Iran Key To Middle East Peace

[Rue]

The attempt to portray Iran as a haven for Jews is par for the course. Now the anti Israelis are experts on how Jews live in Iran and hey all it took was one article from the New York Times.

The actual life for Jews in Iran is anything but peechy swell.

Here is a different picture painted by an actual Iranian Jew, source:http://www.israelnationalnews.com/Articles/Article.aspx/13819#!

"However, in an interview given to a reporter from the Institute for War and Peace, Moshe Hakimi, a Jewish man living in Iran’s second largest city Mashhad, paints a different picture. He had this to say: “Every newborn is told from his first years of life that we are living in times of crisis and that they must lead a double life. They are told we must not talk about our personal lives in front of non-Jewish people. This absolute secrecy becomes second nature after reaching puberty.”

"Some feel so threatened that many choose to convert to Islam, but continue to practice Judaism in secret". As previously referenced, they, too, as in other times and places in Jewish history, became known as “Crypto Jews.”

He goes on to say: “All Jewish converts to Islam have two names: for example, my grandfather's Muslim name was Sheikh Aboulghasem and his Hebrew name was Benjamin. My father's Muslim name was Ebrahim and his Hebrew name was Abraham. Outside they call me Mousa and at home, I'm called Moshe. In my father's lifetime, many of the Jews had clear Muslim names. They even went to Mecca on pilgrimage and became Hadjis.”

Further accentuating the deprivations of Jewish life in post revolution Iran, a female student named Sepideh had this to say about her chances of getting married to a Jewish man: “There are almost no educated Jewish boys left in Iran to consider for marriage. Emigration is the last resort that we must consider so that maybe we can experience a future free of restrictions.”

Here's another example of what it is like for Jews in Iran:

source: http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/167631#!

"An Iranian leader with close ties to Supreme Leader Ali Khamenei recently accused the Jews of engaging in sorcery and employing it against Iran, the Middle East Media Research Institute (MEMRI) reported.

“The Jews are currently subjecting us to an unprecedented trial. As you read in the Koran, [King] Solomon ruled the world… and God ordered a group of sorcerers to come out against him. The Jews have the greatest powers of sorcery, and they make use of this tool,” said Mehdi Taeb, who heads Khamenei's Ammar Base think tank.

“All the measures that have been brought against us originate with the Zionists. The U.S. is a tool in their hands. So far, they have not used the full [scope of] their sorcery against us. Sorcery was the final means to which they resorted during the Ahmadinejad era, but they were defeated,” he said. “This ability of the Jews was eliminated by Iran. Five years ago they tried to oust Ahmadinejad [by this means].”

Furthermore, the Rasanews.ir website, which is associated with the religious seminaries in Qom, posted an article in March stating that Jews cherish the knowledge of sorcery, pass it down from generation to generation, and believe that it can be used to control mankind, nature and the decisions of G-d.

“The Jews have always tended to resort to divination, [a practice] that has its roots in astronomy, astrology and sorcery, [which they picked up] when they consorted with various peoples in the course of history…” the article states, according to MEMRI.

“The [Jewish] people think that ruling over man, nature, and divine traditions can be achieved only by means of sorcery. They believe that it is possible to conquer nature and control the world, and even to control God’s decisions, by using sorcery methods,” it adds."

Here is an article that makes it clear Iran's cry to anhiliate Israel does not just mean Israeli Jews:

http://www.wnd.com/2012/02/ayatollah-kill-all-jews-annihilate-israel/#!

Here's a portion:

The Iranian government, through a website proxy, has laid out the legal and religious justification for the destruction of Israel and the slaughter of its people.

The doctrine includes wiping out Israeli assets and Jewish people worldwide.

"Calling Israel a danger to Islam, the conservative website Alef, with ties to Iran’s supreme leader, Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, said the opportunity must not be lost to remove “this corrupting material. It is a “‘jurisprudential justification” to kill all the Jews and annihilate Israel, and in that, the Islamic government of Iran must take the helm.”

The article, written by Alireza Forghani, an analyst and a strategy specialist in Khamenei’s camp, now is being run on most state-owned sites, including the Revolutionary Guards’ Fars News Agency, showing that the regime endorses this doctrine."

source: http://www.wnd.com/2012/02/ayatollah-kill-all-jews-annihilate-israel/#0quDA2l6CAeL43aH.99

It is absolute nonsense for posters to come on this board posing as experts on how Jews live in Iran relying on reading a web-site article that tells them one side of the story.

It is absurd to think anyone actually can get a clear true picture of the danger Jews are in, in Iran and that is ebcause it is difficult if not impossible to obtain accurate and verifiable information concerning the condition of the Jews in Iran.

Only a fool would think Iranian Jews are free to speak out about their day to day conditions and how they are treated under Islamic laws that govern Shiite Iran.

The threat of retaliation against the entire jewish community if even one Jew says something negative is an ever present.

Here is a middle of the road article:

http://www.worldcrunch.com/culture-society/the-jews-of-iran-quietly-defying-all-that-039-s-wrong-in-the-middle-east/judaism-iran-israel-religion-middle-east/c3s16562/

Here's a portion:

"After the 1979 revolution, Iran committed itself to protecting Judaism, but now the Iranian state sees only the Palestinian conflict. Friday prayer sermons in Tehran often end with the chorus "Margh bar Israel" — meaning "death to Israel."

The Jewish state reciprocates, with many Israeli newspapers often devoting lengthy analysis guessing when their leaders will bomb Iranian nuclear power stations. Even some U.S. newspaper investigations have concluded that the director of Mossad was probably behind the death of some Iranian nuclear scientists.

In this exacerbated political climate, the happy life of Iranian Jews is, in fact, an image that is a little "too official." Everybody shares the same oversimplified vision that the world is divided into good and evil, with no room for mediation. The only recent positive sign is that President Hassan Rouhani seems to have extinguished the kind of Holocaust denial that former President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad embraced in his speeches.

The article is entitled; The Jews Of Iran, Quietly Defying All That's Wrong In The Middle East

The bottom line is only a fool would try portray Jews in Iran as happy.

Here is an article from the Iranian media and typical of it and I ask anyone after reading it-how would any Jew in Iran feel comfortable living there while its leader calls for the anhiliation of Israel, denies the holocaust or engages in such accusations as the one placed in this government newspaper:

"A state-sponsored newspaper in Iran has published a document claiming to have uncovered a secret plot by the Jewish people, particularly in the US and UK, to spread homosexuality worldwide."

source:http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2012/09/08/iran-news-agency-jews-are-spreading-homosexuality-in-a-world-takeover-bid/

Next the arm chair geniuses on the Jews in Iran can tell us about how they treat Gays, Zoroastreans, women, Christians and how its wonderful.

[Big Guy]

The USA, China, Russia, Britain, France and Germany appear to understand the vital place that Iran holds in the region. Talks were supposed to finish on Monday but have now been extended till July 2015. Iran's President Hassan Rouhani said Monday that a nuclear deal with the three world powers would be done.

Personally, I think Iran will have a functional nuclear device by that time.

American Kerry praised his Iranian counterpart Mohammed Javad Zarif saying he had "worked diligently and approached these negotiations in good faith and with seriousness of purpose."

From the sidelines, Benjamin Netanyahu, Israelis prime minister, welcomed the apparent LACK of progress at the Vienna talks.

Looks like the growing split between the USA (and those other major nations) and Israel is beginning to widen.

I am not sure if this is a good thing or a bad thing for Canada.

[On Guard for Thee]

I don't think it has anything to do with a US Israel split. It has to do with the fact that Iran is not bargaining in good faith with regard to whether they want a nuke or just a nuclear power generator. Of course Kerry is going to say nice things so as not to derail the ongoing talks. Saudi also doesn't want Iran to have a nuke and Israel of course will launch a few F 16's if need be.

[Rue]

Obama deliberately ordered the release of a story about Israel leasing air bases in Azerberjan to prevent a sole air strike against Iran.

The reason I believe at this point Israel can not launch a strike is because both Obama and Erdogan of Turkey are against it and both are going out of there way behind the scenes to prevent it from happening. With Obama cowtowing to Iran now to help it get rid of ISIL it sees Iran as an ally not Israel as long as Obama is in office. If a strike were to come it would have to wait until after then next election.

In the interim Iran probably already has the nuclear bomb capacity. In fact any one of us could go on the internet and get instructions to make a dirty bmb with a enough nuclear fall out to wipe out a city.

I believe the nuclear discussions may in fact be a cover for an even greater concern, chemical warfare.

Iran has rockets capable of being sent to Israel full of chemicals such as anthrax or viruses that would wipe out people but not buildings.

Iran's clergy council is unstable enough to want to kill both the Jews and Sunni Muslims it would be able to kill with germ warfare. Syria and Hezbollah also have chemical weapons and probably rogue terrorists in many terror cells from Iraq.

Its also likely Chechnyan Mulsim extremists allied with Al Quaeda and ISIL also got their hands on some from Russia.

I personally believe chemical warfare is far more of a threat.

Then again that is a subjective speculation on my part.

However for anyone to say Iran is a stable nation is again absurd.

How anyone would say it appears stable is beyond me.

This is a country whose President is in direct conflict with his Atatollah and Muslim supreme council.

This is a country that spends most of its time spying on its own students and citizens and continuing to torture and kill its own citizens and persecute

gays, Bahaiis, Christians, Zoroastreans, Jews, labour union leaders, and anyone who they believe is a communist, socialist, democrat, atheist,

feminist.

All one has to do is read the reports written by Iranians who have left their country to know its a totalitarian police state trying to keep control of a people who want Western values and a Western way of life. Its a country that fears its own people and in particular its students and intelligentsia.

How anyone could say it appears stable is unbelievable. All one has to do is read what Iranians say.

Then again the experts on this forum without ever having been to Iran and know how Iranians live or the persecuted in Iran live,"appear" to be able to define it as a stable country that treats its minorities oh so well.

[marcus]

Israel has rockets capable of being sent to Iran full of chemicals such as anthrax or viruses that would wipe out people but not buildings.

Israel's extremist government is unstable enough to want to kill anyone.

I couldn't agree more.

Edited November 26, 2014 by marcus

[bush_cheney2004]

Canada has strike fighters attacking the locals far across the sea, but Israel is the bad guy for actually defending itself from an existential threat in the region ?

[Rue]

I couldn't agree more.

Marcus responded above to the following he placed in post #31 above:

Posted Today, 10:52 AM

Rue, on 25 Nov 2014 - 11:38 AM, said:

Israel has rockets capable of being sent to Iran full of chemicals such as anthrax or viruses that would wipe out people but not buildings.

Israel's extremist government is unstable enough to want to kill anyone.

I couldn't agree more.

I did not state the words in bold he passes off as coming from me. I have advised the forum moderator of his misrepresentation.

[Rue]

In regards to Iran's instability it is primarily economic.

It is a fact that Iran’s unit of currency teh RIAL has been declining every since its internal Islamic revolution in 1979 and that decline suddenly increased after sanctions were imposed against Iran over its nuclear weapons develoment.

If you look at today's current value of the RIAL its going above 30,000 Rials to a US dollar.

In the year running up to current President Hassan Rouhani’s election in June 2013 uit declined by almost 50%.

Because of the instability of its currency there has been a ripple effect.

To start with every day household goods become so expensive the typical family will not be able to afford them.

It also prevents small businesses from being able to function.

The sanctions have seriously harmed Iran.

Big Guy can go find out for himself at:

http://lcweb2.loc.gov/frd/cs/profiles/Iran.pdf

http://www.indexmundi.com/iran/inflation_rate_(consumer_prices).html

http://www.payvand.com/news/13/nov/1075.html

[marcus]

This is a good article in New York Times today detailing the Kerry-Zarif et al negotiations over the last two years --what these negotiations amount to is a four dimensional chess game--with Rouhani/Zarif and the specter of their conservative doppelgänger in Tehran facing Obama/Kerry and the specter of their conservative doppelgänger in Washington--with Israel/AIPAC knocking down the chess pieces anytime any semblance of an agreement might seem likely --Israel is the only winner of these failed negotiations --their headhunters can now go back to an even more Zionist friendly US Congress to impose even more sanctions on Iranian people and call for military strike, as they dispatch their assassins to murder even more Iranian scientists --

NYT

[sharkman]

Marcus...

I did not state the words in bold he passes off as coming from me. I have advised the forum moderator of his misrepresentation.

I know, I called him out on some wildly inaccurate stats, I think one has to have at least a little integrity when posting or there's no point.

[marcus]

I know, I called him out on some wildly inaccurate stats, I think one has to have at least a little integrity when posting or there's no point.

Yes. "Wildly inaccurate stats". Like the ones I got from a few years before you got yours about how many Jews live in Iran.

This was never about "how many Jews live in Iran". The point I was trying to make, and in which you tried to run away from, was that Iranians don't seem to have anything against "Jews". You and some others try to sell something else on here. Like Iranians want to kill any Jew in sight. Iran has the second highest population of Jews in the Middle East. Iranian Jews practice their religion freely as do Christians.

You talk about integrity? How about stop trying to change the topic and creating a false narrative when it comes to debating.

Edited November 26, 2014 by marcus

[Rue]

Marcus has now removed the words he tried to pass off as mine in the grey box he originally posted out of the grey box.

He has of course offered me no apology for passing off his own opinion as if they were my words being quoted from a previous post.

That speaks for itself.

[Rue]

Marcus you got caught red handed attributing a statement to me as if I quoted it. You now respond to Sharkman suggesting he and I and others claim Iranians want to kill any Jews on sight. Neither of us suggested that or stated that. You again misrepresent what we have actually stated.

Your continued false misrepresentations speak for themselves.

[Rue]

Dre your continued attempts to bait me and misrepresent what I say to avoid discussing the thread speaks for itself. Trying to hide behind the word "tacit" as your latest justification for what you are doing also speaks for itself.

Trying to derail this thread by baiting me has failed. So has your attempt to distance yourself from Eye then defend him not to mention Eye's denying what he said, then admitting it, then denying it again.

You and he and Marcus and Hudson Jones and Jacee and the rest of the anti Israeli entourage of course will remain silent on the thread.

Are you even allowed by your script handlers to admit the PFLP exists?

The two cousins (originally reported as brothers) who engaged in the attack in the synagogue were members of the PFLP sent on a pre-planned terrorist attack. Within minutes of the attack,Hamas broadcast to Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza details of the attack, applauding it and urging more attacks. People then went into the streets cheering incited by the repeat broadcasts depicting the attack as heroic and glorious victory.

The anti Israel entourage will come on this board to piss on Israel but will never state that the PFLP and Hamas are as much an obstacle to peace as settlements on the West Bank.

They will come on this board and quickly point out how unreasonable Israel is but will deliberately ignore what Hamas and PFLP stand for and that is the indiscriminate murder of innocent civilians through violent actions intended to incite further violent actions of murder as a deliberate tactic and expression of political will.

[Big Guy]

Another thread dragged into the Bad Jews, Good Jews ...

There are a few more nations in the Middle East than just Israel.

[Hudson Jones]

This is a good article in New York Times today detailing the Kerry-Zarif et al negotiations over the last two years --what these negotiations amount to is a four dimensional chess game--with Rouhani/Zarif and the specter of their conservative doppelgänger in Tehran facing Obama/Kerry and the specter of their conservative doppelgänger in Washington--with Israel/AIPAC knocking down the chess pieces anytime any semblance of an agreement might seem likely --Israel is the only winner of these failed negotiations --their headhunters can now go back to an even more Zionist friendly US Congress to impose even more sanctions on Iranian people and call for military strike, as they dispatch their assassins to murder even more Iranian scientists --

NYT

I think the conservatives in Iran are not as eager to derail the talks as the conservatives in the U.S.

The conservatives in Iran are feeling the pinch of the sanctions as they have a lot of hand in businesses that would benefit from the sanctions being lifted. Whereas the republicans in the U.S. (and many democrats) are the yes-men of AIPAC/Israel. They will continue to try to derail the talks. Now that they have a majority, it's a chance for them put a little more push behind sabotaging peace.

[Big Guy]

Iran, the former Persian empire has a rich history of thousands of years of art, architecture, literature and culture. Any attempt to write it off as an insignificant nation of terrorists and turban headed bozos would be a major mistake. It has three times the number of people in the military as does Israel. It has a population two and a half times that of Canada and a formidable aerospace program.

The general consensus at this time is that Israel may indeed have the ability to attack Iran but could not win a war with Iran.

To underestimate the power of this country would be a major mistake. Iran is one of the few countries in the Middle East that have the ability to become "friends" with the West.

It appears to me that there is no way that the West can continue to have any influence in the Middle East without the cooperation of Iran. Because someone is an enemy of Israel does not mean it has to be an enemy of the West. The West cannot continue to try to control things in the Middle East by remote control.

I believe that the future of any possible peace in the Middle East cannot be attained with the West marching lock step with Israel while Israel is basically thumbing their nose at the demands from the West regarding settlements and the isolation of Gaza.

Our foreign policy has been that what is good for Israel is good for the USA and Canada. Israel keeps doing things in the Middle East that is good for Israel - that is expected. It is time for the USA and Canada to be doing things in the Middle East that are good for the USA and for Canada.

[Bonam]

Iran, the former Persian empire has a rich history of thousands of years of art, architecture, literature and culture. Any attempt to write it off as an insignificant nation of terrorists and turban headed bozos would be a major mistake. It has three times the number of people in the military as does Israel.

Relevance? Israel has repeatedly defeated its invaders, despite always being significantly outnumbered. Also, not that it matters, but the "rich history" of the Persian empire is a history of being in conflict with "the West" (as you call it) for thousands of years.

The general consensus at this time is that Israel may indeed have the ability to attack Iran but could not win a war with Iran.

Cite for this "consensus"?

To underestimate the power of this country would be a major mistake. Iran is one of the few countries in the Middle East that have the ability to become "friends" with the West.

Any country can be "friends" with the West. All they gotta do is not devote 100% of their national energy to doing whatever they can to spite the West.

It appears to me that there is no way that the West can continue to have any influence in the Middle East without the cooperation of Iran. Because someone is an enemy of Israel does not mean it has to be an enemy of the West. The West cannot continue to try to control things in the Middle East by remote control.

Why should "the West" try to control things in the middle east, at all?

I believe that the future of any possible peace in the Middle East cannot be attained with the West marching lock step with Israel while Israel is basically thumbing their nose at the demands from the West regarding settlements and the isolation of Gaza.

Israel is "thumbing its nose" because the Obama administration is not a good time for it to do anything else. There were serious peace talks before, under Olmert, and there will be again in the future.

It is time for the USA and Canada to be doing things in the Middle East that are good for the USA and for Canada.

Best thing for the US and Canada would be to stay the heck out of the middle east. Seriously, that place is nothing but a sink of blood and money. Yeah, they've got oil, but so does Canada, more than plenty.

[marcus]

Iran, the former Persian empire has a rich history of thousands of years of art, architecture, literature and culture. Any attempt to write it off as an insignificant nation of terrorists and turban headed bozos would be a major mistake. It has three times the number of people in the military as does Israel. It has a population two and a half times that of Canada and a formidable aerospace program.

The general consensus at this time is that Israel may indeed have the ability to attack Iran but could not win a war with Iran.

To underestimate the power of this country would be a major mistake. Iran is one of the few countries in the Middle East that have the ability to become "friends" with the West.

It appears to me that there is no way that the West can continue to have any influence in the Middle East without the cooperation of Iran. Because someone is an enemy of Israel does not mean it has to be an enemy of the West. The West cannot continue to try to control things in the Middle East by remote control.

I believe that the future of any possible peace in the Middle East cannot be attained with the West marching lock step with Israel while Israel is basically thumbing their nose at the demands from the West regarding settlements and the isolation of Gaza.

Our foreign policy has been that what is good for Israel is good for the USA and Canada. Israel keeps doing things in the Middle East that is good for Israel - that is expected. It is time for the USA and Canada to be doing things in the Middle East that are good for the USA and for Canada.

Well said.

And to add to the discussion and respond to Hudson in regards to the conservatives in Iran, here is something I saw earlier today:

CNN

A news clip is not enough to form an opinion, but the resistance by the conservatives in Iran sound awful lot like the republicans and democrats who are against a deal with Iran.

Edited November 27, 2014 by marcus

[sharkman]

Marcus you got caught red handed attributing a statement to me as if I quoted it. You now respond to Sharkman suggesting he and I and others claim Iranians want to kill any Jews on sight. Neither of us suggested that or stated that. You again misrepresent what we have actually stated.

Your continued false misrepresentations speak for themselves.

The thing is, I caught Marcus red handed too. That's what I mean about integrity, he basically ignored the fact that he was dead wrong and had tried to pass off wildly inaccurate numbers. A simple google search was all it took, if people can't make the most basic attempt to check their own numbers, then what's the point engaging them in debate?

[Big Guy]

To Bonam - My post on the significance of Iran refers to what relationship Canada might have with Iran. The leaders of nations do what is best for their nations. The USA does what is good for the USA and Israel does what is good for Israel. I suggest that Canada does what is good for Canada.

I agree that Canada should stay out of those civil and religious wars in the Middle East. But if we feel that there is some benefit to Canada, I suggest that it be for the benefit to Canada. If we are to look to leadership in that area then why are we tying ourselves to the American apron strings? What benefit is it to Canada to support Israel?

I would suggest a review of our relationship with Israel and an opening of diplomatic dialogue with Iran. I also suggest that if we choose to be involved in those foreign wars that it could be in the form of trusted diplomatic negotiators rather than a few expensive planes.

[Bonam]

To Bonam - My post on the significance of Iran refers to what relationship Canada might have with Iran. The leaders of nations do what is best for their nations. The USA does what is good for the USA and Israel does what is good for Israel. I suggest that Canada does what is good for Canada.

Canada does do what is good for Canada... which is for the most part keeping its foreign policy fairly closely aligned with the US. Now, we certainly have the freedom to stay out of US wars if we judge them to be a bad idea, but getting all chummy with nations that the US finds itself in conflict with is likely to lead to real difficulties in Canada-US relations, such as increased border/flight security, increased scrutiny of visa applications, increased screening of goods shipped between the two countries, etc. Given that most Canadians live within a few miles of the US border and rely heavily on trade with the US, I'd rather focus on keeping that international relationship going well, rather than risking it to get friendly with America's geopolitical rivals or enemies.

I agree that Canada should stay out of those civil and religious wars in the Middle East. But if we feel that there is some benefit to Canada, I suggest that it be for the benefit to Canada. If we are to look to leadership in that area then why are we tying ourselves to the American apron strings? What benefit is it to Canada to support Israel?

Why we tie ourselves to American apron strings is explained above. Why we support Israel is also fairly straightforward, it's the only democratic, somewhat secular, somewhat "free" state in the region, surrounded pretty much literally by hordes of barbarians, who have invaded it over and over. Why support a besieged democracy against fundamentalist theocracies? Because we want to check the power of said fundamentalist theocracies. Of course, that does not mean blanket support, and that is why many Western countries are (rightly) critical of settlements.

I would suggest a review of our relationship with Israel and an opening of diplomatic dialogue with Iran. I also suggest that if we choose to be involved in those foreign wars that it could be in the form of trusted diplomatic negotiators rather than a few expensive planes.

It doesn't take a country to be a negotiator between two other parties, just a few highly skilled diplomats/mediators.

[marcus]

The thing is, I caught Marcus red handed too. That's what I mean about integrity, he basically ignored the fact that he was dead wrong and had tried to pass off wildly inaccurate numbers. A simple google search was all it took, if people can't make the most basic attempt to check their own numbers, then what's the point engaging them in debate?

The thing is, you're lying. This is where I got my numbers from, Jewish Virtual Library:

Unofficial estimates of the Jewish community's size vary from 20,000 to 25,000.

As I said before to your previous accusation:

Yes. "Wildly inaccurate stats". Like the ones I got from a few years before you got yours about how many Jews live in Iran.

This was never about "how many Jews live in Iran". The point I was trying to make, and in which you tried to run away from, was that Iranians don't seem to have anything against "Jews". You and some others try to sell something else on here. Like Iranians want to kill any Jew in sight. Iran has the second highest population of Jews in the Middle East. Iranian Jews practice their religion freely as do Christians.

You talk about integrity? How about stop trying to change the topic and creating a false narrative when it comes to debating.

Edited November 27, 2014 by marcus

[guyser]

Maybe you should provide a link to your source, it seems pretty off. My Wiki link says it's slightly above 8700, down from 25,000 in 2009. Looks like they've been leaving for some reason. Any guesses there? Maybe you can find another 5 year old link.

There are sites all over that give guesstimates of between 10,000 and 35,000. And plenty of sites (Jewish ones even...ghasp) that say life is fairly good for a Jew in Iran, careful existence but not scary existence.

[Big Guy]

Well Bonam I will continue to respectfully disagree with you. I believe that the USA is on the decline. I do understand the economic repercussions of our relationship with them. We have been more than just trading partners but have been in their back pockets in the past and only partially successful in avoiding getting too deeply involved in their wars. I believe that we can strike out on our own without pocking a finger into the eagles eye.

As for Israel, I firmly believe that if Canada did not serve a beneficial function for Israel then we would be ignored - and good for them. Protect your own people at all costs. But the same for us. But "check the power of said fundamentalist theocracies" as a reason to support Israeli land usurping, collective punishment, indiscriminate bombing and nose thumbing at Obama? I do not support that as reason enough for me. But everybody has an opinion.

I still believe that Iran is the key to Middle East peace. After Harper we should be better positioned to go back to our previous sceptical and more neutral position on Israel. I do not know what Israel feels it is going to have to do to attain their goals and I do not feel a Canadian blanket support, or any unconditional support, is a wise position for Canada.