America under President Trump

[Rue]

17 hours ago, Yzermandius19 said:

You file tax returns with the IRS. The IRS has them. You may not have seen them, but they are there, and he didn't get charged with tax fraud, sooooo, there is obviously nothing there that is illegal. He has been heavily audited over years, y'all are grasping at straws.

Maybe. Maybe not. I do admit when using straws I suck at it. I concede that.

[Yzermandius19]

8 minutes ago, Rue said:

Maybe. Maybe not. I do admit when using straws I suck at it. I concede that.

If you are holding out hope that IRS is covering for Trump's criminality, and if the tax returns are released it will be plain for all to see, that's is some serious wishful thinking going on. That's not a thing that is happening, give it up already, if they had anything on him, we'd know it long before he ever ran for President, they are dying to nail him to wall, be real.

You Trump Haters really need to learn to pick your battles better instead of always falling for obvious nonsense just because you don't like the guy and want to see him gone, so any conspiracy theory under the sun that results in "Trump being done" is instantly believed no matter how obvious it is that it's bullsh*t.

Edited October 19, 2019 by Yzermandius19

[Rue]

17 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Americans were far more embarrassed by President Jimmy Carter.   He was not re-elected.

That is absolutely true. I can not argue with that at all.

[Rue]

4 minutes ago, Yzermandius19 said:

If you are holding out hope that IRS is covering for Trump's criminality, and if the tax returns are released it will be plain for all to see, that's is some serious wishful thinking going on. That's not a thing that is happening, give it up already, if they had anything on him, we'd know it long before he ever ran for President, they are dying to nail him to wall, be real.

You Trump Haters really need to learn to pick your battles better instead of always falling for obvious nonsense just because you don't like the guy and want to see him gone, so any conspiracy theory under the sun that results in "Trump being done" is instantly believed no matter how obvious it is that it's bullsh*t.

I do not agree with or support conspiracy theories. If Trump has committed any illegalities it is up to the courts to decide but he should not use his office to stay above the law of the land. He also as a public figure can not accuse others of being suspect and corrupt and not think he will be held to the same standard.  Your concern about conspiracies should also apply to  his that he throws at others in his constant twitter attacks. Using your reasoning in the second sentence he should now not question Biden.

[Yzermandius19]

7 minutes ago, Rue said:

I do not agree with or support conspiracy theories. If Trump has committed any illegalities it is up to the courts to decide but he should not use his office to stay above the law of the land. He also as a public figure can not accuse others of being suspect and corrupt and not think he will be held to the same standard.  Your concern about conspiracies should also apply to  his that he throws at others in his constant twitter attacks. Using your reasoning in the second sentence he should now not question Biden.

You continue to cling to the hope that there is a smoking gun in his tax returns just because you haven't personally seen them all, and neither has the public, as if that is the only way to tell. Give it up already.

Edited October 19, 2019 by Yzermandius19

[WestCanMan]

2 hours ago, Yzermandius19 said:

If you are holding out hope that IRS is covering for Trump's criminality, and if the tax returns are released it will be plain for all to see, that's is some serious wishful thinking going on. 

Trump isn't releasing his tax returns because 1) he doesn't want people to see how broke he was, ruining his reputation as a businessman, or 2) because he's too wealthy and he's worried that his base won't support him. 

I'm pretty sure that one of those two things will be the case  (whether or not he has committed tax fraud or whatever) and whichever one it is will be the "worst thing that ever happened to American voters!!!!!!" as soon as CNN finds out which one it is. Because at CNN, everything's "THE WORST EVER!!!!!! AHHHHHHHH!!!!!!"

[Yzermandius19]

3 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

Trump isn't releasing his tax returns because 1) he doesn't want people to see how broke he was, ruining his reputation as a businessman, or 2) because he's too wealthy and he's worried that his base won't support him. 

I'm pretty sure that one of those two things will be the case  (whether or not he has committed tax fraud or whatever) and whichever one it is will be the "worst thing that ever happened to American voters!!!!!!" as soon as CNN finds out which one it is. Because at CNN, everything's "THE WORST EVER!!!!!! AHHHHHHHH!!!!!!"

Doesn't have to be either. His tax returns are complicated, and he doesn't want the financially illiterate masses to come to wrong conclusion based on perfectly normal tax returns for someone in his position. There is no smoking gun, he just doesn't want to provide ammunition that his political opponents can use to con the rubes, when not releasing his tax returns isn't hurting him to any significant degree at all.

Edited October 19, 2019 by Yzermandius19

[Cannucklehead]

Just now, Yzermandius19 said:

Doesn't have to be either. His tax returns are complicated, and he doesn't want the financially illiterate masses to come to wrong conclusion based on perfectly normal tax returns for someone in his position. There is no smoking gun, he just doesn't want to provide ammunition to his political opponents when not releasing his tax returns isn't hurting him to any significant degree at all.

I hope you really dont believe that congress is financially illiterate.  

[Yzermandius19]

2 minutes ago, Cannucklehead said:

I hope you really dont believe that congress is financially illiterate.  

They absolutely are. Look at the policies they propose, it's as plain as day. They will simply use the tax returns for political purposes, regardless of what is discovered. The Democrats will claim there is a smoking gun no matter what, even if it's obvious there is none.

Edited October 19, 2019 by Yzermandius19

[Cannucklehead]

So you'd rather one person decides what's right and what's not instead of Congress.

 

Welcome to dictatorship.  

[Yzermandius19]

3 minutes ago, Cannucklehead said:

So you'd rather one person decides what's right and what's not instead of Congress.

 

Welcome to dictatorship.  

That's the IRS's job. Stop creating strawmen because you need an even dumber argument to compare yours to, otherwise your argument breaks down.

Absolute clown college. The IRS has seen the tax returns, they've audited Trump repeatedly, and found nothing worth charging him over, that information becoming public will not reveal a smoking gun, give it up. There is no legal requirement for Trump to release his tax returns to congress or the public, and not doing so is not a dictatorship.

Edited October 19, 2019 by Yzermandius19

[Cannucklehead]

Well theres many problems with that.  Why shouldn't congress be allowed to review what the president has been paying or not paying in taxes?  What if the IRS did not notice something, or if they were bribed?  What about international taxes?  I'm sure the IRS has no jurisdiction on those, and trump is an international businessman.  

[Yzermandius19]

4 minutes ago, Cannucklehead said:

Well theres many problems with that.  Why shouldn't congress be allowed to review what the president has been paying or not paying in taxes?  What if the IRS did not notice something, or if they were bribed?  What about international taxes?  I'm sure the IRS has no jurisdiction on those, and trump is an international businessman.  

There is no law requiring Trump to release his tax returns to congress or the public, that information being forcefully released to congress or the public will not solve the problems, it will simply politicize the situation further and make it worse. The IRS wants to nail Trump to wall, they have not been bribed, and they are not covering up his crimes.

Trump has a right to privacy, if you don't like that, change the law to force anyone running for POTUS to release them, but until then, Trump ain't gonna cave to you, nor should he. If he releases some of them, you will simply claim the smoking gun is in the returns he didn't release.

Edited October 19, 2019 by Yzermandius19

[Cannucklehead]

2 minutes ago, Yzermandius19 said:

There is no law requiring Trump to release his tax returns to congress or the public, that information being released to congress or the public will not solve the problems. The IRS wants to nail Trump to wall, they have not been bribed, and they are not covering up his crimes.

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/oct/11/trump-tax-returns-house-of-representatives-congress

 

 

Better luck next time.  

[Yzermandius19]

6 minutes ago, Cannucklehead said:

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/oct/11/trump-tax-returns-house-of-representatives-congress

 

 

Better luck next time.  

If Trump was breaking the law by not releasing his tax returns, the Democrats would have tried to impeach him over it, yet they haven't. There is no such law, a federal appeals court in DC is in the bag for the Democrats, their decision is entirely a political one, not based on any law, their decision will never be upheld by the SCOTUS, if it even got that far.

Also, from your article:
 

Quote

The list of documents makes no mention of Trump’s tax returns, which are the subject of separate legal disputes.

Better luck next time. Next time, try actually reading the links you post, and you won't look like such an idiot.

Edited October 19, 2019 by Yzermandius19

[Cannucklehead]

I guess you stopped reading there then?  Typical.  

[Yzermandius19]

5 minutes ago, Cannucklehead said:

I guess you stopped reading there then?  Typical.  

There is no law dummy. The only reason the SOME past president's released SOME of their tax returns, is because they wanted to, they were not forced to do so.

Edited October 19, 2019 by Yzermandius19

[Cannucklehead]

Neal claimed that Congress “has a duty to conduct oversight of departments and officials,” and in this case, that duty involves evaluating the IRS policy to audit all presidents’ tax returns. The letter cites a 1924 law that gives the House Ways and Means Committee the power to request tax returns from the Treasury Department for review in closed session.

[Dougie93]

33 minutes ago, Cannucklehead said:

Neal claimed that Congress “has a duty to conduct oversight of departments and officials,” and in this case, that duty involves evaluating the IRS policy to audit all presidents’ tax returns. The letter cites a 1924 law that gives the House Ways and Means Committee the power to request tax returns from the Treasury Department for review in closed session.

Separation of powers,  just because some partisan hack congressmen claims something, doesn't make it true

The IRS is the Executive Branch, congress doesn't actually control it.

The Judiciary has sided with the Executive Branch, congress has no right to see the Presidents personal tax returns, never has.

The tax return disclosure is a political choice, if the President doesn't feel the need to disclose them to win the election, that's his choice.

Trump doesn't need to pander to these clowns, his base hates them with a passion, so they got nothing, Trump will win the election with ease.

Edited October 19, 2019 by Dougie93

[WestCanMan]

1 hour ago, Cannucklehead said:

I hope you really dont believe that congress is financially illiterate.  

Did you see Schiff's interpretation of Trump's phone call? They don't have to be illiterate, they will just act like they always do.

"OMG Trump colluded with Mongolia to racistly cheat on his tax returns on a bed in a Ulan Batur hotel room with some bleach and a rope! 4 witness already testified that they know nothing about it, so it has to be believed! Now we are in a recession and islamic state has totally re-taken their lost land because of Trump! This is proof that if he loses the election he will try to remain on as President! By the power vested in CNN, everyone else in the country is exonerated and all of the investigators in the country will focus on Trump. We will arrest his associates on charges unrelated to their dealings with Trump and offer them reduced sentences for their completely legitimate testimony. God willing, we will get another Democrat on the throne in 2020 and the rioting, looting and cop-killing can resume!"

[Rue]

19 hours ago, Yzermandius19 said:

You continue to cling to the hope that there is a smoking gun in his tax returns just because you haven't personally seen them all, and neither has the public, as if that is the only way to tell. Give it up already.

I am not clinging to any hope. Its the other way around actually as you and Trump supporters blindly ignore what has happened:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/ny-trump-tax-returns-1.5311596?cmp=rss

A US District Court Judge ordered his tax returns released and Trump appealed. He appealed because he does not want to release hush money paid to Stormy Daniels which of course none of you Trump supporters have an issue with, Of course none of you have any issue with his repeated bankruptcies and tax returns already released that show he avoided paying taxes playing the tax system. Hey now. How does that work. This is a man who claims he is a brilliant businessman and his sole claim of credibility when it comes to running businesses is that he used tax loopholes to avoid paying tax for years while at the same time claiming he  earned millions while avoiding  paying thousands of people he employed by using bankruptcy proceedings  repeatedly to avoid paying. There's a role model and Saint.  Mr. America, man of the people. Lol. Please continue with Donald the Martyr and how is above the law.

 

 

Edited October 20, 2019 by Rue

[Rue]

To be clear here is the issue the Trump supporters on this forum dismiss as only  politically motivated and I am quoting it from: source: https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/ny-trump-tax-returns-1.5311596?cmp=rss

"Trump's lawyers have said that Vance's investigation is politically motivated and that the request for tax records should be stopped because Trump is immune from any criminal probe as long as he is president.

The judge swept that claim aside as overly broad.

"As the court reads it, presidential immunity would stretch to cover every phase of criminal proceedings, including investigations, grand jury proceedings and subpoenas, indictment, prosecution, arrest, trial, conviction, and incarceration," Marrero wrote. "That constitutional protection presumably would encompass any conduct, at any time, in any forum, whether federal or state, and whether the president acted alone or in concert with other individuals." "

So The above is what is being appealed.

What precipitated the above was:

"Cohen is serving a three-year prison sentence for crimes that included campaign finance violations in connection with the hush money.

Trump was never charged, though prosecutors said publicly that he was aware of and directed the illegal payments. Justice Department policy has long been that sitting presidents cannot be charged criminally.".....

...Cohen turned over copies of financial statements he said the president provided to Deutsche Bank during a 2014 effort to buy the Buffalo Bills. The statements showed Trump's net worth soaring from $4.55 billion US in 2012 to $8.66 billion US in 2013."

So with the above in mind,  I ask this, why do Trump supporters on this board blank out the full context of issues involving Trump and reduce every issue that deals with him  to a political conspiracy against him by his haters.?

What world do you guys live in? He's no martyr. He is a deeply flawed individual with some serious issues that the public has a right to seek clarity on. No President is above the laws he demands others to follow. He's A tax scam artist not some  role model or Saint.

Please you supporters of Trump explain to me how is it someone who reported financial losses of $1.7 billion from 1985 to 1994 is a role model of someone who can run business let alone the US economy.

Here are the tax issues you Trump supporters ignore in the most simple of terms so you can understand them:

https://www.cnn.com/2019/05/07/politics/trump-tax-returns-losses/index.html

His entire business record was built on avoiding paying taxes. That is the role model you admire? Good on you. You like someone who avoids paying taxes. Here is the problem those of us have who don't hero worship tax dodgers. This man used the bankruptcy process repeatedly to avoid paying thousands of employees he hired.

He's no hero. He played the legal system to avoid being honest and upfront and paying taxes on supposed income earned and he used the legal system to avoid paying employees. You think that is admirable?  That's your role model-someone who claims to be a successful businessman by claiming to lose billions to avoid paying tax?

Save it. Those are brown stains on his pants not an image of Jesus.

 

 

 

 

Edited October 20, 2019 by Rue

[Yzermandius19]

The district court is from DC, they are the biggest Democrat partisan hacks their are, bigger than California or New York even. Putting your faith in the them to make an impartial decision regarding Trump, is laughable. There is no law that he has to release his tax returns, stop being dumb and assuming that because some hack court says he has to release them, that doesn't mean that is even close to the truth and will never hold up in a higher court.

Edited October 20, 2019 by Yzermandius19

[Dougie93]

25 minutes ago, Yzermandius19 said:

The district court is from DC, they are the biggest Democrat partisan hacks their are, bigger than California or New York even. Putting your faith in the them to make an impartial decision regarding Trump, is laughable. There is no law that he has to release his tax returns, stop being dumb and assuming that because some hack court says he has to release them, that doesn't mean that is even close to the truth and will never hold up in a higher court.

Jooish Bowlshevik Conspiracy doesn't care, all that matters is his insecurity aboot being at the mercy of the American Information Age Revolution.

Knee jerk fear of being displaced by the onset of Manifest Destiny.

Big Daddy Trump President of Canada is just a fetish,  the revolution doesn't stop with Trump, he's merely a messenger.

Obama was even more dangerous to Canada, much more insidious, because Canadians let their guards down to the Democrats.

Stoopid, because as much as the Democrats fawn over Canadian socialism, as socialists themselves, they are the ones who want to freeze Canada out.

Who invoked the Buy American again?  It was Obama, in his American Recovery and Reinvestment Act of 2009

The Democrats are the ones who want to adopt the Canadian way, which is protectionism and supply management.

Canadian lefties are not free traders, but neither are  American lefties.  It's the Democrats who will cut Canadian throats, by their own Canadian doctrine.

Just desserts if there ever was.  Beggar thy neighbor Canada gets beggared into an economic grave of its own making.

Edited October 20, 2019 by Dougie93

[WestCanMan]

4 hours ago, Rue said:

So with the above in mind,  I ask this, why do Trump supporters on this board blank out the full context of issues involving Trump and reduce every issue that deals with him  to a political conspiracy against him by his haters.?

You ask the question but you don't like the answer. It's the massive double-standard between what it takes to get a Dem indicted/convicted vs a Republican.

1) We all saw Hillary quickly skate through all the charges against her, there was actual physical evidence that she committed actual crimes, people who testified were all quickly given immunity even though they didn't give any evidence that was of value, she never had to testify under oath but when she did testify all she said was "I don't remember because I bumped my head a couple days ago" (she was in the midst of her presidential campaign and her memory wasn't causing her any trouble at all during long campaign speeches and debates), her husband just randomly (yet covertly) met the AG on a tarmac two days before they exonerated her (but all they did was talk about their grandkids, and Bill Clinton doesn't have grandkids).

Do you see a pattern where Dems just say "we never talked about it, we completely ignored the elephant in the room" and CNN says "they never talked about it, the story is closed". The Clintons did it and now the Bidens did it with both China and Ukraine, they get a CNN exoneration - an exoneration that you fully and unquestioningly accept. The Dems also just say "I don't remember" over and over and that's sufficient. Comey did it, Hillary always does it. The Dems could say "I don't know how those bodies got in the trunk of my car", CNN would just say "it's now known that they don't know how the bodies got in the trunk of their car" and you'd turn the topic to "Trump extorted the Ukrainian Prez and tried to get him to fake crimes by Biden."

2) We all saw two full years of BS allegations of Russian collusion when "we were on the threshold of impeachment" every other day. Then at the end we find out that there was never any evidence of actual collusion. Manafort was put in jail on unrelated charges and offered a reduced sentence for, obviously coerced, testimony and you didn't even bat an eye. That's serious banana republic/gestapo crap that you should be worried about. But CNN and their sycophants say "Manafort was jailed for Russian collusion". Nope. Absolutely 100% not true, at all.

There's more. Kavanaugh, Smollett, other Trump charges/allegations, etc. 

Long story short, when the Dems and CNN say they have proof that it's 100% certain that someone committed a crime, or say that someone didn't commit a crime, my probability meter doesn't budge, at all. They have a solid, unblemished record of blatantly lying to us about these things. 

 

There absolutely is an established track record of Trump's haters conspiring against him. Only a complete idiot would say otherwise. Van Jones said that collusion was "a big nothingburger" a year before the investigation ended and some people still won't give up on that crap. 

For Pete's sake Rue, you know all this. There are people here who I think could actually be hoodwinked by all of this. You're not one of them.