Why is Race Still an issue?

[JerrySeinfeld]

Its pretty much impossible to disagree that the Democratic Party never wins another election without a huge percentage of the black vote. So let's be honest. The party with the most interest in racial divide is the Democrats. If African Americans begin to see themselves not as a block of dependent voters but as individuals with personal goals and a desire for freedom, then they, by definition, become republicans. Is there any disagreement that racial divides in politics exist and are perpetuated by Democrats?

Jesse Jackson

Al Sharpton

A couple of examples.

Edited September 3, 2012 by JerrySeinfeld

[Argus]

Its pretty much impossible to disagree that the Democratic Party never wins another election without a huge percentage of the black vote. So let's be honest. The party with the most interest in racial divide is the Democrats. If African Americans begin to see themselves not as a block of dependent voters but as individuals with personal goals and a desire for freedom, then they, by definition, become republicans. Is there any disagreement that racial divides in politics exist and are perpetuated by Democrats?

Jesse Jackson

Al Sharpton

A couple of examples.

I think that's nonsense. While many Blacks have reached the middle class and above, they needed help to do so. The Republican party would eliminate that help. Naturally these Blacks resent that. In addition, poor Blacks, and the majority still are poor, need government assistance of various kinds. The Republican party is all about ending, or at least, drastically cutting back that assistance in order to cut taxes for their patrons: the corporations and the wealthy. There is every natural reason why the vast bulk of Blacks, and for that matter, Hispanics, would vote against Republics, even if they're not over-enthusiastic for the Democrats. The Republicans' own platforms over the last few decades have all been completely opposed to the poor and lower middle classes. Instead of trying to craft any sort of message which appeals to the poor and minorities Republicans have been trying to disenfranchise them by bringing in ever more stringent identification requirements for voting. How is it this can be blamed on the Democrats?

[punked]

Its pretty much impossible to disagree that the Democratic Party never wins another election without a huge percentage of the black vote. So let's be honest. The party with the most interest in racial divide is the Democrats. If African Americans begin to see themselves not as a block of dependent voters but as individuals with personal goals and a desire for freedom, then they, by definition, become republicans. Is there any disagreement that racial divides in politics exist and are perpetuated by Democrats?

Jesse Jackson

Al Sharpton

A couple of examples.

Could it be that the Republican party is openly hostile not just to AA but most minorities in the US? Yes it could.

[eyeball]

Is there any disagreement that racial divides in politics exist and are perpetuated by Democrats?

Perpetuated? I don't doubt that democrats gain the most from racial divides but they don't have to do much if any perpetuating to achieve that.

[cybercoma]

The Mormon Church believed that blacks were an inferior species and has never made apologies for it. Romney belonged to the Church then. And now he's using a slogan from the KKK.

Gee... I dunno. Why's race an issue?

[JerrySeinfeld]

I think that's nonsense. While many Blacks have reached the middle class and above, they needed help to do so. The Republican party would eliminate that help. Naturally these Blacks resent that. In addition, poor Blacks, and the majority still are poor, need government assistance of various kinds. The Republican party is all about ending, or at least, drastically cutting back that assistance in order to cut taxes for their patrons: the corporations and the wealthy. There is every natural reason why the vast bulk of Blacks, and for that matter, Hispanics, would vote against Republics, even if they're not over-enthusiastic for the Democrats. The Republicans' own platforms over the last few decades have all been completely opposed to the poor and lower middle classes. Instead of trying to craft any sort of message which appeals to the poor and minorities Republicans have been trying to disenfranchise them by bringing in ever more stringent identification requirements for voting. How is it this can be blamed on the Democrats?

First, the republican party was founded on the basis of abolishing slavery, and thousands of republicans fought and died on that principle. It was the Democrats who founded the KKK and fought to keep slavery alive and well.

Second, I reject your theory that dependency created by the Dems has worked out well for blacks. Just as with the first nations people in Canada, giving people handouts hasn't resulted in a "hand up" at all. To the contrary, it has created a culture of dependency within the group. A perpetual culture which feeds Democratic party power: we keep you dependant upon us, you keep voting for us. Like a pusher and a junkie. Don't believe me? Look at the cities in parts of the country that have long been under Democratic rule: Detroit, California, Chicago. These are places with huge government programs and massive Democrat control. And they are also bankrupt, in a shambles, and worse.

Your entire premise is based upon the principle that people without white skin need the government to give them something. Without even getting into how racist that attitude is, I do agree that this is what the Democratic party truly believes in, and it hasn't worked and isn't working.

What poor people need most is jobs. Jobs are created by businesses. Businesses invest under low regulation and low tax environments. The Democratic party has increased all of the above. Hence, it is the Democrats who are anti poor, because all they have to offer the poor is more dependency. The single worst thing you can do to a person is rob them of their independence. Unfortunatey, the entire Democrat platform is based upon dependence.

Edited September 3, 2012 by JerrySeinfeld

[cybercoma]

First, the republican party was founded on the basis of abolishing slavery, and thousands of republicans fought and died on that principle. It was the Democrats who founded the KKK and fought to keep slavery alive and well.

And you would have a point if this was still the Reconstruction era. It's not, so this historical fact is entirely meaningless today.

[JerrySeinfeld]

And you would have a point if this was still the Reconstruction era. It's not, so this historical fact is entirely meaningless today.

And the civil rights movement was over half a century ago, so you too would have a point if this were 1962. It's not. It's 2012.

[cybercoma]

And the civil rights movement was over half a century ago, so you too would have a point if this were 1962. It's not. It's 2012.

Just because Civil Rights protests ended doesn't mean that there's equality yet. Argus already pointed out the reasons why race is an issue today.

[JerrySeinfeld]

Just because Civil Rights protests ended doesn't mean that there's equality yet. Argus already pointed out the reasons why race is an issue today.

Race is an issue because the Democrats want it to be an issue.

We've tried the Democrat dependency programs for 50 years. FIFTY YEARS. Go to Detroit or a Chicago ghetto. How's that been working' out for blacks. And now you're saying we need MORE of the SAME?

Wow.

[dre]

If African Americans begin to see themselves not as a block of dependent voters but as individuals with personal goals and a desire for freedom, then they, by definition, become republicans.

:lol:

[waldo]

What poor people need most is jobs. Jobs are created by businesses. Businesses invest under low regulation and low tax environments. The Democratic party has increased all of the above.

Jer... and yet, the Politifact Truth-O-Meter suggests you're, once again, full of it:... private-sector jobs, Jer! Should we also add in government/public-sector jobs, hey?

former U.S. President Bill Clinton speaking at the just completed 2012 Democratic Convention: "

Since 1961 … our

private

economy has produced 66 million private-sector jobs. So what's the jobs score? Republicans 24 million, Democrats 42 (million).

"

[bleeding heart]

Race is an issue because the Democrats want it to be an issue.

We've tried the Democrat dependency programs for 50 years. FIFTY YEARS. Go to Detroit or a Chicago ghetto. How's that been working' out for blacks. And now you're saying we need MORE of the SAME?

Wow.

Excuse me; but the Republicans have been in power for much of the past "FIFTY YEARS," as you so eloquently stress the point.

More than half of those fifty years, actually.

Now, I realize it offers a giddy, partisan pleasure to not only blame the left for what the left does...but to blame the left for what the right does, too!

Pleasureable, but unwise, and unreasonable.

The fact is, as some conservative-leaning folks like to say, we are responsible for our own actions.

Another way to put it is "conservative/Republican is what conservative/Republican does."

They've been in power more than half of these fifty years; therefore, they share at least fity percent of the blame for everything you are criticizing.

[jacee]

Its pretty much impossible to disagree that the Democratic Party never wins another election without a huge percentage of the black vote. So let's be honest. The party with the most interest in racial divide is the Democrats.

Since black people are only 13% of the US population, they don't swing the vote much.

I think you're exaggerating a non issue to vent your racist views.

I do wish mapleleafweb would do something to rid itself of the white supremacists who dominate this board with their trashy race talk and tacky thread titles.

It's not a mainstream Canadian view and it lowers mapleleafweb to sewer status.

Anybody know of a Canadian discussion board for broad range discussion without the trash?

[kimmy]

If Republicans don't think race should be an issue, then what's up with the voter suppression antics being employed by Republican governors in Wisconsin and the Deep South?

Seinfeld voice: "What's up with voter list purges?!"

Jobs are created by businesses. Businesses invest under low regulation and low tax environments.

I picture this bit of Republican propaganda being dispensed by a cartoon eagle. It's a claim that gets repeated over and over again and people seem to accept at face value without any analysis.

I keep inviting you guys to make a case as to why tax cuts for rich-guys and corporations are going to create jobs for Americans, and I have yet to hear a credible response.

As for deregulation... the Republicans want you to think they're talking about repealing rules preventing you from drilling for oil on land where somebody said they saw a spotted owl.

What they're actually talking about is repealing the rules that were put in place to prevent banks from screwing up the entire economy all over again.

If African Americans begin to see themselves not as a block of dependent voters but as individuals with personal goals and a desire for freedom, then they, by definition, become republicans.

I think the Libertarians are the party of freedom. The Republicans are the party of cranky old prudes who went apoplectic over Janet Jackson's nipple and think that anti-sodomy laws ought to be reinstated.

-k

[Michael Hardner]

As welfare continues to get rolled back, and the government gets out of the business of helping people - shouldn't we be seeing African Americans flocking to the Republicans with their newfound prosperity ?

Shouldn't the cities be regenerating themselves ?

It's not working - that's why.

[Argus]

First, the republican party was founded on the basis of abolishing slavery, and thousands of republicans fought and died on that principle. It was the Democrats who founded the KKK and fought to keep slavery alive and well.

History. This is not your father's Republican Party. As Jeb Bush has said, neither his father nor Ronald Reagan would have been acceptable to the rabid Tea Party people.

Second, I reject your theory that dependency created by the Dems has worked out well for blacks. Just as with the first nations people in Canada, giving people handouts hasn't resulted in a "hand up" at all. To the contrary, it has created a culture of dependency within the group.

I don't entirely disagree with you, however, you fail to take into consideration that while slavery (offically) might be in the distant past, actual slavery continued up to 1942 in many southern states. Afterwards, virulent racism made it virtually impossible for most Blacks to get anywhere in life, for they were denied jobs, decent education, and any real help by government. That went on to the mid nineteen sixties. There are still many Blacks alive who remember not being able to go through the same doors as White people, you know. The efforts to economically emancipate Blacks really only began in earnest in the late sixties and seventies, and you're correct in that it has been far from a total success. But governments have been making things up as they went along, with little to guide them but recent performances. They have succeeded in creating opportunities, and a real Black middle class. But the challenges of the inner cities and the lack of opportunities and education there continue.

What poor people need most is jobs. Jobs are created by businesses. Businesses invest under low regulation and low tax environments. The Democratic party has increased all of the above.

Creating jobs is all well and good -- though I've seen no evidence the Republicans have any real plans on how to do that -- but lowering taxes is just not in the cards given the enormous debt level the US government is under, not without massive cuts to government spending. And that's the gist of the problem here. The Republicans are proposing big tax cuts combined with huge military spending increases. Assuming they aren't lying, the only ways to do that are to either run the debt up even higher - much higher -- or massively cut all the kind of aid to the poor which can help them get economically involved in a real way. The situation in the inner cities is such that many young people never finish high school. How are they going to get these jobs anyway, with no education, and no job skills?

The Republican plans would inevitably result in huge cuts to education, to job training programs, to welfare, health care, pensions, food aid, including food stamps and school lunch programs. How is any of that going to get people off dependency? Do you think most of them are living on welfare for life in inner cities because it's fun? I'm sure there are some slackers, but the inner city culture is one where a job advertisement is almost beyond understanding. They don't read the papers there, and they're not perusing job ads on the internet (most of them). There is a real lack of understanding about how to even search for a job to apply for. Remember, in this world, most jobs are word of mouth. Most of us get jobs through contacts. When you live in the kind of environment they do neither of those exists. So how are Republicans going to help get them off welfare and onto the work rolls, other than cutting welfare to "inspire" them?

By the way, would you care to explain the success of business in many other countries which have far higher tax environments?

Hence, it is the Democrats who are anti poor, because all they have to offer the poor is more dependency. The single worst thing you can do to a person is rob them of their independence.

Funny. I would think robbing them of food and medical care would be worse.

[Argus]

Since black people are only 13% of the US population, they don't swing the vote much.

I think you're exaggerating a non issue to vent your racist views.

I do wish mapleleafweb would do something to rid itself of the white supremacists who dominate this board with their trashy race talk and tacky thread titles.

It's not a mainstream Canadian view and it lowers mapleleafweb to sewer status.

Anybody know of a Canadian discussion board for broad range discussion without the trash?

Not sure I know one with standards and quality low enough for you. May I suggest the comment pages on the Globe and Mail?

[Bonam]

Not sure I know one with standards and quality low enough for you. May I suggest the comment pages on the Globe and Mail?

Comment sections on youtube videos may also be suitable.

[Shady]

Its pretty much impossible to disagree that the Democratic Party never wins another election without a huge percentage of the black vote.

Yep. They wrote off the white vote, and the male vote, decades ago. They almost don't even try anymore.

[ironstone]

The Mormon Church believed that blacks were an inferior species and has never made apologies for it. Romney belonged to the Church then. And now he's using a slogan from the KKK.

Gee... I dunno. Why's race an issue?

So do you think Romney will actually say to American blacks "I'm gonna put y'all back in chains"?

It is the Dems,by and large that want to make race an issue in this election.

I'm guessing that there are more blacks on entitlement programs now then there were before 2008.How is this progressive in any way?

[waldo]

Yep. They wrote off the white vote, and the male vote, decades ago. They almost don't even try anymore.

the 'white vote', Shady? Here I thought Obama was leading Romney in the white female demo by over 50%!

the 'male vote', Shady? Really? What about the non-white male vote, hey Shady?

since you're once again in your free-wheeling unsubstantiated Shady opinion only mode, why not step up and lay down the full demographic breakdown for gender, race, age. This time extend yourself... offer up independent/cited substantiation... rather than unsubstantiated Shady opinion.

[cybercoma]

So do you think Romney will actually say to American blacks "I'm gonna put y'all back in chains"?

It is the Dems,by and large that want to make race an issue in this election.

I'm guessing that there are more blacks on entitlement programs now then there were before 2008.How is this progressive in any way?

I bet there's more whites and latinos on "entitlement" programs too. Gee. I wonder why that is. Must be all the Democrats fault. That's the only thing I can think of happening in 2008: Obama was elected.

[bleeding heart]

What poor people need most is jobs. Jobs are created by businesses. Businesses invest under low regulation and low tax environments. The Democratic party has increased all of the above. Hence, it is the Democrats who are anti poor, because all they have to offer the poor is more dependency. The single worst thing you can do to a person is rob them of their independence. Unfortunatey, the entire Democrat platform is based upon dependence.

How does your theory account for the Democrats getting the Jewish vote--every election, without exception?

[punked]

How does your theory account for the Democrats getting the Jewish vote--every election, without exception?

I can tell you. Outside of the Cuban American community (much which is made up of those who left Cuba when Castro came to power and who were able to fly out as fast as they could with much of the Cuban treasury on the plane) minorities lean democrat because the Republicans southern strategy is tell white people you make them the priority no matter what. You will suppress the minority vote, it really is the others fault they aren't like you they aren't "real Americans". It is scary because out of the depression (outside of America) those types of policies really took hold and lead a different type of recovery.

Inside America during the 30-40s they choose to stand together to invest in roads, bridges, dams, the power grid. They dug their way together, however that is not what happened in the rest of the world. In the rest of the world they chose to blame the "other" and get their way out by taking from the "other" or enslaving the "other". It scares me that type of politics is stronger now in America then when it swept the rest of the world.