Transgender Discrimination in Canada

[stopstaaron]

So? How many BBWs or women over 40 will be on stage? It's not like you're going to be personally affected by this. In this day and age, so-called beauty contests have to get with the times. Otherwise, they'll be even more lame than usual.

They were already lame. I don't watch them..ever. Couldn't careless. But this is a hot topic. She might have had a case had she not LIED on her application form about her real gender. 1. Miss Universes do not lie. 2. Lying on any application form is usually an immediate dismissal

[DogOnPorch]

They were already lame. I don't watch them..ever. Couldn't careless. But this is a hot topic. She might have had a case had she not LIED on her application form about her real gender. 1. Miss Universes do not lie. 2. Lying on any application form is usually an immediate dismissal

She 'lied' the same way Ayaan Hirsi Ali 'lied'.

She's not a refugee. She lived in Kenya for a few years after escaping the horrors of Somalia.

[Black Dog]

She might have had a case had she not LIED on her application form about her real gender. 1. Miss Universes do not lie. 2. Lying on any application form is usually an immediate dismissal

If she had been up front about her (irrelevant) status as a trans person, would you support her in her desire to compete?

Clearly not, so the procedural argument here is pretty chickenshit.

[stopstaaron]

If she had been up front about her (irrelevant) status as a trans person, would you support her in her desire to compete?

Clearly not, so the procedural argument here is pretty chickenshit.

No, but she might have had a legitimate court case.

[stopstaaron]

She 'lied' the same way Ayaan Hirsi Ali 'lied'.

one fled from a war torn country where her life was in danger

totally not the same as lying to get into a beauty pageant

[dre]

I think we oughta just avoid this entire debate, and go with the legal definition.

If theres an F on their drivers license next to "Gender", that is a legal designation and it should be ILLEGAL to bar those people from services or access specific to that gender, regardless of whether we are talking about using the girls washroom, or joining a private club.

[bush_cheney2004]

What's a new part or two, eh?

Yeah...parts are just parts. I had a transgender boss and everything was just bolted on parts. She was about 6' 8" and weighed 300 lbs., so she could easily take care of herself. The only problem was other women in the ladies room freaking out whenever she entered.

This thread has exceeded even my wildest troll dreams !

[stopstaaron]

Yeah...parts She was about 6' 8" and weighed 300 lbs., so she could easily take care of herself. The only problem was other women in the ladies room freaking out whenever she entered.

Can you blame them?!

[bush_cheney2004]

Can you blame them?!

Hey...they all got the memo and the company didn't want to face lawsuits either way. Human Rights wonks would be all over that. GLBTs ain't new to me.

[stopstaaron]

Hey...they all got the memo and the company didn't want to face lawsuits either way. Human Rights wonks would be all over that. GLBTs ain't new to me.

LGBTs sounds better than GLBTs

women go first

Edited March 27, 2012 by stopstaaron

[Bonam]

Sex is biology, gender is society.

And?

[Guest American Woman]

And?

I'm not sure what he's getting at either, as research suggests that transgender behavior has a biological basis; and just as there is no 'cure' or 'treatment' for homosexuality, there is no known cure or treatment for transgendered behavior.

[bush_cheney2004]

I'm not sure what he's getting at either, as research suggests that transgender behavior has a biological basis; and just as there is no 'cure' or 'treatment' for homosexuality, there is no known cure or treatment for transgendered behavior.

Sex and gender are not binary....that's why some people get so hung up on this. Hence, no 'cure' is available or required.

[Michael Hardner]

LGBTs sounds better than GLBTs

women go first

BLTG sounds the best though, as it sounds like Bacon Lettuce and Tomato with Guacamole...

[DogOnPorch]

one fled from a war torn country where her life was in danger

totally not the same as lying to get into a beauty pageant

The same sort of BS was going around with Ms Hirsi Ali's Dutch citizenship. This after becoming a Dutch politician of some effect.

As Little Miss Springfield, Lisa unwillingly becomes a symbol for Laramie Cigarettes. She begins to fight back by protesting against the dangers of cigarettes at her appearances, and also vows to target the corruption of Mayor Quimby. Quimby and the Laramie officials meet to look for a way to dethrone Lisa as Little Miss Springfield. They find it through a technicality on her entry form; when Homer saw an area marked "Do not write in this space" on the paper, he wrote under it: "Okay". Amber is restored to her place as Little Miss Springfield. At home, Homer and Lisa discuss what they have learned, and Lisa thanks him for caring about her self-esteem. Homer requests that she remember it "the next time I wreck your life", to which Lisa gladly agrees.

As for the contestant: if the contest organizers wish to act like a pack of Dark Age desert cave dwellers, I suppose it is THEIR silly contest.

[DogOnPorch]

Yeah...parts are just parts. I had a transgender boss and everything was just bolted on parts. She was about 6' 8" and weighed 300 lbs., so she could easily take care of herself. The only problem was other women in the ladies room freaking out whenever she entered.

This thread has exceeded even my wildest troll dreams !

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=feE1G2sJty0

[WWWTT]

This is a very interesting case!

First off because many womans groups have claimed(and rightfully so) that beauty pageants are sexist!Enforcing stereo types and belittleing the importance of the female role in society!

However bearing/raising children is a crutial role for ensuring our existance so we still can not dismiss its importance.Obviously women have the choice.

It would be very interesting if the transgender individual whom was disqualified filed a lawsuite.

Would the pageant claim that this individual is incapable of bearing children?Or that she just simply lied on her application?

This can go different ways and would be a good test of constitutional rights in Canada!

WWWTT

[cybercoma]

CTV reports that a Miss Universe Canada finalist has been disqualified because of sexual reassignment surgery:

She may look every bit the part of a beauty queen, but Jenna Talackova has lost her chance for the crown because she was born a biological male.

The 23-year-old Miss Universe Canada finalist was disqualified from the competition after it was discovered she had undergone sexual reassignment surgery,

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2012/03/24/transgender-miss-universe_n_1377147.html

Where are "Charter Rights" when a girl needs them? Time to lawyer up for a big payday!

It could be worse. She could live in the Land of the "Free".

[cybercoma]

You don't have to be a "bigot" to know it has no fallopian tube, ovaries, periods

how can this person take part in a pageant for females while missing the key components of a female?

If this happened in the US youd agree with their decision too

Because pageants are about the presentation of gender, not the biological sex of the participants.

[cybercoma]

stopstaaron,

When I first read through your posts on this thread, I'll admit that I was a bit angry at your ignorance. After some reflection, I realize that it's not fair to expect that you would understand the differences between some things. People commonly confuse these things and are socialized to believe that they are binary oppositions. Instead of getting mad at you and putting you down, I'm simply going to post an infographic and hope that it may help you understand some fundamental concepts that are foreign to many people.

The Genderbread Person

[stopstaaron]

stopstaaron,

When I first read through your posts on this thread, I'll admit that I was a bit angry at your ignorance. After some reflection, I realize that it's not fair to expect that you would understand the differences between some things. People commonly confuse these things and are socialized to believe that they are binary oppositions. Instead of getting mad at you and putting you down, I'm simply going to post an infographic and hope that it may help you understand some fundamental concepts that are foreign to many people.

ok

Edited March 28, 2012 by stopstaaron

[bush_cheney2004]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LnUMjMux2vU&feature=related

[Michael Hardner]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LnUMjMux2vU&feature=related

Note to self: If I don't have a cohesive argument, put up a video of a pouty 6 year old babbling along...

[bush_cheney2004]

Note to self: If I don't have a cohesive argument, put up a video of a pouty 6 year old babbling along...

Note to self: Some dolts can't recognize organized discrimination against transexuals, but it's always a good opportunity to link to my vapid blog.

[cybercoma]

ok

So, these pageants are about gender expression and gender identity. It's about the portrayal of feminine "beauty." Thus, the biological sex of the participants is completely irrelevant.

The only people that react angrily to this are those that feel homosexuality is a problem. They fear being attracted to her because she was born a man, although for all intents and purposes she exhibits the feminine beauty of a woman and has the gender identity of a woman. So truly you're being attracted to female qualities, not male qualities. In that way, it wouldn't be homosexual to be attracted to her because you're not a man being attracted to masculine gender expression and a person with a male gender identity. Regardless, you're not having sex with her, so her biological sex is immaterial and all of the aforementioned is predicated on the assumption that there is something wrong, abnormal, or detestable with homosexuality.

Since pageants are nothing more than the presentation of gender and of these ridiculous constructed notions of what feminine beauty is, she ought to be allowed to compete. I hate pageants, as they serve no purpose other than to construct a beauty ideal. However, if she, being born a male, can exhibit that beauty ideal just as well, if not better than individuals that were born female, more power to her.