Moonlight Graham Posted January 27, 2016 Report Share Posted January 27, 2016 Finally had a chance to watch the speech. It was a good speech, sometimes a great speech. It's still really annoying though how he uses that phoney folksy accent of his when making his populist speeches. So it's still just a speech, and I wish it had more truth in his own action behind it. Obama is the master of saying great things and then not following through on implementation. A hypocrite in a lot of ways, but in others he does follow through so some credit deserved. The best part of the speech was the "worst kept secret in Washington" part about campaign finance reform. Interesting the things he didn't mention. Nothing about police-on-black violence, and nothing about guns/gun violence whatsoever. Paul Ryan sitting behind Obama with that grin and the head-tilt looking all smug the entire speech was pretty annoying Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Guy Posted January 27, 2016 Report Share Posted January 27, 2016 I believe that one of the qualifications we look for in leadership is a positive attitude and an ability to "rally the troops". This is true for all political parties in North America. The most memorable speeches in history have been given by leaders in times of tragedy and chaos where the public fears for the future. This is true from Franklin Delano Roosevelt's Pearl Harbor Address to the American People to Bush's speech from the smoldering ruins of New York after 9/11. There are very few things that a President can do. Uplifting the spirits of the nation is one of the few. Elections are won and lost on fear or hope. Governance requires hope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonlight Graham Posted January 27, 2016 Report Share Posted January 27, 2016 There are very few things that a President can do. Uplifting the spirits of the nation is one of the few. The POTUS can use his leadership to try to bend policy in Congress his way. On a bunch of things Obama talks but I don't see him acting, or his actions completely contradict his words. Obama has talked about campaign finance reform in his SOTU speech etc., but where has the action and legislative leadership been on his part? He lead health care reform, why not this? https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/obamas-campaign-finance-reform-plans-have-faded/2013/04/29/8342977e-ae7d-11e2-a986-eec837b1888b_story.html http://www.bloomberg.com/politics/articles/2014-12-15/rip-obama-the-campaignfinance-reformer Obama is great at uplifting spirits but a lot of the time it's just gums flapping in the wind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shady Posted January 28, 2016 Report Share Posted January 28, 2016 I've seen this show before. I say something; you say it's not true; I provide a cite that says it's true; you disappear. http://www.multpl.com/us-gdp-growth-rate/table/by-year http://www.tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth-annualYour numbers don't make any sense. For instance, you claim a 2012 gdp growth of 3.24%. How do you arrive at that number when the highest growth of any quarter in 2012 was 2.7%? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shady Posted January 28, 2016 Report Share Posted January 28, 2016 http://data.worldbank.org/indicator/NY.GDP.MKTP.KD.ZG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shady Posted January 28, 2016 Report Share Posted January 28, 2016 http://www.statista.com/statistics/188185/percent-chance-from-preceding-period-in-real-gdp-in-the-us/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BubberMiley Posted January 28, 2016 Report Share Posted January 28, 2016 http://www.tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth-annual Your numbers don't make any sense. For instance, you claim a 2012 gdp growth of 3.24%. How do you arrive at that number when the highest growth of any quarter in 2012 was 2.7%? I just quote the numbers, I don't compile them. Whether it was 3.24% or 2.7% is kind of irrelevant though. Growth is growth, and it would have been negative for a long time if not for the stimulus spending. Even GWB got that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted January 28, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 28, 2016 .... Even GWB got that. That's why Obama continued GWB policies, including tax cuts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
On Guard for Thee Posted January 28, 2016 Report Share Posted January 28, 2016 That's why Obama continued GWB policies, including tax cuts. Except he worked to stop wars rather than starting them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shady Posted January 28, 2016 Report Share Posted January 28, 2016 I just quote the numbers, I don't compile them. Whether it was 3.24% or 2.7% is kind of irrelevant though. Growth is growth, and it would have been negative for a long time if not for the stimulus spending. Even GWB got that. You should really know what numbers you're citing. The numbers you provided aren't the GDP growth from the last few years. According to your data, GDP growth under George W Bush was 6% some years, which isn't correct. Apology accepted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonlight Graham Posted January 28, 2016 Report Share Posted January 28, 2016 Except he worked to stop wars rather than starting them. He liked stopping big ground wars but liked starting and continuing little wars using bombs from the sky...without constitutionally necessary congressional approval. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
On Guard for Thee Posted January 28, 2016 Report Share Posted January 28, 2016 He liked stopping big ground wars but liked starting and continuing little wars using bombs from the sky...without constitutionally necessary congressional approval. That's true, he does have his "kill list", but at least he has got some of his soldiers out of harms way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BubberMiley Posted January 28, 2016 Report Share Posted January 28, 2016 You should really know what numbers you're citing. The numbers you provided aren't the GDP growth from the last few years. According to your data, GDP growth under George W Bush was 6% some years, which isn't correct. Apology accepted.My numbers were sourced to the US Bureau of Economic Analysis. Until you show me how they're wrong, I shall believe them. Now go fret about how they arrived at the difference in a percentage point, and avoid acknowledging the obvious positive effect of the infrastructure investments during that time. (Oh, and apology accepted for saying the numbers were fantasy when they clearly weren't. With weeks of work, you couldn't find anything that cite it more than a point lower.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shady Posted January 28, 2016 Report Share Posted January 28, 2016 My numbers were sourced to the US Bureau of Economic Analysis. Until you show me how they're wrong, I shall believe them. Now go fret about how they arrived at the difference in a percentage point, and avoid acknowledging the obvious positive effect of the infrastructure investments during that time. (Oh, and apology accepted for saying the numbers were fantasy when they clearly weren't. With weeks of work, you couldn't find anything that cite it more than a point lower.) No, your numbers don't make any sense. I aleardy explained it to you. I've already cited the actual GDP growth numbers from multiple sources. I'll ask again. How do you arrive at a 2012 growth rate of over 3% when the highest quarter of growth that year was 2.7%? Do you even know what data you're posting? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shady Posted January 28, 2016 Report Share Posted January 28, 2016 United States GDP Annual Growth Rate http://www.tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth-annual Actual GDP growth rates from the U.S. Bureau of Economic Analysis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BubberMiley Posted January 29, 2016 Report Share Posted January 29, 2016 (edited) United States GDP Annual Growth Rate http://www.tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth-annual Actual GDP growth rates from the U.S. Bureau of Economic Analysis. Yes, similar numbers to what I posted. Not fantasy numbers at all, right? Both depict modest growth. You can get caught up in the miniscule differences in how they compile data in order to deflect from the fact that your claim they were fantasy numbers was ridiculous, and from the fact that Obama's infrastructure spending saved us from what could have been Depression-era double-digit negative growth. Edited January 29, 2016 by BubberMiley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted January 29, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 29, 2016 For sure...Obama's "Buy American" policy sure saved "us"...look at how great Canada is doing now ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BubberMiley Posted January 29, 2016 Report Share Posted January 29, 2016 See, even the resident GOP cheerleader has to face reality sometime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shady Posted January 29, 2016 Report Share Posted January 29, 2016 See, even the resident GOP cheerleader has to face reality sometime.I answered my question to you for you. Using your own source. You're welcome and apology accepted. In the future though, it's best to know what kind of data you're posting.http://www.multpl.com/us-real-gdp-growth-rate/table/by-year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BubberMiley Posted January 29, 2016 Report Share Posted January 29, 2016 I answered my question to you for you. Using your own source. You're welcome and apology accepted. In the future though, it's best to know what kind of data you're posting. http://www.multpl.com/us-real-gdp-growth-rate/table/by-year In the future, try and come up with an obfuscation plan a little sooner.Apology accepted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shady Posted January 29, 2016 Report Share Posted January 29, 2016 In the future, try and come up with an obfuscation plan a little sooner.Apology accepted. Try to post inflation adjusted numbers, and not try to sneak in non adjusted ones. It was a good attempt though! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BubberMiley Posted January 29, 2016 Report Share Posted January 29, 2016 Try to post inflation adjusted numbers, and not try to sneak in non adjusted ones. It was a good attempt though! Nevertheless, after that pathetic attempt to redirect the topic, the stimulus spending was successful in creating some modest growth in the economy when there was a very real threat of continued negative growth for years to come. So in response to Sharkman's original point, yes, Obama does get it. Do you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shady Posted January 29, 2016 Report Share Posted January 29, 2016 Nevertheless, after that pathetic attempt to redirect the topic, the stimulus spending was successful in creating some modest growth in the economy when there was a very real threat of continued negative growth for years to come. So in response to Sharkman's original point, yes, Obama does get it. Do you? No. The stimulus hasn't created growth. Even Obama admitted that there's no such thing as shovel ready jobs. The recession officially ended and positive growth had happened before most of the stimulus was even implemented. Again, nice try. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BubberMiley Posted January 29, 2016 Report Share Posted January 29, 2016 No. The stimulus hasn't created growth. Even Obama admitted that there's no such thing as shovel ready jobs. The recession officially ended and positive growth had happened before most of the stimulus was even implemented. Again, nice try. Uh, that just shows how the stimulus and the promise of further stimulus worked. Why do I even try to debate with such economic illiteracy? LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shady Posted January 29, 2016 Report Share Posted January 29, 2016 Uh, that just shows how the stimulus and the promise of further stimulus worked. Why do I even try to debate with such economic illiteracy? LOL Right. I have a rock that keeps bears away. Since there's no bears around, I'm assuming it's working. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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