Zionism is Cancer

[The_Squid]

The antisemitism cries are completely asinine.

"WOLF WOLF"!!

[Rue]

Jacee look what has happened on this board. You can find all the accusations you want levelled at me that I call people anti-semitic simply because they criticize Israel but when I have asked for the words indicating this, Ghost has not provided any, HJ has not provided any, Eye has not provided any, you haven't. You've all made the allegation about me, attacking me personally for words you claimed I said and not one set of words from me to back up your allegations.

Now you ask me when you won't to provide examples where derogatory things were said about Jews using the pretext of criticizing Israeli state policies?

Right. I get it. Your group can make all kinds of allegations about me calling them anti-semitic for no reason, but I in turn must provide words to back up my opinions but not them. Two standards, one for you, one for me.

.

Well I once again will back up my continuing argument about what I said about the unsubstantiated allegation by the lot of you that either I, or Europeans, or settler colonial extensions call people anti semites simply because they criticize Israel which by the way is not the topic of this threadbut hey why not try derail it from the actual thread right?- Wrong I am going to direct back to the thread when I am done providing you exactly what you want, yet again:

Thread-Does Israel Have The Right to Exist,

Reply 92, by Ghost

Regardless of everything, there is still a decent Jewish population on this planet. They did not survive by being weak or stupid. Manipulative and coercive, sure. But they are not weak or stupid.

Reply 102 by Ghost

No. I see it as people with, 1-money, 2-influence, and 3-political power , that are manipulative and coercive. Strip away their nationality, race, religion, and that is what it comes down to.

Reply 98 by Rue

Ghost Hacked your comment that Jews survived by being manipulative and coercive is exactly what is expected of you, a negative anti-Semitic stereotype spewed out on the forum using the pretext of discussing Israel as a state to spew it.

You provide a shining example of what anti-Semitism is and how its couched on the forum using Israel as the pretext to spew it.

Your comment is a negative subjective statement that does nothing but incite hatred to Jews. I am glad it is there for all to see and you can defend it all you want. It speaks for itself.

Reply 103 by Ghost
Which comment upset you? (smiley face)

Reply 109 by Ghost

Jews need to think outside that box. If God made the Earth then the whole planet is Holy.

Go on Jacee, explain how making insulting coments about Jews being coercive and needing to think outside the box had anything to do with the thread. They did not. What they did show is under the pretext of questioning Israel's existence Ghost used that pretext to begin insulting Jews with negative stereotypes and he found it funny and tried to dance his way out of the very words he stated, denying he meant Jews but slipped right back in to insutling Jews a few threads later.

Then we had this thread:

Thread-French Magazine Attacked by Terrorist

Reply 406- Hudson Jones,

“The Jews can learn from Muslims' response to the Paris attack which was done in the name of Islam.
The swift and powerful condemnation issued by Muslim groups all over the world will help to reduce anti-Muslim feeling and deter young Muslims from joining the jihadis.

This condemnation by Muslims contrasts strongly with the support given by most Jewish communal associations around the world to Israel’s massacre last summer of over 1,400 civilians, including over 500 children, in Gaza.”

Response from MR in Reply 408

Your attempt Hudson Jones to try twist this terrorist attack around to engage in a pissing contest between who reacts better to terrorist attacks, Muslims or Jews should be no surprise. You have aleady come on once on this thread trying to pit Muslims against Jews suggesting Jews get better treatment when people drew cartoons about them than Muslims.

This is your second attempt to try engage in a line of comment that necessarily criticizes Jews as a collective and now would suggest we did not react appropriately after this last terror attack let alone pose it in a way that compares our reactions to those in the Muslim community and can c ome upw ith an evaluation that the Muslim reaction could be quantified let alone be quantified to be "better" than the Jewish reaction.

Your comments are without any basis. They are purely subjective and they necessarily call on people to criticize Jews as a collective and suggest Jews are inferior to Muslims when we react to terror."

Now of course you know who that Hudson Jones is. He's the one who has repeatedly accused me not just Europeans and settler colonial extensions as wrongfully calling people anti semites simply because they criticize Israel.

Show me one example he provided or better still you go out and find one example where I called someone an anti semitic simply because they criticized Israeli state policy.

He hasn't you haven't. Why not? If its true produce the words....either put up or move on.

Now this is also the same Hudson Jones who called Zionism cancer. He has yet to provide his methodology for determining that just as he has provided not one example of the methodology he used to conclude all Europeans and settler colonial extensions are dupes of Zionist acrobats.

Yet he accuses me of denying the allegations he can't produce. That's the best position yet from him, he claims I deny the very thing he can't prove.

Its really simple Jacee. I have and will take your words, his and anyone else's on this board that make negative or insulting generlizations or assumptions about Jews, Israelis or Zionists and challenge them. If and when they are targetted at Jews I will then challenge them as hurtful to Jews and therefore anti semitic. Otherwise I will continue to address them not as anti semitic but anti Israeli or anti Zionist and explain why I disagree with them.

Don't play yourself with me as someone I falsely accused. My responses to you are extremely detailed and go word by word through what I said and you said.

I will repeat two last things;

1-you came on this board and stated nobody has to recognize Israel as a Jewish state.

When I then said you don't recognize Israel as a Jewish state because of that statement, you claimed I misrepresented you. So I then asked you directly, you Jacee do you personally believe Israel has a right to be Jewish. To date you won't answer. The only answer you will give me is OTHERS do not have to recognize Israel as a Jewish state. So don't play wrongfuly mispresented with me. You are the one refusing to answer except by giving a generalized negative answer to avoid answering and yes because of that refusal to answer, I get it Jacee. You can not get your state to say Jews should be allowed to have a Jewish state-not you.

You can easily state Palestinians should. You have no problems with Muslim states being just that, but you can't bring yourself to say, Jews have a right to live in a Jewish state. You say it does not matter what anyone thinks about that just Israel. Of course it does Jacee. It matters because as you are well aware Hamas and the PA have indicated they will NEVER accept the right of Jews to live in a Jewish state-that matters because it is part of their Islamic belief that Jews cannot as dhimmi ever have a state and they will not give up that basic Muslim belief.

2-When HJ described Zionism as cancer, he engaged in a subjective slur of all Zionists calling their belief in the right of Jews to live as a collective expressed through a state cancerous.

That necessarily means any Jew who wants to express their collective identity through a state in HJ's mind can be slurred as a cancer.

The term as I showed was used by the Iranian President in a context to deny Israel's right to exist and also to attack and insult any Jew who believes in their right or the right of fellow Jews to express their identity through a state.

The words recycle the derogatory insult once used to describe ALL Jews as cancer. Now the term " All Jews" has been replaced by the word "Zionists".

However the context is still used to insult Jews and in particular Jews who believe their existence needs to be protected by a state.

Its interesting because the same Iranian President said he was not against all Jews just Zionist Jews so the statement was not anti semitic and that is a tactic used by many criticizing the state of Israel. They say, as long as the derogatory comment about Jews can be attacked to questioning Israel's existence, its not anti semitic. That's not logical. Saying something hurtful about Jews is not suddenly not hurtful and negative against Jews simply because it might not also relate to denying Israel's existence.

When discussing Israel's right to exist, comments that insult Jews as a people become anti semitic. When criticizing Israel state polices without questiioning Israel's right to exist and without insulting Jews or insulting the Jewish religion or making false assumptions about jews or Judaism, is not anti semitic.

There have been specific instances where I called Ghost out for making negative generalizations about Jews. His denying he did is pointless. His trying to suggest I only challenged him as being anti semitic because he criticized Israel is not true,. The words he quoted and I have shown you show the exact opposite and in fact show specific connection to words that negatively stereotype and insult Jews.

You I have never called an anti semite and you are well aware of that. I have stated and I repeat it, I do not believe for a second you are of the view Israel should exist as a Jewish state. I believe that because its quite simple you won't state it.

As for HJ his tactic is to keep repeating his allegation but not provide prove or basis for it and then to make references to EVERYONE. Well where are everyone's posts that indicate I called them anti semites, let alone the posts where I called them anti semites simply because they criticized Israel?

Where are they.

Where are the examples he claims exist?

When he started an allegation on the French terrorist thread that Jews are treated more favourably than Muslims by Charlie Hebdo what proof did he provide. None. What he did though is produce a cartoon repeating his allegation. Its what he does. He provide subjective opinions, passes them off as proof. They are not proof of anything but the same subjective opinion as his own.

When he produces articles on this forum they do NOT state facts, but unsubstantiated subjective opinions. That doesn't prove his point in fact all it does is show he has no proof for his points and can only repeat a subjective opinion but not back that opinion up with anything other than another subjective opinion.

That is why I challenge HJ because I believe he is a one trick pony on this forum only able to produce negative subjective insults, or comments about Israel and then in some contexts, Jews or Zionists or all three.

As for Eye, his posts and inability to reference any objective basis for his name calling speaks for itself.

As for Ghost I asked him to provide one set of words where I called him an anti semite simply for criticizing Israel and he could but but he has insisted on circling back and repeating the allegation 3 more times with no words from me to prove his allegation.

It is precisely because he has no examples he then shifted the focus away from what I have actually said and asked me now without any words, to say if I think he is an anti semite or not.

He is trying to get me to engage in the tactic he, you, Eye and HJ have done on this and the anti semite thread, call you names with no objective basis or words that you said to support such an allegation. You 4 have repeatedly demonstrated that exercise, I haven't.

I practice what I preach, you do not.

Now you can all continue to try make this personal and about me, but until the lot of you put up the words, you are wasting your own time and mine and the longer you go without proving your allegations the more you prove my point that the 4 of you come on this board starting negative inflammatory accusations about Israel especially in the headline of your threads, but never finish what you start with any substance to your allegations.

Buh bye.

[Rue]

The antisemitism cries are completely asinine.

"WOLF WOLF"!!

What anti semitism cries? Please specify them.

Here we go another one comes on the thread throws out an unspecified allegation, has no reference to the allegation but hey,

why specify-this is just a forum to come on, throw out a negative accusation with !!! marks.

Yah we get it.

Monkey see, monkey do.

Primates do that. The Alpha male first calls out then the submissive males chirp in.

Yes sir, I prefer being a lone wolf and howl at the moon and the monkeys.

[eyeball]

Liar.

Edited January 23, 2015 by eyeball

[jacee]

Rue your rants are incomprehensible crap.

[Bonam]

Liar.

Rue your rants are incomprehensible crap.

Is this what passes for discussion on this forum? Grow up, folks.

[jbg]

Rue your rants are incomprehensible crap.

Actually they're quite comprehensible. You just don't agree with them. That is your right. Canada is a great country that way.

[eyeball]

Is this what passes for discussion on this forum? Grow up, folks.

Apologist.

[Rue]

Yep the name calling speaks for itself and as Bonam and JBG thanks.

Edited January 23, 2015 by Rue

[Hudson Jones]

- Person misrepresents several posters on a forum

- Persons call the person out

- Person denies misrepresenting them and asks for proof

- Persons find the patience to look and show proof that he misrepresented them and also himself

- Person denies it again

- Persons become fed up with the misrepresentations, denials and long-winded, mostly incoherent posts

- Two posters come in the thread, arms up in the air, somehow forgetting the person's history of posting, insults and uncivil behaviour, then ask why the persons are fed up with this poster.

[Bob Macadoo]

Just for the record "crap" isn't incomprehensible as you were able to define its value. I would think it would be more appropriate to say "...voluminous, rambling crap." or "...voluminous, insightful prose."

[Michael Hardner]

Please stop getting personal on these threads !

If somebody makes an accusation, and you repeatedly ask them to back it up and they don't do it to your satisfaction then you have gone as far as you can. Just restate what happened and move on. The thread will just hang there with the request for cite as the end point and anybody reading it will draw their conclusions from that.

[jbg]

- Person misrepresents several posters on a forum

- Persons call the person out

- Person denies misrepresenting them and asks for proof

- Persons find the patience to look and show proof that he misrepresented them and also himself

- Person denies it again

- Persons become fed up with the misrepresentations, denials and long-winded, mostly incoherent posts

- Two posters come in the thread, arms up in the air, somehow forgetting the person's history of posting, insults and uncivil behaviour, then ask why the persons are fed up with this poster.

With scant developments in the way of news, person opens yet another anti-Israel thread (link), maybe 24 and counting?

[Big Guy]

What is wrong with opening an anti-anything link? Whatever topic comes up, there are those for and those against. Does it matter if the OP is "for" something or "against something"? The discussion generated will still represent all sides.

[jbg]

What is wrong with opening an anti-anything link? Whatever topic comes up, there are those for and those against. Does it matter if the OP is "for" something or "against something"? The discussion generated will still represent all sides.

In such a repetitive, reiterative and redundant manner?

[Big Guy]

It is if it is the same posters posting the same opinions with the same attitude.

A thread disappears into the black hole of the archives when the same old posters posting the same old opinions with the same attitude have had enough. The quickest way to allow a thread to disappear is to ignore it.

[Rue]

Nothing "wrong "with it Big Guy and I agree with your last comments actually. Its nor right or wrong. I am just talking to the double standard and how the bias creates contradictions.

Big Guy you tend to define things as wrong and right I do not. You then project that kind of reasoning process on me. Its not my process or way of doing things. To me things are neither wrong or right, they are a mix of both and in debate one tries to find a middle ground to the extreme polar opposites which if they become to extreme become one and the same.

However I doubt you would understand if I tried to explain my approaches to dialectics, fractal theory, quantum relativity,. You have made it clear you stop reading after a sentence.

[Hudson Jones]

With scant developments in the way of news, person opens yet another anti-Israel thread (link), maybe 24 and counting?

There is no argument that Bokoharam or ISIS are violating international and human rights laws. There is also no support from Western governments for those groups. For some reason, there is a resistance, despite enormous amount of proof, in accepting that Israel has been violating the Palesitnian's rights for decades. This is why it's imperative that people around the world, especially in the Western countries where we take pride in valuing democracy and human rights, speak up against this gross injustice and pressure our governments to stop supporting and also put pressure on our so-called ally, to start doing the right thing. This is much like Apartheid South Africa.

Perhaps one day you will abandon your tribalism and nationalism and come to the righteous side, instead of supporting and promoting injustice.

[jbg]

There is no argument that Bokoharam or ISIS are violating international and human rights laws. There is also no support from Western governments for those groups. For some reason, there is a resistance, despite enormous amount of proof, in accepting that Israel has been violating the Palesitnian's rights for decades. This is why it's imperative that people around the world, especially in the Western countries where we take pride in valuing democracy and human rights, speak up against this gross injustice and pressure our governments to stop supporting and also put pressure on our so-called ally, to start doing the right thing. This is much like Apartheid South Africa.

Perhaps one day you will abandon your tribalism and nationalism and come to the righteous side, instead of supporting and promoting injustice.

Then how are Boko Haram and ISIS being funded? Receiving supplies?

[Hudson Jones]

Then how are Boko Haram and ISIS being funded? Receiving supplies?

What does that have to do with my comment or to your comment that I replied to? You have a habit of quoting a post and then commenting with something totally unrelated.

[jbg]

What does that have to do with my comment or to your comment that I replied to? You have a habit of quoting a post and then commenting with something totally unrelated.

Your post referred to funding. Can't you read?

[Hudson Jones]

Your post referred to funding. Can't you read?

Not America or Western countries. So I'm not sure why you would ask that question. Their funding comes from mainly Saudi (our close ally).