Layton Lionisation Excessive

[MiddleClassCentrist]

*suggestion that the U.S.A is not as good as Americans think*

*butt hurt Americans enter discussion, ignoring any data that goes against their belief of "AMERICAAAAA F*** YEAH!"*

*MCC grabs popcorn*

[Smallc]

Well, perhaps they are BOTH bad examples! Where does that leave us?

As far as individuals affording healthcare better than "government paid", there's also private insurance.

Ummm, who's going to pay for that? Healthcare costs are rising faster than pretty much anything else in every country.

[BubberMiley]

This post is not about health care. It's about a funeral circus. Oooops service.

It's frustrating when nobody else wants to make fun of the mourners with you, isn't it?

[Wild Bill]

Ummm, who's going to pay for that? Healthcare costs are rising faster than pretty much anything else in every country.

Seems to me that was my original point but I'm getting too tired of having to go back and research my posts.

[Michael Hardner]

Seems to me that was my original point but I'm getting too tired of having to go back and research my posts.

It's pretty simple. We want more for less.

I can see some private options helping with that. Facilities and resources, for example, may do with some better management. This is what private clinics are. Any changes, though, have to be integrated with a better plan for engaging with the public.

[PIK]

I would like to see hospitals for the elderly only.

[Smallc]

Seems to me that was my original point but I'm getting too tired of having to go back and research my posts.

Then you didn't really have a point in suggesting private insurance, did you?

[fellowtraveller]

Ummmmm. The U.S. isn't exactly lacking in businesses. But yeah. The horror!!

Laugh if you like, but the US health care system defintiely restricts workplace mobility and small business development. If you have dependents, or anybody with a preexisting condition, you are going to be very careful to keep what benefits you have at your current job rather than think of moving.

[bush_cheney2004]

Laugh if you like, but the US health care system defintiely restricts workplace mobility and small business development. If you have dependents, or anybody with a preexisting condition, you are going to be very careful to keep what benefits you have at your current job rather than think of moving.

Really? I didn't think about it for even a moment, because COBRA laws provide portability and continuous coverage if desired. People are mobile as ever as employees, often not of their own choosing anyway. That dog don't hunt....

[fellowtraveller]

Really? So if I am working for MegaCorp Inc in Detroit with full health care benefits, have kids with asthma and a wife with cancer, have a burning desire to start my one man lawn maintenance empire then MegaCorp is obliged to pay for health care indefintiely and after I leave their employ?

US employers are obliged to continue to pay health care benefits when their staff leave to work for a company that has no or lesser benefits?

[AngusThermopyle]

All persons in Canada are not covered by provincial health care. Choosing to "worry" about bankruptcy is your own concocted fear.

BC is correct when he states this. From a personal perspective I had my ID stolen, now I have no health care coverage, of course the answer is simple right? Just get new ID. Well that itself is not so simple. I've been trying for over a year and a half now. The system is set up in a sort of circular snake swallowing its tale kind of way. Its a sort of "to issue you this we need to see that" kind of thing. Having recieved citizenship when I was about seventeen I do not have any of the original paperwork, my mother had that, I have no idea what happened to it as she died of cancer last December. As so I have no coverage and the process of obtaining it appears to be stalled indefinately, they won't even accept my military service records as any kind of proof of identity. Ironically the only items they will accept are the two I don't have, a health card or citizenship card. So I'm now in the enviable position of paying for something I'm denied, nice system we have in Canada.

As for my mother, as I said she died of Cancer. They said she had it for about 13 years. She saw three seperate doctors and all three misdiagnosed her and treated her for bird flu of all things. Over the years she told them repeatedly that it wasn't the flu but something else and they kept telling her she was wrong, they were the doctors after all. Well she was right but being right didn't help her at all. Yeah, great f*cking system we have in this country.

[Guest American Woman]

Laugh if you like, but the US health care system defintiely restricts workplace mobility and small business development. If you have dependents, or anybody with a preexisting condition, you are going to be very careful to keep what benefits you have at your current job rather than think of moving.

Lots of things restrict workplace mobility and small business development. For instance, if you have dependents, or anybody with health problems, you are going to be careful to keep a good, steady income - ie: stay at your current job - rather than think of moving. I'd wager most Canadians in that position aren't leaving well paid jobs by the thousands to start a risky personal business any more than Americans are. Or aren't.

[bush_cheney2004]

Really? So if I am working for MegaCorp Inc in Detroit with full health care benefits, have kids with asthma and a wife with cancer, have a burning desire to start my one man lawn maintenance empire then MegaCorp is obliged to pay for health care indefintiely and after I leave their employ?

If you leave their "employ", they are obligated by federal law to provide membership to the same group policy for medical and dental insurance, except that the entire cost is paid by the employee. This provides continuity of insurability for people with pre-existing conditions.

US employers are obliged to continue to pay health care benefits when their staff leave to work for a company that has no or lesser benefits?

No, they are obliged to continue membership and eligibility but the "staff" pays the total group premium.

[Shakeyhands]

BC is correct when he states this. From a personal perspective I had my ID stolen, now I have no health care coverage, of course the answer is simple right? Just get new ID. Well that itself is not so simple. I've been trying for over a year and a half now. The system is set up in a sort of circular snake swallowing its tale kind of way. Its a sort of "to issue you this we need to see that" kind of thing. Having recieved citizenship when I was about seventeen I do not have any of the original paperwork, my mother had that, I have no idea what happened to it as she died of cancer last December. As so I have no coverage and the process of obtaining it appears to be stalled indefinately, they won't even accept my military service records as any kind of proof of identity. Ironically the only items they will accept are the two I don't have, a health card or citizenship card. So I'm now in the enviable position of paying for something I'm denied, nice system we have in Canada.

As for my mother, as I said she died of Cancer. They said she had it for about 13 years. She saw three seperate doctors and all three misdiagnosed her and treated her for bird flu of all things. Over the years she told them repeatedly that it wasn't the flu but something else and they kept telling her she was wrong, they were the doctors after all. Well she was right but being right didn't help her at all. Yeah, great f*cking system we have in this country.

Boy... What a horrible story this is. I've had my wallet stolen or lost a few time over the years (in fact once it was stolen right out of our hotel room in FL while we were sleeping!) and I have to say that although I was born here which may simplify things a bit, I've NEVER had a hard time replacing any piece of ID. And as far as your mother goes, thats a sad story and I am very sorry for your loss.

Haaving said that, perhaps things would be easier for you, getting ID, better health care etc... if you went back to where ever it was that you came from?

[Shady]

BC is correct when he states this. From a personal perspective I had my ID stolen, now I have no health care coverage, of course the answer is simple right? Just get new ID. Well that itself is not so simple. I've been trying for over a year and a half now. The system is set up in a sort of circular snake swallowing its tale kind of way. Its a sort of "to issue you this we need to see that" kind of thing. Having recieved citizenship when I was about seventeen I do not have any of the original paperwork, my mother had that, I have no idea what happened to it as she died of cancer last December. As so I have no coverage and the process of obtaining it appears to be stalled indefinately, they won't even accept my military service records as any kind of proof of identity. Ironically the only items they will accept are the two I don't have, a health card or citizenship card. So I'm now in the enviable position of paying for something I'm denied, nice system we have in Canada.

As for my mother, as I said she died of Cancer. They said she had it for about 13 years. She saw three seperate doctors and all three misdiagnosed her and treated her for bird flu of all things. Over the years she told them repeatedly that it wasn't the flu but something else and they kept telling her she was wrong, they were the doctors after all. Well she was right but being right didn't help her at all. Yeah, great f*cking system we have in this country.

Did you have the photo health card or the red and white one?

[Smallc]

As for my mother, as I said she died of Cancer. They said she had it for about 13 years. She saw three seperate doctors and all three misdiagnosed her and treated her for bird flu of all things. Over the years she told them repeatedly that it wasn't the flu but something else and they kept telling her she was wrong, they were the doctors after all. Well she was right but being right didn't help her at all. Yeah, great f*cking system we have in this country.

That, as unfortunate as it is, has absolutely nothing to do with any system.

[Wild Bill]

Boy... What a horrible story this is. I've had my wallet stolen or lost a few time over the years (in fact once it was stolen right out of our hotel room in FL while we were sleeping!) and I have to say that although I was born here which may simplify things a bit, I've NEVER had a hard time replacing any piece of ID. And as far as your mother goes, thats a sad story and I am very sorry for your loss.

Haaving said that, perhaps things would be easier for you, getting ID, better health care etc... if you went back to where ever it was that you came from?

Geez, Shakey! Considering Angus has been a combat soldier, putting up his life for this country, isn't your post a bit...smarmy?

[Argus]

Geez, Shakey! Considering Angus has been a combat soldier, putting up his life for this country, isn't your post a bit...smarmy?

I would have suggested 'dumb'.

[Shakeyhands]

I would have suggested 'dumb'.

And you would have been wrong.. again.

Please point out what is "dumb" about it.

[Shakeyhands]

Geez, Shakey! Considering Angus has been a combat soldier, putting up his life for this country, isn't your post a bit...smarmy?

Read his post again. Nothing smarmy about my response at all.

[Shady]

Read his post again. Nothing smarmy about my response at all.

I happen to agree with your response. It needed to be said.

As for replacing lost or stolen citizenship. I simple form is required, stating your name, address, etc. And a swearing that you've lost your ID, and if you find it, you'll notify Citizenship & Immigration in the future. Your new citizenship is sent to you, usually 4 - 6 weeks later. Which is essential, along with proof of residency (drivers licence, utility bill, pay stub, bank statement, lease or mortgage agreement, etc) to replace a lost or stolen health card. A couple of pieces of ID is required in order to prevent health care fraud. Unfortunately there are non-Ontario/Canaidan residents that possess Ontario health cards, and use the health care system every year.

[Argus]

And you would have been wrong.. again.

Please point out what is "dumb" about it.

You are suggesting that because he's having trouble replacing his documents he ought to abandon the place he's lived for most of his life, even served in the military for, and return to the place he grew up?

It's a dumb thing to say.

[Shakeyhands]

You are suggesting that because he's having trouble replacing his documents he ought to abandon the place he's lived for most of his life, even served in the military for, and return to the place he grew up?

It's a dumb thing to say.

I'm suggesting that since our system is so terrible, perhaps that one that he had where ever he came from is better.

[Wild Bill]

I'm suggesting that since our system is so terrible, perhaps that one that he had where ever he came from is better.

Basically, you said "Why don't you go back to where you came from, then?"

I don't think anyone of us has the right to ask that of someone who has put his life on the line for our country.

What have YOU done that's comparable? I could never be so arrogant as to make a comment like yours.

[Shakeyhands]

Basically, you said "Why don't you go back to where you came from, then?"

I don't think anyone of us has the right to ask that of someone who has put his life on the line for our country.

What have YOU done that's comparable? I could never be so arrogant as to make a comment like yours.

And?

He also made a choice to serve in the military, good for him if that is what he wished to do... it doesn't make him any more special than any one else in my opinion, regardless if they have been in the military or not.

And while I didn't serve in any capacity, I do have 2 daughters who are both currently officers in the military (Army and Navy) and a son who wishes to follow his big sister in to the Army. They were brought up right, are extremely responsible and functioning members of our great society, so I suppose that is my contribution. Plus I'm nice to old ladies.