Should Justin Trudeau resign?

[jbg]

Why? Honesty issues ?

(SM should be on)

Probably the same reasons I'm not eligible to run for Parliament under the NDP banner; I'm not a Canadian, nor is the Pope.

[Wayward Son]

How about a middle ground, that abortion should be, to quote President Clinton, "safe, legal and rare."

My position is that each abortion should be a decision between the woman and the doctor. Therefore I support policy for it to be safe and legal. As to rare, every person has a different definition of what rare means. If it means positive policies to reduce unwanted pregnancies such as access to birth control, then yes. If it means barriers to access to abortion, then no.

[overthere]

Meaningless platitude. Of course it should be safe, legal, and rare. And frankly it is.

I would add 'easily accessible on demand' to that list .

[Bob Macadoo]

Someone let Cardinal Collins know that he should be more concerned with the child molesters in his ranks than the Liberal Party's position on abortion. He's one to weigh in on leadership. I mean come on.

I liked how Collins came out all politicky saying Trudeau shouldn't judge his moral values on his candidates....platitudes and all and then when asked whether he'd serve JT communion he says "I'm not going to get into that", meaning he won't put up nor shut-up.

Loved it....saying politics has no business getting involved in moral choices......indeed.

[Big Guy]

"Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and unto God the things that are God's".

[Keepitsimple]

Rosie DiManno - in today's Star:

...and again - it's not about people's personal beliefs on abortion - it's about Trudeau as a person, and about his judgement.

Justin Trudeau is far too callow for his age.

There’s no excuse for it at 41.

He is displaying the haughtiness of his father and the vanity of his mother, a most unpleasant combination. The jejune gall, however, is all his own. Dad, at least, was a cunning and brilliant politician. Pierre Elliot Trudeau resorted to autocratic edicts at moments of crisis. Justin Trudeau seems hell-bound to create a crisis where none need exist.

Apropos of nothing, the Trudeau spawn has now decided that ethical lobotomy should be imposed on anyone who wants to fly the Liberal colours as a candidate in the next federal election. You will conform to Trudeau’s “resolute pro-choice” stand on abortion or sacrifice your liberal affiliations.

The irony of unintended consequences here is that all of a sudden abortion is back in the domain of public debate, which we could all have done without. Prime Minister Stephen Harper doesn’t want to have that discussion, as he’s made quite clear in recent years — in large part because the issue is too divisive within his own cabinet and among nuisance-distraction backbenchers. He’s crushed all gambits to the contrary.

There is a law of the land, which is that there’s no law of the land. No abortion legislation exists and, while some of us have considerable reservations about this free-for-all state of affairs, the alternative — to once again plunge into furious hostilities over a woman’s right to choose — is counterintuitive.

Trudeau has opened that door by his absolute position. If you have doubts, if you have reservations — moral, religious, any flicker of conscience — then you’re not wanted under the Liberal big tent and can’t exercise, as an MP, a free vote should the matter arise in Parliament in any variation: sex selection abortions, for example, the termination of a female fetus because a boy-child is preferred, with some absolutist pro-choice feminists contorting themselves into intellectual pretzels, caving into gender-hatred disguised as cultural values rather than conceding an inch; late-term abortions, when the fetus is viable, because we’re assured this is a rare occurrence, performed only when the mother’s life is at risk.............continued

Link: http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2014/05/16/on_abortion_justin_trudeau_imposes_ethical_lobotomy_on_liberals.html Edited May 16, 2014 by Keepitsimple

[Peter F]

Let me get this straight:

Harper is a good man for not allowing the abortion issue come to a vote

Trudeau is a bad man for not allowing the abortion issue come to a vote

[Bob Macadoo]

Rosie DiManno - in today's Star:...and again - it's not about people's personal beliefs on abortion - it's about Trudeau as a person, and about his judgement. Link: http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2014/05/16/on_abortion_justin_trudeau_imposes_ethical_lobotomy_on_liberals.html

Rosie Dimanno....the shrillness of Sue-Ann Levy with the crassness of well.....Ms. Levy. I think there's a Maple leafs opinion piece needed....she should stick to that.

[Keepitsimple]

Let me get this straight:

Harper is a good man for not allowing the abortion issue come to a vote

Trudeau is a bad man for not allowing the abortion issue come to a vote

Trudeau has yet to do anything.....he is the leader of a third-place party whose current position on this has yet to be tested. Wait for the other shoe to drop - there will be a "clarification" coming.

[Keepitsimple]

Rosie Dimanno....the shrillness of Sue-Ann Levy with the crassness of well.....Ms. Levy. I think there's a Maple leafs opinion piece needed....she should stick to that.

Hey - don't shoot the messenger....we're talking about the Toronto Star here, not exactly a Harper fan!

[WestCoastRunner]

Trudeau has yet to do anything.....he is the leader of a third-place party whose current position on this has yet to be tested. Wait for the other shoe to drop - there will be a "clarification" coming.

JT has since becoming leader:

• In the last three months of 2013, the federal Liberals boasted 44,000 individual donors—outpacing the Conservatives in this regard for the first time in a decade.
• Since Trudeau became leader, the Liberals have led, or been tied, in nearly every national poll, the latest giving them an eight-point advantage over the Harper Conservatives.

[On Guard for Thee]

Let me get this straight:

Harper is a good man for not allowing the abortion issue come to a vote

Trudeau is a bad man for not allowing the abortion issue come to a vote

Bingo. Does the word hypocritical seem to fit here?

[carepov]

No, the opposite. What pro-lifers are trying to do is grant the fetus more rights than any non-fetus. The right to use someone else's body against that person's wishes.

Let's say that a young child needs part of someone's liver to survive, and will die within hours without said transplant I am a perfect match, and the only match that is likely to found in time. I could save that child's life. I would have a moral obligation, but no legal obligation to agree to the transplant. That is for the simple reason that the legal system is based upon my right to bodily integrity superseding any benefits that anyone else might gain from the use of my body against my will.

The pro-choice position grants equal rights to all. The pro-life position wishes to take away rights from the woman, and give extra rights to the fetus.

OK, I agree... except what about when the fetus reaches the point where it can survive outside the womb? Surely then its right to life would no longer involve the right to use someone else's body against their wishes, right?

[Peter F]

Trudeau has yet to do anything.....he is the leader of a third-place party whose current position on this has yet to be tested. Wait for the other shoe to drop - there will be a "clarification" coming.

Has yet to be tested? He just decreed that all liberal party candidates (incumbents excepted) shall support the status quo. I figure thats as much a test as any other political leader gets.

We've seen Harper tested on this very thing: No abortion laws will be brought before parliament. Hows that for not giving a goddamn for what the

anti-abortionists in his causes think?

[Wayward Son]

OK, I agree... except what about when the fetus reaches the point where it can survive outside the womb? Surely then its right to life would no longer involve the right to use someone else's body against their wishes, right?

Correct.

[BC_chick]

Trudeau has yet to do anything.....he is the leader of a third-place party whose current position on this has yet to be tested. Wait for the other shoe to drop - there will be a "clarification" coming.

Well, at least you're admitting that he's only a third place part leader.... for now.

[Keepitsimple]

Has yet to be tested? He just decreed that all liberal party candidates (incumbents excepted) shall support the status quo. I figure thats as much a test as any other political leader gets.

We've seen Harper tested on this very thing: No abortion laws will be brought before parliament. Hows that for not giving a goddamn for what the

anti-abortionists in his causes think?

You're missing the point. By "tested", I mean how the public will buy his ultimatum in an election - and for that matter, how his Party will react over the longer term. As I said, I would not be surprised if a "clarification" was coming. All he's done so far is make a statement and said it's now his policy. Harper on this issue, made his position known a long time ago - it has been accepted by the Party and has survived several elections.

Edited May 17, 2014 by Keepitsimple

[Peter F]

Sure...and if JT and the Libs manage fine then whats the problem?

[Keepitsimple]

Sure...and if JT and the Libs manage fine then whats the problem?

We don't know that yet, do we? We don't know how much he has alienated the Catholics. We don't know how much he will have alienated that majority of voters who hold views other than his strict policy of Abortion on Demand. We don't know if there will be revolts in riding associations whose collective conscience differs from JT's. We don't know if Liberals who are prevented from running will go public and strike out at JT. Abortion has always been a powder keg of nuanced, deeply held, personal views. JT has lit a match to it - for no reason. There are virtually no positive reports on his knee-jerk decision and Harper has come off looking like the calm, "Big Tent" leader.

The above also answers your question of "what's the problem".

Edited May 17, 2014 by Keepitsimple

[Peter F]

No we don't know yet...so why all this talk of tyrants? It may very well work out just fine. I bet lots of anti-abortion catholics vote conservative knowing full well Harper will not allow the abortion debate. Why cant these catholics you mention vote liberal for the very same reason?

[PIK]

http://www.ottawasun.com/2014/06/30/how-us-foreign-policy-came-to-grief

Interesting story and I see it happening here under a trudeau government.

[Black Dog]

http://www.ottawasun.com/2014/06/30/how-us-foreign-policy-came-to-grief

Interesting story and I see it happening here under a trudeau government.

You see Trudeau starting an unnecessary war that turns into a quagmire that destabilizes the entire region? Or are you all-in crazy and suggesting Canada would disintegrate like Iraq has?

[PIK]

You see Trudeau starting an unnecessary war that turns into a quagmire that destabilizes the entire region? Or are you all-in crazy and suggesting Canada would disintegrate like Iraq has?

Just screwing his allies ,like Obama has.