowling alley, it's league night so you can't get a lane. No one is saying you can't swim in a co-ed swimming pool. No one is saying women should be banned from wearing swimsuits in public. All they're doing is trying to accommodate newcomers who are uncomfortable with co-ed swimming. Some here are reacting like they've banned co-ed swimming altogether or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 Given the OP, is it odd to have that as a qualifier? When I'm trying to understand why segregation is okay for you in some circumstances but not others, it's not odd but raises further questions about why sometimes segregation is okay but other times it's not. Context matters, of course. I will give you that. But like I said in my post above this one, this isn't a matter of segregation for racial hatred. It's a matter of segregation to help people adjust and feel more comfortable to a new life after fleeing untold hardship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 No.....it's best that they bite the bullet at the get go. It's best they bite the bullet, eh? I see your dog whistle is tuned and ready to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 There are schools for girls or boys! It's not mandatory for you to enroll your child in an all-girl or all-boy school! It's not mandatory for Christians, either! No, there's nothing wrong with that. It's not mandated that you swim during segregated hours either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiderfish Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 All they're doing is trying to accommodate newcomers who are uncomfortable with co-ed swimming. By altering an established co-ed swimming program without informing or consulting with parents who have enrolled their kids prior to doing so. Maybe they need to start a "Syrian swimming program" for those who are not comfortable, it may solve the problem for everyone. Complaining about this is like throwing a fuss that when you go to the bowling alley, it's league night so you can't get a lane. No, it's more like going to family night at the bowling alley and being approached by the proprietor of the establishment half way through your game who asks the women and girls in your party to please go over to the far lanes because they are trying to accommodate the religion of several refugees who have shown up who would like to try out the game. But like I said in my post above this one, this isn't a matter of segregation for racial hatred. Who stated or implied it was? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Guy Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 (edited) I am continually amused by those who try to tap dance around, obfuscate, rationalize, and camouflage the fact that they do not like or want to be associated with people who are immigrants, who look differently, who speak differently and often act differently from them. You will use any excuse from nationalism to national security to hide the fact that you are racist. You hold your own race as superior to that of others and therefore look down your nose at lifestyles and practices of those born elsewhere. You fear that these folks from other countries may be smarter than you are and contribute more to this country than you do. These folks might be better at your job than you are and you or your children will be replaced. You are a Canadian! You are entitled! You were here first and you want to slam the door!! Unless you are an aboriginal, you and your ancestors are immigrants - no better or worse than the immigrants of to-day. Edited August 9, 2016 by Big Guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 What do you think of Christian schools segregating boys and girls? Is that different? Why is it different? It's voluntary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Squid Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 It's voluntary. Sure is... so is segregated swimming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 Who cares, their business their business. MY business. This is a government organization. Affirmative actions, as much as you hate it, or providing services for minorities is constitutionally protected. This is not affirmative action. It is deliberate discrimination and isolation of females at the behest of misogynistic foreigners who we have 'saved' by bringing them here, and yet who are insisting on bringing their own crude, backwards cultural values here and imposing them on us. If this was not muslims all you islamaphobes would not give a flyng f. On the contrary, if this was a group of misogynistic Christians getting them to change their policy to separate the kids you'd be up in arms in outrage. It is all just cultural bias and you people are just ignorant that people do things you do not. It is about a clash between our modern, secular, tolerant culture and their backward, brutal, violently intolerant and barbaric culture. I think ours should prevail in this, our country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 Sure is... so is segregated swimming. This was not voluntary. It was imposed by the university on an existing co-ed class at the behest of the refugees. None of the Canadian parents were asked or even consulted before the change was made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 It's not mandated that you swim during segregated hours either. If it's a public place....it should be open to the public! Period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 (edited) Sure is... so is segregated swimming. So you mean to say that women can swim with men if they choose to? And vice versa? They'll be allowed? <scratching head> So why are we making such a big fuss about this if "segregation" is just lip service? Edited August 9, 2016 by betsy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 (edited) I am continually amused by those who try to tap dance around, obfuscate, rationalize, and camouflage the fact that they do not like or want to be associated with people who are immigrants, who look differently, who speak differently and often act differently from them. You will use any excuse from nationalism to national security to hide the fact that you are racist. You hold your own race as superior to that of others and therefore look down your nose at lifestyles and practices of those born elsewhere. You fear that these folks from other countries may be smarter than you are and contribute more to this country than you do. These folks might be better at your job than you are and you or your children will be replaced. You are a Canadian! You are entitled! You were here first and you want to slam the door!! Unless you are an aboriginal, you and your ancestors are immigrants - no better or worse than the immigrants of to-day. Oy. Entitled? (The nerve! - look who's actually feeling entitled!) Slam the door? Where did all that come from? Speaking of slamming the door.....I'm beginning to understand why Europe is desperately wanting to close the door. Too late. Edited August 9, 2016 by betsy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 (edited) Who cares, their business their business. it is our business! This is our country! Furthermore.....anything that involves taxpayers' money, should be our business! Can't you see that this is only fostering animosity? Canadians who oppose massive refugees into our country are being vindicated by what we're seeing now! The bleeding heart pussy society we have is only going to cater and pander - just listen to them! They're not even here for a year and we already have this controversy! These are people who were supposed to have fled for their lives, and this is what happens when you bring them in! That's gratitude for you. That's the message I'm getting from what I'm reading here. We're screwed for being nice guys. Edited August 9, 2016 by betsy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCoastRunner Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 All they're doing is trying to accommodate newcomers who are uncomfortable with co-ed swimming. Some here are reacting like they've banned co-ed swimming altogether or something. Unless I misunderstood the article, that's exactly what they did. They banned co-ed swimming altogether as this camp for everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Squid Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 So you mean to say that women can swim with men if they choose to? And vice versa? They'll be allowed? <scratching head> So why are we making such a big fuss about this if "segregation" is just lip service? No, I'm saying there are other times when there is no segregation of boys and girls. (we are not talking about adults here... stick with the program...) So it's no different than telling people that sending kids to segregated schools is a choice. So is this. Don't get me wrong... I think it's abhorrent. But I think you and Argus are hypocritical about this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiderfish Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 That's the only difference. I agree that it shouldn't happen. My question is more around segregation in general. If a Muslim parent wanting the sexes segregated is "lunacy", is that also true for Christian parents who choose segregated schools? I think it's a backwards practice and isn't good for development as a person. But I hold that view for segregated schools as well. Do you? Or Betsy? I didn't say segregating sexes is "lunacy", for accommodation of Muslim or Christian reasons. My personal view on this is I don't really care what these groups do behind the walls of their own institutions, I'm not Muslim or Christian and it doesn't really affect me....that is until one of these groups decides that public programs need to be altered and genders segregated to accommodate their religion or culture, of which I am not a follower. Then it becomes everyone's business. That's what I see is the source of the push-back here. And for the record, if I read the story correctly, I don't believe the parents of the refugee kids were even approached prior to the U of R making this decision. It sounds like it was a decision made solely by the university with the belief that this would somehow encourage diversity. I'm not sure the parents of the newcomers even wanted this move to be made and if so do not hold them accountable one bit for this terrible decision, the university made a poor choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiderfish Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 (edited) I am continually amused by those who try to tap dance around, obfuscate, rationalize, and camouflage the fact that they do not like or want to be associated with people who are immigrants, who look differently, who speak differently and often act differently from them. You will use any excuse from nationalism to national security to hide the fact that you are racist. You hold your own race as superior to that of others and therefore look down your nose at lifestyles and practices of those born elsewhere. You fear that these folks from other countries may be smarter than you are and contribute more to this country than you do. These folks might be better at your job than you are and you or your children will be replaced. You are a Canadian! You are entitled! You were here first and you want to slam the door!! Unless you are an aboriginal, you and your ancestors are immigrants - no better or worse than the immigrants of to-day. I'm not exactly sure who this diatribe was directed at, but I too am constantly amused by those who feel they are above everything in a civil discussion about immigration and integrating newcomers into a society, and "look down their noses" at those who don't hold a certain point of view; decrying them of being closet racists or supremacists without actually having the first clue about who they actually are or what they actually believe. It's laughable if nothing else, however contributes nothing to a discussion. Edited August 9, 2016 by Spiderfish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 By altering an established co-ed swimming program without informing or consulting with parents who have enrolled their kids prior to doing so. Maybe they need to start a "Syrian swimming program" for those who are not comfortable, it may solve the problem for everyone. No, it's more like going to family night at the bowling alley and being approached by the proprietor of the establishment half way through your game who asks the women and girls in your party to please go over to the far lanes because they are trying to accommodate the religion of several refugees who have shown up who would like to try out the game. Who stated or implied it was? I more or less agree that others shouldn't be inconvenienced by it. If a Syrian swim program is what it takes, I'd be fine with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 If it's a public place....it should be open to the public! Period.Until a bakery that serves the public is asked to make a cake for a gay couple, eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Guy Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 (edited) .... It's laughable if nothing else, however contributes nothing to a discussion. Its laughable that someone would try to rationalize their blatant dislike for people not like them with the old , "Discussion of immigration and integrating newcomers" excuse. Just because you are "discussing" your dislike of immigrants and fear what they will do to "your" country. I used to post addresses of Heritage and other racist sites and was discouraged by the mods. I used to do so that the folks here could compare their "discussions" of immigration and integration with the blatant racist "discussions of immigration and integration" that take place on those sites. At least they admit to their views. I just wish these folks had the courage to just admit that they do not like immigrants or do not like Muslims or do not like people who are not like them and probably fear that these immigrants may be brighter than they are. But, so be it - let us continue to code racism in intellectual, theoretical and bafflegard language! Edited August 9, 2016 by Big Guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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