kimmy Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 Cynics have accused Republicans of only caring about children until they're born. Well, in Michigan, that claim has teeth. After eliminating tax credits for outside-the-womb children in 2011, Michigan Republicans are now working to introduce... the Fetus Tax Credit! Folks, we couldn't make this stuff up. -k Quote (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻ Friendly forum facilitator! ┬──┬◡ﾉ(° -°ﾉ)
Guest Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 If the Republican party ever wants to be taken seriously again, it has to get rid of these freaking wingnuts. Quote
Sleipnir Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 ....lol? Quote "All you need in this life is ignorance and confidence; then success is sure." - Mark Twain
GostHacked Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 And we wonder why society as a whole is doomed? Quote
Sleipnir Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 Can someone explain to me the 'fetus tax credit'? I may be getting the wrong impression... Quote "All you need in this life is ignorance and confidence; then success is sure." - Mark Twain
GostHacked Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 Can someone explain to me the 'fetus tax credit'? I may be getting the wrong impression... Have sex, get pregnant .. get tax credit .... almost like paying people to have kids. Quote
msj Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 Have sex, get pregnant .. get tax credit .... almost like paying people to have kids. No, it would be like paying people to almost have kids. Quote If a believer demands that I, as a non-believer, observe his taboos in the public domain, he is not asking for my respect but for my submission. And that is incompatible with a secular democracy. Flemming Rose (Dutch journalist) My biggest takeaway from economics is that the past wasn't as good as you remember, the present isn't as bad as you think, and the future will be better than you anticipate. Morgan Housel http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2016/01/14/things-im-pretty-sure-about.aspx
Guest American Woman Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 (edited) Cynics have accused Republicans of only caring about children until they're born. Well, in Michigan, that claim has teeth. After eliminating tax credits for outside-the-womb children in 2011, Michigan Republicans are now working to introduce... the Fetus Tax Credit! Folks, we couldn't make this stuff up. Actually, that doesn't present it quite the way it is. Yes, the $600 tax credit for dependent children was eliminated for 2013, but children are still considered dependents, thus qualify for a "dependent exemption," and the proposed legislation would include fetuses of at least 12 weeks at the end of the tax year, under the care of a doctor for that period of time, as a "dependent exemption," also. Fetuses wouldn't be getting any "tax credits" that "outside-the-womb children" don't get. The idea is to recognize that even before the child is born, parents face increased expenses, but I doubt if this bill will ever see the light of day. Edited November 25, 2012 by American Woman Quote
betsy Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 So there you go. AW explained it. No need to get all excited and hyperventilating about it....just because you saw the word, "fetus." And, "Republican." Quote
Michael Hardner Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 Thanks, AW, for explaining that. Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
Shady Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 Actually, that doesn't present it quite the way it is. Yes, the $600 tax credit for dependent children was eliminated for 2013, but children are still considered dependents, thus qualify for a "dependent exemption," and the proposed legislation would include fetuses of at least 12 weeks at the end of the tax year, under the care of a doctor for that period of time, as a "dependent exemption," also. Fetuses wouldn't be getting any "tax credits" that "outside-the-womb children" don't get. The idea is to recognize that even before the child is born, parents face increased expenses, but I doubt if this bill will ever see the light of day. I concur, thanks for the actual explanation AW. It's too bad the originator of the thread didn't take the time to learn more about the issue before posting that caricature. Quote
Shady Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 So there you go. AW explained it. No need to get all excited and hyperventilating about it....just because you saw the word, "fetus." And, "Republican." LOL, well said. They're like a pack of Pavlov's dogs. *ding* *ding* *ding* Quote
Michael Hardner Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 To be fair, the article linked in the OP is misleading. But if this was really a life-begins-at-conception deal then the bill wouldn't specify 12 weeks, would it? Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
Shady Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 (edited) To be fair, the article linked in the OP is misleading. True. That's part of the problem relying on very partisan media for information. My favourite part of the OP was the "folks, we couldn't make this stuff up." Actually, you did! But if this was really a life-begins-at-conception deal then the bill wouldn't specify 12 weeks, would it? Also true. Edited November 25, 2012 by Shady Quote
msj Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 (edited) I still do not see how kimmy's post or even the article in the OP as misleading as some would like us to think. Taking another look it is clear that what they are saying is that the Republicans want to extend a tax credit to start at 12 weeks of pregnancy. So lets call that an increase in a tax credit which is "good." Perhaps the article should be clearer as to stating what AW has mentioned above. On the other hand, the Republicans want to slash other tax credits/benefits which have to do with real live children (such as the Earned Income Tax Credit and the child care subsidy) which is "bad" and for which AW's post is silent. Edited November 25, 2012 by msj Quote If a believer demands that I, as a non-believer, observe his taboos in the public domain, he is not asking for my respect but for my submission. And that is incompatible with a secular democracy. Flemming Rose (Dutch journalist) My biggest takeaway from economics is that the past wasn't as good as you remember, the present isn't as bad as you think, and the future will be better than you anticipate. Morgan Housel http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2016/01/14/things-im-pretty-sure-about.aspx
GostHacked Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 No, it would be like paying people to almost have kids. A minor technicality , but a technicality none the less. !!! Quote
GostHacked Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 If they can give a fetus a tax credit, wait till they start taxing the fetus. Not even born and already in debt to the system. Financial slavery. Quote
eyeball Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 The idea is to recognize that even before the child is born, parents face increased expenses, but I doubt if this bill will ever see the light of day. Maybe not but the spectacular afterimage from even this little glimpse should last awhile. Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
cybercoma Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 This is an attack on pro-choice. If a child is a "dependent" at 12 weeks, then the next move is to say that the woman is killing a dependent. Quote
CPCFTW Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 This is an attack on pro-choice. If a child is a "dependent" at 12 weeks, then the next move is to say that the woman is killing a dependent. Could you get any more dependent than living in someone's womb? Quote
Guest American Woman Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 The bill refers to "the fetus," not "the baby," and there are already laws in Michigan against harming a fetus, so really, I don't see how this would alter abortion laws. At any rate, it's already been pulled from Monday's legislative agenda, indicating that the legislature is not ready to vote on it, and any proposed bills that are not passed by December 31 are forfeited and must be rewritten and reintroduced the following year, and there's no guarantee of what will happen during that year. While there are some states that have a "stillborn" deduction, recognizing that the parents of a stillborn baby have added expenses, Michigan's stillbirth tax credit has been repealed. Again, I don't see this bill as seeing the light of day. I do think there's some merit to it, as pregnancy does result in extra expenses, but most likely the "dependency exemption" isn't the way to go. Quote
Michael Hardner Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 This is an attack on pro-choice. If a child is a "dependent" at 12 weeks, then the next move is to say that the woman is killing a dependent. Why "the next move" ? Would it be necessary to pass this bill first before banning abortion after the first trimester ? Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
gunrutz Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 This is an attack on pro-choice. If a child is a "dependent" at 12 weeks, then the next move is to say that the woman is killing a dependent. Damn this slippery slope that nothing ever seems to slide down. Quote
Sleipnir Posted November 25, 2012 Report Posted November 25, 2012 If they can give a fetus a tax credit, wait till they start taxing the fetus. Not even born and already in debt to the system. Financial slavery. Which would essentially be a tax on women since men can't biologically carry the fetus. Quote "All you need in this life is ignorance and confidence; then success is sure." - Mark Twain
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