Mass shooting

[WIP]

The American culture isn't crumpling - from within, or elsewhere. Not agreeing with your biased, bogus claim is not to be in denial.

Yes, American culture is crumbling from within, and the spike in gun crimes and mass shootings is all the proof that's necessary. The gun nuts are churning over how back in the day, there were lots of guns around, but far fewer shootings. The difference is that now, people are losing their jobs, losing their houses, losing their health insurance (usually as a result of job loss), and lashing out in unpredictable ways. The picture of the suspect in Friday's horrendous crime is still a little foggy, but it appears that he was disabled to some degree by Asperger's Syndrome, and it appears that he had little if any treatment or counseling during his youth to help him adapt to this defect in mental processing ability. Not that there's a straight line between mental illness and grabbing a gun and going on a shooting spree, but a society that provides little support, and cuts back what is available....but allows lots of guns to be handy for anyone who feels like using one, is asking for more and more of these incidents in the nightly news report.

I was just talking to my wife a half hour ago, as we scanned the latest shooting incidents in Alabama, Oregon and a couple of other places since the school shootings on Friday. My own theory for the meltdown is that, since the U.S. has become an increasingly divided, isolated, and individualistic society since the changes in culture brought about by new technology-starting with television, and more recently divided by the increased stratification of wealth and incomes, Americans, by and large, can't act collectively in any sort of mass uprisings like in Southern Europe, the Middle East or Latin America. Maybe it would be safe to allow free and easy access to guns in a saner, less stressed out nation, but that is not the America of today.

And, I'm not gloating or chest-thumping about how wonderful everything is up here in Canada! Despite some somewhat misleading headlines on our economic health, and having a better social safety net....which we are also cutting back on....the main difference between Canada and the U.S. right now is the number and availability of handguns! I don't think, no matter how much money and how much squawking the NRA and Gun Owners of America do right now, that they are going to be able to stop reforms to gun ownership and sales any more....2nd Amendment be damned!

[Guest Derek L]

What are we talking about here? Two inches? Three?

That would fall under the Prohibited class……………

[Wilber]

Hence the reason for safe storage laws to mitigate such a possibility................My question would be why the dead mother allowed her now dead son, a son (as it’s becoming apparent) that had “social issues” which played apart in said parent pulling said child out of public schools, access to firearms…………If the gun had of been in a monitored safe, said event would likely have never happened with the mothers firearms…………..To expound upon said thought process, if a violent mentally disturbed person were locked up in a puzzle factory, that too would lesson such occurrences.

Who's to say they weren't stored properly, the kid lived there. It's quite possible that he managed to get her keys or codes without her knowledge or even got them by force. I' really wonder what is more important to you, that someone might have broken a storage law or that 20 six year olds and 6 of their teachers are dead. You guys can rationalize anything.

[Boges]

So what are “military grade weapons”?

What about any weapon that can fire 15+ rifle rounds at a fast rate without re-loading or using a bolt?

Edited December 17, 2012 by Boges

[Wilber]

I believe you mentioned prior that you too are a gun owner, if this is the case, I’d assume you follow the safe storage laws outlined in the Canadian Firearms Act………….I would suggest, much to the ire of many American gun owners, that Safe Storage laws coupled with Licensing, would help mitigate the “problem” of gun deaths associated with legal firearms and their owners.

Turns out I own half a gun. When I was a kid, a fellow worker talked my father into going hunting with him so he went down to the hardware store and bought a surplus rifle. Years later, I wound up with it. I stuck it in the attic after I had removed the bolt and hid it elsewhere in the house meaning to buy a trigger lock. I assumed it was some kind of Enfield because that's what surplus guns were back then and the SN started with RE but it didn't look like any other Enfield I'd seen. That's what I registered it as though. 5 years ago when I saw on in the RMC arms museum. It was a US Model 1917. I've never had any ammunition for it and still don't know what caliber it is. Most were 30.06 but Remington made a bunch for the British in 303 during WW1. From web research, I think it is a 303. Never took it to a gun shop to find out though.

To make a long story short, when we moved this year after 23 years, do you think I could find that bolt? It's either somewhere in the old house, got chucked out with two decades of clutter or still in an unpacked box somewhere which I doubt. If I don't find it soon, I'll just turn it in.

[bush_cheney2004]

What about any weapon that can fire 30 rifle rounds at a fast rate without re-loading?

What about them? Haven't you ever seen a firearms competition with REVOLVERS using speed loaders ?

[BubberMiley]

That would fall under the Prohibited class……………

I think anyone who posts gun porn in a thread about children getting murdered by one of their own should try Viagra instead.

[bush_cheney2004]

.... If I don't find it soon, I'll just turn it in.

Take it to the pawn shop in Las Vegas. You can be on the History Channel show "Pawn Stars".

[Boges]

What about them? Haven't you ever seen a firearms competition with REVOLVERS using speed loaders ?

They have revolvers that hold more than 15 rifle rounds? Also you still have to cock (giggle) the hammer with revolvers right?

[Guest Derek L]

Who's to say they weren't stored properly, the kid lived there. It's quite possible that he managed to get her keys or codes without her knowledge or even got them by force. I' really wonder what is more important to you, that someone might have broken a storage law or that 20 six year olds and 6 of their teachers are dead. You guys can rationalize anything.

Well they quite obviously weren’t stored properly in a home with a diagnosed mentally ill person...........As for the level of importance, well as mentioned by others, such a tragedy will become examined after the fact.

[bush_cheney2004]

I think anyone who posts gun porn in a thread about children getting murdered by one of their own should try Viagra instead.

Frankly, it is very apporiate to post "gun porn" in a thread about mass shootings.....this will help some people get a clue about the topic.

[Boges]

Take it to the pawn shop in Las Vegas. You can be on the History Channel show "Pawn Stars".

Rick can't buy any firearm made before 1900 You clearly don't watch the show. You'll only see classic guns on that show. Now the Cajun Pawn Stars guy, He's selling a crazy-ass gun almost every episode. Saw him drop over $100,000 for a WW1 era rifle that could shoot over trenches.

[Boges]

I think anyone who posts gun porn in a thread about children getting murdered by one of their own should try Viagra instead.

I think this thread is more about the Gun Control issue than the children. There's not really much point debating a how horrible a tragedy like that is.

[BubberMiley]

Frankly, it is very apporiate to post "gun porn" in a thread about mass shootings.....this will help some people get a clue about the topic.

Didn't you get suspended for doing that last time?

[bush_cheney2004]

Rick can't buy any firearm made before 1900 You clearly don't watch the show.

Get your story straight.....before or after 1900 ? US model was 1917 according to the post above.

I've actually been in that pawn shop on Las Vegas Blvd. It's a dump selling Chumley souvenoirs.

Edited December 17, 2012 by bush_cheney2004

[bush_cheney2004]

Didn't you get suspended for doing that last time?

Nope....you must be confused...again.

[Guest Derek L]

What about any weapon that can fire 15+ rifle rounds at a fast rate without re-loading or using a bolt?

I can reload from a standing position a 92FS (10 rounds) somewhere bet 1-1.5 seconds……….SMLE no.4 (granted a few years ago) just under 30 aimed rounds out to 200 yards in under a minute with a 70 year old bolt action rifle………The argument of rapid fire is a strawman .

[Guest Derek L]

They have revolvers that hold more than 15 rifle rounds? Also you still have to cock (giggle) the hammer with revolvers right?

Not on a double action..........And a revolver, unlike a semi-auto, doesn't jam due to feeding issues.

[Black Dog]

I can reload from a standing position a 92FS (10 rounds) somewhere bet 1-1.5 seconds……….SMLE no.4 (granted a few years ago) just under 30 aimed rounds out to 200 yards in under a minute with a 70 year old bolt action rifle………The argument of rapid fire is a strawman .

So wait how many grade schoolers is that? Just trying to put in in practical terms.

Edited December 17, 2012 by Black Dog

[bush_cheney2004]

Not on a double action..........And a revolver, unlike a semi-auto, doesn't jam due to feeding issues.

Correct Sir...every gun nut deserves to have a high quality revolver in his/her collection. The biggest mistake people make in time rapid fire competitions is to waste time putting the empty loader back in their pocket or vest. Just drop it to the ground like an empty magazine when ejected. Go for the gold !

[GostHacked]

So the gun porn has taken us away from the point of the thread.

[Boges]

Get your story straight.....before or after 1900 ? US model was 1917 according to the post above.

I've actually been in that pawn shop on Las Vegas Blvd. It's a dump selling Chumley souvenoirs.

I've just watched the show. He's turned people away for trying to sell guns made before 1900. A guy wanted to sell him a Cannon in a recent episode but his Gun Expert couldn't guarantee it wasn't made pre-1900.

[bush_cheney2004]

I've just watched the show. He's turned people away for trying to sell guns made before 1900. A guy wanted to sell him a Cannon in a recent episode but his Gun Expert couldn't guarantee it wasn't made pre-1900.

Look, I'm not saying you're wrong, but I know he has purchased several blunderbusses and civil war muzzle loaders, obviously made before 1900.

[Guest Derek L]

I think this thread is more about the Gun Control issue than the children. There's not really much point debating a how horrible a tragedy like that is.

Exactly..........As such, with such a tragedy, issues will be debated, and with debated issues, there will me misunderstandings associated with facts………..If some misconceptions can be put to rest, and an honest discussion garnered without one side resorting to labelling the other as (even indirectly) supportive of such tragedies or reverting to low brow phallic insults no progress will be made.

I’ve offered feasible consolatory suggestions……..The retort, I have a small tillywhacker, supportive of the killings and I’m nuts etc

Under such guise, be it here or the national scene, one thing is certain on such a divisive subject, if one side refuses fair dialogue I can guarantee that nothing will happen, fore the push goes to the gun owners……..

[bush_cheney2004]

I’ve offered feasible consolatory suggestions……..The retort, I have a small tillywhacker, supportive of the killings and I’m nuts etc

Moreover, it is clear that such a mindset has no idea what they are talking about, will lash out with false conclusions and more ineffective "feel good" solutions, all while driving more people to purchase firearms who wouldn't have otherwise done so.