Should Marijuana Be Legal?

Boges · August 21, 2014

Just like any other business. And as easy as it may seem to grow my own plants, there is of course a bit more to it than just sticking a seed in a pot. Has to be dried etc., etc. And I just don't want to be bothered so I would just go to the local pot store, get a few joints, then to the liquor store for a bottle of wine and done. Every dollar I spend in that pot store is tax revenue the government is missing out on now. And in BC that business grosses around 6 billion (yep with a

That's you. I'm sure you think Canada's level of taxation is just fine and dandy. Lots of people don't think that way.

Again this is all about the level of taxation the government decided to levy. But if you're accustomed to having your drug of choice tax-free why would you suddenly volunteer to pay. Especially since doing that previously illegal hobby is now, no longer illegal.

Also if governments invest in the overhead in to open these pot stores I'm sure they'd want to increase the numbers of people using the product. (See the amount of marketing the LCBO does) So would they advertise? Kind of hypocritical banning the advertising of tobacco but advertising good ole pot, dontcha things?

Edited August 21, 2014 by Boges

Black Dog · August 21, 2014

I'm just pointing out the difference between the drugs. You really have to work hard to side-step taxation of Alcohol and Tobacco. It's like these people that Cord Cut, they work so hard not to pay for a good, yet expensive, product/service, but is the product/service they end up getting even worth the effort?

Where as growing your own pot sounds so easy that unless you were really lazy (we are talking pot heads here) you could find so many ways to sidestep paying taxes once it either ceases to be a crime or becomes legal.

Growing your own pot is the same as brewing your own beer or making your own wine. You can do it easily enough, but the quality will be commiserate with the amount of effort and expense you put into it.

Again this is all about the level of taxation the government decided to levy. But if you're accustomed to having your drug of choice tax-free why would you suddenly volunteer to pay. Especially since doing that previously illegal hobby is now, no longer illegal.

Are you talking about producers or users here? For users, legalization means a better product at a (likely) cheaper price (tax in) in a convenient location. What's not to like?

On Guard for Thee · August 21, 2014

That's you. I'm sure you think Canada's level of taxation is just fine and dandy. Lots of people don't think that way.

Again this is all about the level of taxation the government decided to levy. But if you're accustomed to having your drug of choice tax-free why would you suddenly volunteer to pay. Especially since doing that previously illegal hobby is now, no longer illegal.

Also if governments invest in the overhead in to open these pot stores I'm sure they'd want to increase the numbers of people using the product. (See the amount of marketing the LCBO does) So would they advertise? Kind of hypocritical banning the advertising of tobacco but advertising good ole pot, dontcha things?

Take a look south to Colorado and Washington. You don't need to advertise. Just open the doors.They can't keep the shelves stocked.

BubberMiley · August 21, 2014

Again this is all about the level of taxation the government decided to levy. But if you're accustomed to having your drug of choice tax-free why would you suddenly volunteer to pay. Especially since doing that previously illegal hobby is now, no longer illegal.

They wouldn't be "volunteering" to pay tax; they would be required to under the law. It would no longer be legal if they didn't follow the law, obviously, so they would probably pay the taxes just for the novelty of being on the straight and narrow.

But it's not like it being "tax-free" now means it's cheap. The government will be able to reap tremendous revenue by keeping consumer prices exactly where they are. It's still more expensive to buy in Colorado and Washington than it is in Canada.

Boges · August 21, 2014

They wouldn't be "volunteering" to pay tax; they would be required to under the law. It would no longer be legal if they didn't follow the law, obviously, so they would probably pay the taxes just for the novelty of being on the straight and narrow.

But it's not like it being "tax-free" now means it's cheap. The government will be able to reap tremendous revenue by keeping consumer prices exactly where they are. It's still more expensive to buy in Colorado and Washington than it is in Canada.

People don't seem so concerned with consequences when they do it now.

The US has a bit different view of Alcohol and Tobacco. It's much easier for them to make the transition as alcohol and tobacco already are regulated at such a low level.

In Canada governments control distribution of alcohol while they make using tobacco as difficult as possible. Are we to expect the same treatment from legal pot? If so, then a black market will likely pop up.

Boges · August 21, 2014

It appears in Colorado the private sector is doing the distribution.

We probably won't see a system like that in Canada.

BubberMiley · August 21, 2014

People don't seem so concerned with consequences when they do it now.

So you're saying you don't think there will be a net benefit?

Boges · August 21, 2014

So you're saying you don't think there will be a net benefit?

It depends on how a legal system is implemented. I don't trust out government to do it right.

I think you'd make more money ticketing people in a decriminalization model then taxing people for a product they can easily grow at home.

Black Dog · August 21, 2014

In Canada governments control distribution of alcohol while they make using tobacco as difficult as possible. Are we to expect the same treatment from legal pot? If so, then a black market will likely pop up.

There's no black market for booze and smokes (yes I know there's a black market in cigarette distribution, but that's mainly a byproduct of the unique arrangements with First Nations. No one is making and selling illegal booze or smokes in signnificant quantities).

It depends on how a legal system is implemented. I don't trust out government to do it right.

I think you'd make more money ticketing people in a decriminalization model then taxing people for a product they can easily grow at home.

Sigh. For the upteenth time: it's not that easy to grow quality weed at home.

On Guard for Thee · August 21, 2014

It depends on how a legal system is implemented. I don't trust out government to do it right.

I think you'd make more money ticketing people in a decriminalization model then taxing people for a product they can easily grow at home.

Well once again the Colorado and Washington state models show otherwise.

Boges · August 21, 2014

Well once again the Colorado and Washington state models show otherwise.

You won't see that model here.

Black Dog · August 21, 2014

Weed is not basil

Question: Where can Coloradans grow marijuana plants? Can people just stick them in a sunny window next to basil and aloe?

Answer: A big thing to remember with marijuana plants is that they need to flower to produce THC ( tetrahydrocannabinol, the chemical that gets people high) and other medicinal cannabinoids. In order to do that, they need 12 hours of light and 12 hours of total darkness a day.

So the best place to grow marijuana is in a room in the basement with a locked door so light doesn't inadvertently get in when the plants are "sleeping." If you don't have a basement, a small closet with light-leak protection around the door will work.

Q: Is special growing equipment required?

A: All sorts of prepackaged items are available, like grow boxes or grow tents, that are probably best for a small space like a closet, or for someone who doesn't want to get into growing marijuana too intensely.

But if you're trying to get six plants to be as robust as possible, you probably need to install something that's more permanent, like a 400- to 600-watt lamp with a hood assembly that comes with a ballast, which you place at least a forearm's length above the plants.

Keep in mind that the ballast is going to get very hot, so you need to have adequate cooling in the room as well, like a portable air conditioner with a thermostat. You don't want the room to get above 80 degrees because the hotter it is, the slower the plants grow. The ideal temperature is 75 to 80 degrees when the lights are on and 68 to 74 degrees when the lights are off.

You also have to watch humidity, because every time you water plants in a small space, you're going to get high humidity. It should be below 50 percent to prevent bud mold or rot.

You can measure humidity with a hygrometer from a hardware or grow store, and reduce it with a dehumidifier or air conditioner.

Q:How would a home grower comply with the rule that limits them to three plants in flower?

A: That means you can grow only three plants if you don't have two separate growing areas. The reason having only three plants is bad is that you want to keep a rotation going. Or else every time you get done harvesting, you have to go back to a store. If you want a continual supply, you want the perpetualness of having a vegetative stage and a flowering stage going all the time.

Q: How much does all this stuff cost?

A: Most grow boxes are $200 to $400, but if you want one with HVAC temperature-control capabilities, it's pretty pricey — close to $1,000. You can find grow boxes at most local hydroponic stores or grow shops.

A light system and building materials will run $350 to $1,000, and electricity costs per harvest are $100 to $200.

Boges · August 21, 2014

There's no black market for booze and smokes (yes I know there's a black market in cigarette distribution, but that's mainly a byproduct of the unique arrangements with First Nations. No one is making and selling illegal booze or smokes in signnificant quantities).

Sigh. For the upteenth time: it's not that easy to grow quality weed at home.

Black market tobacco is a huge issue. If you see anyone smoking a brand called Putters they got that on a reserve. Edited August 21, 2014 by Boges

On Guard for Thee · August 21, 2014

In any case it's not hard to see which way we are heading. I swear Harper does not lift a finger to do anything he can't see a few votes in and so now he is letting Mackay talk about decriminalizing pot tells us something. As far as generating money from tickets I'd hazard a guess that most cops frankly don't give a shit and you'd have to be dumb enough to walk into your local police station puffing away before they'd bother to bust you.

Black Dog · August 21, 2014

Black market tobacco is a huge issue. If you see anyone smoking a brand called Putters they got that on a reserve.

Are they growing it or just distributing it?

BubberMiley · August 21, 2014

It depends on how a legal system is implemented. I don't trust out government to do it right.

I think you'd make more money ticketing people in a decriminalization model then taxing people for a product they can easily grow at home.

It is far from easy to grow a worthwhile product and the risks of illegally growing it at home could be easily made to be not worth it.

guyser · August 21, 2014

The US has a bit different view of Alcohol and Tobacco. It's much easier for them to make the transition as alcohol and tobacco already are regulated at such a low level.

You keep on this tangent when in fact alcohol (dont know about tobacco) sales, use, production is very heavily regulated in the US.

Seriously boges, get off that tangent.

Boges · August 21, 2014

In any case it's not hard to see which way we are heading. I swear Harper does not lift a finger to do anything he can't see a few votes in and so now he is letting Mackay talk about decriminalizing pot tells us something. As far as generating money from tickets I'd hazard a guess that most cops frankly don't give a shit and you'd have to be dumb enough to walk into your local police station puffing away before they'd bother to bust you.

So you admit the laws aren't really enforced.

Also see speeding tickets as to how cops are motivated. You don't think camping on at the bottom of a hill on a Sunday morning is about public safety do you?

Boges · August 21, 2014

You keep on this tangent when in fact alcohol (dont know about tobacco) sales, use, production is very heavily regulated in the US.

Seriously boges, get off that tangent.

Not until I can't cross the border and pick up beer at a gas station for less than half price, than I can here.

Mighty AC · August 21, 2014

It is far from easy to grow a worthwhile product and the risks of illegally growing it at home could be easily made to be not worth it.

When MJ is legal in Canada I say we tax seed sales and allow people to grow their own if they choose. My guess is that most will still buy higher quality product from retailers.

On Guard for Thee · August 21, 2014

So you admit the laws aren't really enforced.

Also see speeding tickets as to how cops are motivated. You don't think camping on at the bottom of a hill on a Sunday morning is about public safety do you?

And don't you think it's just a bit easier for that cop to see me speeding by down the street in my 2000 lb automobile than walking by him with a quarter ounce of pot in my pocket?

eyeball · August 21, 2014

How about a free market?

Free? What are you, some kind of communist or something?

dre · August 21, 2014

I have never seen any valid argument for the criminalization of soft drugs. Legalize, let people grow their own, and allow for taxed commercial distribution. Spend a little money on treatment programs and save the rest.

Criminalization of soft drugs is one of the dumbest things ever attempted. Such a waste of time and money.

guyser · August 21, 2014

Not until I can't cross the border and pick up beer at a gas station for less than half price, than I can here.

I crossed over the border and headed to Idiana...on a Sunday. Not one store open that could sell booze.

Cross over into Minn or 4 other states....one can only buy low alohol beer in stores and convenience. Want real beer? Go to to a liquor store

Pennsylvania is worse.

Now back to smoking doobies....I mean discussing the merits of legalization

guyser · August 21, 2014

I have never seen any valid argument for the criminalization of soft drugs. .

I have, depending on your viewpoint.

As CEO of HEALTHINC, and once youve paid a tonne of moolah to fund campaigns for your MP etc, and you are worried about losing profitshares, then it makes sense....from that perspective.

The fact that mj can ease plenty of illnesses, provide comfort to thousands suffering various illneses annd disease, then as CEO you are worried that your overpriced non-natural medicine will take a hit.

Or one can argue , 'well shit, we built all these goddam prisons, lets fill 'em"

"How?"

"Stoners , violent and crazy when hopped up on mary jane " (That one is actual)

Edited August 21, 2014 by Guyser2