Liberals back CSIS in torture lawsuit - and go even Further!

[Keepitsimple]

Say it ain't so! Say it ain't so!

Sunny Ways.......let's see where they end up on C51.

OTTAWA—The Liberal government has taken up the former Conservative government’s legal fight against an apology and compensation for three Canadians tortured in the Middle East, despite voting in favour of the former detainees’ cause while they sat in opposition.

As well, in aggressively defending the actions of CSIS and trying to prevent the release of thousands of unredacted documents that a judge is now poring over, the Liberals are going further than their Conservative predecessors did to protect CSIS sources.
Lawyers for Prime Minister Justin Trudeau’s Liberal government are seeking retroactive blanket anonymity for spies and their sources and have filed an appeal in a civil lawsuit launched by the three men with that goal in mind. A Conservative bill last year, C-44, which enacted source protection, was not made retroactive.

Link: http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2016/02/06/liberals-back-csis-in-torture-lawsuit.html

Edited February 8, 2016 by Keepitsimple

[PIK]

Well he just announced that the jets are coming home with their tails between their legs and we just thru another billion away. I have never been so embarrassed as I am now, just what do the airmen and airwomen think ,or the whole military. Just think the liberals here used to say that harper ruin our relations with our allies, what a crock that was. Trudeau is pissing off our allies and wants to cozy up to Iran, and any other dictator he can find.

[On Guard for Thee]

Well he just announced that the jets are coming home with their tails between their legs and we just thru another billion away. I have never been so embarrassed as I am now, just what do the airmen and airwomen think ,or the whole military. Just think the liberals here used to say that harper ruin our relations with our allies, what a crock that was. Trudeau is pissing off our allies and wants to cozy up to Iran, and any other dictator he can find.

Perhaps you should acquaint yourself with Josh Earnest's official reply to the F 18 announcement before you go off half cocked with comments about pissing off our allies.

[Big Guy]

Well he just announced that the jets are coming home with their tails between their legs and we just thru another billion away. I have never been so embarrassed as I am now, just what do the airmen and airwomen think ,or the whole military. Just think the liberals here used to say that harper ruin our relations with our allies, what a crock that was. Trudeau is pissing off our allies and wants to cozy up to Iran, and any other dictator he can find.

I am applauding our jets coming home and hope every Canadian comes home soon. We would not have lost a cent if Harper had decided on a Canada first foreign policy rather than "Me too USA". What pisses me off and embarrasses me are the civilian armchair quarterbacks who are always ready to give up others lives to satisfy some personal political agenda.

Well done JT! It would be easy to listen to the shouts of those outraged war mongers and renege on an election promise. It is time the rest of the world saw Canada as a peace loving country with its own foreign policy. I hope that foreign policy will include staying out of foreign civil wars.

[WestCanMan]

Perhaps you should acquaint yourself with Josh Earnest's official reply to the F 18 announcement before you go off half cocked with comments about pissing off our allies.

Josh Earnest is a bit of a clown, but I wouldn't mind seeing his reply. Do you have a link? Google is just bringing up him talking about Trump

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[On Guard for Thee]

Josh Earnest is a bit of a clown, but I wouldn't mind seeing his reply. Do you have a link? Google is just bringing up him talking about Trump

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You may see him as a clown if you like but he does speak for the US administration. I heard his comments on TV so don't see a link.

[poochy]

Well, it might be two faced, but it's hard to complain if it's the sensible thing to do, id rather they get it right (if it is, idk) than do what they have done with the jets just for the sake of being different than the last guy.

[WestCanMan]

This is just a case of reality setting in for our naive PM.

When he was a member of the opposition he could cry wolf every time the Gov't made a move, now he is in the position where he has to follow his words up with actions and it's not so easy anymore.

Like I said before he was PM, trying to keep 10 million sq km of Canada safe from terrorist threats requires more than just polite questions and getting proper search warrants. Anyone charged with such a monumental task is going to have to bend a few rules, and that includes more than just reading WestCanMan's emails if they feel the need.


I do find it interesting/alarming though that the gov't can't just tell a judge to keep "thousands of unredacted documents" private. If they have to find a member of csis guilty of something and take some kind of action that's one thing but just throwing our dirty laundry out there and making it accessible to the world is just insanely stupid. All those losers in IS who are beheading journalists so that they can commit genocide in private would love to prove that some creeps got waterboarded or something by CSIS.

[On Guard for Thee]

This is just a case of reality setting in for our naive PM.

When he was a member of the opposition he could cry wolf every time the Gov't made a move, now he is in the position where he has to follow his words up with actions and it's not so easy anymore.

Like I said before he was PM, trying to keep 10 million sq km of Canada safe from terrorist threats requires more than just polite questions and getting proper search warrants. Anyone charged with such a monumental task is going to have to bend a few rules, and that includes more than just reading WestCanMan's emails if they feel the need.

I do find it interesting/alarming though that the gov't can't just tell a judge to keep "thousands of unredacted documents" private. If they have to find a member of csis guilty of something and take some kind of action that's one thing but just throwing our dirty laundry out there and making it accessible to the world is just insanely stupid. All those losers in IS who are beheading journalists so that they can commit genocide in private would love to prove that some creeps got waterboarded or something by CSIS.

Proper oversight of CSIS is important so they don't read your emails and possibly react inappropriately without convincing a hopefully impartial judge. And please don't trot out that old saw about "if you have nothing to hide...blah blah blah." Existing laws have kept us just as safe but also respected our privacy. I like a bit of privacy.

[Special Delivery]

I think the OP has taken things waaaaaay out of context. Can we see the entire documentation and not just a few quotes?

[WestCanMan]

Proper oversight of CSIS is important so they don't read your emails and possibly react inappropriately without convincing a hopefully impartial judge. And please don't trot out that old saw about "if you have nothing to hide...blah blah blah." Existing laws have kept us just as safe but also respected our privacy. I like a bit of privacy.

Proper oversight of the people csis is watching is more important than your ability to send emails privately. Most people tend to have a bloated sense of entitlement and a lack of concern for the greater good. Noone wants to pay taxes, they don't see the value in the roads they use, the schools their children attend, the value of having police and ambulances and doctors ready to help them, etc. They want to keep every cent they make so they can get nicer shoes and they think that they get to send mass emails with utmost privacy. Too bad.

Privacy is for your home life. You and your wife and kids get privacy. You get privacy with your doctors. Your business gets privacy from other businesses. What privacy beyond that is of the utmost importance?

You won't get it anyways, regardless of what csis and the fbi and cia are "restricted from snooping into". Get over it.

[On Guard for Thee]

Proper oversight of the people csis is watching is more important than your ability to send emails privately. Most people tend to have a bloated sense of entitlement and a lack of concern for the greater good. Noone wants to pay taxes, they don't see the value in the roads they use, the schools their children attend, the value of having police and ambulances and doctors ready to help them, etc. They want to keep every cent they make so they can get nicer shoes and they think that they get to send mass emails with utmost privacy. Too bad.

Privacy is for your home life. You and your wife and kids get privacy. You get privacy with your doctors. Your business gets privacy from other businesses. What privacy beyond that is of the utmost importance?

You won't get it anyways, regardless of what csis and the fbi and cia are "restricted from snooping into". Get over it.

Trying to conflate paying taxes with a right to privacy is nothing more than red herring. People do know they have to have roads and doctors etc., and they have to pay for it. C51 gives CSIS too much power to wield without proper oversight. Of course they will snoop, but they should have to convince someone impartial (a judge) that they actually have something that justifies kicking my door down and throwing me and jail without even charging me. Luckily Trudeau has agreed to repeal the worst part of that bill, as well as a bunch of others. I hope he gets to it soon.

[waldo]

I think the OP has taken things waaaaaay out of context. Can we see the entire documentation and not just a few quotes?

without even bothering to look into the merits of what MLW member Simple is providing, if you accept it outright, the more complete/correct wording in his OP title would be: Liberals back Harper Conservatives backing CSIS in torture lawsuit - and go even Further!

(apparently... that going "Further" (than Harper Conservative) emphasis is, uhhh... sumthin about retroactive)... if you accept the premise of the OP as presented.

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[eyeball]

Liberals are going further than their Conservative predecessors

Recall why real lefties warned why leaving a bigger more robust dictator's tool kit for the next dictator was a really stupid thing to do.

I recall how it's not mattered a single bit who was in charge of Canada's fisheries and especially why.

The utter obliviousness of Canadians to it all is a spectacle all of its own.

[Rue]

Ah there it is. Trudeau the two faced hypocrite is justified in being one because he's just repeating a Harper policy. Brilliant Waldo brilliant. As usual you missed the point zip zap zam over your head again and I do not refer to an F-18 either.

Oh let me explain it Waldo. Trudeau criticized Harper for the very policy he now supports. Saying he is only following what Harper initiated is not the issue. Being dead against it and now supporting it that's the issue Waldo. Here let me explain it in easy words-

FLIP FLOP.

Oy gevalt my attempt to explain makes me feel like Jed Clampett trying to explain something to Jethro.

Here let's try explain this next issue with F18's. Trudeau got up in Parliament and referred to F 18's as phallic symbols...its there in Hansard...Lordee Lord he suggested our F18's were penises....big shiny ones. Shame on Stephen Harper he said for playing with his penises/F 18's. Go on Waldo read back Justin's comments comparing F18's to penises.

So now he's bringing his penises home. However he will keep refuelers in the mission as long as they only refuel some other country's penises. There then. Its not rocket science. Its about penises. Trudeau called his F18's penises and he made it clear he feels uncomfortable using penises. He has no problem refueling someone else's penis, just not his own. Better still, he has no problem putting his soldiers on the ground to use laser lights to point the way so another country's penis can do the shooting he just don't want his penis shooting off. Yah yah got it. F18's are big phallic symbols as he called them and got forbid we use them. Hands off. Don't touch or shoot off your penises Canada. That's not the Canadian way.

Oh let's spit it out shall we. We can refuel other people's jet fighters. We can assist them on the ground hit targets but we ourselves should not fly our jets. Talk about a ridiculous absurd message.

The mission Canada will be doing should be commended. The pulling of the jets however is a friggin joke. But hey think of it this way Trudeau is penalizing Canada for having F18 penises.

Phallic symbols he called them. Yah we got it. He feels comfortable now that he's cut off his penises. Got it.

Lord excuse me if I am circumspect about this (inside Jewish joke) but but I think someone has an identity issue and penis anxiety and acts it out via the Canadian identity.

For those of you who want to cut it off, guess what-by the time Trudeau is done with the Armed Forces in the years to come, I can assure you Canada will have no scrotum at all.

Hey now, I know a group once whose leader had them all cut off their penises. Then he said aliens would come and bring them into the promised land. Now that guy and his followers committed suicide.

Waldo be careful. You sound like Trudeau has you in a spell. Don't get too cocky with his positions..no wait how could you...they are pointless...man I could go on and on.

It all makes sense. Canada's emblem is the Beaver not an F18 pee pee.

Edited February 10, 2016 by Rue

[waldo]

were penises.... playing with his penises... to penises...his penises... country's penises... about penises...F18's penises... using penises... someone else's penis...country's penis... his penis... your penises...F18 penises... cut off his penises... penis anxiety... cut off their penises

....man I could go on and on.

pardon! Context matters! Canada was participating within a non-combat role and time was approaching to extend upon that commitment. Of course, as Harper was laying the groundwork (towards finally getting his 'war on'), he extolled the virtues of "the nobility of combat". And as it turned out, Harper had already made a commitment to U.S. officials even before any expected "debate/discussion" on that new role in Parliament. In the face of the initial Iraq quagmire that Harper so insisted Canada join in on, there was appropriate questioning as to just what Harper was leading Canada into... what role, what period of commitment, what measures of success, etc.. Apparently... Liberal Party leader Justin Trudeau raised concerns that Harper hadn't made the case for an expanded combat role in Iraq suggesting, whipping out (your penis fixation) just wasn't enough in making the case for an expanded combat military role... that more than just "shiny toys and the nobility of combat" was required. And uhhh... by the by... it was the same Harper 6 months later coming back to the 'further combat expansion well' to once again extend Canada's military participation into Syria.

as for ending the direct participation in bombing (that 'token' CF-18 contribution), Justin Trudeau has been very consistent in describing the rationale - Canada has finite resources and the Trudeau government's position is that Canada can realize more return for that resource investment, can provide a greater contribution as detailed within the new commitment/role strategy. Given the relatively immediate positive feedback received from officials at the U.S. Pentagon, U.S. Obama admin, NATO and other allies... many other leaders agree with the new strategy/approach.

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[bush_cheney2004]

....Here let's try explain this next issue with F18's. Trudeau got up in Parliament and referred to F 18's as phallic symbols...its there in Hansard...Lordee Lord he suggested our F18's were penises....big shiny ones. Shame on Stephen Harper he said for playing with his penises/F 18's. Go on Waldo read back Justin's comments comparing F18's to penises.

So now he's bringing his penises home. However he will keep refuelers in the mission as long as they only refuel some other country's penises.

This is brilliant....Mr. Trudeau has been "hoisted by his own petard".

[On Guard for Thee]

This is brilliant....Mr. Trudeau has been "hoisted by his own petard".

Nope, but he has though been elected leader by his own people. Now we are starting to see some sensible decisions coming from Ottawa.

[eyeball]

When Canada has its 9/11 and Trudeau talks again about understanding why so many people hate us I wonder if it will occur to him to go look in a mirror?

[Rue]

Yes Eyeball, context...lol....calling F-18 penises oh bu wait...now your context...that terorists only attack people because they deserve it. Terrorists will leave you alone if you don't shoot or point your F8 penises at them.

Brilliant logic Eye. Terrorists only attack bad people because they show their penises... never penisless people. Brilliant.

In your world if you hide form terrorists, poof they never hurt you.

Right. Dang I am not sure what is more absurd, Justin's fear of silver penises or your bad thigs only happen to bad people analogies.

This just in a new Canadian national anthem

Oy Canada, my home and penisless land,

due North and pee

with penis anxiety

Oy Canada

due North and pee

Oy Canada we hide for thee

Oy Canada we never will point when we pee

Edited February 11, 2016 by Rue

[waldo]

Oy Canada, my home and penisless land,

due North and pee

with penis anxiety

notwithstanding your cocksure posturing, not everyone shares your desire for... or envy of... it. Not that there's anything wrong with that.

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