Law and Order in America

[Black Dog]

Undercover cop, discovered by activists at Oakland protest, pulls gun on crowd

That picture. Love how he's got the weapon turned on its side just like he's seen in the action movies.

[GostHacked]

Apparently it is now illegal to film police in Illinois.

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014/12/09/the-illinois-house-and-senate-passed-a-bill-that-could-make-recording-cops-illegal/

That could put the cop cams in a predicament. Could be a move to get cop cams from getting implemented. But can they be held accountable if they violate so called eavesdropping laws?

[GostHacked]

75 years for filming cops in public?

[The_Squid]

75 years for filming cops in public?

Nope.

http://www.rcfp.org/browse-media-law-resources/news/strict-eavesdropping-law-ruled-unconstitutional-illinois-case

An Illinois judge ruled the state’s eavesdropping law unconstitutional as applied to a man who faced up to to 75 years in prison for secretly recording his encounters with police officers and a judge. “A statute intended to prevent unwarranted intrusions into a citizen’s privacy cannot be used as a shield for public officials who cannot assert a comparable right of privacy in their public duties,” the judge wrote in his decision dismissing the five counts of eavesdropping charges against defendant Michael Allison. - See more at: http://www.rcfp.org/browse-media-law-resources/news/strict-eavesdropping-law-ruled-unconstitutional-illinois-case#sthash.6m6B6CqE.dpuf

[GostHacked]

The real issue is that he was going to get 75 years for it. More than a murder or rape. The real issue is that you are going to be charged with eavesdropping when the cops are recording the same thing.

Yes the charges were dropped, meaning those people should not be charged in the first place. That is the problem.

If the police are not doing anything wrong, then they won't mind a little intrusion into their daily lives from the public.

[The_Squid]

The real issue is that he was going to get 75 years for it. More than a murder or rape. The real issue is that you are going to be charged with eavesdropping when the cops are recording the same thing.

Yes the charges were dropped, meaning those people should not be charged in the first place. That is the problem.

If the police are not doing anything wrong, then they won't mind a little intrusion into their daily lives from the public.

The good news is that a judge ruled it unconstitutional so there can't be any prosecutions trying to use that law in that manner. That's a good thing. The system worked. It stopped the petty cops and State from prosecuting this person for no good reason. It is now legal in Illinois to record cops.

[GostHacked]

The good news is that a judge ruled it unconstitutional so there can't be any prosecutions trying to use that law in that manner. That's a good thing. The system worked. It stopped the petty cops and State from prosecuting this person for no good reason. It is now legal in Illinois to record cops.

Yes it is good news. However it should not have needed to get to that point.

[The_Squid]

Yes it is good news. However it should not have needed to get to that point.

And slavery shouldn't have had to have a war fought about it in the USA to abolish it! There are prosecutors and cops who overstep their authority... and some who don't. The system worked in this case. Too bad slavery couldn't have been resolved like this, eh?

[GostHacked]

And slavery shouldn't have had to have a war fought about it in the USA to abolish it! There are prosecutors and cops who overstep their authority... and some who don't. The system worked in this case. Too bad slavery couldn't have been resolved like this, eh?

The system worked only because it was challenged. So it really did not work, but it corrected itself. So the laws they had violated people's rights.

[The_Squid]

The system worked only because it was challenged. So it really did not work, but it corrected itself. So the laws they had violated people's rights.

That's how it's designed to work. There are not many preemptive rulings... how laws are applied are often decided by courts. Hence hundreds of years of "common law".

It may be a flawed system, but can you think of any better systems out there?

[cybercoma]

I don't think cops should be recorded or wear these silly body cameras. These are just red herrings for the bigger issues. It's putting a bandaid on a severed limb.

[Big Guy]

I fully support police body cameras. It protects the public and discourages overzealousness in law enforcement.

[bush_cheney2004]

I agree...body cameras for all criminals and convicts too. Hell, body cameras for everybody !!

[eyeball]

Private individuals should be free to wear whatever they want or don't want. Public officials OTOH should follow the terms of their employment.

[bush_cheney2004]

No...body cameras for every lyin', cheatin', stealing, murderin' one of "us". It will make for lots of cool YouTube videos.

[On Guard for Thee]

No...body cameras for every lyin', cheatin', stealing, murderin' one of "us". It will make for lots of cool YouTube videos.

Why not stay out of it if all ya got is nonsense. Put your body camera on and go for a walk. Send it to youtube.

[GostHacked]

I fully support police body cameras. It protects the public and discourages overzealousness in law enforcement.

I don't believe it will make a difference. Police can and do tamper with evidence to cover their asses. And once they get used to it, they will go back to their usual behaviour. A major problem is that not enough good cops are ratting out the bad ones.

[guyser]

A major problem is that not enough good cops are ratting out the bad ones.

Only if by not enough you mean none....zero...nada...

Oh wait, absolutes....well theres probably one.

[GostHacked]

Only if by not enough you mean none....zero...nada...

Oh wait, absolutes....well theres probably one.

There are good cops out there, don't get me wrong. How many times do we hear 'internal investigations proved the police used appropriate force', when investigating police brutality and trigger happy police? Only when the public gets mad is anything done about it. The cop gets off , a person is dead, and the cop is allowed to continue his work in most cases.

I keep bringing up Kelly Thomas who was beat to death by police. Only when the public cried out where two of the police charged with murder/manslaughter. IF I helped someone beat another up, I'd be an accessory to a crime. But the law is applied different to police. Which goes back to my point of one set of rules for you and me, another for the police and people in government.

We should not ever be in a position where we need to challenge the authorities.

Edited December 11, 2014 by GostHacked

[guyser]

But the law is applied different to police. Which goes back to my point of one set of rules for you and me, another for the police and people in government.

We should not ever be in a position where we need to challenge the authorities.

There will always be a slightly diff set of rules for them and for us.

It has to be in order to work , at least to some degree.

But that said, the everyday crap that cops get off from is what drives me crazy.

For instance, cops are known to love fast cars, and drinking.

Ive seen the stats for the TPS personnel's personal insurance . Gues what, all 5000+ of them have virtually no tickets and almost zero DUI charges.

I suppose they could all be such good drivers and never drink and drive.

naw....couldnt be, 5000 is too large for that stat to be true.

Edited December 11, 2014 by Guyser2

[GostHacked]

There will always be a slightly diff set of rules for them and for us.

It has to be in order to work , at least to some degree.

So much for equality in our society.

But that said, the everyday crap that cops get off from is what drives me crazy.

For instance, cops are known to love fast cars, and drinking.

A guy I grew up with and was a close friend of mine for years, became a cop, and has wrecked his own car and damaged a police cruiser because of the drink. Also he was about to be brought up on assault charges. Nothing happened as far as I know.

Ive seen the stats for the TPS personnel's personal insurance . Gues what, all 5000+ of them have virtually no tickets and almost zero DUI charges.

I suppose they could all be such good drivers and never drink and drive.

naw....couldnt be, 5000 is too large for that stat to be true.

That speeding cop who killed the 5yr old riding in a car got off no problem. Excessive speeding and not even responding to an emergency. The parents to take some blame for making a wrong traffic move, but if the cop has not been excessively speeding unnecessarily , things might have turned out different. I believe the cop was cleared of wrongdoing.

Edited December 11, 2014 by GostHacked

[guyser]

So much for equality in our society.

I am referring to things such as having a gun, speeding on emerg calls,forcible actions against those deemed in the wrong as part of their job action.

But I am not talking about assualting someone without merit (a la G20 which is looking horrible for them w the current testimony)and those types of things.

[Black Dog]

Here's one for the "but, but, but....CANADA!" crowd.

A 48-year-old-grandmother who was acting as a “Good Samaritan” was karate-kicked, sucker-punched, beaten and left with “catastrophic injuries” by a police officer, a judge said Tuesday.

It has been two long years since Maria “Tonie” Farrell was charged with assaulting a police officer in an incident that has left her crippled from a shattered knee.

But in his ruling, Justice George Beatty exonerated — and validated — Farrell when he found that it was OPP Sgt. Russ Watson who attacked her while on duty April 2, 2013.

The kicker?

The Special Investigation Unit investigated the case and found no reasonable grounds to charge Watson, although he refused to produce his notes.

"OK guy, we'll take your word for it."

Edited December 18, 2014 by Black Dog

[Argus]

Here's one for the "but, but, but....CANADA!" crowd.

The kicker?

"OK guy, we'll take your word for it."

I would hope a very large lawsuit is in the process of being drawn up.

[Michael Hardner]

I would hope a very large lawsuit is in the process of being drawn up.

We don't have those in Canada, so much...