GostHacked Posted February 24, 2015 Report Posted February 24, 2015 You are free to protest as long as you got a permit to do so. Can you taste the freedom? Quote
Smallc Posted February 24, 2015 Report Posted February 24, 2015 When the internet predator bill was coming out, a bunch of us phoned our MPs. It was dropped. That's how things work in a democracy. You go through legal channels. Quote
Keepitsimple Posted February 24, 2015 Author Report Posted February 24, 2015 Why does the government reject oversight? If they are not doing anything wrong, then I don't understand what the fear is. Now, now....there's no need to start stating untruths (it's a softer way of saying "lies"). The government does not "reject" oversight. They have injected additional oversight into the process in the form of Judicial approval - but they have rejected any change to the structure of how oversight is done. Funny how even when people agree - there are still those that continue to argue. I think it's pretty well unanimous on this board that people think that oversight should at least be evaluated in light of the proposed changes. As to what shape oversight should take, who knows - it's a complicated issue that deserves study. Quote Back to Basics
jacee Posted February 24, 2015 Report Posted February 24, 2015 When the internet predator bill was coming out, a bunch of us phoned our MPs. It was dropped. That's how things work in a democracy. You go through legal channels. Ya I'm sure Harper's going to listen. :/ You exercise your rights your way. Others exercise rights other ways, by expressing, associating, assembling. . Quote
Black Dog Posted February 24, 2015 Report Posted February 24, 2015 I think both of you are ignoring the reality of the current crop of terrorists' motivation. They are not comfortable with Western society. We are the enemy. They want to remake us. What I am saying is that there is nothing respectful of Canadian values in that at all. This has piss-all to do with the subject at hand. Quote
jacee Posted February 24, 2015 Report Posted February 24, 2015 (edited) Why does the government reject oversight? If they are not doing anything wrong, then I don't understand what the fear is.Now, now....How very patronizing. A clue ... there's no need to start stating untruths (it's a softer way of saying "lies"). The government does not "reject" oversight. They have injected additional oversight into the process in the form of Judicial approval Only when CSIS/Harper decide they may be doing something illegal. And you can bet they will 'decide' that everything they do is legal so there will be no oversight at all. - but they have rejected any change to the structure of how oversight is done.Exactly. Funny how even when people agree - there are still those that continue to argue. I think it's pretty well unanimous on this board that people think that oversight should at least be evaluated in light of the proposed changes. As to what shape oversight should take, who knows - it's a complicated issue that deserves study.Exactly ...we do seem to agree that better oversight of CSIS/Harper's actions is necessary, but ... better oversight of CSIS/Harper is NOT going to happen. Harper has spoken. The dictatorship is in place with secret police to enforce his will against all dissent, all of his enemies (and he has no friends), with no public oversight. Now he just has to rig an election ... or cancel it for secret reasons of 'national security'. Wait for it ... . Edited February 24, 2015 by jacee Quote
Keepitsimple Posted February 24, 2015 Author Report Posted February 24, 2015 This has piss-all to do with the subject at hand. Well - not so fast.....there's a lot of things rolled into the concept of "anti-terrorism" and one of them is keeping bad people out of Canada altogether. What constitutes "bad people"? A broader definition should include people who cannot and will not accept our basic core values - or at least those that are trumpeted every day in the media. They include tolerence, inclusion and equality - and we should be very careful that the road to immigration, Permanent Residency and ultimately Citizenship - be paved with a vetting process that emphasizes these values. Quote Back to Basics
Black Dog Posted February 24, 2015 Report Posted February 24, 2015 Well - not so fast.....there's a lot of things rolled into the concept of "anti-terrorism" and one of them is keeping bad people out of Canada altogether. What constitutes "bad people"? A broader definition should include people who cannot and will not accept our basic core values - or at least those that are trumpeted every day in the media. They include tolerence, inclusion and equality - and we should be very careful that the road to immigration, Permanent Residency and ultimately Citizenship - be paved with a vetting process that emphasizes these values. Is any of this part of Bill C51? Quote
jacee Posted February 24, 2015 Report Posted February 24, 2015 Is any of this part of Bill C51? No it's a propaganda derail. . Quote
Keepitsimple Posted February 24, 2015 Author Report Posted February 24, 2015 How very patronizing. A clue ... Only when CSIS/Harper decide they may be doing something illegal. And you can bet they will 'decide' that everything they do is legal so there will be no oversight at all. Exactly. Exactly ...we do seem to agree that better oversight of CSIS/Harper's actions is necessary, but ... better oversight of CSIS/Harper is NOT going to happen. Harper has spoken. The dictatorship is in place with secret police to enforce his will against all dissent, all of his enemies (and he has no friends), with no public oversight. Now he just has to rig an election ... or cancel it for secret reasons of 'national security'. Wait for it ... . You're a real hoot Jacee! Tin-foil alert! Quote Back to Basics
jbg Posted February 24, 2015 Report Posted February 24, 2015 OK we'll send Harper and CSIS over there. Generalized Muslim - hating is not welcome here. Just my opinion That is not generalized Muslim-hating. It is rejection of the radical Muslim's restrictive views. Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
eyeball Posted February 24, 2015 Report Posted February 24, 2015 Prosecuted in a manner that's guaranteed to generate more of them. Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
overthere Posted February 24, 2015 Report Posted February 24, 2015 An enduring memory of Jean (Le Bully)Chretien: when he choked out a protester: http://www.thestar.com/sports/hockey/2012/04/13/jean_chretien_applies_shawinigan_handshake_to_don_cherry_on_beer_label.html Quote Science too hard for you? Try religion!
cybercoma Posted February 24, 2015 Report Posted February 24, 2015 Protests are completely legal. That's why cities even have permits for them! You don't have permits for illegal acts. Also, protests on most public land are perfectly okay, as long as they don't block access."Permitted protest" Think about that. You're asking for permission to protest from the people you're protesting. You don't see a conflict there? Quote
cybercoma Posted February 24, 2015 Report Posted February 24, 2015 When the internet predator bill was coming out, a bunch of us phoned our MPs. It was dropped. That's how things work in a democracy. You go through legal channels.They were under no obligation to drop it. They could have rammed it through and you still would have voted for them in the next election. Quote
PIK Posted February 24, 2015 Report Posted February 24, 2015 People talking about harpers secret police are nothing but pathetic people that have no idea what secret police are and what they do. Quote Toronto, like a roach motel in the middle of a pretty living room.
Big Guy Posted February 24, 2015 Report Posted February 24, 2015 If they did, it would not be "secret". Quote Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
Smallc Posted February 24, 2015 Report Posted February 24, 2015 Ya I'm sure Harper's going to listen. :/ He did. Governments don't always listen to protest either, nor should they. They were under no obligation to drop it. They could have rammed it through and you still would have voted for them in the next election. I have never once voted Conservative - not once. My vote is never a sure thing. See above as to their willingness or not to drop something. Quote
Smallc Posted February 24, 2015 Report Posted February 24, 2015 "Permitted protest" Think about that. You're asking for permission to protest from the people you're protesting. You don't see a conflict there? We live in a democratic society where the right to lawful non intrusive protest is constitutionally protected. We're not living in a fascist state, and you're acting like we are. Quote
jacee Posted February 24, 2015 Report Posted February 24, 2015 (edited) We live in a democratic society where the right to lawful non intrusive protest is constitutionally protected.Protest is never lawful and non intrusive. We're not living in a fascist state, and you're acting like we are.We are now.Dissent is criminalized. . Edited February 24, 2015 by jacee Quote
Keepitsimple Posted February 24, 2015 Author Report Posted February 24, 2015 Protest is never lawful and non intrusive. We are now. Dissent is criminalized. . If you want to be taken seriously - stop repeating things that make no sense. Quote Back to Basics
PIK Posted February 24, 2015 Report Posted February 24, 2015 We will see what happens if the tamils start blocking roads again. Quote Toronto, like a roach motel in the middle of a pretty living room.
guyser Posted February 24, 2015 Report Posted February 24, 2015 We will see what happens if the tamils start blocking roads again.Traffic will stop. Up next , does night follow day? When we come back, we will discuss. Quote
jacee Posted February 24, 2015 Report Posted February 24, 2015 (edited) If you want to be taken seriously - stop repeating things that make no sense.Did I say I wanted you to take me seriously?Of course not. Just food for thought. And some more ... /spy-agencys-review-group-cant-perform-oversight-role The small group watching over Canadas spy agency says it was purposely devised to be a limited, after-the-fact review body not an all-seeing oversight committee that would vet spy operations. Only Harper vets (directs) spy/secret police operations. . Edited February 24, 2015 by jacee Quote
poochy Posted February 24, 2015 Report Posted February 24, 2015 Protest is never lawful and non intrusive. We are now. Dissent is criminalized. . You have moved well into troll territory. Quote
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