punked Posted April 28, 2012 Report Share Posted April 28, 2012 (edited) I'm perfectly "claim"... The fact is that Woodsworth had a mountian of evidence about Fascist agression in Europe long before the Invasion of Poland... I doubt anything would have changed his mind...He was a devout Pacifist... It doesn't matter,however,because even his own CCF caucus threw him under the bus... So did the US why don't you ever talk about them not getting involved sooner? Hind sight is 20/20 but you weren't there so take a breath. Edited April 28, 2012 by punked Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Weber Posted April 28, 2012 Report Share Posted April 28, 2012 So did the US why don't you ever talk about them not getting involved sooner? Hind sight is 20/20 but you weren't there so take a breath. The US wasn't part of the British Empire and wasn't attacked by The Axis until Pearl Harbour... There are always cowards who won't fight in the face of evil...Woodsworth was one of them and even his CCF caucus wouldn't vote with him... Now you take a breath...And read a history book... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted April 28, 2012 Report Share Posted April 28, 2012 Oh well.... His rightminded CCF caucus had a spine and didn't chicken out like he did in '39... Yes. I'm sure if he had a crystal ball, he would have found out what everyone else did after his death in 1942. You're taking modern knowledge of WWII and applying facts that came to light later to decisions that were made prior. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punked Posted April 28, 2012 Report Share Posted April 28, 2012 (edited) The US wasn't part of the British Empire and wasn't attacked by The Axis until Pearl Harbour... There are always cowards who won't fight in the face of evil...Woodsworth was one of them and even his CCF caucus wouldn't vote with him... Now you take a breath...And read a history book... Yah I get it knowing everything we know now war was a great choice. However they didn't know what we know now. War is a big sacrifice for a country to make not only do you send your sons and Husbands off to die it take much sacrifice for the people who stay at home and have to give up many comforts. It isn't something to be taken lightly which is why probably why the US waited to get involved. As for the British Empire thing why should Canada care about the British empire? I don't remember us getting involved in the Falkland Islands that is poor reasoning. Again books are great, and hindsight is 20/20 but he was there at the time and you weren't. The rest of the CCF were for war but Woodsworth stood on the other side of the argument and if you actually looked at what we knew at the time he had a point. Edited April 28, 2012 by punked Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punked Posted April 28, 2012 Report Share Posted April 28, 2012 Yes. I'm sure if he had a crystal ball, he would have found out what everyone else did after his death in 1942. You're taking modern knowledge of WWII and applying facts that came to light later to decisions that were made prior. He had a stroke in 40 and was done from that point onward anyhow so even before the US went to war with knowledge of how aggressive Germany was he could not have changed his opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted April 28, 2012 Report Share Posted April 28, 2012 It isn't something to be taken lightly which is why probably why the US waited to get involved. Maybe....the US learned its lesson during WWI and your empire's asinine imperialist wars. The US didn't start WWII, but it sure as hell finished it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punked Posted April 28, 2012 Report Share Posted April 28, 2012 Maybe....the US learned its lesson during WWI and your empire's asinine imperialist wars. The US didn't start WWII, but it sure as hell finished it. I'll give you that and to be fair the US needed the years from 39-41 to ramp up military spending train and so on. They were a great asset but the fact is in 39 the US would not have gone to war either. Yet Jack isn't take the piss out of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted April 28, 2012 Report Share Posted April 28, 2012 I'll give you that and to be fair the US needed the years from 39-41 to ramp up military spending train and so on. They were a great asset but the fact is in 39 the US would not have gone to war either. Yet Jack isn't take the piss out of them. The US doesn't go to war just because your reigning monarch makes a speech. If you recall, the United States exists because of violent opposition to the very idea of such a thing. In fact, Canada waited at least a week to join the Commonwealth in war to demonstrate an independent decision and declaration. Technically, Canadians were still British subjects. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punked Posted April 28, 2012 Report Share Posted April 28, 2012 (edited) The US doesn't go to war just because your reigning monarch makes a speech. If you recall, the United States exists because of violent opposition to the very idea of such a thing. In fact, Canada waited at least a week to join the Commonwealth in war to demonstrate an independent decision and declaration. Technically, Canadians were still British subjects. I know which is what an independent country should do. Good for you guys for making decisions based on facts, planning, and the will of your people. Edited April 28, 2012 by punked Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWTT Posted April 28, 2012 Report Share Posted April 28, 2012 Looks like Harper really screwed up good this time! I guess every enemy of Canada (or the US,but when the conservatives or liberals are in power any enemy of the US is now an enemy of Canada) will now be just as guilty as Hitler.Will have committed the same crimes as Hitler etc,etc,etc.Regardless of the era,the national background,etc,etc. But is Afganistan an enemy of Canada?Or I guess its just the Taliban.But how is this like Hitler and Germany of the 1930's?? Better question would be is Harper stupid/ignorant or does he think everyone else is stupid/ignorant or neither? Do all conservatives have to jump through freekin hoops twisting and bending facts to justify the words used by Harper? WWWTT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWTT Posted April 28, 2012 Report Share Posted April 28, 2012 Yah I get it knowing everything we know now war was a great choice. However they didn't know what we know now. War is a big sacrifice for a country to make not only do you send your sons and Husbands off to die it take much sacrifice for the people who stay at home and have to give up many comforts. It isn't something to be taken lightly which is why probably why the US waited to get involved. I agree with the second part about the sacrifice and gravity of going to war. But Japan was clearly an aggressive country well before the 1940's!And in the 30's Germany was acting very aggressive! The very same can be said about Britain,France,USA,Spain,Portugal,Netherlands,Belgium,Russia/USSR,Italy,etc,etc(and not just white western countries too) at some point in history.Maybe not necessarily the 1930's but you get where I'm going with this. My point is that the people in Canada have the right to stand up and say that we do not want to be part of this international tangled web of conflict. And there needs to be more people to stand up! WWWTT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmax Posted April 28, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 28, 2012 LOL What harper said must have really stung the left, as they say the truth hurts and it was the truth. Who cares what the left calls themselve ,they still are the left. And if the left had thier way , none of us would be speaking english or french. I don't know who it stung.. While I don't like the Prime Minister to be laughed at, I gotta say, it is funny.As for your spin on history... it was those Commie Russians who captured Berlin... and operated on 80% of the Front.... And lets not forget harper has been called a nazi by the left ever since he came along, so he throws one back at you and listen to the crying. If the Prime Minister Of Canada is of another party and ever calls the Opposition Leader Hitler, I would expect him to Apologise if not outright resign. There are alot of yahoos on forums on the political spectrum who say crazy things. That is not the role of the Prime Minister of Canada. And now the left is crying because harper had a closed door meeting with the dali lama, saying he is sucking up to the chimese by doing it. Yet chretien pretty well lived in china when he was PM and nobody could suck up to the chinese like chretien. lets all praise the Oil going to China and their Labour coming here... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BubberMiley Posted April 28, 2012 Report Share Posted April 28, 2012 LOL What harper said must have really stung the left, as they say the truth hurts and it was the truth. Who cares what the left calls themselve ,they still are the left. And if the left had thier way , none of us would be speaking english or french. And why would that be? Because "the left" didn't want to fight "the right?" So who cares what the right calls themselve ,they are still the right. And if the right had thier way , all of us would be speaking german (and spelling sentences poorly in English). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted April 29, 2012 Report Share Posted April 29, 2012 And now the left is crying because harper had a closed door meeting with the dali lama, saying he is sucking up to the chimese by doing it. sucking up to the Chinese??? Apparently, you haven't a clue about the relationship between China and Tibet/Dali Lama.. Yet chretien pretty well lived in china when he was PM and nobody could suck up to the chinese like chretien. do you think no one will actually call you on your continued BS? Over a decade as Prime Minister, Chretien led 4 trade missions to China: - 1994: Prime Minister Jean Chrétien visited Beijing and Shanghai with Team Canada: two ministers, nine provincial premiers, the territorial leaders and the head of the Federation of Canadian Municipalities - 1996:Prime Minister Jean Chrétien, Minister of International Trade Art Eggleton and Secretary of State (Asia Pacific) Raymond Chan visited Shanghai to attend the annual general meeting of the Canada-China Business Council, and Chrétien, Minister of International Trade Sergio Marchi, and Secretary of State (Asia Pacific) Raymond Chan visited Beijing - 1998: Prime Minister Jean Chrétien, Minister of International Trade Sergio Marchi and Secretary of State (Asia Pacific) Raymond Chan visit Beijing (attending the Canada-China Business Council annual general meeting) and Lanzhou (visiting Canadian-funded development projects) - 2001 Prime Minister Jean Chrétien visited Beijing, Shanghai and Hong Kong with Team Canada. It was the largest trade mission in Canadian history to that point. Chrétien was accompanied by close to 600 business participants, eight provincial premiers, three territorial leaders, Minister for International Trade Pierre Pettigrew and Secretary of State (Asia-Pacific) Rey Pagtakhan. in a 6 year period, your boy Harper has been to China twice. By your "standards", Harper is living in China! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evening Star Posted April 29, 2012 Report Share Posted April 29, 2012 Even if you accept the ludicrous premise that the NDP and CCF are the same thing because "the left is the left", CCF ("the left") policy in 1939 was in favour of the war. Only Woodsworth voted against it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vendetta Posted April 30, 2012 Report Share Posted April 30, 2012 What an idiot, the party and grime minister, desperation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bleeding heart Posted May 2, 2012 Report Share Posted May 2, 2012 LOL What harper said must have really stung the left, as they say the truth hurts and it was the truth. No. It was the opposite of the truth, as has already been firmly demonstrated in this very thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted May 2, 2012 Report Share Posted May 2, 2012 Agreed. Invoking Hitler to insult the ndp is hilarious. Shows Harper's lack of class and sense. Well, I would have thought this lack of class and sense was restricted to the nether regions of his base of support. Who's taking their cue from who in Parliament and the electorate these days, supporters or leaders? I wonder how long it'll be until everyone's fighting in the streets blaming each other for the state of the world? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mentalfloss Posted May 2, 2012 Report Share Posted May 2, 2012 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fletch 27 Posted May 2, 2012 Report Share Posted May 2, 2012 I SO do not agree with Steve Harper on this one.... Mulcair is much more of a Joseph Stalin type.. Except where Joseph Stalin pushed the line on communism with no regard for his own people, Mulcair JUMPS over that line and takes the batton to the next level! Not even Jack Layton managed to push the lines of communism to this level, And in such a short period of time! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter F Posted May 2, 2012 Report Share Posted May 2, 2012 I SO do not agree with Steve Harper on this one.... Mulcair is much more of a Joseph Stalin type.. Except where Joseph Stalin pushed the line on communism with no regard for his own people, Mulcair JUMPS over that line and takes the batton to the next level! Not even Jack Layton managed to push the lines of communism to this level, And in such a short period of time! To the Gulag with you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bleeding heart Posted May 2, 2012 Report Share Posted May 2, 2012 I SO do not agree with Steve Harper on this one.... Mulcair is much more of a Joseph Stalin type.. Except where Joseph Stalin pushed the line on communism with no regard for his own people, Mulcair JUMPS over that line and takes the batton to the next level! Not even Jack Layton managed to push the lines of communism to this level, And in such a short period of time! So....Mulcair is more Stalinist than....Stalin! No one could possibly think so, while remaining serious. That's how we know you're joking! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Weber Posted May 2, 2012 Report Share Posted May 2, 2012 (edited) I SO do not agree with Steve Harper on this one.... Mulcair is much more of a Joseph Stalin type.. Except where Joseph Stalin pushed the line on communism with no regard for his own people, Mulcair JUMPS over that line and takes the batton to the next level! Not even Jack Layton managed to push the lines of communism to this level, And in such a short period of time! Erm...yeah... I this you Glenn Beck impression??? I suppose,using that sophomoric level of logic,Stephen Harper MUST be setting up concentration camps to intern those that aren't true believers in Conservative Party "right-minded" thinking... Oh look!!!I see brigades of the Harper Youth goosestepping down the street!!! Edited May 2, 2012 by Jack Weber Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fellowtraveller Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Erm...yeah... I this you Glenn Beck impression??? I suppose,using that sophomoric level of logic,Stephen Harper MUST be setting up concentration camps to intern those that aren't true believers in Conservative Party "right-minded" thinking... Oh look!!!I see brigades of the Harper Youth goosestepping down the street!!! That is correct, those camps will soon surface under the name Son of Katimivik. Can we just all agree that Harper is worse than Hitler? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Squid Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Can we just all agree that Harper is worse than Hitler? Ah yes.... turn it around to try and make it seem that your fearless leader is so hard done by. Did you conveniently forget already that it was Harper with the Hitler reference? Nice try though.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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