Encouraging Developments Against Zionist Apartheid Regime!

[bush_cheney2004]

Still no BDS love for Gaza, even as the Zionist goals of a Jewish state in Palestine have been realized and recognized by the world for more than 50 years. Support for Israel remains strong in the U.S., and has increased significantly based on Gallup polls.

Israel's hopeful haters in the international peanut gallery should realize that their dependence and cheering for American BDS groups works both ways.

[Hudson Jones]

Still no BDS love for Gaza

Your comment still makes no sense because you still don't seem to understand what BDS is about. BDS is not about giving economic assistance to Gaza (it's not even possible since there is a blockade on Gaza by Israel). BDS is about putting cultural and economic pressure on Israel to follow international law.

But you go ahead and repeat the nonsense, like it means anything.

[bush_cheney2004]

But you go ahead and repeat the nonsense, like it means anything.

Please do likewise, praying for nonsense that the U.S. will see things your way and change existing policies that overwhelmingly support Israel.

[Hudson Jones]

Please do likewise, praying for nonsense that the U.S. will see things your way and change existing policies that overwhelmingly support Israel.

The prostitutes in Congress and Senate will eventually give in to the pressure of truth. The tide has changed. Zionism is starting to lose the support of Jews living outside of Israel. They can no longer relate to the inhumane acts and policies.

But yeah, I'm glad you're finally understanding what BDS is about.

[bush_cheney2004]

The prostitutes in Congress and Senate will eventually give in to the pressure of truth. The tide has changed. Zionism is starting to lose the support of Jews living outside of Israel. They can no longer relate to the inhumane acts and policies.

Oh sure..and the "prostitutes" in Canada will extend CIFTA for more trade with Israel. Money talks...BDS bullcrap walks.

Just "starting to lose"....is that all ? Better pray harder that the U.S. turns off the $3 billion in annual aid to close ally Israel.

...and still no BDS love for Gaza.

Edited August 1, 2015 by bush_cheney2004

[marcus]

Money talks...BDS bullcrap walks.

I'm sure you're old enough to remember Apartheid South Africa. The Anti-Apartheid movement started in the 60's.

Do you remember how hard England (and some other Western countries) fought against the Anti-Apartheid movement? Guess what. They failed to stop it.

The non-governmental economic and cultural boycott of Israel has already started. More and more artists are refusing to perform in Israel and/or in the illegal settlements. There is an academic boycott. Stephen Hawking, one of the biggest names and greatest minds in our lifetime has jumped on the BDS movement as well. Dozens of academic institutions in the West have voted to support BDS as well. Not to mention dozens of religious organizations, are also doing the same.

If Sheldon Adelson (GOP donor) and Haim Saban (Hillary Donor), the billionaire super donors are worried about BDS and have put together a hush hush meeting to tackle the BDS movement, then something is up. It doesn't matter how much you or any other person wants to deny it.

[bush_cheney2004]

Do you remember how hard England...

Seriously ? "England" ?

I'm not denying BDS...just pointing out that it has a very long way to go to achieve the stated goals. Not only am I old enough to remember the anti-apartheid movement, I am also old enough to remember when the boycotts were rejected (e.g. Paul Simon) to much greater effect.

Ain't no "Sun City" tune for Palestine.

Edited August 1, 2015 by bush_cheney2004

[marcus]

Seriously ? "England" ?

I'm not denying BDS...just pointing out that it has a very long way to go to achieve the stated goals. Not only am I old enough to remember the anti-apartheid movement, I am also old enough to remember when the boycotts were rejected (e.g. Paul Simon) to much greater effect.

Ain't no "Sun City" tune for Palestine.

The end result: Collapse of the Apartheid government. Even Paul Simon couldn't stop it.

I don't think anyone is under the impression that Israel will leave the Occupied Territories and make a real and just deal overnight. But the way the BDS movement is going, it's going to happen. The movement is too strong.

[bush_cheney2004]

The end result: Collapse of the Apartheid government. Even Paul Simon couldn't stop it.

You missed the point entirely, and obviously know little about the actual history of that time.

Now....it's just a slogan twisted to attack Israel's policies today.

[marcus]

You missed the point entirely, and obviously know little about the actual history of that time.

Now....it's just a slogan twisted to attack Israel's policies today.

Then enlighten me. What point did I miss and what part of my comment makes you think I don't know the actual history of that time?

[bush_cheney2004]

Then enlighten me. What point did I miss and what part of my comment makes you think I don't know the actual history of that time?

Paul Simon wasn't trying to "stop it".

[On Guard for Thee]

Paul Simon wasn't trying to "stop it".

Then what in your "enlightened" mind was he attempting to do?

[marcus]

Paul Simon wasn't trying to "stop it".

His choice not to respond to the boycott? Who cares about Paul Simon. Your denial, Sheldon's millions, nothing will stop the BDS movement.

The point is that the anti-apartheid success to end the racist South African government took some time but it was inevitable that it was going to happen. We are seeing the same thing happen with the end of the brutal occupation of the Palestinians and their land.

[Rue]

HJ you are well aware Omar Barghouti is. To respond with the words you did trying to play semantics as to his role as founder and leader of the BDS speaks for itself as does the attempt to play semantics with me as to whether he is one of its chiefs.

You also falsely represented the BDS position using semantics to lend credence to the false presentation that it only wants compensation for displaced Palestinians. It does not and has never presented a position where it will forgo the return of 5 million so called Palestinians to Israel in return for money or other compensation. That is a falsehood.

It demands a return to Israel of 5 million Muslims and not just return but giving such people property-property already habitated by Israelis BOTH Musim and Jewish.

You can deny that all you want, play semantics all you want, make comments about me pounding keys, but that is its position and no amount of spin the words by you can weasel out of that position. The fact you can't even come clean with that position speaks for itself.

You can't even admit the actual position you advocate which is the destruction of Israel as a Jewish state..

Edited August 1, 2015 by Rue

[marcus]

You also falsely represented the BDS position using semantics

No one is using semantics. It's important that you pay attention. This is their official position and it has been from when it started:

The BDS movement was launched by 170 Palestinian civil society organizations in 2005 with three clearly articulated aims:

1) an end to Israel's military occupation of Palestinian territories,

2) full rights for Palestinian citizens of Israel, and

3) the right of return or compensation for Palestinian refugees.

All three expectations are legitimate, lawful and do not harm the State of Israel. Israel should accept giving compensation to the 700K+ UNRWA registered Palestinian refugees.

Edited August 2, 2015 by marcus

[Rue]

Its important you understand whatever name you use that pretending it does not stand for the dismantling of a Jewish state of Israel is not hidden no matter how many times you respond avoiding that position.

Its important you pay attention-flood the board with falsehoods, I will challenge you whatever names you use..

Edited August 2, 2015 by Rue

[GostHacked]

Its important you understand whatever name you use that pretending it does not stand for the dismantling of a Jewish state of Israel is not hidden no matter how many times you respond avoiding that position.

Its important you pay attention-flood the board with falsehoods, I will challenge you whatever names you use..

Your tagline is showing.

[marcus]

Its important you understand whatever name you use that pretending it does not stand for the dismantling of a Jewish state of Israel is not hidden no matter how many times you respond avoiding that position.

Its important you pay attention-flood the board with falsehoods, I will challenge you whatever names you use..

If Israel pays compensation to the refugees, which you falsely claimed were not registered (and anyone could pretend to be Palestinian), then the State of Israel would not have to worry about its Jewish population becoming a minority.

So how would paying compensation for the refugees, instead of allowing them to return to their lands taken away from them "dismantle Israel"?

Or are you talking about the illegal settlement in the Occupied Territories and pretending that they are part of State of Israel?

[jbg]

You don't seem to understand what BDS is.

I can only imagine what it is. It seems from the outside like a beehive of Jew-hating activity. While we're at it, speaking of apartheid, what is the Jewish population of Gaza other than kidnapped hostages?

[Rue]

Marcus you misrepresent again. Hamas has not said it would recognize Israel as a Jewish state if Palestinian refugees were compensated. That is a fabrication. Provide where it has stated that. Repeating a false position won't make it true.

Both the PA and Hamas have stated compensation means the placement of 5 million alleged Palestinians in Israel.and the dismantling of it as a Jewish state.

Your repeated misrepresentations won't change that position which is public domain and anyone can find and is repeated daily in their media which I and many others read.

Save that tune Marcus.

Now let's deal with the other nonsense. Finish what you started:

1. provide the statement of Hamas that says it will recognize a Jewish state if Palestinians were compensated

2. provide the statement of the PA that says it will recognize a Jewish state if Palestinians were compensated

3. provide the definition of Palestinian refugee.

You won't because 1 and 2 do not exist.

In regards to 3, everyone knows what the definition is. All refugees of the world are defined as people displaced by armed conflict and forced to leave their country but not their offspring born out of the country except one people, and just one Palestinians.

The definition of a Palestinian refugee was changed. All anyone has to do to claim they are Palestinian is to say they are decended from a Palestinian but can not be a Jew.

The Jews of Palestine who live in Jordan and the West Bank who do not recognize Israel as a state are not considered Palestinians because they are not Muslim. That is a fact.

This is also a fact. There is no test to determine authenticity of alleged Palestinian blood. There can not be. The reason for that is the vast majority of so called Palestinians are in fact Muslim Arab peoples who flooded Palestine displacing actual Palestinian Muslims and Palestinian Christians and Jews. They came from Syria, Lebanon, Iraq, North Africa. They flooded Jordan and the West Bank based on British immigration policies that deliberately opend the floodgates to prevent a Jewish majority from forming a state.

That is fact and so is the fact the majority of these people are descended from non Palestinian Arabs.

What is fact is that any Muslim can go to the West Bank and if they live there two years uninterrupted are considered Palestinian.

In fact on the West Banl the majority of illegal suatters are not Jewish settlers, its Arabs calling themselves Palestinians who moved there in the last 20 years looking for work. This is precisely why Arafat blew up the land titles office. He was faced with a civil war between peoples of the West Bank who were Muslim fighting over land title.

That of course you won't talk about. You can't Your script won't allow that.

Your script is in fact is discriminatory. It says an Arab Jew, a Jew from an Arab nation who moves to Israel is an invader but an Arab Muslim from an Arab nation who moved to the West Bank or the former Palestinian is automatically Palestinian.

A Jew who came from Europe to Israel is a colonialist imperialist invader but an Arab Muslim coming from outside Palestine is not.

Its a double standard. Its a double standard that ignores more Jewish refugees were displaced from Arab countries, then supposed Palestinians from Palestine and ignores of those 900,000 displaced Jews, 700,000 of them had no choice but to flee to Israel.

Its a bull crap standard based on Muslim bigotry and let us lay it out shall we Marcus.

In Sharia law, a Muslim can have a sharia law Muslim state but a Jew have a state, not a chance. Tell them why you define us as Dhimmii. Go on tell them. Tell them why Jews in Muslim countries can not own land or have equal citizenship and are defined as inferior second class citizens shunned to ghettoes. Go on, you are so quick to talk about apartheid, tell them about the system of dhimmitude that still exists.

Tell them how Britain illegally created transJordan which they referred to as a temporary set up and to this day as a constitution that prohibits Jewish citizenship. You know Jordan, the first Palestinian state that to this day on its coat of arms calls itself the Palestinian state. Go on tell them

how Jordan offered instant Palestinian citizenship in Jordan until 1967 and you have zero problem with that or the fact that over 125 other nations have law of returns for identified ethnic groups that make them eligible for citizenship but its only when Israel does it, you get all indignant.

Tell them. Tell them how a Jew can not have a nation but Muslims can. Tell them why. Have the balls to discuss your true religious values.

Tell them why you won't admit why the definition of Palestinian refugee has no test, its simply based on self chosen identification with NO TEST.

Go on finish it. Tell them what you mean by registration. You even know how a so called Palestinian registers themselves and what it means? Well?

Go on expert-tell them the criteria for being able to register as a Palestinian. You can't. Your script won't allow you to admit its simply based on asking.

The UN rendered its treatment of refugees a joke. It created one set of rules for Palestinians, another for the rest of the world's refugees. Its allowed its alleged neutral refugee offices in Gaza and the West Bank to be used to store weapons. ammunition, house terrorists and serve as field operations for Hamas and other terror cells. It allows its hospitals and roves to be used as operation quarters and launch posts.. It allowed its UN vehicles to be used as weapons of war.

Go on tell them.

Lol. Like your script would allow it.

Edited August 9, 2015 by Rue

[jacee]

I can only imagine what it is. It seems from the outside like a beehive of Jew-hating activity. While we're at it, speaking of apartheid, what is the Jewish population of Gaza other than kidnapped hostages?

Israel is subject to criticism like any other country, without you and rue flinging accusations of "Jew hating".

The lock-step propagandizing you do is stupider than you really are.

.

Edited August 10, 2015 by jacee

[bush_cheney2004]

Israel is subject to criticism like any other country, without flinging accusations of "Jew hating".

Great...can't wait for the BDS Canada movement for illegally occupying and controlling First Nations' land and resources.

[marcus]

I can only imagine what it is. It seems from the outside like a beehive of Jew-hating activity. While we're at it, speaking of apartheid, what is the Jewish population of Gaza other than kidnapped hostages?

You imagine anything that criticizes the brutal colonization and human rights abuse by the Israelis as "Jew-hating". There seems to be a lot of self-hating Jews out there who back the BDS movement. One of the largest Jewish organizations, who is growing rapidly, is Jewish Voice for Peace. Here is their statement on BDS.

JVP has grown dramatically in size and influence in the past two years. As part of the ongoing assessment sparked by this growth, JVP reviewed its BDS policy. On the basis of an organization-wide conversation about BDS, we have refined our position while maintaining our strategy. JVP shares the aims of the Palestinian Boycott National Committee — ending the occupation, achieving equality for Palestinians now living in Israel, and recognizing Palestinian refugees’ right of return. JVP focuses our efforts on boycott and divestment campaigns that directly target Israel’s occupation of the West Bank and East Jerusalem and its blockade of the Gaza Strip. We believe this to be the most effective way for JVP to help bring about the aims we share with the Palestinian BDS call.

everyone knows what the definition is. All refugees of the world are defined as people displaced by armed conflict and forced to leave their country but not their offspring born out of the country except one people, and just one Palestinians.

The definition of a Palestinian refugee was changed. All anyone has to do to claim they are Palestinian is to say they are decended from a Palestinian but can not be a Jew.

Oh no! Someone other than Jews is receiving a special recognition and Rue No Likey!

If Israel had not dragged this on for this long, then there wouldn't be offsprings. Israel brought this up on themselves. In late 1980's, Arafat officially recognized the State of Israel and resolution 282. That was the beginning of what could have been traction. Instead, Israel decided that it will accelerate the illegal settlements and continue the systematic ethnic cleansing of East Jerusalem.

So Israel has brought this on themself. They thought if they dragged and didn't respond to the refugee problem, it would just go away. Guess what? It didn't.

[Rue]

Jacee let's spell out the tactic used on this thread for you. Don't accuse me of flinging anything let alone accusing people simply because they disagree with Israeli policies as being Jew haters.

My exposure as to the device HJ used does not accuse someone of being a Jew hater simply because they criticize Israeli policies. That is a falsehood.

Also HJ trying to suggest I call Jews self haters is a crock. It is also a falsehood.

Let's spell it out since you want to deliberately ignore what he does. Don't play me, don't mistate my words, don't try spin what HJ has done or Big Guy did in the past with me, let me spell it out in words you can try misrepresent:

source: http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Good_Jews_and_Bad_Jews

"Good Jews and bad Jews" is a common argumentative dichotomy, whereby "good Jews" are those who happen to agree with a person's positive stereotypes regarding how those who happen to practice Judaism or are of Jewish ancestry should behave (and, hence, ought to be protected from criticism) and "bad Jews" are those who fulfill negative stereotypes about how those same individuals should not behave. Either straw-man "group" can be a majority or minority, but both usually fulfill the lowest expectations (by non-Jews, usually those in historically-Christian- or Muslim-dominated territories) of how a Jewish person should be perceived."

Anti-Zionism

" In Anti-Zionism, a "good Jew" is one who does one of the following:

if living elsewhere, forswears moving to Israel

if living in or born in Israel, agrees with anti-Zionist viewpoints regarding why Israel should not be classified, culturally, as a "Jewish state".

tells "the truth" about "Jewish evil"

A "bad Jew" includes those who do not do these things, including everyone from Jewish settlers in the West Bank to nameless Israeli Jews in Tel Aviv. "

HJ and you and anyone else who wants to engage in this device can hear me loud and clear, the fact I am a Zionist and another Jew is not is not relevant to the thread-you want to raise it to play this game, here I am to as you would say Jacee fling it back.

I will spell it out one last time for you Jacee and Big Guy and HJ and anyone else who wants to play the Jew card-read this article-it spells out what you do and it speaks for me or Jacee or anyone else who finds this Jew card on this thread or any thread bigotry:

source: http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/the-bad-jew/

I have included this entire article as it directly addresses the bigotry being used by HJ on this thread with his good Jew bad Jew routine:

"There’s a certain feeling in the world community that in order to be a ‘good’ Jew, there is certain criteria that must be met. For instance, to make it into the oh so wonderful progressive elite clubs, where everyone is soooo intelligent and at one with the universe, where you get to sip vegetable tea, and dine on caramel roots infused with new-age raspberry extract, you need to acknowledge certain things.

You must use the word nakba to describe the Palestinian situation, because nothing screams ‘good’ Jew more than saying how bad the Jews in Israel are. You must completely and utterly accept the Palestinian narrative, because well… that’s what the world seems to believe… and surely surely you don’t want to be different?

To be that ‘good’ Jew you so desire, it is imperative that you must be of the post-Zionism variety, because pride and belief in your country and its right to live is just soooooo last century. Europe is that shining light we must aspire to, because other than the daily terrorist attacks by Islamic fascists (or as Obama might say uninspired youth), things are great there!

But there are those ‘good’ Jews who have made it and can be accepted into that elite club of nations. There is Noam Chomsky who says that Israel’s actions in “Palestine” are “Much Worse than Apartheid” in South Africa. Wow, he sounds ‘good’ indeed! Or how about Norman Finklestein who has accused Israel of being a “terrorist state” and committing a Holocaust in Gaza. Welcome to the world, Norman! And then there’s Martin Indyk, who just the other day, warned Israel that if the new government of Israel after the March elections did not subscribe to essentially the world view of two states, then they should expect UN Security Council resolutions proposed not by the Palestinians, but by the International community. Martin Indyk also blames Israeli settlements for the failure of the peace talks, not Palestinian incitement, or terror, or Abbas’s accusations of genocide, or Palestinian rejection of any offers… All of these things make him an exceptionally ‘good’ Jew, because nothing says ‘good’ Jew more than screwing your own people!

But despite my desire to be a ‘good’ Jew and drink vegetable tea with the rest of the elite, I’m sad to say I can’t. Oh, how I’d fit in and belong, if I’d just give up this fallacy of believing in a Jewish state, but no… I won’t so I’ll remain unwelcomed into the community of nations.

And while authors like Finklestein and Chomsky line up to denigrate the State of Israel, I’ll be arguing the opposite. And while I might be criticized for being against ‘peace’ by not supporting the Palestinian narrative and the UN view, I’ll respond as any high school student would when not chosen for their netball team: Whatever!

Because I am bad, baby! So you better watch out – yeah I’m talking to you! Um..er… no sorry sir, not you with the skull tattoo across your face and the ring through your cheek, but the little kid behind you – yeah YOU!

I’m so bad that people cross the street when I walk by, and if someone gives me a stare…then I’ll… walk a little quicker!

Now, I may not don myself in leather, or drive a Harley, and the car seat in the back might say otherwise – but don’t be fooled, because I am bad bad bad! Bad to the bone…

You see, I’m a bad Jew, because I’ll continue to do the unpopular thing and support Israel in its fight. I don’t want to be the ‘good’ Jew accepted by the world’s elite. I want to be the bad Jew who makes the world’s elite cringe.

I will continue to support the Jewish homeland – which remains on the frontline against the Islamic fascism that is lunging at the world’s doors. I will support the Israeli prime minister who speaks out against the terrorist supporting entity of Iran – while the rest of the world seems to be falling over themselves trying to make a deal with it. And while they may eventually end up waving a piece of paper declaring “peace in our time”, history has taught us that treaties with fascist dictatorships seldom end in peace in any time.

I will also not subscribe to the erroneously and malicious views of the so-called “occupation” of the Jewish homeland, and I will most definitely not demonize the people and the communities who live there. Should Israel one day give some of their territory to the Palestinians, then it should be their choice giving their territory, not the occupied lands the world want to believe.

And while those oh so modern people scoff at the notion of history and nationhood and tradition, I will continue to embrace them all and show a sense of pride in the history of my people and my nation.

I’ll continue to do all these things, because I’m not the ‘good’ Jew that Obama and the UN and the Europeans want.

I’m the bad Jew – and I’m only getting worse."

You bet I am also a bad Jew and I will only get worse.

HJ quotes when people who agree with him when they are Jews for the above reason-don't try ignore it. Its there for all to see as it was when Big Guy questioned whether I was a Jew or before that mentioned how he had Jew friends who disagreed with that I said.

Its a pale bigoted device and I will challenge it for what it is.

[Rue]

You imagine anything that criticizes the brutal colonization and human rights abuse by the Israelis as "Jew-hating".

So Israel has brought this on themself. They thought if they dragged and didn't respond to the refugee problem, it would just go away. Guess what? It didn't.

You Marcus of course won't respond to me. You can't. You made false allegations you can not back up. You continue to state false positions of Hamas and then when challenged change the subject.

As for your baiting me, or Hacee, neither of us have accused any Jew of being self hating. You do. You and Jacee and others who try play the good Jew bad Jew card falsely throw that back as what we claim. We do not. You do. This device you now use of falsely attributing to us your stereotypes is called out as just that.

Show one word where Jacee or I accused anyone of being self hating. Go on. Just once back up your statement. Its one misrepresentation after the other.

This thread is about you now trying to piss on Jews who support Israel as a Jewish nation. It has nothing to do with the thread but it shows how you use the thread to simply throw out piss at Jews for simply wanting to be Jews in Israel.

As for your Israel brought it on itself b.s. response its par for the course. Its a simplistic accusation that absolves extremist Arabs and Muslims of any responsibility for their failures, violence, terrorism, corupt regimes and chaos.