WWWTT Posted October 27, 2012 Report Posted October 27, 2012 We have high unemployment and high welfare rolls in this country yet we're importing workers and resources I don't understand. The government needs to take control of these resources and kick out all the foreign invaders and keep Canada for Canadians! It's funny that only a few years ago Harper was very anti China. Now he's bending his ass over backwards to please the Chinese. Looks good on him! WWWTT Quote Maple Leaf Web is now worth $720.00! Down over $1,500 in less than one year! Total fail of the moderation on this site! That reminds me, never ask Greg to be a business partner! NEVER!
scribblet Posted October 27, 2012 Report Posted October 27, 2012 How is it that companies can't find employees when the youth unemployment rate is well over 15%? That's people actively looking for fulltime employment and can't find it. That's the 64,000 $$ question, why won't Canadians take these jobs... Quote Hey Ho - Ontario Liberals Have to Go - Fight Wynne - save our province
Bonam Posted October 27, 2012 Report Posted October 27, 2012 That's the 64,000 $$ question, why won't Canadians take these jobs... Not many Canadians want to spend their lives toiling away in subterranean thralldom under the yoke of their new Chinese masters? Quote
Topaz Posted October 27, 2012 Report Posted October 27, 2012 What's the chance that these 2000 workers are 2000 Red Chinese privates? The chinese are not stupid people, what better way to bring spies. Quote
login Posted October 28, 2012 Report Posted October 28, 2012 (edited) It's funny that only a few years ago Harper was very anti China. Now he's bending his ass over backwards to please the Chinese. Looks good on him! WWWTT He went to China.... They named a meal after him.... obviously he wasn't in the meal... Maybe upon seeing China, it dawned on the PM exactly what China really was. Perhaps it takes experiencing a country to know what it really is, even with state security grooming every millimeter of the experience. Edited October 28, 2012 by login Quote
scribblet Posted October 28, 2012 Report Posted October 28, 2012 Not many Canadians want to spend their lives toiling away in subterranean thralldom under the yoke of their new Chinese masters? Thralldom - Yoke of masters - really, get a grip. Canadian miners make good money, and rightly so, they are not in the yoke of any master. And I suppose Newfoundlers don’t want to work in thraldom under the yoke of their Canadian masters. http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/newfoundland-labrador/story/2012/06/04/nl-thailand-crab-plant-butler-604.html Quote Hey Ho - Ontario Liberals Have to Go - Fight Wynne - save our province
Argus Posted October 28, 2012 Author Report Posted October 28, 2012 "Should" ? Ok. Let's explore that a little. Let's play devil's advocate. Why ? Is it just the Protestant work ethic ? Is work good for the soul ? What if there is no work to do ? What will happen when the robots do the work ? I'm clearly thinking in terms of turning down jobs. If there's no jobs, there's no jobs. But if we're importing low skill workers then there are clearly jobs to be had. I also don't think it's in the interest of the country to pay people to stay in areas there are no jobs and where there are unlikely to be jobs rather than having them move to areas where there are jobs. As to why, I should think that would be obvious: because these people are living on the hard work of others. Namely me! Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted October 28, 2012 Author Report Posted October 28, 2012 With all due respect, yours is just one voice calling out. The same companies who call for lower taxes call for lower wages to be competitive and they have a lot more pull than you or me. We have more votes than them. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted October 28, 2012 Author Report Posted October 28, 2012 How is it that companies can't find employees when the youth unemployment rate is well over 15%? That's people actively looking for fulltime employment and can't find it. I think companies could, in most cases. But in the cases where they can import foreign workers, I can see why they would prefer to do that. The foreign workers get paid less, and are entirely dependent on the company's good will. They do what they're told for no benefits and don't complain or they're sent home. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted October 28, 2012 Author Report Posted October 28, 2012 I do not think the Chinese are concerned with running the world. From what I see they are more concerned with improving their own country. If they influence other nations to do the same,then yes that would be a very good thing! But maybe you are thinking of something else? WWWTT You were the one who said he wished the Chinese ran the world. I just wanted to clarify why you thought that would be a good thing. It seems to me the elites in China are primarily interested in enriching themselves, and in building up power, both for themselves as individuals, and for China. Nor do they shrink from threatening others in the world to get their way, either economically or militarily. So why did you say that would be a good thing? Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted October 28, 2012 Author Report Posted October 28, 2012 That's the 64,000 $$ question, why won't Canadians take these jobs... Either the companies aren't trying to recruit Canadians because they prefer cheaper, more obedient foreign workers, or the Canadians in question find it more comfortable to live off pogey/welfare than working at an unpleasant job. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted October 28, 2012 Author Report Posted October 28, 2012 Not many Canadians want to spend their lives toiling away in subterranean thralldom under the yoke of their new Chinese masters? I worked a lot of jobs I didn't like when I was younger. I didn't slack off and let someone else do the work and then demand some of their money. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Michael Hardner Posted October 28, 2012 Report Posted October 28, 2012 We have more votes than them. But you can't get a meeting with the Minister of Industry. As for you supporting people who aren't working... it's not you that supports them, it's the system. And as I pointed out, eventually there won't be enough work. We're trying to come up with things that need to be done, rather than reducing our work week in response to there being less work. Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
scribblet Posted October 28, 2012 Report Posted October 28, 2012 Either the companies aren't trying to recruit Canadians because they prefer cheaper, more obedient foreign workers, or the Canadians in question find it more comfortable to live off pogey/welfare than working at an unpleasant job. The gov't is investigating this, and the questionable preference for mandarin speaking applicants. If this is the case and Canadians are not able to apply then the whole process should be restarted. The co. should advertise again and should be able to prove that no Canadians applied before bringing in temp. workers. If they can prove that no Canadians applied then there is a problem, either with lazy Canadians who won't work, or we do in fact need to import workers. Quote Hey Ho - Ontario Liberals Have to Go - Fight Wynne - save our province
Bonam Posted October 28, 2012 Report Posted October 28, 2012 Thralldom - Yoke of masters - really, get a grip. Canadian miners make good money, and rightly so, they are not in the yoke of any master. And I suppose Newfoundlers don’t want to work in thraldom under the yoke of their Canadian masters. Haha I take it you didn't appreciate my use of more colorful language. The fact remains, why would you expect a Chinese company to care about Canada or Canadian workers? Yeah, the government could force these companies to hire Canadians with some regulations, but how do you think these Canadian workers that the company doesn't really want would be treated when they aren't really wanted, when the company really wants to bring in a bunch of Chinese instead? Further, the resources in the ground are limited, and letting foreign companies dig them up and make a big chunk of the profit overseas in their foreign headquarters shortchanges the value of these resources for Canadians. So if you want to address the problem, start with figuring out not why there aren't enough Canadian workers to work in the mines, but why there aren't enough Canadian companies to operate the mines. Either the companies aren't trying to recruit Canadians because they prefer cheaper, more obedient foreign workers, or the Canadians in question find it more comfortable to live off pogey/welfare than working at an unpleasant job. In this case it sounds like option #1, considering the jobs had a Chinese language requirement specifically designed to keep Canadians out. I worked a lot of jobs I didn't like when I was younger. I didn't slack off and let someone else do the work and then demand some of their money. Congrats. Myself, I got an education and used it to work in jobs I liked. Nowhere did I talk about demanding some of someone else's money. Quote
TimG Posted October 28, 2012 Report Posted October 28, 2012 (edited) So if you want to address the problem, start with figuring out not why there aren't enough Canadian workers to work in the mines, but why there aren't enough Canadian companies to operate the mines.I think a big part of the problem is the wages offered. How do they compare to what people would get if they went to the Alberta oil sands? The pool of workers that would be useful to the mine would often be useful to the oil sands.If the wage levels are significantly less then we need to ask if raising the wage levels would make the mine uneconomic? If it does then we have to make a choice: let the business close or allow foreign workers. In agricultural work the result is usually to allow foreign workers. Edited October 28, 2012 by TimG Quote
WWWTT Posted October 28, 2012 Report Posted October 28, 2012 He went to China.... They named a meal after him.... obviously he wasn't in the meal... Maybe upon seeing China, it dawned on the PM exactly what China really was. Perhaps it takes experiencing a country to know what it really is, even with state security grooming every millimeter of the experience. Actually Harper was too busy kissing George Bush's butt to go to China. After Bush left,Obama changed the channel on China policy and Harper couldn't kiss enough. WWWTT Quote Maple Leaf Web is now worth $720.00! Down over $1,500 in less than one year! Total fail of the moderation on this site! That reminds me, never ask Greg to be a business partner! NEVER!
WWWTT Posted October 28, 2012 Report Posted October 28, 2012 You were the one who said he wished the Chinese ran the world. I just wanted to clarify why you thought that would be a good thing. It seems to me the elites in China are primarily interested in enriching themselves, and in building up power, both for themselves as individuals, and for China. Nor do they shrink from threatening others in the world to get their way, either economically or militarily. So why did you say that would be a good thing? Next time I'm feeling confused I will come to you to clarify how I am exactly feeling. What am I thinking now? WWWTT Quote Maple Leaf Web is now worth $720.00! Down over $1,500 in less than one year! Total fail of the moderation on this site! That reminds me, never ask Greg to be a business partner! NEVER!
Argus Posted October 28, 2012 Author Report Posted October 28, 2012 But you can't get a meeting with the Minister of Industry. But we can make him the ex-minister of industry by voting him out of office. As for you supporting people who aren't working... it's not you that supports them, it's the system. That's specious. I support the system. And as I pointed out, eventually there won't be enough work I have no idea what you're talking about here. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted October 28, 2012 Author Report Posted October 28, 2012 (edited) Next time I'm feeling confused I will come to you to clarify how I am exactly feeling. What am I thinking now? WWWTT You seem to be thinking you can wiggle out of not explaining why you replied "Thank God" to the suggestion the Chinese will soon be running the world, or at least, that if you weasel around enough nobody will notice you didn't answer. Edited October 28, 2012 by Argus Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
WWWTT Posted October 28, 2012 Report Posted October 28, 2012 You seem to be thinking you can wiggle out of not explaining why you replied "Thank God" to the suggestion the Chinese will soon be running the world, or at least, that if you weasel around enough nobody will notice you didn't answer. I don't think anyone really cares about a feeble joke I made other than you. However I did make a slight attempt at what I have perceived,however you have a different impression of Chinese society. WWWTT Quote Maple Leaf Web is now worth $720.00! Down over $1,500 in less than one year! Total fail of the moderation on this site! That reminds me, never ask Greg to be a business partner! NEVER!
Michael Hardner Posted October 29, 2012 Report Posted October 29, 2012 But we can make him the ex-minister of industry by voting him out of office. You have a lot less power to do that than the lobbyist. That's specious. I support the system. You alone ? No, you are just a part of it. I have no idea what you're talking about here. There is just less work to do as time goes on. Do we want to have unemployment or do we want to have leisure ? Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
PIK Posted October 29, 2012 Report Posted October 29, 2012 I live in a area that is full of farms, berries , apples and veggies and they have to bring in foriegn workers to pick it, while able bodied young people sit on the main street all summer doing nothing but getting into trouble. Time to force these people to work when the jobs are available. I worked farms growing up and friends went off to pick tobacco. The canadian has become very lazy. Quote Toronto, like a roach motel in the middle of a pretty living room.
wyly Posted October 29, 2012 Report Posted October 29, 2012 (edited) I live in a area that is full of farms, berries , apples and veggies and they have to bring in foriegn workers to pick it, while able bodied young people sit on the main street all summer doing nothing but getting into trouble. Time to force these people to work when the jobs are available. I worked farms growing up and friends went off to pick tobacco. The canadian has become very lazy. no there is an intellectual arrogance that rewards higher pay to someone tapping away at a keyboard more money than someone who does physically demanding work...you have to be insane to work for minimum wages in the agricultural industry when you can make more as a food server with far better working conditions or an equivalent amount working in retail...hmmm let's see now, work for minimum in retail at walmart or work a farm for minimum in the blazing heat or freezing cold while swatting mosquitoes and blackflys. ya that's a real difficult decision to make...the days when you worked farms are decades past, work options were few and horrendous working conditions were the norm but canadians have more options and way smarter now, if you want them to do crappy jobs you better be ready to pay them the true value for their labours...of course that will mean higher food costs and then you'll be whining about the good old days when food was cheaper... edit-then there is your assumption that those young people sitting on main street don't have jobs, they could very well be working a couple of part time jobs, split shifts, evening shifts, weekends or they have well off parents and don't need to work at all... Edited October 30, 2012 by wyly Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
eyeball Posted October 29, 2012 Report Posted October 29, 2012 We have high unemployment and high welfare rolls in this country yet we're importing workers and resources I don't understand. The government needs to take control of these resources and kick out all the foreign invaders and keep Canada for Canadians! I don't understand either. Didn't Papa Harper rise to power on a wave of sentiment that is virulently opposed to government control over resources? And yet...where is that sentiment now in the wake of Harper's rush to sell those very same resources to other countries that more often than not seem to be invading us with their own nationalized resource corporations? Exactly who's side are you and your hero on anyway? Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
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