Can I ask a question about Cultural Appropriation?

November 26, 2015

Things like this should be covered under trademark and copyright law. If a region in France the only one allowed to sell wines called "Champagnes" then native bands should have ownership over native designs.

Didn't something in a similar vein happen with a BC bands jacket about twenty years ago? I'm going to have to look that up.

Edit> Cowichan Sweaters.

Edited November 26, 2015 by bcsapper

jacee · November 26, 2015

Interesting article. I would say this was wrong on the level that someone is profiting from the appropriation, passing it off as their own work. I hope they are suitably embarrassed. Also, $845 for a sweatshirt?

Then there's, "Dsquaw" line???

I'm not sure why anyone would call their fashion line "Dc*nt".

With apologies for language, but that's what it means.

Obviously they had no clue.

Seems like they have a fair bit to answer for...

Edit> I do have to say, upon reflection, that the thing that bothers me about this is that it almost amounts to individual theft, not cultural appropriation. I know it is both, but it is the former that bothers me.

I think it's both. The designs are spiritual, prayers.

See headdress issue added above. Military medals would be one comparison. Also spiritual and leadership meanings.

Each feather is given, bestowed with a meaning I believe.

One doesn't just make one's own headdress.

They are ceremonial.

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Edited November 27, 2015 by Michael Hardner
language

BC_chick · November 26, 2015

What bugs me is people telling other people what should offend them.

Reminds me of a verbally abusive ex boyfriend who always said I'm too sensitive and he's 'just joking'.

jacee · November 26, 2015

Reminds me of a verbally abusive ex boyfriend who always said I'm too sensitive and he's 'just joking'.

Good analogy.

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Wilber · November 26, 2015

Reminds me of a verbally abusive ex boyfriend who always said I'm too sensitive and he's 'just joking'.

At least you had the good sense to make him an ex boyfriend.

November 26, 2015

See headdress issue added above.

That's a good article, and it goes someway towards answering my original question. The significance of a cultural aspect matters. I would certainly look down on anyone who wore military medals with the express purpose of pretending that had earned them. Less so if they did so because they simply did not realize, or did not care about their significance, but I certainly understand the distress of those close to the issue, even if that were the case.

Edited November 26, 2015 by bcsapper

jacee · November 26, 2015

Didn't something in a similar vein happen with a BC bands jacket about twenty years ago? I'm going to have to look that up.

Edit> Cowichan Sweaters.

Ya, but that was more an intellectual property issue as Cowichan sweaters are produced by the Band for sale.

http://www.cbc.ca/beta/news/canada/british-columbia/cowichan-tribes-reach-olympic-sweater-deal-1.830116

jacee · November 26, 2015

That's a good article, and it goes someway towards answering my original question. The significance of a cultural aspect matters. I would certainly look down on anyone who wore military medals with the express purpose of pretending that had earned them. Less so if they did so because they simply did not realize, or did not care about their significance, but I certainly understand the distress of those close to the issue, even if that were the case.

Ya that would be fraud ... and I'm pretty sure soldiers would be upset if someone "did not realize or did not care"too.

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Edited November 26, 2015 by jacee

November 26, 2015

Ya that would be fraud ... But I'm pretty sure soldiers would be upset if someone "did not realize or did not care"too.

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True, it's just that good natured ignorance is easier to forgive.

-1=e^ipi · November 27, 2015

now you take the cultural symbols?

Groups of people don't own cultural symbols. No one controls who their ancestors were. Therefore, assigning 'culture' to people based on their race or where their ancestors were from is racist. All cultures are human cultures.

Wilber · November 27, 2015

Groups of people don't own cultural symbols. No one controls who their ancestors were. Therefore, assigning 'culture' to people based on their race or where their ancestors were from is racist. All cultures are human cultures.

I agree in principle but some stereotypes can be insulting. Like designer brands, native bands who market products based on their culture should copyright a logo so customers can tell the real thing from fakes.

-1=e^ipi · November 27, 2015

Well that's why so many claims of "censorship" in these PC debates ring hollow. Most people don't have the capacity to actually censor anyone.

Yeah... It's not like there is a Gregory Elliot trial or anything...

jacee · November 27, 2015

Groups of people don't own cultural symbols. No one controls who their ancestors were. Therefore, assigning 'culture' to people based on their race or where their ancestors were from is racist.

Oh I think it's a matter of personal choice whether to participate in the culture you are born in.

Not your choice what others choose to do.

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overthere · November 27, 2015

I'm not sure why anyone would call their fashion line "Dc*nt".

With apologies for language, but that's what it means.

Obviously they had no clue.

No, that is not the meaning of the word 'squaw', now or ever.

http://www.nativeweb.org/pages/legal/squaw.html

I think you are practicing cultural misappropriation by adopting/propagating this fallacy as fact to suit your victim agenda. Shame.

Accountability Now · November 27, 2015

On the sports topic...I can see the term Redskin being offensive but I don't see how other ones like Chiefs and Blackhawks are. I know a number of First Nations hockey teams that use those very names themselves. If the term is derogatory then why is ok for them to use it? I think it's clearly an example that not all First Nations or Indigenous people find this offensive, rather it's a few squeaky wheels.

Big Guy · November 28, 2015

On the sports topic...I can see the term Redskin being offensive but I don't see how other ones like Chiefs and Blackhawks are. I know a number of First Nations hockey teams that use those very names themselves. If the term is derogatory then why is ok for them to use it? I think it's clearly an example that not all First Nations or Indigenous people find this offensive, rather it's a few squeaky wheels.

There are different rules in play. Many blacks refer to each other as "ni%%er" in conversations with each other - and find that not only acceptable but their right because they are the same color.

I find the same with Italians who call each other "w**s", Germans who call each other "squareh**ds" and Europeans who call each other "honk**s" and "polla**s".

People of the same background can call each other whatever they want and interpret it as a term of endearment or familiarity - but any "outsider" who dares to use the same term is looking for trouble.

Accountability Now · November 28, 2015

People of the same background can call each other whatever they want and interpret it as a term of endearment or familiarity - but any "outsider" who dares to use the same term is looking for trouble.

I agree with you when we're talking about an informal setting but these are official names for the organizations.

Wilber · November 28, 2015

Should the military rename its Blackhawk and Apache helicopters? Should native personnel refuse to fly or work on them. Must I stop eating pizza? Where does this nonsense end?

-1=e^ipi · November 28, 2015

Should the military rename its Blackhawk and Apache helicopters? Should native personnel refuse to fly or work on them. Must I stop eating pizza? Where does this nonsense end?

The nonsense ends when the world is like this:

video

Then we will have a utopia!

Edited November 28, 2015 by Michael Hardner
fixed video link

Hal 9000 · November 28, 2015

If the issue is about a dominant culture abusing the culture of an inferior culture as cyber pointed out, are we just accepting that white culture is superior to all the others?

If we can't do yoga, would that suggest that Indians, Hindus, Buddhists etc are all inferior to us? And, yhose making these decisions, seem to be white liberals, are white liberals in their own way telling these people that they are in fact inferior and even victims of the white race?

Will we do away with karate because we feel the Japanese are an inferior culture? No more Swedish massages...or is that ok - swedes are white.

Hal 9000 · November 28, 2015

The yoga instructors I know are kinda hippieish, spiritual types and considering the university angle, I don't think it's a stretch that the yoga instructor might lean politically left- maybe even liberal.

This means that the liberals have likely made their box so tiny, that they're having to turn on themselves and each other now.

drummindiver · November 28, 2015

Point of order please...the word "nigger" was appropriated from Latin/English language and culture.

Search Results

nig·ger

ˈniɡər/

nounoffensive

noun: nigger; plural noun: niggers

a contemptuous term for a black or dark-skinned person.

Origin

late 17th century (as an adjective): from earlier neger, from French nègre, from Spanish negro ‘black’ (see Negro)

drummindiver · November 28, 2015

So is it reasonable to assume that if culltural appropriation isn't also offensive, then it should be okay? And by offensive I mean actually offensive, not that some people find cultural appropriation itself offensive.

So, Africans took our lead and started wearing clothes and shoes.

Same as Aboriginals.

I say we call social appropriation and take it back.

People need to lighten up. Wearing a head dress is not insultive ffs.

drummindiver · November 28, 2015

On the sports topic...I can see the term Redskin being offensive but I don't see how other ones like Chiefs and Blackhawks are. I know a number of First Nations hockey teams that use those very names themselves. If the term is derogatory then why is ok for them to use it? I think it's clearly an example that not all First Nations or Indigenous people find this offensive, rather it's a few squeaky wheels.

I don`t see that Redskin is derogatory.

I don`t find paleface or cracker derogatory either.

Sticks and stones. People need to grow the fu(k up.

Wilber · November 28, 2015

Judo must be removed from the Olympics and from this day forward only Anglo Saxons are allowed to play soccer, cricket, rugby and golf. Only the French are allowed to play tennis. Yoga for god's sake. Give me a freeking break.