OCCUPY

[blueblood]

Ah yes, all profits are attributable to CEO's and CEO's are the only ones who can cost a company huge amounts of money if they screw up. What nonsense. 34 million is cheap? No doubt he would quit and go to work at Micky D's if it only paid a paltry 15 million.

Job security? Give me a break. Most smart CEO's make sure they have a parachute big enough to set up almost any of their employees for life, no matter how incompetent they turn out to be at actually running the company.

All systems get out of whack at times, no matter how good they are. This is one of those times. In nature, the result is usually a mass dieing until balance is restored. Sometimes it is the same in humanity. The challenge is to recognize there is a need to restore some kind of balance before it reaches a point things like the guillotine get hauled out.

We are a long way from that point but the signs are there. Time to start paying attention.

If you had 34 million to spend on a CEO who would get you 4 billion in cash you wouldn't spend it. I'd make that deal any day of the week.

The CEOs negotiated with the board of directors for that parachute. If there's a problem take it up with the board that granted it in the first place,

they could tell the CEO to pound sand for asking for a contract like that, but they don't. Why is that?

There is balance, we just have a bunch of whiners at OWS who don't know how an economy works.

[WWWTT]

I'm all for protest, when it enhances or initiates dialogue. The problem I have with OCCUPY is that there doesn't seem to be a realistic goal, and therefore no end date for it.

As such, the idea seems to be that a permanent protest of some kind is to replace actual dialogue between stakeholders in our society. This is a change from what the protests of the 1960s were meant to achieve. Those protests used mass movements to communicate through mass media, in such a way to make people aware that there were those who were generally not happy with the state of affairs.

Protesting, as a tool, was a big hammer to be used on a big nail: civil rights action, withdrawal from Viet Nam. These were big issues and the protesters had clear, and not unpopular demands: equal rights for all... end the war, etc.

I'm sensing tepid support for the movement itself from leftists on the board, even if you do agree with the general message.

Regardless of our ability/inability to understand OCCUPY or share their sence of achievable goals through protest does not mean that the participants of OCCUPY forfeit their right to participate in peacefull protest!

Hey at first I did not understand Mandarin dialect chinese,but after lots of educating I am starting to understand a little.

I believe the same would apply to OCCUPY.

This protest is against the 1%,not the 99%.And if you do not understand this protest it would be safe to assume you are not part of the 1%.

As far as much/some of the left not understanding OCCUPY I have to agree with you(the left on this thread anyways).

I would suggest that OCCUPY is a further left than the average lefty on mapleleafweb.

WWWTT

[Vancouverite]

A death has occurred at Occupy Vancouver. This phenomenon isn't going to last long.

[Guest Manny]

A death has occurred at Occupy Vancouver. This phenomenon isn't going to last long.

Reports show that woman dies of a drug overdose, and people die from drug overdose in the streets of Vancouver all the time. But now the mayor is trying to use this to justify shutting the protest down, for their own safety. I doubt he will succeed... unless they bring in riot police and beat them over their heads with batons. That will certainly make them safe

[WWWTT]

As such, the idea seems to be that a permanent protest of some kind is to replace actual dialogue between stakeholders in our society. This is a change from what the protests of the 1960s were meant to achieve. Those protests used mass movements to communicate through mass media, in such a way to make people aware that there were those who were generally not happy with the state of affairs.

Protesting, as a tool, was a big hammer to be used on a big nail: civil rights action, withdrawal from Viet Nam. These were big issues and the protesters had clear, and not unpopular demands: equal rights for all... end the war, etc.

This is an incorrect summarization!Or a partial mis diagnoses.

Durring the 50's,60's and 70's the media was widely broadcasting the injustices of the day.Example would be "the shot that was heard around the world"(American soldier judge/jury/executioner in Vietnam)

However today western governments are very quick to stamp out any unsencored media(wikileaks).

If the media does not show you the injustices will you recognize them?And if the media does not report an injustice then is it?

OCCUPY has a freekin mountain to climb,because people are brainwashed by the media!

WWWTT

[Rick]

And after PET enacted the War Measures Act, how successful were the FLQ radicals (like yourself?) at achieving their goals?

Wait, are you saying you support PET...

You say radicals.. I say... Reformers

[Rick]

This is an incorrect summarization!Or a partial mis diagnoses.

Durring the 50's,60's and 70's the media was widely broadcasting the injustices of the day.Example would be "the shot that was heard around the world"(American soldier judge/jury/executioner in Vietnam)

However today western governments are very quick to stamp out any unsencored media(wikileaks).

If the media does not show you the injustices will you recognize them?And if the media does not report an injustice then is it?

OCCUPY has a freekin mountain to climb,because people are brainwashed by the media!

WWWTT

Well said comrade!

[WWWTT]

A death has occurred at Occupy Vancouver. This phenomenon isn't going to last long.

If you are a drug addict does that mean you do not have the right to peaceful protest?

Was this woman somehow causing any violence towards others?

This incedent only has negative impact with those who have little concept/understanding of constitutional rights!

WWWTT

[Boges]

From what I hear from people that support the "Occupy Movement" the goal is to make governments react to them.

They want to be forcibly removed because they think it will allow them to cry foul.

They can't realistically think camping out in parks are going to make "fat cats" give a shit. The one percent are laughing at them, while they're counting their money.

[Rick]

Politicians and right leaning lemmings want nothing to do with Occupy and will turn a tragic loss into an oppurtunity to spin the message.

[Guest Derek L]

Wait, are you saying you support PET...

You say radicals.. I say... Reformers

Sure, I “supported” him on some of his policies, namely social/domestic issues.

I’ll ask the question again though, did the FLQ “reformers” achieve their goals?

[jacee]

Another heroin overdose on the streets of Vancouver doesn't even make the news. It's a big deal only because it's used as an excuse to criticize the protest.

It's tragic, as the lives of homeless people are, but she had caring people around her at least.

This should be shining a light on the plight of homeless people and drug addiction, whose lives are so bleak that living in a tent is better.

Unfortunately, politicians and merchants are using it only for personal gain, to villify the protest.

[Guest Derek L]

If you are a drug addict does that mean you do not have the right to peaceful protest?

Was this woman somehow causing any violence towards others?

This incedent only has negative impact with those who have little concept/understanding of constitutional rights!

WWWTT

Didn’t the General Assembly announce that they don’t recognise the authority of emergency services, the day prior to the death? What protestor(s) called 911 when they found the young lady? Isn’t that calling into question their past statements? Do they or don’t they recognise “the Man”?

As I said a few days ago, if the occupy movement wants to gain any form of traction amongst the actual 99%, they’d best learn to “shape” their message……..One of Canada’s largest public relations & marketing firms are in a tower just a few blocks away from the campground….

[Rick]

Sure, I “supported” him on some of his policies, namely social/domestic issues.

I’ll ask the question again though, did the FLQ “reformers” achieve their goals?

In some ways yes. But they gave up too easily.

The successful Arab Spring is a much more accurate reflection of the times.

[Guest Derek L]

Another heroin overdose on the streets of Vancouver doesn't even make the news. It's a big deal only because it's used as an excuse to criticize the protest.

It's tragic, as the lives of homeless people are, but she had caring people around her at least.

This should be shining a light on the plight of homeless people and drug addiction, whose lives are so bleak that living in a tent is better.

Unfortunately, politicians and merchants are using it only for personal gain, to villify the protest.

Politicians & Merchants are in the business of “selling” and “delivering” the demands of the actual 99%…..If the majority of society didn’t agree with “them”, the results of the last election would have been different…..

[Guest Manny]

They can't realistically think camping out in parks are going to make "fat cats" give a shit. The one percent are laughing at them, while they're counting their money.

Clearly, you don't get it.

[Guest Manny]

As I said a few days ago, if the occupy movement wants to gain any form of traction amongst the actual 99%, they’d best learn to “shape” their message……..One of Canada’s largest public relations & marketing firms are in a tower just a few blocks away from the campground….

The revolution... REFUSES to be televised.

[Guest Derek L]

In some ways yes. But they gave up too easily.

The successful Arab Spring is a much more accurate reflection of the times.

In what ways yes?

The Arab Spring and the occupiers here are apples and oranges…….Democratic representation was a desire in the Middle East……The majority of society here already feel fulfilled to a varying degree……..This is made evident by the fact that only ~0.0001% of the population are sleeping in parks…….

[Guest Derek L]

The revolution... REFUSES to be televised.

And that is one of the main reasons why they will never gain traction with the majority of the public……Their views, as made evident by recent polling, are no longer creating a general indifference by the actual 99%, but turning the 99% (well ~75%) into holding an opposing view towards them.

Perhaps they should occupy Insite and leave the art gallery…..

[Tilter]

If the "occupiers" were truthful about what they are protesting they would admit that the protest is based upon the amount of "allowance" their Exec Fathers and Mothers give these shitdisturbers to stay away from home.

[Guest Manny]

And that is one of the main reasons why they will never gain traction with the majority of the public……Their views, as made evident by recent polling, are no longer creating a general indifference by the actual 99%, but turning the 99% (well ~75%) into holding an opposing view towards them.

Your claims are refuted by the fact that it has continued to grow and spread to cities worldwide. I think that is their real, main objective. And not through mainstream media. These idealists believe that once they incorporate, it's over.

[Guest Derek L]

Your claims are refuted by the fact that it has continued to grow and spread to cities worldwide. I think that is their real, main objective. And not through mainstream media. These idealists believe that once they incorporate, it's over.

Day one of occupy Vancouver saw anywhere from 4-5 thousand people….today, there’s under 100 campers….you call that growth?

These “idealists”, with that views that you purport, will never be anything other than the fringe…….You want the 99%, you embrace the mainstream media…..You want the 99% to hear your message, a 30 second commercial spot during hockey or American Idol will be more effective than sandwich boards, blogging and sleeping in a park.

[bush_cheney2004]

...As far as the impact of the demonstrations, both then and now, they do unnerve voters, and steer them to a "law and order" candidate". Thus I agree they are a problem for Obama.

Agreed, but they are a problem for Obama for other reasons as well, as his base thinks he is the "sell out" that the Occupy Movement is against to begin with. As for the organic protest model in Canada, I'm not convinced they have the tradition to mount anything on the scale we saw in the "states" for the 60's and 70's. Even here at MLW, the references are largely American. Ironically, Neil Young's California ranch and music royalties may put him in the 1%.

[eyeball]

Protesting, as a tool, was a big hammer to be used on a big nail: civil rights action, withdrawal from Viet Nam. These were big issues and the protesters had clear, and not unpopular demands: equal rights for all... end the war, etc.

I'm sensing tepid support for the movement itself from leftists on the board, even if you do agree with the general message.

Perhaps that hammer didn't hit the nails as hard as you think.

Speaking for myself I think the OWS movement is too late to do much about the state of affairs the world is in. Things are largely out of anyone's control now, inertia has taken over.

[bush_cheney2004]

....Example would be "the shot that was heard around the world"(American soldier judge/jury/executioner in Vietnam)

Get your facts straight when slamming Americans...this incident did not involve an American soldier...it was South Vietnam's national chief of police, and it was an American photographer who won a Pulitzer for the reporting. Does Canada "celebrate" photos of the Somalia Affair with equal significance?

Edited November 6, 2011 by bush_cheney2004